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Posted: 9/7/2006 7:03:52 PM EST
I've been trying very hard to avoid buying a S&W M&P 223. BUT I'm a real Smith fan. Put their logo on a gun and, well...

I can not hit the broad side of a barn. That's the truth. Also I'm getting old enought that my eyesight isn't what it once was. So I've been leaning towards the tactical model with a scope.

Any opinions on the advantages of the tactical over just the basic M&P rifle?
Link Posted: 9/7/2006 7:27:36 PM EST
Link Posted: 9/7/2006 8:25:56 PM EST
I'm in the same boat as far as being a smith fan. I went with an M&P 15 just for fun, flattop, without the factory rail (which is made by troy if memory serves). I love the rifle, and as another part of the addiction i picked up a smith 1911 last week.

Its a little more expensive, but worth it if you want it enough :).

Slap an eotech or scope on it and you'll be all set :)
Link Posted: 9/7/2006 9:43:55 PM EST
i just got a smith & wesson m&p15a about a month ago. it is not made by smith, it is made by stag. but your right it does say smith & wesson on it!!!! the model 15a i got has the flat top with the troy industies fold down rear battle sight, which says m&p on it. it does not have the folding front sight. i am VERY happy with the gun. if your looking to use a scope for range use only, and dont want to spend a fortune to buy the tactical model, get the standard model and remove the carry handle and you have many options for the scope, or spend a few extra and change the front sight to move it out of the scopes way depending on what you get and how you mount it. if you buy the tactical model ill be jelouse! lol. i had the oprotunity to fire 240 rounds of wolf steel cased ammo threw it and had no problem what so ever with it.
Link Posted: 9/7/2006 10:45:40 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/7/2006 10:47:11 PM EST by xenophobe]

Originally Posted By Lancelot:
You can build the same rifle for less money, it just won't say S&W on it.


Unless you think you can get a brand new Stag M4 for $661, I'd say you're wrong.

I picked up my M&P-15T for $1250.

Price breakdown:
$250 Troy BUIS
$240 Troy MRF-MX
$ 45 Troy Lo Pro Gas Block
$ 34 YHM 15 slot rail covers (3 @ 11.25 ea)
$ 20 Supplied Hard Case
$661 Complete M4 minus handguard, FSB

Even if you consider what dealer cost for the Troy stuff is, the base rifle is still at a great price.
Link Posted: 9/8/2006 1:19:11 AM EST
I dont believe you get the same lifetime warranty if you buy it through stag either.

I am VERY happy with my MP15T.
Link Posted: 9/8/2006 2:31:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By Azlum:
I dont believe you get the same lifetime warranty if you buy it through stag either.

I am VERY happy with my MP15T.


I beg to differ...Stag has a lifetime warranty. Just checked in my catalog.
Link Posted: 9/8/2006 3:52:43 AM EST
I bought one and it is very nice. Solid weapon for the price. Own 6 COLTS and I like the S&W just as much. Will be getting the tactical model next.
Link Posted: 9/8/2006 4:15:19 AM EST
[Last Edit: 9/8/2006 4:16:28 AM EST by JRandyH]
I bought the non tactical rifle about 4 months ago since I couldn't find the tactical one. It jammed from the first shot. I sent it to S&W who sent it to Stag to be repaired. IT works fine now. I like it OK and considered buying a Tactical one several weeks ago for around 1259.00 plus our state tax. I had just received my Rock River Arms which blows the Smith&Wesson away in build quality. I decided not to get the Smith.
I put tac rails and a light on my S&W after they fixed it.
JRandyH
Its a good buy if you can get it around 1259.00 or so. I wouldn't pay anymore. I got my RRA with SS barrel, Daniel Defense Rails and filp up sights for about 1350.00
Here is the S&W


Here is the RRA
Link Posted: 9/8/2006 4:36:45 AM EST
to answer your original question, find a good variable power scope with both standard and illuminated reticle. you'll have the opportunity for better accuracy at all ranges.

Last weekend i zero'd 2 ar's i put together. a couple old deerhunters took me to their spot in a cotton field and target barrels were set up at 25, 50 & 100yds. they had 3 3006's with scopes and i had an ar with an aimpoint and one with iron sights. i wasted 2 mags of ammo on 50 before turning to the 25 and finally got the sights dialed in. No problems after that but my groups from a mechanical bench weren't as good as the scoped rifles'. go figure.

the dot on an aimpoint is going to be 4 inches in diameter at 100 yds and as it obscures that 4 inches, that's about the best accuracy you can hope for. iron sights on an ar leave alot of wiggle room and that bullseye looks the size of a pinhead.

put a decent scope on and the bull gets pretty easy to see.

