Main argument against the gas piston systems..

AR-15 » AR Discussions

AR Sponsor:

Site Notices

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Main argument against the gas piston systems..

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:00:13 PM EDT

Just contacted Ares, and Leitner-Wise. Many probably already know this but you cannot use almost all rail type systems for either gas piston conversion. My thought- why? The whole versatility of the M16 system is based upon the rail system yet neither gas piston conversion will work with a rail system unless you go with a heavier ARMS SIR system for clearence. Another design flaw is that neither system can even be made to work by modifying a standard rail system- probably because of the large diameter of the front portion of both systems with the captured springs for the gas piston. If I want a gas piston I guess I'll stick with my 5.56 AK's with rail handgards but if I want a rail system on my AR then I guess I'll leave it stock.

Just wish SIG would release the 55x, with a lower that accepts AR mags and then all problems would be resolved.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:06:55 PM EDT

[#1]

Grenadier precision is already making a top quality rail system that is compatible w/ the LW GP system. Ultimately this is a short term problem, in the near future the market will be saturated with piston compatible rail systems.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:09:57 PM EDT

[#2]

How about handgard compatible pistons? I mean it isn't like there isn't any room under there- you'd think they would have designed them better.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:10:44 PM EDT

[#3]

check out POF's rail systems......gas piston ar's just havent hit the market with enough force yet to get anyone to invest in makeing the rails for them

and there are modifyed handgards from POF for piston systems......but for standard handgards it will not work because it would compromise the relyablity of the system inorder to make parts that small.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:11:28 PM EDT

[#4]

Yeah but who cares? The rail systems that come with most gas-piston uppers are awesome (speaking from experience). In the next year or so the market will be filled with rails that are compatible with various gas piston uppers.

- rem

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:12:37 PM EDT

[#5]

pof-usa.com they make regular M4 double-heat shielded handguards that fit around their gas-piston upper. I have one of their gas-piston uppers with the P9X predator rail system. I really like it. I wouldnt trade it for any other rail.

- rem

Quoted:
How about handgard compatible pistons? I mean it isn't like there isn't any room under there- you'd think they would have designed them better.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:20:05 PM EDT

[#6]

I have a POF with the Predator rail. I don't understand the complaints about the rail. With Magpul XT rail covers the feel of the rail (no VFG) is similar to standard M4 hanguards. It looks really big in pics on the net, but actually isn't. Kinda like the way Aimpoints look on the net...

TS

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:35:05 PM EDT

[#7]

Leitner Wise has a regualr handguard option when you buy their upper. LaRue is making future rails compatabile with LW piston systems. GP already makes an excellent rail system. Looks like your "main arguement against the gas piston systems" has no teeth.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:38:22 PM EDT

[#8]

Does it because I just called Leitner-Wise, basically their handguard is proprietary. Go get the conversion, they try to use your Knights Armament Rail system (mil-Spec), they won't fit, that is my point.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:39:53 PM EDT

[#9]

SO now for a completel conversion your talking $400-$600 for the gas piston then sell off your existing rail system to put down another $250+ on a piston specific rail system. They could make one that fits is all I'm saying.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:48:12 PM EDT

[#10]

Creeper, you aren't listening. Mark LaRue is going to make his rails compatible with the LW system. The KAC was a cool rail, 10 years ago.

Posted: 1/26/2006 1:49:43 PM EDT

[#11]

Yeah no kidding ASU1911

Pretty stupid argument against the gas-piston systems.

- rem

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:04:41 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Does it because I just called Leitner-Wise, basically their handguard is proprietary. Go get the conversion, they try to use your Knights Armament Rail system (mil-Spec), they won't fit, that is my point.

Your KAC rail does not allow the use of the milspec barrel nut... who cares? Its part of the items you replace to get the KAC rail to work on your upper. If you get a new rail system the KAC nut will not work with that either and you must buy a new barrel nut. I would not suggest a conversion as LW upperd the price to like $700 or something astronomical. Buy a new upper built by them. Sell your old upper if you have to for the cash. That is what I did.

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:51:14 PM EDT

[#13]

aw jeez...

one problem with the pistons is the piston has to be up higher so that the actuating rod can have a straight shot into the upper because they can't have a bend in them like gas tubes. I'm rambling a little OT but I think this will be or probably already is the biggest reason there are handguard issues...

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:07:24 PM EDT

[#14]

I agree with whoever said the quality rail options will follow.

As more conversions and factory piston systems get out, the manufacturers will follow.

Did someone say LT was already on this?

Your point is valid though. It is a minor influence in my procrastination.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:21:22 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Creeper, you aren't listening. Mark LaRue is going to make his rails compatible with the LW system. The KAC was a cool rail, 10 years ago.

Don't you all get it? LaRue is in! KAC is so Like "Old School"

I had a piston upper when Piston Uppers wern't cool! The Rhino Gas System

Posted: 1/26/2006 4:16:06 PM EDT

[#16]

Did you have a ninja FF rail system?

Posted: 1/26/2006 4:19:43 PM EDT

[#17]

The piston driven AR I shot got fucking hot too fast.

Posted: 1/26/2006 4:20:52 PM EDT

[#18]

The only ting Ninja about my rifle was the color! It has triangle handguards notched at the front for gas cylinder clearance

Posted: 1/27/2006 12:42:54 AM EDT

[#19]

Fella's right. You can't bend a gas piston system like a tube.

I don't care what anyone says, we have a new rail design that will make everybody wet their panties. Coming int the new year. Gas piston or impingement. Like nothing out there.

As a matter of fact the current ARM-R makes an awesome impingement rail, we just do not market it that way.

Posted: 1/27/2006 6:34:22 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
Fella's right. You can't bend a gas piston system like a tube.

I don't care what anyone says, we have a new rail design that will make everybody wet their panties. Coming int the new year. Gas piston or impingement. Like nothing out there.

As a matter of fact the current ARM-R makes an awesome impingement rail, we just do not market it that way.

Any chance of this innovative beast being displayed at SHOT, along with the FAL ARM-R

Posted: 1/27/2006 7:59:15 AM EDT

[#21]

Well I partially agree with Creeper, I wouldn't say it's the main arguement against gas piston systems, but it definately limits your choices.

At least for the present.

The ARM-R is very nice though.