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Posted: 4/24/2014 6:36:36 PM EDT
Best friend gave his son a new PSA 16" Carbine Length AR for his BD. The son was disappointed because the brass deflector looks like it had hundreds of rounds after just 40 (ejecting at 5:00). Ammo was American Eagle Tactical XM193.

I remember reading somewhere that the weaker the ejector spring gets the further back the cases are ejected. Is this just because it is new and needs to be broken in, weak ammo, etc...? Any suggestions as to how to get it to move forward to say 3:00 would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 6:39:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/24/2014 6:42:58 PM EDT by Fooboy]
If it ejects and cycles it's fine.

File this under "my car's engine makes a noise when I push the gas pedal"
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 6:43:50 PM EDT
Agree...no problems what so ever. its his first and he got upset....we were just shooting the shi! to see if maybe we could adjust it.
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 6:46:17 PM EDT
so it's doing it's job


you can use a piece of velcro on the deflector to prevent the brass from leaving a mark
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 6:46:35 PM EDT
Hell, I like 5:00 Keeps the brass down off my bitchy neighbors at a tight range.

Link Posted: 4/24/2014 6:50:21 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By peligro113:
so it's doing it's job


you can use a piece of velcro on the deflector to prevent the brass from leaving a mark
View Quote


Thats not a bad idea! I personally dont care about mine...but it is his first and he waited a long time. He will learn! lol
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 7:07:50 PM EDT
Never understood people getting upset about brass deflector wear.

A shot rifle is cooler looking than the 30 round a year safe queen.

Teach him it's a tool, tools show wear if you use them.
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 7:47:47 PM EDT
I'm not following what the issue is here.....
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 8:09:11 PM EDT
The issue is: Is there anyway to adjust the ejection of brass from 5:00 to something more forward like 3:00 for example?
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 8:20:34 PM EDT
Probably needs a H or H2 buffer. Either way, it works and it's a tool. My Noveske has brass all over its deflector. It wears it with pride.
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 8:25:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/24/2014 8:36:59 PM EDT by DasRonin]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
The issue is: Is there anyway to adjust the ejection of brass from 5:00 to something more forward like 3:00 for example?
View Quote


Well... if you feel you must change the ejection pattern!

Get and install an adjustable gas block... use it to reduce the gas blown back into the gas key on the bolt carrier. If you really want to have total control... first open up the gas port on the barrel and you can over gas or under gas the bolt carrier until the non-existant problem you have no longer exists.

A prudent person would leave the gas system alone.

It's your rifle and money! (or your "friends" rifle and money)


(Of course there is this old saying... "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!")
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 8:55:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/24/2014 8:55:46 PM EDT by DiveFlyFun]
I totally agree with you that if it aint broke dont fix it. His father and I were just wondering if there was an easy way to adjust it.
Its the kids first gun and he is really exicted...
Link Posted: 4/24/2014 11:17:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/24/2014 11:20:13 PM EDT by occasionalvisitor]
You could try replacing the buffer spring or changing the buffer to a different weight.

What weight buffer is installed in the gun now?
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 12:44:47 AM EDT
If it works you would be silly to mess with it. Unless it is ejecting at 5oclock with zero force and just barely plopping out. But that's the point of your post his deflector is taking a beating. Instead of braking some that's fixed tell the kid this is how it outta work. You can lighten the buffer to probably get a more forward ejection but his deflector is still gonna get hit. If he doesn't like an AR in good working order suggest airsoft. The Velcro is your best fix if this thing is cycling with his ammo.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 2:09:53 AM EDT
I put a piece of a foam/rubbery type of material that is sticky on one side on my brass deflector...not in order to prevent the BD from getting dinged up, but i did so based on the advice of a HP shooter....its easier on the brass and according to him it helps prevent it from getting thrown as far.

Personally I don't think either is true, but I never bothered taking the stuff off (mainly because I forgot its on there).

OP, if the kid wants to save the BD that may be an option for him.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 2:14:08 AM EDT
So the problem is brass deflecting off the brass deflector?
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 2:30:34 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Lumpy196:
So the problem is brass deflecting off the brass deflector?
View Quote



Not really, it is more about the deflecting brass off the brass deflector is marring the brass deflector.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 2:38:14 AM EDT
Probably easier to fix the kid and I'm explain that's why the brass deflector is there. Or, but a slick sided upper and replace it. No more brass deflector wear.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 3:44:08 AM EDT
Even if you change the ejection pattern the deflector will show wear. By nature of its purpose it gets hit with empty cases.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 4:23:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 4:30:55 AM EDT by lunarjohnrambo]
Agreed. First post!
The idea behind a deflector was to bounce brass down softly instead of throwing it... this way lefties could shoot m16s w/o taking it in the face
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 4:50:08 AM EDT
Unless he reloads and case mouths are getting beat up, leave it alone.

Brass deflector is s'posed to get brassed up.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 4:52:00 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CIE:
Probably needs a H or H2 buffer. Either way, it works and it's a tool. My Noveske has brass all over its deflector. It wears it with pride.
View Quote


He needs a lighter buffer or more gas.

