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Posted: 4/11/2006 6:38:23 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 12:22:40 PM EST by KeltechSu16CA]
I LIVE IN CALIFORNIA" I KNOW I FEEL SORRY FOR ME TOO, NEEDLESS TO SAY I CAN'T HAVE AN AR-15 BUT I CAN AND DO HAVE A SU16-CA KELTEC.
I REALLY LIKE THIS RIFLE IT REALLY IS RELIABLE AND VERY ACCURATE (1.5 MOA@100 YRDS!) WELL NOT ALWAYS DEPENDING ON THE SHOOTER.

SO WE WENT TO THE RANGE MY FRIEND WAS LUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE AN AR BEFORE THE HOLLYWOOD SHOOT OUT. WE BOTH HAVE BEEN SHOOTING FOR A LONG TIME NORMALLY BOLT ACTION RIFLE .308 30/06 AT RANGES WELL PAST THE 600 METERS MARK.
WE DID A TEST AND THEY SHOOT THE SAME!
WE SHOT OUT TO 200 WITH THE SAME RESULTS! BOTH HAVE A EOTECH RED DOTS
HE HAD A FEW JAMS MAYBE BECAUSE WE WERE USING WOLF.

I STILL LIKE THE AR BETTER BECAUSE DAMN IT JUST LOOKS F@#%^G GREAT!
I LOVE THE PISTOL GRIP AND THE WAY IT’S A STRAIGHT LINE TO YOUR SHOULDER AHHHH .
BUT FOR $600 YOU CANT BEAT IT! MUCH BETTER THEN MY MINI-14
and SKS
now these are old pics before igot the Eotech I AM USING A TROGLO 2.5 MOA RED DOT X2 PIECE OF CRAP IF YOUASK I SENT IT BACK BUT THE M-6 LASER FLASH LIGHT WORKS GREAT AND SO DOES THE AK-74 FLASH/M BRAKE
http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9358/picture0486kb.th.jpg
http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/2037/sm7083752cc0oi.th.jpg
http://img342.imageshack.us/img342/9708/plrforendslingscopewt9sg.th.jpg
http://img342.imageshack.us/img342/2418/picture0466te.th.jpg
http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/5413/picture0524wa.th.jpg
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:44:43 PM EST
I feel sorry for the next poor sap that tries to read this post. My brain hurts all of a sudden.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:49:12 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 6:49:55 PM EST by DBAR]
I'm just going to say "Bull Shit".
One more thing GTFO (you figure it out).
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:51:16 PM EST
WHY DOES YOUR BRAIN HURT? TAKE A PAIN KILLER.
head.gif
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:52:42 PM EST
you're a looser if u tipe in awl kaps
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:53:07 PM EST
BULL SHIT ON WHAT?
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:54:35 PM EST
AM I? What about when you cant spell what does that make you?
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:59:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 7:00:06 PM EST by ALPHAGHOST]
Garand

of your choices: Kel-Tec

pls cut off the "caps lock" button

IBTL
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:59:43 PM EST
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:05:27 PM EST
Is that for other guns?
Is evryone rude or maybe just you
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:07:54 PM EST

Personally, if I couldn't have an AR, I'd get a M1A/M14 clone.



1.5 MOA is impressive with a red-dot sight, btw.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:08:43 PM EST

Originally Posted By Boom:
This has nothing to do with the AR15. Sorry you live in a commie state, that's your fault not mine. You need to post this stupid thread here: ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=6&f=2 and not in the AR discussion forum.



how do I move it ?
horse.gif
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:10:34 PM EST
well its a eotech 1 moa dot I am using IMI ammo 55 gr 1:9 and sand bags. Years of shooting helps as well.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:16:19 PM EST

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
well its a eotech 1 moa dot I am using IMI ammo 55 gr 1:9 and sand bags. Years of shooting helps as well.



Without match ammo, it's VERY impressive shooting - and perhaps a little luck

I've been shooting (on and off) for about 30 years, and would have trouble with that, even off a sand bag.

Good job.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:27:59 PM EST

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
well its a eotech 1 moa dot I am using IMI ammo 55 gr 1:9 and sand bags. Years of shooting helps as well.



