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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/27/2002 3:48:20 PM EDT
Guys,

I'm looking to buy a kit in the next couple weeks. I was about to purchase a kit from J&T but like me they are located in Kentucky. That means I would have to pay sales tax.

I've read all the reviews on both companies. Is it really worth the extra $40 or so to buy from J&T over Model 1? Model 1 actually has the same type kit I want for $30 less anyway. That makes it a $70 difference.

What are the quality of the kits from Model 1? Do they use any plastic parts other than the furniture?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated,


Link Posted: 9/27/2002 4:05:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 4:31:33 PM EDT
Never had a good encounter with Model 1. J & T screwed up pretty big once, but sincerely appologised for it several times.
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 4:49:22 PM EDT
I had a buddy that got a model 1. It had a CAST front sight base, not a forged like J&T, and it took FOREVER to get there. I never had a problem with J&T. All the parts except for my barrel and carrier were military contract, and the service was great, which is more than I can say for what is being said about model one, I've heard all sorts of horror stories about them. Just wanted to let you know. Put it this way, J&T impressed me quite a bit in quality and service, and I'd pay a bit extra not to get that crappy cast front sight base anyhow. Hope this helps.

P.S. the uppers thet sell are the exact same color as DPMS lowers, perfect match!
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 5:19:47 PM EDT
J&T went the extra mile for me, and delivered a very good product, to boot.
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 5:28:19 PM EDT
What are your opinions of DPMS lowers versus RRA lowers?
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 7:17:27 PM EDT
I've already bought one CAR-16 kit from J&T, and getting ready to buy another. Go with J&T; you won't regret it.
Link Posted: 9/27/2002 7:26:26 PM EDT


JT!

absolutely

-Spaceman

Link Posted: 9/27/2002 7:43:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/28/2002 11:44:53 AM EDT by beretta92]
Well J&Ts kits are the stuff.My first AR-15 was one of there kits FN upper Shaw barrel a 16" postban that shoots 1/2"MOA easy its that good.
Also I noticed your name KY23 do you live in the comonwelth of Kentucky.. If you do the Knob Creek machine gun shoot is in 2 weeks and J&T and Model 1 Sales will both be there and you can compare them..I have had bad trouble with Model 1 Sales,But J&T wend beyond the call of duty they made sure I got everything and it was all quality parts there Shaw barrel outshoots everything on the range even some 24" bulls that 16" shoots that good and they took care of me...CAR-15 heavy.gif Beretta92
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 7:24:51 AM EDT
J&T shipped my CAR kit quickly, and when it arrived, I was pleasantly surprised at the excellent packaging, and good quality parts, all well assembled.

The lower parts were bagged, the upper completely assembled (so you don't need to worry about buying action block, armorer's wrench, etc.). All were placed in a molded styrofoam tray in fitted compartments. I have never seen such excellent packaging. I saved it in case I need to ship a rifle or upper anywhere.

Also, went to the range, blasted off several full 30 rnd mags, and not a single malfunction of any sort. I will certainly be buying more from them.
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 7:30:49 AM EDT
I am about to order 2 kits from J&T. I just bought 2 OLYMPIC lowers, does anyone know how the colors will match?
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 11:43:05 AM EDT
KY23 I used a DPMS lower from Shooter's Supply they were $106-$119..They had quite a few of them and I went threw them all looking for defects and they were all pretty close..Good quality I have never used a RRA but have heard they are one of the best cast lowers available.
On the color topic my DPMS lower has the grey parkerized look and my upper a J&T kit is more black not grey but the gun looks good but you can tell..Are you going to the Knob Creek Machine Gun Shoot? It in two weeks Oct.11th-13th
They will all be there were you can look and feel, smell,Check out the kits..J&T RULES..
Beretta92
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 11:55:44 AM EDT
RRA lowers are forged.
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 3:24:03 PM EDT
I'd like to ammend something, I meant earlier that the FORGED DPMS lowers are the same color as the J&T upper, the cast from what I see in pictures is grey. Also in reference to RRA lowers, I saw on this site that there may be fit problems between the uppers push pin block and the lower.
____________________________________________

heart.gif
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 4:56:01 PM EDT
I bought a CAR-16 kit from J&T ($434) and a forged lower receiver from Numrich Gun Parts ($99). The lower was made by Continental Machine & Tool and is perfect in every way. Continental makes lowers for all the name brand AR-15 companies (their serial numbers start with the letters "CM"). The only difference between my lower receiver and a Colt: instead of a horse there are the initials "C.M.T." and the words "made in New Britain, CT" stamped into the side. The trigger parts that come with the J&T kit are made by Colt and fit the CMT receiver perfectly. Even with shipping I've only got about $560 into this rifle. On the flipside, as good as this weapon looks and shoots it will probably never be worth more than I have into it. But then... I got it to shoot, not to sell...and it shoots great!

Link Posted: 9/28/2002 5:09:49 PM EDT
What is the difference between a cast and forged lower? How can I tell which is which from looking at the lower?
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 5:15:44 PM EDT

Originally Posted By KY23:
Guys,

I'm looking to buy a kit in the next couple weeks. I was about to purchase a kit from J&T but like me they are located in Kentucky. That means I would have to pay sales tax.

I've read all the reviews on both companies. Is it really worth the extra $40 or so to buy from J&T over Model 1? Model 1 actually has the same type kit I want for $30 less anyway. That makes it a $70 difference.

What are the quality of the kits from Model 1? Do they use any plastic parts other than the furniture?

