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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 7/29/2005 4:05:12 AM EDT
I did a search and really did not come up with anything so here goes.

Do you guys see any difference in accuracy between the two rail systems? I was shooting my 16" LMT w/RAS II recently and it shot extremely well consistently. My other (2) 16" Colt w/RAS also shot well from previous outings but I think the RAS II equipped upper had a slight edge.

I was thinking of picking up another RAS II for one of the Colts cause I don't like the way the RAS lower rails wiggle when grasping the vertical grip. Would I be better served getting buying the UK SAS lower rail instead? For the price of two I can retrofit both Colt uppers. Does it add any unwanted tension that may throw off POI?
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 5:57:41 AM EDT
RAS II = free float.

RAS isn't free floating.

That could explain at least some of the accuracy gain.
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 8:13:11 AM EDT
Ive used both and have not seen any real difference. The RAS II has the hump on top, making it optimum for the Aimpoint sight. It does cramp your mounting surface for other types of sights such as the ACOG or Eotech. If you actually plan to mount your Eotech forward on the upper, near the front sight, the RAS II might provide a more stable mounting platform. I prefer the standard RAS myself.
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 8:41:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 9:00:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SMGLee:
As far as wiggle factor, the SAS lower rail is the way to go but it is expensive so by buying a RAS2 it already come with a SAS style lower so you can save money and get a free float rail system. two thumbs up.



Chen,
Are you saying that the RASII already has the SAS lower? I have to go back and research the SAS option. It's been a while since i looked. But I was thinking of picking up an RASII in the near future.
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 9:33:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 11:57:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By MTRancher:
Ive used both and have not seen any real difference. The RAS II has the hump on top, making it optimum for the Aimpoint sight. It does cramp your mounting surface for other types of sights such as the ACOG or Eotech. If you actually plan to mount your Eotech forward on the upper, near the front sight, the RAS II might provide a more stable mounting platform. I prefer the standard RAS myself.


The hump doesn't really affect mounting an ACOG at all... the Eotech is another story though, unless like MTRancher said, you mounted it forward of the hump towards the front sight. Even then, the hump might interfere with fast access to the buttons on the back of the Eotech. I had an Eotech, and currently have a RAS II, but never put the two together to check function. ACOG works great with the RAS II though.

Dave
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 12:19:39 PM EDT
You can mount the ACOG on the RAS II and Ive done it. Problem is you are limited as to how far forward you can place it. My NSN would bump the "hump" and I still didnt have room to put a BUIS on it.
Link Posted: 7/29/2005 3:22:43 PM EDT

I show this pic strictly to demonstrate why most shooters don't need a free float Rail. The head shot was fired at 50 yds on my Belly using XM193 Ammo thru a 16" HBAR Bushy with a KAC RAS. How much better does anyone think they will need, or better yet, have the capability to perform. Oh yeah, Stock single stage Trigger for all the guys who need a better trigger to shoot well. if it's a working gun it's a 300 m carbine. now an SPR type rifle is a differnt story.

Bottom line is you can buy accuracy to a point, after that, it's on you.

Link Posted: 7/29/2005 5:36:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/30/2005 4:25:41 AM EDT by FALbert]
For the kind of shooting I do with my carbines, free floating is not required. However, I do like the solid feel of the vertical grip on free floaters.

As listed by SMGLee, the lower is the same as the one from the RAS II kit. KAC part # 20033

quarterbore.com/library/pdf_files/clamplower.pdf

quarterbore.com/library/pdf_files/rasiipartnum.pdf

It seems to make more sense to just buy a RAS II. For the nominal extra bucks, I can free float plus get all those extra panels and another vertical grip.
Link Posted: 7/30/2005 10:34:05 PM EDT

Originally Posted By SMGLee:
Let me double check and if anyone can confirm... the RAS2 lower has a retansion screw just like the SAS lower rail.


I'm not British, so I don't know what to look for. Here's the flip side of the RAS-2:



Originally Posted By MTRancher:
You can mount the ACOG on the RAS II and Ive done it. Problem is you are limited as to how far forward you can place it. My NSN would bump the "hump" and I still didnt have room to put a BUIS on it.


Must be using the wrong brand BUIS. With the standard TA51 mount, my KAC 300m fit fine with room to spare, With the 19S mount, I could fit an ARMS 40A in there and still move the Acog back/forth one rail notch.
RAS2 + ACOG NSN on TA51 + KAC BUIS
RAS2 + ACOG 11 on 19S + ARMS BUIS
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 5:44:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By SMGLee:
Let me double check and if anyone can confirm... the RAS2 lower has a retansion screw just like the SAS lower rail.



Yes, our (KAC) RAS2 has a clamp and with a retention screw at the rear of the lower (removable) rail. The front of the RAS2 has a "finger" on both sides that hook into the underside of the top rail assembly. Use of the lower rail clamp screw is optional for quick conversion to the M203. For everyone else, I recommend installing the screw and keeping the 1/8" Allen wrench with your field cleaning kit.

Note, however, that the SAS Lower for the M4 RIS and M4 RAS does not have the "fingers" of the RAS2, but the clamps and screws between the two are identical.
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 5:49:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kisara:






Damn, dude, can I dig through your junk pile?

