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11/22/2017 10:05:29 PM
Posted: 8/19/2004 12:03:15 PM EST
I am having trouble posting this picture......

Here is the link though.....
http://www.armytimes.com/channel.php?GQID=show
You have to look at the slide show from 8/19...

The picture is of a tanker who is aiming his M4 and he has the detachable carry handle mounted on the bottom of his forearm..... I had never seen this before and just thought it was worthy of note...

Can anyone help post the pic if it is worth it?????????


-mbd


Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:09:31 PM EST
Without looking at the picture, I will say that its fairly common practice to do it like that. Keeps the carry handle close at hand if you need to slap it on, but out of the way of optics. Often times there are not enough BUIS to go around.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:11:12 PM EST
Here ya go:





Lonny
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:12:02 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:13:29 PM EST
this pic has gotten around today...
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:15:35 PM EST
What type of rail system is that? KAC wrapped in paracord or some funky rail covers I haven't seen yet.

Sort of looks like a Surefire also.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:21:29 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:21:41 PM EST
thanks..........................................
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:24:42 PM EST
since acogs break all the time... keep those irons close!

JK
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 12:31:29 PM EST
Which ACOG is that??
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 1:19:35 PM EST

Originally Posted By jar3ds:
since acogs break all the time... keep those irons close!

JK







Lonny
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 1:30:35 PM EST
What? They break all the time? That does it, no ACOG on my rifle!
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:29:50 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/19/2004 2:42:01 PM EST by Bradd_D]
Here's where I'm keeping my BUIS these days...

Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:40:17 PM EST
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:46:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By Bradd_D:
Here's where I'm keeping my BUIS these days...

img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-8/805704/BUISandACOG2.jpg



Sweet. You got a BUGS(Back Up Glass Sight) for when your irons crap out on you.

CHRIS
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:49:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By Cixelsyd:

Originally Posted By Bradd_D:
Here's where I'm keeping my BUIS these days...

img.villagephotos.com/p/2004-8/805704/BUISandACOG2.jpg



Sweet. You got a BUGS(Back Up Glass Sight) for when your irons crap out on you.

CHRIS



Exactly! I figured the Canadians were onto something.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:51:00 PM EST

Originally Posted By fq1234:
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?



Me thinks he is. Some sort of tank/APC crewman.

I recall some of the picks from Afghanistan our soldiers mounted the detachable carry handles on the left or right side rails.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:55:10 PM EST
Brad

Now, that has some promise... I take it you use the large aperture exclusively?

SD
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 2:59:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By fq1234:
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?



Here's a couple of more with quotes. You make the call.





Quote:
The commander of a U.S. Army Abrams tank shoots his automatic rifle towards a Shi'ite militant position in the southern Iraq city of Najaf, August 19, 2004






Quote:
An American soldier takes aim as he sits atop a U.S. tank while patrolling the deserted streets in the besieged city of Najaf Thursday Aug. 19, 2004. An Iraqi Cabinet minister said Thursday that Iraqi forces could begin an offensive against Muqtada al-Sadr within hours, despite the firebrand cleric's acceptance of a cease-fire proposal
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 3:03:49 PM EST
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 3:03:54 PM EST

Originally Posted By SailorDude:
Brad

Now, that has some promise... I take it you use the large aperture exclusively?

SD



I really prefer the small aperture for most shooting, but you can't beat the large aperture for speed and that's what a BUIS is all about.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 3:40:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By fq1234:
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?



I think the M4 and the M1 Abrams give him away as an American.



I wasn't familiar with the helmet. I guess it stands to reason that if our tankers used special helmets in past wars that they would also use special helmets in this one.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 3:44:53 PM EST

Originally Posted By fq1234:

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By fq1234:
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?



I think the M4 and the M1 Abrams give him away as an American.



I wasn't familiar with the helmet. I guess it stands to reason that if our tankers used special helmets in past wars that they would also use special helmets in this one.



It's called a CVC helmet. I painted mine tiger stripe when Uncle Sugar let me use one.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 3:54:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/19/2004 3:56:45 PM EST by XMP]
The carry handle on the bottom is so that you can sight targets in the new gangsta sideways position like they do with pistols. All the rage in Kalifornia.



Or maybe they have to carry them with them for BUIS as their commanders do not let them not run amuck without the issued sights. So they attach them to the rails.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 4:12:44 PM EST
The bizarre thing about that pic is that tankers are even carrying M16 family firearms as personal weapons. Back in the day everybody wanted an M1911A1 in a shoulder holster.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 4:30:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By fq1234:

Originally Posted By Lumpy196:

Originally Posted By fq1234:
He's obviously not American. Is that an Iraqi with American bought arms?



I think the M4 and the M1 Abrams give him away as an American.



I wasn't familiar with the helmet. I guess it stands to reason that if our tankers used special helmets in past wars that they would also use special helmets in this one.



I was wondering what you were getting at! I could see if you were used to only seeing the K-pot where you may have been thrown.