Link Posted: 9/8/2006 11:26:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By xenophobe:

Originally Posted By Lancelot:
You can build the same rifle for less money, it just won't say S&W on it.


Unless you think you can get a brand new Stag M4 for $661, I'd say you're wrong.

I picked up my M&P-15T for $1250.

Price breakdown:
$250 Troy BUIS
$240 Troy MRF-MX
$ 45 Troy Lo Pro Gas Block
$ 34 YHM 15 slot rail covers (3 @ 11.25 ea)
$ 20 Supplied Hard Case
$661 Complete M4 minus handguard, FSB

Even if you consider what dealer cost for the Troy stuff is, the base rifle is still at a great price.



I second everything above. I paid $1299 for mine, shoots great.

Lancelot,

I notice you chime in on every S&W 15 thread, have you ever handled or shot one?

Link Posted: 9/30/2006 9:33:20 PM EST

Originally Posted By Azlum:
I dont believe you get the same lifetime warranty if you buy it through stag either.

I am VERY happy with my MP15T.


On another thread I think they said on page 29 of the manual 1 year waranty.
I could have been misled, but lifetime may be for handguns not the AR.


www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=295631
Link Posted: 9/30/2006 9:38:00 PM EST
I think this was good move for Stag, alot of LE depts. buy on name alone. This way Stag gets more sales with the S&W name.
Link Posted: 10/1/2006 3:10:19 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/1/2006 6:47:12 AM EST
i saw S AND W's at a PA gun show. the m4 was running around 8-900.
the finish was awesome and the upper/lower where real nice and tight. no slop.

i think they are nice no matter who builds it. nice piece.
Link Posted: 10/1/2006 6:55:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By JRandyH:
I had just received my Rock River Arms which blows the Smith&Wesson away in build quality.


Can you explain what you mean by that?

Link Posted: 10/1/2006 7:34:39 AM EST
Here is my MP15T with an A2 stock.

Link Posted: 10/1/2006 8:02:03 AM EST
I have my own version of the M&PT...built it myself...but cost me a whole lot less thanks to the EE...all the parts were brand new. The only difference was that it has a Bushy bbl, phantom and the stock....but the bare bones of the gun I bought for less I doubt I'll need a life time warranty on. All quality stuff.

Link Posted: 10/1/2006 8:25:48 AM EST
The smith MP15 looks good but with a 4140 steel barrle you get the same from Stag or RRA for $400 cheaper.For the money of the smith id buy a Colt LE6920 as its the same money.The MP15 does have a mip-spec telestock but the rifle is a bit over priced at $1200.
Link Posted: 10/1/2006 11:09:39 AM EST

Originally Posted By ChromeLined:
The smith MP15 looks good but with a 4140 steel barrle you get the same from Stag or RRA for $400 cheaper.For the money of the smith id buy a Colt LE6920 as its the same money.The MP15 does have a mip-spec telestock but the rifle is a bit over priced at $1200.


I don't follow your math.

The S&Ws and RRAs I've seen for sale are about the same price, $900-1000. When I see 6920s for sale, they're $1200-1300, about what the S&W M&P15T goes for already tricked out with Troy gas block, rail, and sights.

Link Posted: 10/1/2006 12:48:28 PM EST

Originally Posted By ChromeLined:
The smith MP15 looks good but with a 4140 steel barrle you get the same from Stag or RRA for $400 cheaper.For the money of the smith id buy a Colt LE6920 as its the same money.The MP15 does have a mip-spec telestock but the rifle is a bit over priced at $1200.



You need to compare apples and oranges, which you are not. There are 3 models of the MP15. The one at $1200 is the tactical model.

Do some research. You can not buy any model of new AR, outfitted like a S&W MP15T for $800.

Link Posted: 10/30/2006 7:40:32 AM EST
height=8
Originally Posted By Azlum:
I dont believe you get the same lifetime warranty if you buy it through stag either.

I am VERY happy with my MP15T.


S&W only warrants their AR's for one year from date of purchase. Read the warranty statemen in the owner's manual.
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