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Posted: 8/17/2004 9:55:19 PM EST
I am pretty sure if I walk into this local copshop on Sep 13th (it is 13 and not 14 right?) that they would probably decline to sell me a Colt AR-15 A3 Carbine, even though i completely qualify and infact hold a CHL negating the need to call the FBI.

If this does happen can I call the big brother (BATF) and make them sell to me or can the decline and make up some BS??

These guys totally suck as the refused to sell my buddy a baton a few years ago and they mostly see to cops as they have uniforms duty holsters ect.

What do you think the chances are that they will sell one to me?

Thanks
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 10:24:28 PM EST
The BATF is going to make them sell an AR to you? If the local piggly wiggly can refuse service to people Im pretty damn sure cops can.
Link Posted: 8/17/2004 10:29:29 PM EST
Welp there goes that idea.

Thanks

Link Posted: 8/18/2004 2:44:23 AM EST
Why are you wanting to shop where your $$$ are not appreciated? I'll bet there is nothing they sell that you can't find somewhere else, cheaper. Maybe not with the "instant gratification" of an over the counter tranaction. What you should do is go there, and exclaim loudly for several customers benefit, "Hey, these prices are way too high!".

Paladin
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 3:00:09 AM EST
Why worry about it? Buy one from someone here on the boards. For the most part the local shops here suck and that is why they don't get any of my money.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 4:57:11 AM EST

Originally Posted By FredM:
I am pretty sure if I walk into this local copshop on Sep 13th (it is 13 and not 14 right?) that they would probably decline to sell me a Colt AR-15 A3 Carbine.

If this does happen can I call the big brother (BATF) and make them sell to me or can the decline and make up some BS??


Buying a AR-15 at the cop shop!!!!! And then if they say no your going to call the BATF? You really are joking arnt you?
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:03:41 AM EST

Originally Posted By have_gun_will_travel:

Originally Posted By FredM:
I am pretty sure if I walk into this local copshop on Sep 13th (it is 13 and not 14 right?) that they would probably decline to sell me a Colt AR-15 A3 Carbine.

If this does happen can I call the big brother (BATF) and make them sell to me or can the decline and make up some BS??


Buying a AR-15 at the cop shop!!!!! And then if they say no your going to call the BATF? You really are joking arnt you?



He means, newbie, a Police Supply/gunshop, not the fucking police station.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:04:51 AM EST
FWIW, the local cop shop is sitting on lots of restricted stuff - mostly magazines that they get from trade-in guns. The guys can't wait for the AWB to expire so they can unload them to the general public. Barring any ruling on marked items by the ATF, they will be selling the once-restricted stuff to everybody come Sept.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:25:03 AM EST
As an employee of a "Local Cop Shop" I can assure you that we are as eagerly awaiting the legal end of the AWB, as anyone else on this board.

However, we will have to wait to see just exactly what is and isn't legal. Hopefully there will be clarification from BATF BEFORE the date arrives. Rest assured, that as soon as it IS legal, we will be selling any and all legal items to all legal purchasers. Civilian AND LEOs.

By the way, the local LEOs seem to be all unanimous in wanting to see the AWB go away, and have no problems with law abiding citizens owning firearms for recreation, hunting, and yes, self defense.



Lonny
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 5:34:21 AM EST

He means, newbie, a Police Supply/gunshop, not the fucking police station.

I know what the hell he was talking about,what im saying is why would he want the BATF
to get involved in his life, and something that small they wouldnt even care about.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 8:34:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By xcpd69:
However, we will have to wait to see just exactly what is and isn't legal. Hopefully there will be clarification from BATF BEFORE the date arrives. Rest assured, that as soon as it IS legal, we will be selling any and all legal items to all legal purchasers. Civilian AND LEOs.



I'm sorry but what is there to "see" about? If the bans sunsets then it's gone period. Anything legal before Sept 13. 1994 will be legal on Sept 14th, 2004. There is nothing for the BATF to rule on. Any high cap mags or lower receivers marked "LEO only" will then be fully legal. Why? because there will no longer be any law saying that they aren't. BATF can not create laws. They can only give their interpretation of the current law. In this case, the law (or lack there of) is clear and no interpretation is required.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 9:13:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By cgv69:

Originally Posted By xcpd69:
However, we will have to wait to see just exactly what is and isn't legal. Hopefully there will be clarification from BATF BEFORE the date arrives. Rest assured, that as soon as it IS legal, we will be selling any and all legal items to all legal purchasers.



I'm sorry but what is there to "see" about?