I see a KAC FF RAS back there, a LaRue tube in there, some Magpul Ranger plates, Magpul MIAD.
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 6:34:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Kisara:

Originally Posted By SMGLee:
Let me double check and if anyone can confirm... the RAS2 lower has a retansion screw just like the SAS lower rail.


I'm not British, so I don't know what to look for. Here's the flip side of the RAS-2:
tinyurl.com/donkz


Originally Posted By MTRancher:
You can mount the ACOG on the RAS II and Ive done it. Problem is you are limited as to how far forward you can place it. My NSN would bump the "hump" and I still didnt have room to put a BUIS on it.


Must be using the wrong brand BUIS. With the standard TA51 mount, my KAC 300m fit fine with room to spare, With the 19S mount, I could fit an ARMS 40A in there and still move the Acog back/forth one rail notch.
RAS2 + ACOG NSN on TA51 + KAC BUIS
RAS2 + ACOG 11 on 19S + ARMS BUIS


How's your RAS-II holding up? Mine has been rock solid since the day I got it but the damn thing seems to dislike CLP.
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 9:01:02 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 4:00:34 PM EDT
Yes, that was fun. Mongo, those are just some souvenirs from my trip to Malibu...
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 10:37:19 PM EDT
Thanks for the info guys!
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 5:18:00 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mongo001:

Originally Posted By Kisara:

tinyurl.com/donkz




Damn, dude, can I dig through your junk pile?

I see a KAC FF RAS back there, a LaRue tube in there, some Magpul Ranger plates, Magpul MIAD.



LOL. Don't forget the Hello Kitty doll.
Kisara- how do you have all that epuip. and not own a gun? just curious...

Anyway the RAS II does make more sense UNLESS you plan on scoping it other than an ACOG or aimpoint. To me the fact that it clamps onto the reciever (a little more sturdy), FF the barrel (a little more consistancy), ease of install (no need to remove barrel nut, fsb, etc), and now the cost of a "SHOT SHOW SPECIAL" sounds good to go.

The consistency of a FF handguard really doesn't make a significant difference but, would you rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it? IDK you make the call. To me my rifle got more consistent after the FF to where I notice a difference out to 200yds hitting steel. I went with the RAS II cause at the time it was a new item, wanted something FF, and did not require removal of the barrel nut. It works nicely, for me.
Link Posted: 8/1/2005 12:31:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By pup-dawg:

LOL. Don't forget the Hello Kitty doll.
Kisara- how do you have all that epuip. and not own a gun? just curious...

Anyway the RAS II does make more sense UNLESS you plan on scoping it other than an ACOG or aimpoint. To me the fact that it clamps onto the reciever (a little more sturdy), FF the barrel (a little more consistancy), ease of install (no need to remove barrel nut, fsb, etc), and now the cost of a "SHOT SHOW SPECIAL" sounds good to go.

The consistency of a FF handguard really doesn't make a significant difference but, would you rather have it and not need it, than need it and not have it? IDK you make the call. To me my rifle got more consistent after the FF to where I notice a difference out to 200yds hitting steel. I went with the RAS II cause at the time it was a new item, wanted something FF, and did not require removal of the barrel nut. It works nicely, for me.





5000+ rounds through my RAS II, and no rattle. I'm not really sure what everyone's complaining about....


Anyway, here's the simple way I look at Free-Floating rails:

No one can say it's a bad idea. And for $250 or more for an aluminum rail, it better be free-floated!
Link Posted: 8/2/2005 12:22:46 PM EDT
This might sound dunbbut, what does SAS stand for?
Link Posted: 8/3/2005 11:11:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By WILDBILL756:
This might sound dunbbut, what does SAS stand for?



IIRC, 'Special Air Service', as in those elite Brit forces. They are the ones that requested the modded rail for use on their C8Awhatevermathingees.
Link Posted: 8/3/2005 12:51:31 PM EDT
Thanks for the help on the SAS, can you or anyone post a picture of that rail you are talking about so I can under stand better?
Link Posted: 8/3/2005 12:53:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/3/2005 12:55:34 PM EDT by WILDBILL756]
Hav24, where can I get some of those M4 sight/targets? Just the white Military M4 type targets, I have some IDPA cardboard targets.
Link Posted: 8/3/2005 1:39:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WILDBILL756:
Hav24, where can I get some of those M4 sight/targets? Just the white Military M4 type targets, I have some IDPA cardboard targets.



+1. That is an interesting looking (printable?) target, and I have a 6920 to sight in next week... ;)
Link Posted: 8/4/2005 10:04:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/4/2005 10:05:36 PM EDT by WILDBILL756]
Harv24, or Anybody, Please tell me where did you get the M4 300 meters targets,I want some?
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 8:23:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By WILDBILL756:
Harv24, or Anybody, Please tell me where did you get the M4 300 meters targets,I want some?



You can download them for free from www.MD-AR15.com in the Documents section (you have to register as a member first). Just print them out on Cardstock or plain printer paper.

We have the M4 and the M16A2 versions (they have different grids), there are also versions for those that prefer the superior 50y Santose IBSZ.
Link Posted: 8/5/2005 9:44:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/5/2005 9:45:22 AM EDT by WILDBILL756]
Forest, Thanks for the help.
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