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Posted: 5/15/2008 8:25:53 AM EDT
So we have POF, LWRC, Bushmaster, soon to be LMT and HK.  Also the Sig 556 and Massada that are similar to the AR (not sure if I am missing any).  What are the pros and cons of each?  I plan on buying the HK if and when its available (I am a huge HK fan so its a must!).

I however want a new AR prior to the release of the HK.  How do all of these stack up?

Dave
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 8:32:15 AM EDT
[#1]
HK for the WIN!
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 8:50:46 AM EDT
[#2]
Heck yeah just picked up my HK 416 14.5" upper yesterday :) (but I think you know that from the other board LOL)
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 10:41:00 AM EDT
[#3]
I would wait till the move for LWRC is made to the new facility and get the new polygonal/hammer forged barrels with the Tennifer type finish to come out on the production rifles.  At that point you should have the toughest barrel possible to match IMO the best piston system out there.  The wait for a LWRC is just too long right now till the switch happens as well.  

Bushmaster is just an older version of the POF minus the extras. The Sig 556 is similar to an AK more than an AR.  The Masada (Bushmaster ACR) is similar to an AR180 more than an AR.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 5:39:54 PM EDT
[#4]
You forgot Ares Defense.  I have one of their kits in one of my carbines.  About 500 rounds through it now with zero problems.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 5:50:03 PM EDT
[#5]

Quoted:
So we have POF, LWRC, Bushmaster, soon to be LMT and HK.  Also the Sig 556 and Massada that are similar to the AR (not sure if I am missing any).  What are the pros and cons of each?  I plan on buying the HK if and when its available (I am a huge HK fan so its a must!).

I however want a new AR prior to the release of the HK.  How do all of these stack up?

Dave




Link Posted: 5/15/2008 6:10:21 PM EDT
[#6]
I have a POF and like it.

But I think I better get an HK too in order to compare.  
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 8:52:50 PM EDT
[#7]
Bushmaster will custom build a GP conversion on a Carbon 15 upper and their 16" Superlight barrel if you special order it. If matched to their Carbon 15 M4 type lower it will probably result in one of the lightest GP AR's... I'll let you know when this prototype comes in
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 9:06:52 PM EDT
[#8]
I'm on the LWRC waiting list. Let's see... since February, so still quite awhile to go. My upper will be in 6.8, but now I am having doubts and wish I'd stuck with 5.56.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 9:08:51 PM EDT
[#9]
Ares is the best out of all of them on the market. Installs in ten minutes on an upper of your choosing and will run flawlessly. Mine has well over 4K through it and Geoff at Ares has several uppes with over 10K.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 9:31:49 PM EDT
[#10]
I like the Osprey but it is only for mil and police so farI hope they release it to the public.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 9:34:43 PM EDT
[#11]
I am very happy with my POF upper.

1300+ rounds through 9.25" POF upper
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 10:02:46 PM EDT
[#12]
PWS and Adams Arms.
Link Posted: 5/15/2008 10:57:11 PM EDT
[#13]
+1 on the ADAMS ARMS retrofit system
http://www.adamsarms.net/images/gallery/Adams6.jpg
Link Posted: 5/16/2008 5:29:04 AM EDT
[#14]

Quoted:
I'm on the LWRC waiting list. Let's see... since February, so still quite awhile to go. My upper will be in 6.8, but now I am having doubts and wish I'd stuck with 5.56.


They've recently moved into another state so don't worry.  You aren't the only person waiting and having ordered 6.8 doesn't make a difference.  
Link Posted: 5/16/2008 7:45:13 AM EDT
[#15]
Not to start any "flamers"... Being an Army vet from the '70s, my "issue" weapon was an M16 w/203. I have "conventional" GI ARs including MRP CQB and am happy with all of them. The only reason I got interested in GP AR conversions at all (climb into my Nomex suit) is that I am VERY pleased with my Kel Tec PLR-16. Kel-Tec put GP on their 223/556 pistols and carbines and ELIMINATED THE RECEIVER EXTENSION (buffer tube). Their pistols are shorter than many AR-15 pistols, and their SBRs have TRUE FOLDING STOCKS. They are relatively inexpensive, lightweight and VERY VERY RELIABLE. The PLR-16 uses AR-15 mags and are both accurate and very light weight. Function has been flawless with several different types of commercial and surplus 223/556 ammo. It is sufficiently reliable that it has taken its place as one of my two SHTF firearms for home defense. (The other is a Kimber 45ACP). My PLR-16 has the optional foregrip (which puts a Picatinny rail under the fore-end, in addition to a Picatinny rail on top of the receiver). A Phantom flash suppressor does wonders for eliminating flash for night firing. You can read more about the PLR-16 here if you like:
http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/plr16.html

If you MUST have a rifle stock, Kel Tec makes carbines and SBRs using the same action as the PLR-16. The SBR SU-16D is available with both 9" and 12" barrels. I have no personal experience with either the SBRs or carbines so cannot comment on them:
http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/su16d.html

The cost of either the Kel-Tec PLR-16 or SU-16D is on par with many GP conversion kits. However unlike the GP uppers/conversions you can probably buy one at your FFL dealer NOW, if you don't want to wait... The prices (retail $665/$874) are heavily discounted, and you may be able to pick up a new one for much less than a 1000 rnd case of surplus ammo. (I do not want to get into a Kel-Tec vs AR argument here. They both have their places, and I respect both Eugene Stoner and George Kellgren as brilliant designers)

The cost of the ultra-light, Carbon 15 GP upper I ordered from BFI was a tiny bit more than the cost of a 16" LMT GP barrel assy for the MRP (and weighs less than the CQB MRP upper with GP barrel installed). The new BFI GP upper will "share" a BFI Carbon-15 M4 type lower (ACE stock, MAGPUL grips, match trigger) with a MRP CQB and a 24" SS HBAR match upper.