Yeah, I thought that was strange to write too. '[W]e will have to wait to see...' followed by, '[A]s soon as it IS legal...' Well, which is it? Make up your mind, son.

Link Posted: 8/18/2004 9:28:23 AM EST
Why are you clamoring to give your money to people that don't want it? Shop elsewhere.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 9:42:28 AM EST
If those stupid fucks think it's illegal for a civilian to purchase an LEO Only marked Colt after the sunset, they don't deserve to be in business. Although this elitist type of horseshit is prevalent in the industry, you can take your business elsewhere!

As for xcpd69's statement, it reflects what most folks around this board already know.
Some businesses live in FEAR of the BATFE. And what is worse is those businesses seek the permission or approval of the ATF in regards to the "AWB" affected mags and weapons. Sure these businesses have to answer to the ATF, but the ATF can't say jack shit about anything covered by the "AWB" once it sunsets.

Come 9-13-04,


BATFE CAN SUCK MY BIGGER TESTICLE!!!!!

Until then, the BATFE should practice on small testicles just for practice.

HS1
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 10:09:23 AM EST

Originally Posted By HighStrung1:
If those stupid fucks think it's illegal for a civilian to purchase an LEO Only marked Colt after the sunset, they don't deserve to be in business. Although this elitist type of horseshit is prevalent in the industry, you can take your business elsewhere!

As for xcpd69's statement, it reflects what most folks around this board already know.
Some businesses live in FEAR of the BATFE. And what is worse is those businesses seek the permission or approval of the ATF in regards to the "AWB" affected mags and weapons. Sure these businesses have to answer to the ATF, but the ATF can't say jack shit about anything covered by the "AWB" once it sunsets.

Come 9-13-04,


BATFE CAN SUCK MY BIGGER TESTICLE!!!!!

Until then, the BATFE should practice on small testicles just for practice.

HS1



That's all well and good, unless you are in a business where the BATF can revoke your license, shut you down, fine you or put you in jail, for ignoring the law, their regulations and rulings. Sure an individual might get away with minor infractions, or be ignored as a waste of time, but not a business.

Right now, there is still some confusion as to how things will be after the Ban expires, but I'm almost certain things will be cleared up by the time it expires and we can go on with life, with the ban a bad memory.

It would be insanely stupid to "jump the gun," and risk legal problems and the attendant legal fees (Lawyers ain't cheap) with the end in sight.



Lonny
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 10:22:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By cgv69:

Originally Posted By xcpd69:
However, we will have to wait to see just exactly what is and isn't legal. Hopefully there will be clarification from BATF BEFORE the date arrives. Rest assured, that as soon as it IS legal, we will be selling any and all legal items to all legal purchasers. Civilian AND LEOs.



I'm sorry but what is there to "see" about? If the bans sunsets then it's gone period. Anything legal before Sept 13. 1994 will be legal on Sept 14th, 2004. There is nothing for the BATF to rule on. Any high cap mags or lower receivers marked "LEO only" will then be fully legal. Why? because there will no longer be any law saying that they aren't. BATF can not create laws. They can only give their interpretation of the current law. In this case, the law (or lack there of) is clear and no interpretation is required.



Interestingly enough, that seems to be the opinion of at least two BATF agents in meetings with local dealers in two different parts of the country, recently. And in all likelyhood WILL be what comes down officially. Waiting until an official letter confirms it though is prudent. And that letter should be forthcoming by the time the Ban ends.



Lonny
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 11:08:24 AM EST
The ATF, CANNOT MAKE UP REGS, they can ONLY INFORCE REGULATIONS SET FORTH BY BOTH HOUSES AND THE PRESIDENT.

When the ban sunsets, it is gone, NO MAG RESTRICTIONS, NOTHING, it will be just like it was BEFORE SEPT 1004.....
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 11:22:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 12:03:56 PM EST by u-baddog]
I cant even understand why you would want to give anyone money who you think SUCKS. They dont have to sell you shit. Maybe they thought your buddy was a whacko and shouldnt have a baton.

You know what would piss them off , if you opened up a cop shop and wouldnt sell them anything
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 11:29:58 AM EST
The law is worded in a funny way, so effectively the ban is 10 years and 1 day, making everything legal again on September 14, 2004.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 11:33:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 11:33:21 AM EST by corwin1968]

Originally Posted By xcpd69:
As an employee of a "Local Cop Shop" I can assure you that we are as eagerly awaiting the legal end of the AWB, as anyone else on this board.