Without match ammo, it's VERY impressive shooting - and perhaps a little luck hooting
Good job. hr

Thank you I dont always shoot that on average 2-3 moa but yeah i did get lucky but with a scope I do shoot on avverage 1.5-2.5 moa using Isreali ammo headbang.gif
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:31:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 7:35:05 PM EST by KeltechSu16CA]
With my 30-06 I can - or 1 moa but not always

It has 1 pound triger pull SAVAGE F 111

leapold scope harris pod
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:51:16 PM EST
just so you guys know it kicks the crap out of my SKS Now I am talking about the CA model I have added a AK-74 brake on it
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 9:50:59 PM EST
Keltec,

Dude you can get an AR in Kalifornia. Have you been living in a cave for the past few months? Kalifornians are sucking the market of lowers, and uppers dry.

The Kel tec's a cool little backpack gun but will not outshoot an AR.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 10:05:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/11/2006 10:06:21 PM EST by BushmasterGuy77]

Originally Posted By bnorman:
you're a looser if u tipe in awl kaps



HEY, BUT MSTN AND OVERWATCH TYPE IN ALL CAPS, WHY CAN'T HE?





Nathan
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 10:10:02 PM EST
Not enough true choices.

You should have put an FAL, G3, Sig 552, AUG, or any number of other "black" rifles. You need to get rid of the stupid "Ninja Stars" and "Just Shoot Me"

Hardwarz
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 10:18:48 PM EST

Originally Posted By donger8:
Keltec,

Dude you can get an AR in Kalifornia. Have you been living in a cave for the past few months? Kalifornians are sucking the market of lowers, and uppers dry.

The Kel tec's a cool little backpack gun but will not outshoot an AR.


Lol the CA model is no back pack gun it has a bull barrel treaded 1/2/ 28 like AR-15 same bolt Ak-47 tube and takes all ar-15 mags there was a torture test done a while back 580 rounds they were dipping it ice water and shooting it lol it keeps going and going it does shoot just as good as an AR trust me. As far as the AR in california lol it's a joke it has a pin you need to take out to crack in half and feed it (no clips) one by one 10 rounds close the gun put the pin in again and then shoot your 10 rounds lol if you did not know they have shut the mag well shut lol no thank you thats a waste of money and a shame what they have done to the AR-15 the Su on the other hand I can feed it 40 rounders all day
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 10:23:17 PM EST
You can have a G3 in California lol when was the last time you checked the laws out here lol
I should have put m1a now thats a scary gun and it is lavailable here

As far as the star lol you best protect your neck
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 10:56:05 PM EST

As far as the AR in california lol it's a joke it has a pin you need to take out to crack in half and feed it (no clips) one by one 10 rounds close the gun put the pin in again and then shoot your 10 rounds lol if you did not know they have shut the mag well shut lol no thank you thats a waste of money and a shame what they have done to the AR-15 the Su on the other hand I can feed it 40 rounders all day


Mag wells are open on these... and yes, they're in California. lol



Link Posted: 4/12/2006 5:46:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By xenophobe:

As far as the AR in california lol it's a joke it has a pin you need to take out to crack in half and feed it (no clips) one by one 10 rounds close the gun put the pin in again and then shoot your 10 rounds lol if you did not know they have shut the mag well shut lol no thank you thats a waste of money and a shame what they have done to the AR-15 the Su on the other hand I can feed it 40 rounders all day


Mag wells are open on these... and yes, they're in California. lol

img65.imageshack.us/img65/1921/receivers3iq.jpg




in violation, these are not leagl unless you had one before the bann you cant have one now unless your military or law enforment dude read the DOJ on california
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 5:55:12 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 5:57:53 AM EST by DK-Prof]

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:

Originally Posted By xenophobe:

As far as the AR in california lol it's a joke it has a pin you need to take out to crack in half and feed it (no clips) one by one 10 rounds close the gun put the pin in again and then shoot your 10 rounds lol if you did not know they have shut the mag well shut lol no thank you thats a waste of money and a shame what they have done to the AR-15 the Su on the other hand I can feed it 40 rounders all day


Mag wells are open on these... and yes, they're in California. lol

img65.imageshack.us/img65/1921/receivers3iq.jpg




in violation, these are not leagl unless you had one before the bann you cant have one now unless your military or law enforment dude read the DOJ on california





What people are talking about is a potential loophole or gap in the law. There's a big tacked post on it at the top of this page www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=266355

Other understand and can explain it much better than me, but apparently, if an AR manufacturer (i.e. the lower) is ADDED to the list that bans them, there is a 30-day grace period for people to register their AR's. Because there are a number of new manufacturers of AR's - like Mega, LMT, etc, that are not currently listed, a lot of people in CA believe the the CA DOJ will ADD those manufacturer names to the list, which will then give them the opportunity to assemble new AR's legally (in the 30-day period) and register them legally with the CA DOJ.

