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Posted: 10/25/2004 10:47:18 AM EST
Has anyone used them?

I've been thinking about getting a set, but didn't know if it was worth the $30.

KNS Anti Rotation Pins
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:12:35 AM EST

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
Has anyone used them?

I've been thinking about getting a set, but didn't know if it was worth the $30.

KNS Anti Rotation Pins



I've got a set on my AR and they're nice, but they really aren't anything more than a fad item, espcially for semi-auto AR's. I've never had normal trigger pins walk out on me.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:22:59 AM EST

Originally Posted By ipsilateral_7:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
Has anyone used them?

I've been thinking about getting a set, but didn't know if it was worth the $30.

KNS Anti Rotation Pins



I've got a set on my AR and they're nice, but they really aren't anything more than a fad item, espcially for semi-auto AR's. I've never had normal trigger pins walk out on me.



Thanks alot. I just wasn't sure since there really isn't anything keeping the pins in other than the force of the spring pushing it against the hole lower.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:26:54 AM EST
I put a set in my first & favorite lower....though I probably didn't "need" them.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:27:10 AM EST
I broke a J-Pin a couple of years ago and the hammer pin started to walk out but that's not why I bought a set recently. I really just wanted to see what they were all about and so far, I'm impressed. The quality is top-notch but IMHO they aren't necessary. Maybe if you had an old beat up lower with egg shaped holes...
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:42:47 AM EST
No it's brand new, and actually has never had an upper installed on it. I was just thinking prevenative measures
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 11:50:51 AM EST
Since there is no need to protect that expensive preban lower anymore (at least in most states), they are not needed. I do have one on my machine gun and woundn't think about shooting it without one.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 12:38:18 PM EST
They are cheap insurance, plus they allow you to lube the pivots through the pins so you can ensure that the hammer and triggers are actually lubed on the contact points with the pins.

Link Posted: 10/25/2004 12:48:24 PM EST
I have them in my M16 because, well, M16's are expensive. Unless you are having problems with the pins walking out I don't think they are necessary on a semi-auto. Nice, but unnecessary. For sure, you'll never wear out the holes with the KNS pins installed.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 12:55:15 PM EST
I was under the impression these worked best for M16 lowers.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 12:57:49 PM EST

Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
I was under the impression these worked best for M16 lowers.



I can't imagine NOT using them on an M16 lower! BTW they also make one for the sear pin. I had to do a little mod on my rear takedown pin for it to work perfectly, but it's worth it.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 2:12:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By gus:

I can't imagine NOT using them on an M16 lower! BTW they also make one for the sear pin. I had to do a little mod on my rear takedown pin for it to work perfectly, but it's worth it.



I have not installed them, but for now I'm shooting an RDIAS in a Bushmaster lower so I'll toss it when I egg it out.
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 5:07:47 PM EST
I have a set installed in my colt match hbar lower for over a year. These pins are sweeet!! An added benefit of KNS pins, they maintain the correct geometry of the pins.

I use the Jewell trigger setup, and since I installed the pins, the trigger has improved greatly. The trigger pull is now glassy and repeatable.

Well worth the price!!

Stuart
Link Posted: 10/25/2004 5:11:44 PM EST
"A fool and his money are soon parted."

and that's all I've got to say about that.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 12:59:36 AM EST
I put a set in a lower which holes were large enoygh to let the pins rotate.
I'm happy with them and will use them in another lower.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 3:52:49 AM EST
There worth the money. I've got an old Colt SP1 and after 40,000 round the hammer pin hole was so out of round I had to have them welded and redrilled, cost $55. Sometimes the hammer wouldn't catch on the trigger and disconector, very scary.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:04:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By Forest:
"A fool and his money are soon parted."

and that's all I've got to say about that.




I guess that needless comment could be used for everyone here now couldn't it?

I had a question about a $30 set of pins. I don't think that was a nessesary comment really.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:44:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
I had a question about a $30 set of pins. I don't think that was a nessesary comment really.


It answered your questions perfectly - the question is do you have the wisdom to understand it?
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:46:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
I had a question about a $30 set of pins. I don't think that was a nessesary comment really.


It answered your questions perfectly - the question is do you have the wisdom to understand it?



I guess you're a genious because I didn't get it. All I took from it was an insult for asking a question about a prevenative measure.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:54:34 AM EST

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
I had a question about a $30 set of pins. I don't think that was a nessesary comment really.


It answered your questions perfectly - the question is do you have the wisdom to understand it?



I guess you're a genious because I didn't get it. All I took from it was an insult for asking a question about a prevenative measure.