However, we will have to wait to see just exactly what is and isn't legal. Hopefully there will be clarification from BATF BEFORE the date arrives. Rest assured, that as soon as it IS legal, we will be selling any and all legal items to all legal purchasers. Civilian AND LEOs.

By the way, the local LEOs seem to be all unanimous in wanting to see the AWB go away, and have no problems with law abiding citizens owning firearms for recreation, hunting, and yes, self defense.



Lonny



If you don't mind my asking, are you anywhere near OKC? I'd love to go shopping in a "cop shop" come mid-september!
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 11:39:41 AM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 11:40:41 AM EST by Dave_A]
They have a right to refuse service...

You have a right to shop elsewhere...
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:08:35 PM EST

If those stupid fucks think it's illegal for a civilian to purchase an LEO Only marked Colt after the sunset, they don't deserve to be in business. Although this elitist type of horseshit is prevalent in the industry, you can take your business elsewhere!



AMEN!!!!!
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:11:51 PM EST

Originally Posted By xcpd69:
That's all well and good, unless you are in a business where the BATF can revoke your license, shut you down, fine you or put you in jail, for ignoring the law, their regulations and rulings. Sure an individual might get away with minor infractions, or be ignored as a waste of time, but not a business.

Right now, there is still some confusion as to how things will be after the Ban expires, but I'm almost certain things will be cleared up by the time it expires and we can go on with life, with the ban a bad memory.

It would be insanely stupid to "jump the gun," and risk legal problems and the attendant legal fees (Lawyers ain't cheap) with the end in sight.



Lonny



They can not put you in jail, close you down or anything else for ignoring their "rulings" (well I guess they could try but any lawyer worth anything would have you out\open for business in no time.) Their "rulings" are meaningless and carry no legal weight. It's simply their opinion and is no more meaningful than yours or mine. Same thing goes for their regulations (depending on what you mean by their "regulations"?) Remember, they are nothing more then Federal Police Officers. All they can do is enforce the law as it is written.

Aside from that, please help me understand "confusion as to how things will be after the Ban expires"? It seems so blatantly clear and simply that I can't understand what could possible be causing any confusion?

Thanks
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:21:53 PM EST
This has become pointless and is rapidly deteriorating. What is an internet debate and what is reality are two different things. Enjoy your debate, I have nothing further to add.



Lonny
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:22:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By u-baddog:
I cant even understand why you would want to give anyone money who you think SUCKS. They dont have to sell you shit. Maybe they thought your buddy was a whacko and shouldnt have a baton.

You know what would piss them off , if you opened up a cop shop and wouldnt sell them anything



I have known people in the past who have given money to someone they thought sucked.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:28:41 PM EST
[Last Edit: 8/18/2004 12:31:37 PM EST by RenegadeX]

Originally Posted By xcpd69:

Right now, there is still some confusion as to how things will be after the Ban expires, but I'm almost certain things will be cleared up by the time it expires and we can go on with life, with the ban a bad memory.



The only confusion is some folks have confused the AWB ban with the import ban, and think we will be importing HK91/93/94 again, which is incorrect. For those that know the difference (and live in a free state), there is no confusion on the AWB ban, it will be just like September 12, 1994.
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 12:34:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By FredM:
Welp there goes that idea.

Thanks


Link Posted: 8/18/2004 2:45:33 PM EST

O. P. by xcpd69:
This has become pointless and is rapidly deteriorating. What is an internet debate and what is reality are two different things. Enjoy your debate, I have nothing further to add.



In this case, internet debate and reality are one and the same. In the case of your " Cop Shop" the ATF has succeeded in causing your unjust fears. That fear will cost you money. But you have LEO's to sell to, so fuck us civilians right!

HS1
Link Posted: 8/18/2004 3:12:02 PM EST

Originally Posted By HighStrung1:

O. P. by xcpd69:
This has become pointless and is rapidly deteriorating. What is an internet debate and what is reality are two different things. Enjoy your debate, I have nothing further to add.



In this case, internet debate and reality are one and the same. In the case of your " Cop Shop" the ATF has succeeded in causing your unjust fears. That fear will cost you money. But you have LEO's to sell to, so fuck us civilians right!

HS1

Link Posted: 8/19/2004 1:12:47 PM EST
If the shop in quesstion wouldn't sell a baton to your friend, what makes you think they are going to let you walk out of the store with a firearm?
Link Posted: 8/19/2004 4:33:42 PM EST
What do you expect the BATFE to do? Make them sell you a gun? There isn't any law that says a store has to sell stuff to anybody that comes through the door. The ATF would probably give them an award for not selling to regular citizens.
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