Personally, I don't think it is actually going to happen, but a lot of people in CA do - and have bought stripped lowers (like the one in the picture above), just in case. In any event, the stripped lowers are perfectly legal as stripped lowers - under the current law you jsut cannot assemble it into a proper AR (which is why a lot of people have bought a stripped lower and just have it laying around, with their fingers crossed).

Link Posted: 4/12/2006 6:04:16 AM EST
I think this guy owns a KeltecSU16.....just a hunch.
He wants to be validated.

I vote for garand
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 6:15:19 AM EST
who in the fuck uses meters?
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 6:26:28 AM EST

Originally Posted By mef223:
I think this guy owns a KeltecSU16.....just a hunch.
He wants to be validated.

I vote for garand



Do you think I own a kel-tec? did you happen to read my starting quote?
And why are you talking about a WW2 rifle we are talking assult like rifles not 8 rounds of 30-06
h
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 6:32:31 AM EST

Originally Posted By DBAR:
I'm just going to say "Bull Shit".
One more thing GTFO (you figure it out).
h.gif


Sir please you dont know me or my weapon
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 6:33:10 AM EST

Originally Posted By HEADACHE:
who in the fuck uses meters?


Are you serious lol
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:05:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
well its a eotech 1 moa dot I am using IMI ammo 55 gr 1:9 and sand bags. Years of shooting helps as well.



What about a few years of writing? What about a few hours of learning how to be polite? What about not asking questions you have already answered for yourself? What about knowing when you are both too stupid and rude to be on the internet? Stop posting and begin to study for your GED!
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:23:23 AM EST
Thanks for the range report, but it would have been much better had you used traditional sentance structure, and punctuation.

I had to read it three time to get the gist of what you were trying to say.

Break up the run-ons with some paragraphs. Please.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:30:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 7:33:34 AM EST by DBAR]

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:

Originally Posted By DBAR:
I'm just going to say "Bull Shit".
One more thing GTFO (you figure it out).


Sir please you dont know me or my weapon




If we all leave this thread alone it may go away. This is an AR forum, not a Kalifornia forum. This should be moved to GD.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:55:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 7:57:10 AM EST by KeltechSu16CA]

Originally Posted By pigmy:

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
well its a eotech 1 moa dot I am using IMI ammo 55 gr 1:9 and sand bags. Years of shooting helps as well.



What about a few years of writing? What about a few hours of learning how to be polite? What about not asking questions you have already answered for yourself? What about knowing when you are both too stupid and rude to be on the internet? Stop posting and begin to study for your GED!


Lol dude you need to get some!Hmmmm in person your probably an average guy but get you behing the keyboard now lol you turn into the tough guy so th
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:58:54 AM EST

Originally Posted By BillofRights:
Thanks for the range report, but it would have been much better had you used traditional sentance structure, and punctuation.

I had to read it three time to get the gist of what you were trying to say.

Break up the run-ons with some paragraphs. Please.


Dude what are you ateacher?
I am working while I type this I dont have time to edit get over it
go sit on your AR or something
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:29:13 AM EST
KeltechSu16CA offers us a good reminder that "Stupid people do not know they are stupid."
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:42:37 AM EST
I own a Kel-Tec SU16C with the awesome folding stock. The rifle rocks. No ammo feed problems whatsover as of yet.

The stock which folds up over a 30 round clip and still allows the rifle to be fired is ABSOLUTELY AWESOME. The fold out handrail/bi-pod is kinda cheap though. Seems like it could be thicker and more sturdy.

Other than that the rifle is a GREAT back-up. A awesome SHTF carry along. Fold it up and put it in your truck, under the seat or in your backpack, its ready to go.

BUT-

It just doesnt have the feel of an AR. I would think the accuracy isnt as fine tuned all around as you say.....but who knows.