98Zixxer,

Spend a little more time around here before you bash one of the more knowledgeable members of this board. Were I you, I'd give serious consideration to what Forest has to say.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:01:31 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 5:02:41 AM EST by 98Zixxer]

Originally Posted By The_Friendly_Sponge:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
I had a question about a $30 set of pins. I don't think that was a nessesary comment really.


It answered your questions perfectly - the question is do you have the wisdom to understand it?



I guess you're a genious because I didn't get it. All I took from it was an insult for asking a question about a prevenative measure.




here




I didn't bash anyone. I responded to what looked to me as him calling me a fool for asking a question as a new AR15 shooter.


Look, I don't know what was he's getting at, and from what I saw was him calling me a fool for asking a question before making a purchase that wasn't needed.

I'm seeing it's worth it, and I'm seeing it's not worth it. I'm taking it all to heart and thinking about it. It's not like I asked if I should buy something pointless that I'll never use on the rifle. It is used everytime I fire it. All he had to do is say.....

"They suck don't waste your money" or "They're great I reccomend them."
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:19:27 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 5:23:46 AM EST by howlie]



civility

ci·vil·i·ty [ si víllətee ] (plural ci·vil·i·ties)

noun

1. politeness: the formal politeness that results from observing social conventions


2. polite act: something said or done in a formally polite way


knowledgeable

adj 1: highly educated; having extensive information or understanding; "an enlightened public"; "knowing instructors"; "a knowledgeable critic"; "a knowledgeable audience" [syn: enlightened, knowing, learned, lettered, well-educated, well-read] 2: thoroughly acquainted with and skilled in something through study or experience; "well versed in classical languages" [syn: versed] [ant: unversed] 3: alert and fully informed; "politically aware"; "a knowing collector of rare books"; "the most...technically aware of the novelists under thirty"- W.S.Graham; "surprisingly knowledgeable about what was going on" [syn: aware(p), knowing] 4: thoroughly acquainted with through study or experience; "this girl, so intimate with nature"-W.H.Hudson; "knowledgeaIble about the technique of painting"- Herbert Read [syn: intimate, intimate with, knowledgeable about(p)]



These two words are great together....

Link Posted: 10/26/2004 5:23:00 AM EST

Originally Posted By howlie:
civility




ci·vil·i·ty [ si víllətee ] (plural ci·vil·i·ties)

noun

1. politeness: the formal politeness that results from observing social conventions


2. polite act: something said or done in a formally polite way






I thought I was bein civil......I'm keeping it that way. I haven't bashed anyone, nor have I used obscene language to make this uncivil
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 6:50:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
Look, I don't know what was he's getting at, and from what I saw was him calling me a fool for asking a question before making a purchase that wasn't needed.


Nobody called you a fool for asking a question.

It was pointed out that purchasing this product would put you into that catagory.



It's not like I asked if I should buy something pointless that I'll never use on the rifle.


That is EXACTLY what you asked.

Funny how all those M16s lasted for decades w/o the device...
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 7:00:01 AM EST

Originally Posted By Forest:

Originally Posted By 98Zixxer:
Look, I don't know what was he's getting at, and from what I saw was him calling me a fool for asking a question before making a purchase that wasn't needed.


Nobody called you a fool for asking a question.

It was pointed out that purchasing this product would put you into that catagory.



It's not like I asked if I should buy something pointless that I'll never use on the rifle.


That is EXACTLY what you asked.

Funny how all those M16s lasted for decades w/o the device...



Well that's why I asked now wasn't it hatneeded and not something pointless
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 9:49:02 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 9:50:46 AM EST by Parrandero]

Originally Posted By Forest:
"A fool and his money are soon parted."

and that's all I've got to say about that.




Originally Posted by WSAR15:
I put a set in a lower which holes were large enough to let the pins rotate.
I'm happy with then and will use them in another lower




Originaly posted by Mouseomatic:
There worth the money. I've got an ole Colt SP1 and after 40,000 round the hammer pin hole was so out of round I had to have them welded and redrilled, cost $55. Sometimes the hammer wouldn't catch on the trigger and disconector, very scary.



etc. etc.

Guess I will join the rank fools as determined by "one of the more knowledgeable members of this board."
I installed a set in a lower in conjunction with a Chip McCormick drop in trigger/hammer group. I did this to replace the pins with c clips on the end. Was this techinically necessary? No, I did it because I wanted to and that is all that's necessary.

Does this make me a fool? Not only no, but hell no! It suited me to do that and what some "more knowledgeable member of this board" thinks is totally irrelevant!!!!!

Sometimes some of you guys are worse then children, can't ask a question around here without getting some smartass answer and then some asskisser chimming in saying you better listen now, hear me!

Time to crawl back into the cave, had enough of this today, must be post election jitters, nite all. This FOOL signing off.


Link Posted: 10/26/2004 10:48:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By Parrandero:
and then some asskisser chimming in saying you better listen now, hear me!