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated,





I've purchased from both J& T and Model1, never had a problem with anything I bought from either. No horror stories here.

By the way, where in KY are you, I'm originally from Louisville myself. I now reside near Waynesboro, GA.
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 5:33:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By KY23:
What are your opinions of DPMS lowers versus RRA lowers?



DPMS lowers are good, i dont have any experience with RRA

a cast lower will have raised writing on it,i believe most lowers are forged. so the cast lowers should look funny to you.
Link Posted: 9/28/2002 7:47:33 PM EDT
Thanks for all the info guys...I'm going to meet both J&T and Model 1 at the Knob creek machine gun shoot. I'll have to pay sales tax but atleast I won't have to pay shipping and I'll get to see the kit before I buy it.

David,

I'm also from Louisville. Lived here all my life except for the time I spent in the Marines.

Link Posted: 9/29/2002 6:22:12 AM EDT
I live in Louisville also I am going on Friday the 11th asked off months ago the place isn't as packed on the Friday as Saturday or Sunday..
There will be $10-$20 difference in the kits I looked at many from other suppliers and DPMS will be there and they also make forged and stainless steel lowers also for more money.
J&T can't be beat and if they can let us know here after the Shoot..And a question,were do you go shooting ? I drive to Henryville Indiana about 25 miles from Louisville,Went yesterday and the Police had the range and wouldn't let anyone else shoot,wasted my time and gas that sucks they should have to post crap like that at least a week in advance..There were at least 10-20 people standing there along with me.We have as much right to shoot are guns as them in fact we all paid for our guns.. Beretta92
Link Posted: 9/29/2002 7:11:33 AM EDT
beretta92,

I shoot at Knob creek and Blue Grass Sportsmans leage in Wilmore, KY. I shoot in the IDPA matches there.


I've also shot at the Henryville range. Actually...we have more of a right to shoot there than the police officers. Its a public range. The police department should either have their own range or shoot first come first served like everyone else.

I'm also going to the machine gun shoot on the 11th.

Link Posted: 9/29/2002 6:05:32 PM EDT
Will be there go early if you want to park drive a 4x4 they will park you out in a field last time it rained and it was a mess..
And sorry about the crap about the police but they had everyone there pissed acted as if they were the law..They just inforce it not make it.
Several guys there are going to complane but to whom.Conservation Office.Parks Dept. This is a free PUBLIC range ran by the State Forestry Commition..Did I say PUBLIC..The Police range is right next to the PUBLIC range but the police range is 75-100 yards ahead of the public ones line of fire, off to the right there is a dirt hill betweeb them. I wouldn't want to be on the police range while firing was taking place on the other one either but the week after a gunshow there were many shooters wanting to test stuff and some drive 50-75 miles one way to shoot.. Buy from J&T you won't be sorry..Beretta92
Link Posted: 10/1/2002 11:14:15 AM EDT
I have built several rifles on Model 1 kits, always fast delivery and no problems.

There barrels are also made by Shaw and are very accurate, cast sight tower? does it make a difference? Ruger makes there rifle and pistol receivers from cast steel.

I have been happy with Model 1, no plastic except for stocks, uppers completely assembled and headspaced, nice lower parts.

The last one I built was on a DPMS cast lower, everything went together without issue and I have run nearly 400 rounds through it without cleaning and have yet to experience a failure (although it does need a good scrubbing), the DPMS receiver is very nice with hard coat anodizing and what they term as mil-spec teflon finish (very tough).

I am sure J&T is a good outfit but when you get down to it how many people actually manufacture AR15 parts? most of these places simply distribute and assemble so its 6 of one and half dozen of the other.
Link Posted: 10/1/2002 2:41:34 PM EDT
I built a rifle with a 16" heavy barrel w/ detachable carry handle and front sight, all upper parts from "Model 1". Everything was top quality. Never heard anything bad about J&T. I used a RRA lower and the quality on it is also excellent!
Link Posted: 10/9/2002 2:23:33 PM EDT
I am also considering purchasing a utility AR kit to build onto an eagle arms lower that I have had for years. Does anybody know of the colors on the eagle/armalite lowers will match the kits from J&T? It looks as if it will, the eagle lower is flat black and the J&T kits also look flat black. Any comments?
Semper Fidelis!
Link Posted: 10/10/2002 7:58:40 AM EDT
Technically, even if you do buy it out of state, (and you live in Kentucky)ou are required to file the proper form and pay Kentucky sales tax on ANY out of state mail order purchase. The Kentucky Revenue cabinet has been cracking down and loking for people purchasing firearms from out of state vendors.

You might as well pay the tax and just get it.
If your are worried about paying 6% tax in it, maybe you shouldn't be purchasing that item.
I just say this when i think about it...

...It's only money, I'll make more...

KyARGuy
Link Posted: 10/11/2002 1:24:26 PM EDT
Actually, Internet sales fall under a law they passed to try and boost catalog sales. If you currently buy anything off the internet you do not have to pay sales tax if you are out of state.

I'm not sure if firearms still fall under this but I think they would. One FFL dealer I know will do an FFL transfer without charging me sales tax. Another FFL dealer I know charges sales tax everytime.

They are now talking of writing new laws making internet sales taxable.
Link Posted: 10/11/2002 6:26:34 PM EDT
Just got a 16" kit from J & T Distributing today, looks awesome and professionally packed fits just right on my 'US Property' RRA lower, nice and promp service, prices are good too. I recomend them.

BR
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