Have no idea how i will put it to use but i just couldn't resist!!!!!!

Looks like one of the DPMS (? I think?) clone stocks.  I've seen a picture of an M231 clone that had one of them on it, it was pretty interesting looking, I'd love to do one myself, but I can't even begin to think of a way to get the threaded gas block.  Not to mention it wouldn't be very useful.  I can just imagine going to the range, and putting some M193 and M855 ball downrange with my M4geries, with all their optical glory, and reduntant sight upon sight upon sight systems (got one with an ACOG and a BUIS that I also want to piggyback a mini-red dot on to...), until it got darker, and whip out that odd looking beast, and proceed to put tracers downrange with a rifle with no sights!    I might even be tempted to bumfire that one!

Like I said, expensive, unusual, and hardly worthwhile, but such a fun dream...  

~Augee

Here ya go:

www.securityarms.com/20010315/galleryfiles/0900/916.htm

A semi auto M231 clone is not that hard to make even using all the original parts.  I'm currently working on this myself.

The main difference would be it would fire from a closed bolt to be ATF compliant.

This is not hard to do if you use a normal carrier and cut it back and use normal semi auto hammer and trigger components.  

You can still use the original stock with the nested springs and funky buffer.

I wouldn't mind having one of these myself but the gas block and an upper with no sights would be tricky for me. I am sure you could just weld up the holes where the rear sight went but I can not TIG weld and am too cheap to get someone to do it for me...

Speaking of the M231, I got to fire one while in Iraq a few times and I would love to have a real one. You are right about them being totally useless, but that much firepower coming out of that rifle, that fast is just cool.

What on earth would compel someone to make a gun without sights since the gun can presumably be removed from the vehicle and used as a personal defense weapon?  It would seem that the extra few bucks would be worth it...particularly on models that have the wire stock.

SR- Please keep us posted!  I'd be pretty interested in seeing what others would do with an M231 clone, even in semi-only.  

Honestly, I think the M231 is a fascinating evolution of the M16, but I don't see much to gain from making a semi-auto clone and trying to replicate exactly, within the letter of the law, the features of the real thing.  Not that accuracy is unimportant to me, nor am I one of those guys who thinks that all M4geries are a waste because they're not select fire, but unlike the M4, which is primarily designed for semi auto fire, the M231 was adapted in such a way to make it a full auto specific weapon, which I could never make, could never afford, and would never buy at the prices that transferable examples go for.  

Therefore, I'm not too concerned about having to cut down bolt carriers, and find original parts, I'd be satisified with a standard NDS lower and a short pistol style, or wire stock buffer tube, and an M16 upper, the sights can even stay, they don't do much good without the front sights anyways.  The appeal for me would be the downright odd aesthetics, as well as the tacit similarity of holding this odd looking weapon that is similar enough ergonomically to the real McCoy, and tyring to stream tracers out of it on to whatever.

That being said, I'm very interested in anything anyone else can manage trying to build one of these things!  Maybe someone could try and make reproductions of the gas block and handguards?  Yea, dreaming again, I know.  But who knows?  Retro lowers certainly seems to have taken off.

~Augee

Quoted: What on earth would compel someone to make a gun without sights since the gun can presumably be removed from the vehicle and used as a personal defense weapon?  It would seem that the extra few bucks would be worth it...particularly on models that have the wire stock.

No front sight. The gas block screws into the port so it would not fit, and if it were farther back it would still retard the movement of it in the port. Any farther back and you would have to call the front sight a rear sight.

I am almost positive that stock was made by a gunsmith/machinist in the chicagoland area.  I have one just like that, right down to the purple hue on the back, and the guy had made a few of them.  I bet if you pull the wire stock retainer/latch pin out you will find it covered in white grease.

Nonetheless, they are a nice copy of the M231 stock- I had to do a tiny bit of filiing and hand fitting to get the button to work easy and not stick, but now it is perfect.

 I looked for that stock for about a month,couldn't find one. Just as well I started a XM177E2 build instead. If I could ever find a M231 stock I think it would be cool with a shorty flat top upper and an Eotech sight. Nice find, Ronzo

Quoted: I am almost positive that stock was made by a gunsmith/machinist in the chicagoland area.  I have one just like that, right down to the purple hue on the back, and the guy had made a few of them.  I bet if you pull the wire stock retainer/latch pin out you will find it covered in white grease. Nonetheless, they are a nice copy of the M231 stock- I had to do a tiny bit of filiing and hand fitting to get the button to work easy and not stick, but now it is perfect.

I agree.  I knew it couldn't be an original.  I kept on looking at the stock and the pictures of the m231 in the Machine Gun Dealers Bible.  It appears that is is fairly accurate except for the length of the buffer tube, which appears to be at least an inch longer than the original.  I am wondering if this would slow the ROF in full auto.  Either way, i thought it was pretty cool simply because i didn't have one.  The latch button is actually pretty crisp as it is, i will probably not need to modify it in any way.

YOU MUST BUILD IT

probably gonna wait till i've got my 07/02 FFL and actually build a real clone just for fun.  should be within the next few months if everything goes my way.  will definitely post pics.  then just throw an ARMS #39 on it with my C-more or one of my EOTechs on it so that i can actually figure out what i'm shooting at.

And just imagine, i didn't even think about building it when i bought it.  I just didn't have one.

Are you going to build it a an open bolt full auto since you will have your 07/02?

Quoted: Are you going to build it a an open bolt full auto since you will have your 07/02?

That would be extremely difficult to do.

You would need to find the lower sideplates, the carrier, and then machine a lower to use the  open bolt parts.

I've seen one set of side plates and lower parts for sale in the past 3 years.

Quoted: What on earth would compel someone to make a gun without sights since the gun can presumably be removed from the vehicle and used as a personal defense weapon?  It would seem that the extra few bucks would be worth it...particularly on models that have the wire stock.

The weapon really wasn't designed to be used outside of the vehicle which was the problem.  Note only the RIA FPW and Colt XM231 have the wire stock.  It was dropped from the final design entirely, with the belief that the ability to use it outside of the vehicle was not worth the risk of the stock ending up in someone's face if the weapon became unlocked by accident.  Of course, how the gas tube is better is beyond me.  The stock and the sights were dropped at the same time, and the weapon was intended to use magazines with all tracers, allowing the gunner to walk the rounds onto the target.  Again a difficult proposition for a 30 round magazine and a weapon firing in excess of 1,000 RPM.  The ultimate failure of the system has come with the fact that the current M2A3 IFV and M3A3 IFV only retain two of the original six firing ports, both in the rear access doors.

Also: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M231_Firing_Port_Weapon

Yes its wikipedia, but I also happen to have wrote the small entry hehe.

Gust dreaming.



Doc

Got the upper but the handguards and the gasblock are what is holding up the project.

Also got one of the DPMS stocks - takes the standard carbine buffer and spring.

If we ever get it together we'll just stick one of the Colt carrry handle scopes on it.  It's wearing an A1 pencil barrel right now.

The ex-NG guy who barreled it said, "Where the *#@#$!! is the rear sight?

This guy is a high power competition shooter, works on ARs, ex-NG....he's never heard of or seen a 231.

Uppers without the rear sight holes were available on the EE last year but seem to have dried up.