Sigh... Are you always such a dick?
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 11:17:23 AM EST
The AR weapon system was designed along time ago and it makes sense to me that during the course of several decades of observed use under lots of different conditions that product improvements would be developed.

I used to own a 20+ year old SGW AR lower and while it worked wonderfully the pin holes were getting so very loose that the pins would fall straight through the lower if inserted by themselves. I think this was caused more from lots and lots of lower receiver assembly and reassembly. I got into the habit of always removing the trigger group to clean the lower out after shooting. My gut feeling is that this placed more wear and tear on the lower than anything else. Although I am sure actually shooting the weapon does some wear and tear on it as well.

Interesting to note that the .mil does not allow troops to disassemble their trigger groups at all (unless they are an armorer at a higher than company level). I don't know specifically why this is not allowed but my suspicion is that it does in-fact lead to premature wear and tear on the pin holes. During my time in the Army I saw lots and lots of uppers get replaced but I can hardly ever remember a lower getting worked on much less replaced.

I bought a set of these pins to test out because it seems like they will work as advertised. I even tested out the rotation on my stock Bushmaster and LMT lowers while dry firing - you can feel the hammer pin rotate as it dry fires. If nothing else these pins will slow down my efforts to remove the trigger group so easily and maybe I will finally learn to leave it alone for cleaning
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 1:47:24 PM EST

Originally Posted By Parrandero:

Originally Posted By Forest:
"A fool and his money are soon parted."

and that's all I've got to say about that.




Originally Posted by WSAR15:
I put a set in a lower which holes were large enough to let the pins rotate.
I'm happy with then and will use them in another lower




Originaly posted by Mouseomatic:
There worth the money. I've got an ole Colt SP1 and after 40,000 round the hammer pin hole was so out of round I had to have them welded and redrilled, cost $55. Sometimes the hammer wouldn't catch on the trigger and disconector, very scary.



etc. etc.

Guess I will join the rank fools as determined by "one of the more knowledgeable members of this board."
I installed a set in a lower in conjunction with a Chip McCormick drop in trigger/hammer group. I did this to replace the pins with c clips on the end. Was this techinically necessary? No, I did it because I wanted to and that is all that's necessary.

Does this make me a fool? Not only no, but hell no! It suited me to do that and what some "more knowledgeable member of this board" thinks is totally irrelevant!!!!!

Sometimes some of you guys are worse then children, can't ask a question around here without getting some smartass answer and then some asskisser chimming in saying you better listen now, hear me!

Time to crawl back into the cave, had enough of this today, must be post election jitters, nite all. This FOOL signing off.





made sense to me. Now if you asked me about lowering your civic, i might say "a fool....."
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 4:24:09 PM EST

Originally Posted By gus:
I can't imagine NOT using them on an M16 lower! BTW they also make one for the sear pin. I had to do a little mod on my rear takedown pin for it to work perfectly, but it's worth it.



A BIG +1 HERE!

I have them in my registered M16, and wouldn't have it any other way. I also use the KNS sear pin. With M16 lowers priced above $10K now, I figure that $30 is cheap enough insurance. Not to mention that M16's do wear out the pin holes. Otherwise Mike Klos wouldn't have to be welding them up and redrilling for people all of the time. I wouldn't worry about it in an average semi-auto AR-15 though.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 7:03:24 PM EST
Well, I guess I'm a fool. I installed a set on my BM for shits and giggles. I found that the trigger break was much more concise, "breaking a glass rod" comes to mind. If you want to improve your trigger pull, which the last time I checked improves your accuracy, I would suggest giving them a try. Worst case scenario, you sell them for 5-10 less than what you paid. HTH.
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 10:49:43 PM EST
[stands]

Hi.

My name is Ellery, and I'm a fool.

[sits]
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 11:02:54 PM EST
Im waiting on my KNS set..going on my new 20" AR build. Im in it mostly for the enhancing the crispness (if thats a word) of the trigger group, other than that it will just be something my son can ask.."what are those" then i can tell them ..."Those.....Those my son are precision machined $30 a set trigger and hammer pin holder thingys"."Dont be a fool listen to your father"..
Link Posted: 10/26/2004 11:21:08 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/26/2004 11:24:43 PM EST by RABIDFOX50]

Originally Posted By Ellery_Holt:
[stands]

Hi.

My name is Ellery, and I'm a fool.

[sits]



Welcome, now that everyone is here, lets start the meeting....[

Remember, it's all about that Bling-Bling on your AR! I got em too so I guess I'm in the club!
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:15:08 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 6:59:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By Feedingcannibal:
KNS thread.



Thanks alot.

I read the thread and will most likely order a set after I get the complete rifle assemble.
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