Note: I am not planning to shoot matches with the BFI GP upper, so please no flamers about lightweight vs heavy barrel GPs for accuracy, or GP vs GI. There are plenty of posts on the other thread if you want to get into that. I'll be sure to update the board on the ultralight GP AR (when I eventually get it and shoot it. It may be months...
Link Posted: 5/22/2008 9:29:43 PM EDT
[#16]
How does the ADAMS Arms compare to the Ares lightning system?
Link Posted: 5/22/2008 10:08:22 PM EDT
[#17]
I have a 14.5" POF upper and I added a VLTOR CASV-EL rail system to it.  

I'm also waiting on an LWRC upper (M6A2).  To me, I think any modern piston design is good, but the LWRC is more appealing than the POF, in my opinion.  The LWRC's design are more like a "typical" AR.  The POF's handguards have a lot to be desired, unless you buy a rail system and do some heavy-duty modifications to it.

Just my 2 cents.
Link Posted: 5/23/2008 4:04:00 AM EDT
[#18]

Quoted:
So we have POF, LWRC, Bushmaster, soon to be LMT and HK.  Also the Sig 556 and Massada that are similar to the AR (not sure if I am missing any).  What are the pros and cons of each?  I plan on buying the HK if and when its available (I am a huge HK fan so its a must!).

I however want a new AR prior to the release of the HK.  How do all of these stack up?

Dave



If I go PISTON

Then it will be a Total differnt Rifle/Carbine than the AR15
Like the massada


I like the AR15 as is


but Thats just Me
Link Posted: 5/26/2008 3:59:18 AM EDT
[#19]
Yeah I have been into AR's for a while now but I just got my first AR-15 about 6 months ago and I love it.. Im not saying if they released the HK 416 upper here I wouldnt buy one cuz I would, I would love to have somthing I could depend on a whole lot more.. But I am very happy with what I have right now.. I must say I didnt think I would get so addicted to the damn thing, its like I have to have everything on the market for it and im running out of space so Im pretty sure I will be buying another AR-15 but I really would like to get the 416 but if not then I will be happy with a nice LMT.. I really only use it for targer shooting and home defence and I have not had one prob with the AR im using now only with ammo (wolf) but I found some nice stuff that gives me about 1 moa (ultramax 68gr HP match).. But I guess not having shot a 416 I don't know what I am missing, there is one bad thing I have heard about the piston gas systems is there is much more recoil (not that there is much to begin with) but still is it true that there is more recoil?
Link Posted: 5/26/2008 4:13:29 AM EDT
[#20]

Quoted:
Yeah I have been into AR's for a while now but I just got my first AR-15 about 6 months ago and I love it.. Im not saying if they released the HK 416 upper here I wouldnt buy one cuz I would, I would love to have somthing I could depend on a whole lot more.. But I am very happy with what I have right now.. I must say I didnt think I would get so addicted to the damn thing, its like I have to have everything on the market for it and im running out of space so Im pretty sure I will be buying another AR-15 but I really would like to get the 416 but if not then I will be happy with a nice LMT.. I really only use it for tager shooting and home defence and I have not had one prob with the AR im using now only with ammo (wolf) but I found some nice stuff that gives me about 1 moa (ultramax 68gr HP match).. But I guess not having shot a 416 I don't know what I am missing, there is one bad thing I have heard about the piston gas systems is there is much more recoil (not that there is much to begin with) but still is it true that there is more recoil?



Im very happy with my 2 LMT M4`s

I can depend on them AS IS
Link Posted: 5/26/2008 6:40:39 AM EDT
[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:
So we have POF, LWRC, Bushmaster, soon to be LMT and HK.  Also the Sig 556 and Massada that are similar to the AR (not sure if I am missing any).  What are the pros and cons of each?  I plan on buying the HK if and when its available (I am a huge HK fan so its a must!).

I however want a new AR prior to the release of the HK.  How do all of these stack up?

Dave



If I go PISTON

Then it will be a Total differnt Rifle/Carbine than the AR15
Like the massada


I like the AR15 as is


but Thats just Me


I will probably get a Bushmaster ACR too... but it will still never be able to be as compact as the AR gas piston due to the gas system design and the room thats left for a suppressor... we also have to see about accuracy, it certainly wont have the barrel quality of the new LWRC rifles nor the warranty/customer service.  I like having a rifle 2" shorter so I wont be selling the LWRC no matter what.  I for one am happy I sold my LMT to finance my LWRC... no regrets what so ever.  The dark side will call you eventually.
Link Posted: 5/26/2008 6:52:47 AM EDT
[#22]
i am extremely pleased with my pof 9.25" m16.

Now that i have carried a steyr AQAUg for a weekend, i can say that a bullpup AUG may be the way to go if i was going to switch to another rifle system.
Link Posted: 5/27/2008 7:00:00 PM EDT
[#23]
The LWRC rifle is hard to beat.  

The POF is well proven also.
Link Posted: 6/4/2008 1:41:20 PM EDT
[#24]
LWRC
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