However, as long as it's ejecting it's fine. Brass comes off with some Hoppes #9.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 5:16:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 5:19:17 AM EDT by Schive]
Convince him this is fine and to be expected. Tell him not to try to tune the ejection on a rifle that is working properly.

Also, tell him that if he uses steel case, it won't just leave brass marks, it will eventually remove the finish.

Tell him worn deflectors are beautiful and chicks dig them.

You might want to warn him about what the internals are going to look like after a thousand rounds too.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 5:53:36 AM EDT
dude its an AR15 not a piece of art
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 6:06:51 AM EDT
simple and easy fix, dont shoot it
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 6:25:35 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:24:30 AM EDT
Does he know it 'shits where it eats' yet?
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:30:19 AM EDT
My deflector on my M&P 15T was brass colored within 5 shots when I took it out to sight it in. Future BIL stood back and caught the brass in his shirt after a while. It's consistent. Consistently at 5 o'clock.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:42:17 AM EDT
The AR loads, fires and ejects. No malfunctions???


I wish everything was so easy.

Where is the problem??

gd
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:46:28 AM EDT
Wait a second, so the brass deflector deflected brass?
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:47:43 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By HK_MARK23:
simple and easy fix, dont shoot it
View Quote

LOL

I know that and you know that and the kid will learn that as well. But now Im curious if it can be tuned to ones liking and its clear that quite a few here are missing this point...I understand that if aint broke dont fix it and I dont care if mine gets dinged up....but the experience with the kids first AR lead us to this question...and now were curious if it can be tuned...thats all.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:50:22 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By FunYun1983:
Does he know it 'shits where it eats' yet?
View Quote

Seriously....thats your contribution? Im interested in expert advice/comments...not smart ass remarks.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 7:55:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 7:58:05 AM EDT by DiveFlyFun]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By occasionalvisitor:
You could try replacing the buffer spring or changing the buffer to a different weight.

What weight buffer is installed in the gun now?
View Quote

Standard. Personally I think the American Eagle ammo is the cause and that a higher load would be perfect.
Its really now more out of curiosity then anything else. Hell I wouldnt mind learning how to tune it, never know when I may really have to!
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 8:04:30 AM EDT
I would highly suggest not messing with it if it functions properly.

But if you want to mess with it I'd suggest a H or H2 buffer, a new/higher spring rate buffer spring, or as someone else said: Try clipping a coil off the ejector spring or buying a weaker ejector spring.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 8:09:59 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Krylancelo:
I would highly suggest not messing with it if it functions properly.

But if you want to mess with it I'd suggest a H or H2 buffer, a new/higher spring rate buffer spring, or as someone else said: Try clipping a coil off the ejector spring or buying a weaker ejector spring.
View Quote

Thanks! Will let them know and will file for future reference
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 8:17:25 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 8:19:09 AM EDT by Lug1]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Krylancelo:
I would highly suggest not messing with it if it functions properly.

But if you want to mess with it I'd suggest a H or H2 buffer, a new/higher spring rate buffer spring, or as someone else said: Try clipping a coil off the ejector spring or buying a weaker ejector spring.
View Quote
This is opposite advice. Moving to an H buffer or an H2 would move a 3 oclock ejection to potentially a 5 oclock. Ideally you would want a lighter buffer if you wanted to move your 5 oclock ejection forward to a 3 oclock. If you have a carbine buffer in there, the lightest, you are out of luck. But if you had an H2 buffer you could move down to a carbine buffer potentially. Again use the velcro if it works. Why mess with it if it works.

I would also leave the ejector spring alone.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 8:47:41 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Hydra-shokz:


He needs a lighter buffer or more gas.

However, as long as it's ejecting it's fine. Brass comes off with some Hoppes #9.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Hydra-shokz:
Originally Posted By CIE:
Probably needs a H or H2 buffer. Either way, it works and it's a tool. My Noveske has brass all over its deflector. It wears it with pride.


He needs a lighter buffer or more gas.

However, as long as it's ejecting it's fine. Brass comes off with some Hoppes #9.

Link Posted: 4/25/2014 9:18:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 9:19:10 AM EDT by JohnNYPD]
Sounds Normal....

Brass marks on Deflector = Working mans gun....

Beware of the man that has a worn
brass deflector
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 9:34:23 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:

Standard. Personally I think the American Eagle ammo is the cause and that a higher load would be perfect.

Its really now more out of curiosity then anything else. Hell I wouldnt mind learning how to tune it, never know when I may really have to!
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
Originally Posted By occasionalvisitor:
You could try replacing the buffer spring or changing the buffer to a different weight.

What weight buffer is installed in the gun now?

Standard. Personally I think the American Eagle ammo is the cause and that a higher load would be perfect.

Its really now more out of curiosity then anything else. Hell I wouldnt mind learning how to tune it, never know when I may really have to!


