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11/24/2017 4:44:23 PM
11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 10/29/2004 2:34:47 AM EST
I spoke to a retired Marine this week who told me the M16 is being replaced by a 6mm Rifle made by H&K. I remember seeing something on the History Channel about this rifle. This retired Marine told me he has shot it and has seen troops issued this rifle that have been sent over seas to use it in combat. I understand it shoots a 6mm bullet. He also told me that H&K is currently building a manufacturing plant in the US and working with Colt to also produce this new combat rifle.

This Marine also told me the military is going back to the 45 acp pistol for general issue. He told me Kimber has delivered 500 45s for testing . These Kimbers are failing due to being machined too tightly and the tests are currently on hold. I understand Colt is also involved in the testing.

Does anyone have any info on this story I was told?
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 5:24:48 AM EST
I know that one of the SF Marine groups bought a few hundreed Kimbers - it was in an American Rifleman Article this past summer , I'll giv eactual stats if I can find it. And I know H&K has been working on anew rifle system, but I'm not sure why they would replace the M-16 and the 5.56mm as a general issue thing when so many are in service, during an ongoing conflict. - Charles
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 6:23:47 AM EST
The XM8 is [probably] more reliable than the M16 because it uses a gas piston rather than direct gas impingement. It's inherently cleaner.

The new proposed round is 6.8mm, not 6mm. It's based on the .30 Remington.

There are ongoing efforts to replace the M16 simply because it's less reliable than desired, and always has been. 5.56mm is under evaluation because in the 14.5" barrels of M4 class weapons it produces inadequate stopping power.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 7:13:13 AM EST
Standard H&K propaganda BS that they have been releasing for 2+ years.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 7:16:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/29/2004 7:18:43 AM EST by ColtRifle]
Hmmm....I wonder where this "Marine" was really stationed.

NO ONE in the Marine Corps has been issued the XM8 and there are no plans to do so. The Marine Corps just invested in a large number of M16A4s and plans to keep them for a long time. The Marine Corps did purchase a very few XM8s for testing purposes only but there was a number of problems with them necessitating several revisions already. They were chambered in 5.56 and not the 6.8SPC. The Marine Corps is not going to invest much money in a new rifle system yet. They are going to watch the Army and see what they do with the new rifle. I heard that the Army's funding for the XM8 fell through when reviewed by Congress but I'm not sure if that's true. For the story on the XM8, see the Marine Corps Times article. It was this year in the summer time but I can't remember which issue.

I don't know of ANY units in ANY branch of service that have been issued the XM8. I can tell you for sure that NO units in the USMC have deployed with the XM8.

The Marines have been issuing the 45ACP to MEU-SOC recon units for quite some time. They are just rebuilt 1911s. That's old news. But for general issue, units still issue the Beretta. No one knows what they are going to be issuing next. There was talk about getting rid of most of the pistols and replacing them with M4s. I don't know where that has gone though. The Marines still have lots of Berettas.

Link Posted: 10/29/2004 7:34:44 AM EST
MarSOC is using Kimbers and thats not general issue its Special Forces.

XM8 has never been used in combat.

Its 6.8 not 6mm but the XM8 is chambered for 5.56 not 6.8 anyway.

You buddy is totally full of shit.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 7:39:22 AM EST
The MEU(SOC) 1911 is issued to Force Reconnaissance units, The Kimber ICQB is issued to the new Marine SOCM detachment (DET-1). If anyone is interested the 1911 forums have a lot on theese pistols. Run a search on MEU (SOC) or ICQB, Pat Rogers has posted a lot of good info on both.
Steve.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 9:04:34 AM EST
I wouldn't want to be an armorer if we started using H&K's. I'm not sure how the XM-8 is, but US service rifles have always been relatively simple to disassemble for detail work, whereas the HK-91 copy I just purchased requires a lot more equipment to maintain. Re-barreling an M-16 can be done with a vice and an armorer's wrench, re-barreling an HK-91 takes a press to push out the old barrel and push in the new barrel, then a mill or drill press to drill a pin-hole in the new barrel for a retaining pin. The XM-8 may be an easier system to work on than the G-3 though.

Does the XM-8 look bulky to anyone? It may be lighter weight... but it's big and fat looking.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 10:07:12 AM EST

Originally Posted By Artifex:

Does the XM-8 look bulky to anyone? It may be lighter weight... but it's big and fat looking.


Hey I resemble that remark
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 4:41:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By deanimator:

There are ongoing efforts to replace the M16 simply because it's less reliable than desired, and always has been. 5.56mm is under evaluation because in the 14.5" barrels of M4 class weapons it produces inadequate stopping power.



Is this from personal experience?? Inadequate stopping power compared to what?? I am a surgeon that spent 3 months in Northern Iraq during the war and let me tell you that a properly placed 5.56 NATO round will kill you deader than hell. The ones that wern't dead had some prety big holes in them.
Link Posted: 10/29/2004 4:49:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/29/2004 4:49:37 PM EST by windom]

Originally Posted By KurtVF:

Originally Posted By deanimator:

There are ongoing efforts to replace the M16 simply because it's less reliable than desired, and always has been. 5.56mm is under evaluation because in the 14.5" barrels of M4 class weapons it produces inadequate stopping power.



Is this from personal experience?? Inadequate stopping power compared to what?? I am a surgeon that spent 3 months in Northern Iraq during the war and let me tell you that a properly placed 5.56 NATO round will kill you deader than hell. The ones that wern't dead had some prety big holes in them.



Especially cyanide tipped 5.56mm rounds, they'll drop you anywhere it hits you.
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