It isn't just tankers - most combat vehicle crewman where the, well, combat vehicle crewman helmets. It's really no different in principle than aviators helmets - and I'm sure you wouldn't expect to see pilot in a K-pot.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 6:46:02 PM EST
Perhaps the most striking oddity is why is the crew firing 5.56NATO exposed, while sitting on top of a can't miss 120mm? At least use the .50BMG fer cryin' out loud.
Must've been a photo-op.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 10:50:27 PM EST

Originally Posted By CCPD:
Perhaps the most striking oddity is why is the crew firing 5.56NATO exposed, while sitting on top of a can't miss 120mm? At least use the .50BMG fer cryin' out loud.
Must've been a photo-op.




Just "Don't put too many holes in the mosque" rules.
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 11:06:43 PM EST
There's the 120mm Main gun, Coax 7.62x51mm M240 (aka MAG58), loaders M240 uptop and commanders 12.7x99mm M2 HBMG and they decide to shoot 5.56mm?
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 2:17:55 AM EST
gunner, coax, troops..........

I wasn't a tanker, but I would think that the elevation and traverse mechanism on an M1A2 is accurate enough so that the coax could hose down what ever target there is without collateral damage.
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 2:26:13 AM EST
Looks like he's pulling security to me - your visibilty is always limited when buttoned up in a track - the ACOG gives him 4x magnification.
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 3:28:36 AM EST
Adam,

The loader might be but the TC is clearly firing auto/burst in one of the pics. It seems that his eyes are closed due to the fact the weapon stock wasn't extended and he's getting a eye full of ACOG .

CD
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 7:43:17 PM EST
Why pop off rounds from an M4 when you have a perfectly good MaDuece sitting right there beside you.
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 7:44:26 PM EST

Originally Posted By AGC:

Originally Posted By CCPD:
Perhaps the most striking oddity is why is the crew firing 5.56NATO exposed, while sitting on top of a can't miss 120mm? At least use the .50BMG fer cryin' out loud.
Must've been a photo-op.




Just "Don't put too many holes in the mosque" rules.



missed these before I posted my response
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 7:51:08 PM EST

Originally Posted By bigsapper:
The bizarre thing about that pic is that tankers are even carrying M16 family firearms as personal weapons. Back in the day everybody wanted an M1911A1 in a shoulder holster.
hug.gifhug.gif



The M1's carry an M16 as a crew served weapons these days. The individual crewman still have personal weapons in the form of a pistol (when I was in an M1, we still had 1911's. I guess they switched now to Beretta M9's).

Link Posted: 8/20/2004 7:53:54 PM EST
Weapons on a track also don't have the quick acquire - to - fire time that a shoulder-braced weapon does. Coax has to look where the main gun does (duh) so that's out, along with it's exceptional optics.

The pintle guns also dont have optics of their own that I'm aware of but granted I was never a tanker. I don't see one on the 50 in the picture anyhow.

For those 'geez, is that a grenade or a bottle of perfume' moments, I suppose. Gotta love urban warfare.
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 7:58:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By PE556:
gunner, coax, troops..........

I wasn't a tanker, but I would think that the elevation and traverse mechanism on an M1A2 is accurate enough so that the coax could hose down what ever target there is without collateral damage.



True, there's an M240 next to the main gun that can be used to hose down personnelle..but the Gunner's probably inside the turret bustin noze (sleeping), or he might be targeting another target while the TC and Loader do their thing. Either way, the Ma Deuce is supposed to be for vehicles. Geneva Convention and all.
Link Posted: 8/20/2004 8:03:20 PM EST

Originally Posted By javven:
Weapons on a track also don't have the quick acquire - to - fire time that a shoulder-braced weapon does. Coax has to look where the main gun does (duh) so that's out, along with it's exceptional optics.

The pintle guns also dont have optics of their own that I'm aware of but granted I was never a tanker. I don't see one on the 50 in the picture anyhow.




The Ma Deuce has a 3 power sight, but the Ma Deuce was a pain in the azz to get on target vertically. You had to manually turn this knob to bring it down while looking through the CWS (Commander's Weapons Sight). It was designed to engage hard targets out to 800 to 2000 Mtrs, and hose them left to right, not to chase down running individuals.
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 1:04:57 AM EST

Originally Posted By Slv2fun:
The Ma Deuce has a 3 power sight, but the Ma Deuce was a pain in the azz to get on target vertically. You had to manually turn this knob to bring it down while looking through the CWS (Commander's Weapons Sight). It was designed to engage hard targets out to 800 to 2000 Mtrs, and hose them left to right, not to chase down running individuals.



The "flex 50" on the M1A2 SEP that this 1st Cavalry Division Soldier is manning does not have internal controls and optics like the M1/M1A1 - it's all iron sights and manual targetting now. The internal controls have been removed to make room for the Commander's Independent Thermal Viewer (CITV) panel.

Dave
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 4:37:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By Slv2fun:
Originally Posted By PE556:
... Either way, the Ma Deuce is supposed to be for vehicles. Geneva Convention and all.



Here we go again.

You can probably find the Geneva convention online - please point out WHERE - perhaps in the process you may learn something.



Link Posted: 8/21/2004 10:35:48 AM EST

Originally Posted By Lon_Moer:
Which ACOG is that??



That's the ACOG Al Pacino used in Heat
Link Posted: 8/21/2004 10:38:21 AM EST

Originally Posted By streetfighter:

Originally Posted By Lon_Moer:
Which ACOG is that??



That's the ACOG Al Pacino used in Heat





Link Posted: 8/21/2004 10:39:02 AM EST
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