I've seen vids of AE XM193 rounds being chrono'd at 3000-3100 fps out of a 16" barrel. That's hotter than most rounds. I don't think loading is the answer.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:03:06 AM EDT
Leave it how it is!!!
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:09:30 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:

LOL

I know that and you know that and the kid will learn that as well. But now Im curious if it can be tuned to ones liking and its clear that quite a few here are missing this point...I understand that if aint broke dont fix it and I dont care if mine gets dinged up....but the experience with the kids first AR lead us to this question...and now were curious if it can be tuned...thats all.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
Originally Posted By HK_MARK23:
simple and easy fix, dont shoot it

LOL

I know that and you know that and the kid will learn that as well. But now Im curious if it can be tuned to ones liking and its clear that quite a few here are missing this point...I understand that if aint broke dont fix it and I dont care if mine gets dinged up....but the experience with the kids first AR lead us to this question...and now were curious if it can be tuned...thats all.


Did you see my previous post stating that the ejected cases are going to hit the brass deflector anyway? Sure, you can tune it. But it ain't gonna stop the brass deflector from deflectin' dat brass. Best case is that you change which part of the deflector the cases contact. As most people have already recommended, it sounds like its working fine so it's probably best to leave it alone.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:15:08 AM EDT
I have cut half a coil off the ejector spring until they piled up where I wanted and it worked fine. I wouldn't mess with other buffers if the rifle is working.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:32:06 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
The issue is: Is there anyway to adjust the ejection of brass from 5:00 to something more forward like 3:00 for example?
View Quote


Yeah, different ammo. you DONT adjust this. if you want a noob to learn teach him its normal and is nothing.

do NOT teach him to velcro or electrical tape the "brunton bump" , tech the right things like how to shoot.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:42:40 AM EDT
Brass deflector works.... I don't get the problem...
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 10:46:54 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By JohnNYPD:
Sounds Normal....

Brass marks on Deflector = Working mans gun....

Beware of the man that has a worn
brass deflector
View Quote


I like you.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 11:12:26 AM EDT
I used to put electrical tape on mine when it was brand new to keep it looking good as long as possible. It doesn't stick out(black on black), is easy to put on and easy to peel off after you're done at the range. After shooting thousands and thousands of rounds the rest of the rifle has plenty of "character" marks and I really don't care what my brass deflector looks like. I'm sure if I were to buy another aid do the same thing for awhile...
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 11:32:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/25/2014 11:32:21 AM EDT by Eric802]
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 1:17:32 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By joshdb50:
Brass deflector works.... I don't get the problem...
View Quote

Too funny! Amen!
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 1:26:36 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mrrick:


Yeah, different ammo. you DONT adjust this. if you want a noob to learn teach him its normal and is nothing.

do NOT teach him to velcro or electrical tape the "brunton bump" , tech the right things like how to shoot.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mrrick:
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
The issue is: Is there anyway to adjust the ejection of brass from 5:00 to something more forward like 3:00 for example?


Yeah, different ammo. you DONT adjust this. if you want a noob to learn teach him its normal and is nothing.

do NOT teach him to velcro or electrical tape the "brunton bump" , tech the right things like how to shoot.

Agree 1000% The kid needs to learn the real ways of the world and he will, he's still a puppy. Its his first and he's excited so I'm not going to dampen his birthday.

After we got done dealing with him we began to wonder if we could tune it...its a curiosity and desire for knowledge rather then it being a problem.

Personally, I think it would be bad to the bone to have that ability...but at the same time I go for reliability and prefer it running with it as is...it has zero issues is the accuracy is ridiculous. As he reads this thread I am sure he will understand the value of what he has and understand that its the norm.

But his father and I are always interested in learning more...its just part of the process.
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 1:38:51 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By krichbaum:


Did you see my previous post stating that the ejected cases are going to hit the brass deflector anyway? Sure, you can tune it. But it ain't gonna stop the brass deflector from deflectin' dat brass. Best case is that you change which part of the deflector the cases contact. As most people have already recommended, it sounds like its working fine so it's probably best to leave it alone.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By krichbaum:
Originally Posted By DiveFlyFun:
Originally Posted By HK_MARK23:
simple and easy fix, dont shoot it

LOL

I know that and you know that and the kid will learn that as well. But now Im curious if it can be tuned to ones liking and its clear that quite a few here are missing this point...I understand that if aint broke dont fix it and I dont care if mine gets dinged up....but the experience with the kids first AR lead us to this question...and now were curious if it can be tuned...thats all.


Did you see my previous post stating that the ejected cases are going to hit the brass deflector anyway? Sure, you can tune it. But it ain't gonna stop the brass deflector from deflectin' dat brass. Best case is that you change which part of the deflector the cases contact. As most people have already recommended, it sounds like its working fine so it's probably best to leave it alone.

I did and you certainly aren't one of the few missing the point...I appreciate the input!
Link Posted: 4/25/2014 1:56:24 PM EDT
Have him shoot it left handed. Then explain why it's there.
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