Needless to say...it was the Kel Tec that made me want an AR.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:50:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 8:53:42 AM EST by KeltechSu16CA]
There are some dump ass people in here
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:51:51 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 10:23:19 AM EST by KeltechSu16CA]

Originally Posted By pigmy:
KeltechSu16CA offers us a good reminder that "Stupid people do not know they are stupid."



Well you have unequivocally underestimated my intelligence.
Your imprudent comments are quite obvious.
You’re simply a frivolous soul pursuing recognition.

Now go play along…..


Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:57:47 AM EST
I wish I could have one, but the accuracy is there with the right ammo and shooter.
what sight system do you have on it?


Originally Posted By dropbass:
I own a Kel-Tec SU16C with the awesome folding stock. The rifle rocks. No ammo feed problems whatsover as of yet.

The stock which folds up over a 30 round clip and still allows the rifle to be fired is ABSOLUTELY AWESOME. The fold out handrail/bi-pod is kinda cheap though. Seems like it could be thicker and more sturdy.

Other than that the rifle is a GREAT back-up. A awesome SHTF carry along. Fold it up and put it in your truck, under the seat or in your backpack, its ready to go.

BUT-

It just doesnt have the feel of an AR. I would think the accuracy isnt as fine tuned all around as you say.....but who knows.

Needless to say...it was the Kel Tec that made me want an AR.

Link Posted: 4/12/2006 8:58:18 AM EST
IBTL
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:00:34 AM EST

?????
what does that mean



Originally Posted By ALPHAGHOST:
IBTLhr
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:02:06 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 9:04:25 AM EST by xenophobe]

in violation, these are not leagl unless you had one before the bann you cant have one now unless your military or law enforment dude read the DOJ on california


You have absolutely no clue do you? Read DOJ opinion letters on Stag Arms, DSArms, Mega Machine tool, and anything else.

These are 'off-list' lowers that are not definied by CA PC 12276 (RR89 named weapons) or by PC 12276.1 SB-23 features definition. I guess you have not read about Kasler or Harrott?

Read this sticky post... it's even in THIS forum... are you blind lad? lol

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=266355

Then look at the opinion letters themselves...

http://calgunlaws.com/Docs/ASSAULT%20WEAPONS/Articles/letters060220.PDF
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:03:27 AM EST

Originally Posted By HEADACHE:
who in the fuck uses meters?


<cough> ... everyone else in the world ... <cough>


- Ice
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:03:56 AM EST

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
?????
what does that mean



Originally Posted By ALPHAGHOST:
IBTL




In Before The Lock

Mods are probably going to lock this thread as its snowballing....

pics?
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:12:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 9:13:01 AM EST by dropbass]

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
I wish I could have one, but the accuracy is there with the right ammo and shooter.
what sight system do you have on it?


Originally Posted By dropbass:
I own a Kel-Tec SU16C with the awesome folding stock. The rifle rocks. No ammo feed problems whatsover as of yet.

The stock which folds up over a 30 round clip and still allows the rifle to be fired is ABSOLUTELY AWESOME. The fold out handrail/bi-pod is kinda cheap though. Seems like it could be thicker and more sturdy.

Other than that the rifle is a GREAT back-up. A awesome SHTF carry along. Fold it up and put it in your truck, under the seat or in your backpack, its ready to go.

BUT-

It just doesnt have the feel of an AR. I would think the accuracy isnt as fine tuned all around as you say.....but who knows.

Needless to say...it was the Kel Tec that made me want an AR.




Stock metal sight. This is my SHTF gun and it is bare knuckles minimum.

I might add I got mine for $300 NEW
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:15:06 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 9:15:53 AM EST by KeltechSu16CA]
Good deal!
You might want to add a red dot on it, you can get a cheap one but good BSA ,truglo, they are everywhere but yeah with a scope you will see just how accurate that little rifle is

Originally Posted By dropbass:

Originally Posted By KeltechSu16CA:
I wish I could have one, but the accuracy is there with the right ammo and shooter.
what sight system do you have on it?


Originally Posted By dropbass:
I own a Kel-Tec SU16C with the awesome folding stock. The rifle rocks. No ammo feed problems whatsover as of yet.

The stock which folds up over a 30 round clip and still allows the rifle to be fired is ABSOLUTELY AWESOME. The fold out handrail/bi-pod is kinda cheap though. Seems like it could be thicker and more sturdy.

Other than that the rifle is a GREAT back-up. A awesome SHTF carry along. Fold it up and put it in your truck, under the seat or in your backpack, its ready to go.

BUT-

It just doesnt have the feel of an AR. I would think the accuracy isnt as fine tuned all around as you say.....but who knows.

Needless to say...it was the Kel Tec that made me want an AR.




Stock metal sight. This is my SHTF gun and it is bare knuckles minimum.

I might add I got mine for $300 NEW hr
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:21:46 AM EST
Wow thanks I did not know but to be honest I am happy with this little SU-16 Ca that I have did you see the picof it?


Originally Posted By xenophobe:

in violation, these are not leagl unless you had one before the bann you cant have one now unless your military or law enforment dude read the DOJ on california


You have absolutely no clue do you? Read DOJ opinion letters on Stag Arms, DSArms, Mega Machine tool, and anything else.

These are 'off-list' lowers that are not definied by CA PC 12276 (RR89 named weapons) or by PC 12276.1 SB-23 features definition. I guess you have not read about Kasler or Harrott?

Read this sticky post... it's even in THIS forum... are you blind lad? lol

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=266355

Then look at the opinion letters themselves...

http://calgunlaws.com/Docs/ASSAULT%20WEAPONS/Articles/letters060220.PDF

Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:44:22 AM EST
Welcome, KeltechSu16CA seems many people are jumping on you because of your claims. I can't figure out why they attack you personally I would think they would just ask for the evidence and data. I guess they are trying to make you mad or something.

And, BTW, IMO you posted this in the right forum. It a comparison of the Keltec and an AR that sounds relevant to me.

We get posts here about the SCAR, XCR, SIG 556, and and many other non ARs I cannot recall and nobody complains.

I find your results interesting and would love to see pics of the targets. I would also like to see the accuracy comparison with some quality ammo and scopes (I think that might give you a better indication of actual accuracy difference).

Definately a viable alternative in CA. I'm thinking about picking one up some day for a trunk gun.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 10:36:24 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 10:54:48 AM EST by KeltechSu16CA]
Yeah some people, but what can you do? I have shot both with scopes and they shoot the same, some like some ammo, some dont. But as far as a SHTF gun the kel-tec is good, you can put someone down at 300 meters no problem, the AR has the adge (crome line barrel) but reliability I give it to the tec, this thing remings me of an AR accurate and reliable like an AK it's very hard to jam
I think the AR has the edge at long range 20" barrel but the tech is a great gun for the money.
I do think the AR is the best rifle in .223 but the tech is great too
http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=105;action=display;num=1139350137
http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=105;action=display;num=1107839748

Originally Posted By Ridge:
Welcome, KeltechSu16CA seems many people are jumping on you because of your claims. I can't figure out why they attack you personally I would think they would just ask for the evidence and data. I guess they are trying to make you mad or something.

And, BTW, IMO you posted this in the right forum. It a comparison of the Keltec and an AR that sounds relevant to me.

We get posts here about the SCAR, XCR, SIG 556, and and many other non ARs I cannot recall and nobody complains.

I find your results interesting and would love to see pics of the targets. I would also like to see the accuracy comparison with some quality ammo and scopes (I think that might give you a better indication of actual accuracy difference).

Definately a viable alternative in CA. I'm thinking about picking one up some day for a trunk gun.

Link Posted: 4/12/2006 1:39:43 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 1:40:24 PM EST by HotIce]
I own a few AR15, and I owned an SU16A for about six months. It is a very cheap gun (you can get an Alpha for less than $400), but it's definitely not the gun I'd pickup in zero-fail-allowed scenarios.
If you look at the KT forum, quite a number of ppl had a combination of FTF, FTE or stovepipes.
I was pretty lucky and I had about 4-5 failures in about 500 rounds, but that's 4-5 too much when it comes to my life.
They had quite a few rifles with out of spec chamber (too tight) and this created FTEs, many times blamed on the ammos.
KT seemed to be really prompt in fixing rifles once received from complaining users.
The barrel tends to overheat very easily, and this combined with the polymer frame might not be good in the long term.
You also don't want to use KT mags, otherwise you'll spend more time pushing the charging handle forward, than shooting. Good AR15 mags is what you want to use (I used Bushy ones with no probs).
Overall a fun rifle to shoot, but IMO there's no match in a compare with the AR15 platform.



- Ice
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