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Posted: 5/18/2014 6:24:32 PM EDT
I find it comical when I hear guys say "you are fixing a problem that doesn't exist" such as a piston driven vs DI, and if it ain't broke don't try and fix it. I had my doubts after I was told how awesome this $140 buffer assembly was but after installing it in my POF 415 and using it man what an improvement. I have used JP products before and I knew they don't put out junk. I liked it so much I got one for my POF 308 as well. The actions on both rifles feels like their on roller bearings, it's so smooth and quiet especially when shooting suppressed all you hear is a shhhh and the shell eject. The way I see it every upgrade like this that is done is a refinement and one step closer to perfection and more enjoyable to use.
If you have an extra $140 do it.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 6:30:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
I find it comical when I hear guys say "you are fixing a problem that doesn't exist" such as a piston driven vs DI, and if it ain't broke don't try and fix it. I had my doubts after I was told how awesome this $140 buffer assembly was but after installing it in my POF 415 and using it man what an improvement. I have used JP products before and I knew they don't put out junk. I liked it so much I got one for my POF 308 as well. The actions on both rifles feels like their on roller bearings, it's so smooth and quiet especially when shooting suppressed all you hear is a shhhh and the shell eject. The way I see it every upgrade like this that is done is a refinement and one step closer to perfection and more enjoyable to use.
If you have an extra $140 do it.
View Quote


Can you talk further about that bit highlighted in red?
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 6:35:35 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By fortydelta:


Can you talk further about that bit highlighted in red?
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Originally Posted By fortydelta:
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
I find it comical when I hear guys say "you are fixing a problem that doesn't exist" such as a piston driven vs DI, and if it ain't broke don't try and fix it. I had my doubts after I was told how awesome this $140 buffer assembly was but after installing it in my POF 415 and using it man what an improvement. I have used JP products before and I knew they don't put out junk. I liked it so much I got one for my POF 308 as well. The actions on both rifles feels like their on roller bearings, it's so smooth and quiet especially when shooting suppressed all you hear is a shhhh and the shell eject. The way I see it every upgrade like this that is done is a refinement and one step closer to perfection and more enjoyable to use.
If you have an extra $140 do it.


Can you talk further about that bit highlighted in red?


Do you even Hollywood, bro?

Link Posted: 5/18/2014 6:35:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/18/2014 6:42:28 PM EDT by DWood]
....
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 6:48:42 PM EDT
This is clearly within the realm of "what is this i don't even".

The sproing noise is supposed to be there; if the sproing changes then something is wrong. Either you're out of ammo (which one ought to know by not feeling the bolt going forward, although that's easier to tell on my AK when it locks back), or you have a jam and need to remedy it.

Personally I don't know too many people who are so HSLD that the buffer noise is going to give up their firing position.

There are a lot of things that $140 could buy for an AR that would be of much better value, like a new trigger group. Or ammo.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 6:58:02 PM EDT
Then I guess this is only for guys that already have a good trigger. And if you like hearing shink-twang shink-twang thru your skull especially when suppressed then I guess is isn't for you either. It's a definite improvement.. is it worth the price of admission? to me it was but only after I used it. If you are accustomed to shooting other semi platforms such as G36 SCAR etc the buffer noise in your skull is quite annoying.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 7:16:48 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
Then I guess this is only for guys that already have a good trigger. And if you like hearing shink-twang shink-twang thru your skull especially when suppressed then I guess is isn't for you either. It's a definite improvement.. is it worth the price of admission? to me it was but only after I used it. If you are accustomed to shooting other semi platforms such as G36 SCAR etc the buffer noise in your skull is quite annoying.
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I'm inclined to agree with this. I shoot suppressed a majority of the time. In my opinion, the JP is a great improvement. I have it on 2 of my AR-15's and one on my AR-10. Everyone has their own opinion, but in mine, I love it.

In the argument of weather $140 could go towards something more useful, of course! A trigger is always the first thing I switch out on an AR build. But, if you have a majority of your rifle "tricked out", this is a great addition.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 7:31:38 PM EDT


I like the spring noise. It lets me know when I'm empty. And it's time to reload.

With my AKs, you don't get to find that out till it's too late and you're trying to shoot again.

Link Posted: 5/18/2014 7:56:21 PM EDT
I could be wrong but this smells like shilling to me.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 8:03:15 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By fortydelta:


Can you talk further about that bit highlighted in red?
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Originally Posted By fortydelta:
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
I find it comical when I hear guys say "you are fixing a problem that doesn't exist" such as a piston driven vs DI, and if it ain't broke don't try and fix it. I had my doubts after I was told how awesome this $140 buffer assembly was but after installing it in my POF 415 and using it man what an improvement. I have used JP products before and I knew they don't put out junk. I liked it so much I got one for my POF 308 as well. The actions on both rifles feels like their on roller bearings, it's so smooth and quiet especially when shooting suppressed all you hear is a shhhh and the shell eject. The way I see it every upgrade like this that is done is a refinement and one step closer to perfection and more enjoyable to use.
If you have an extra $140 do it.


Can you talk further about that bit highlighted in red?


........
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 8:16:38 PM EDT
I've seen more POF rifles fail than anything else, then along the lines is JP

I run a JP spring on my 6.5CM

Just sayin

Link Posted: 5/18/2014 8:22:24 PM EDT
I have no idea what the OP is talking about.

I don't need anything to soften the springs noise.

The stock buffer spring does not and has not ever bothered be either suppressed and non-suppressed, from 10", 14", 16", 18", and 20" guns.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 10:18:03 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By dangerdan:
I have no idea what the OP is talking about.

I don't need anything to soften the springs noise.

The stock buffer spring does not and has not ever bothered be either suppressed and non-suppressed, from 10", 14", 16", 18", and 20" guns.
View Quote


It is very noticeable when firing suppressed.

I agree this is s great investment for a gun you shoot suppressed. I have one on my 11.5 SBR that is always suppressed.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 10:32:18 PM EDT
I never even notice any spring noise except when using an A2 stock...weird.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 10:53:59 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Mauritius:
I never even notice any spring noise except when using an A2 stock...weird.
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I was the same way until I read all these retarted threads about the spring noise. Now I notice it more. However, not an issue for me.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 11:19:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By mustangduckk:


I like the spring noise. It lets me know when I'm empty. And it's time to reload.

With my AKs, you don't get to find that out till it's too late and you're trying to shoot again.

View Quote


You should know when you're empty when the bolt locks back, with or without the spring noise.
Link Posted: 5/18/2014 11:21:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Mauritius:
I never even notice any spring noise except when using an A2 stock...weird.
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Same here.

Barely notice it on my SBR with collapsable stock.

But my other rifle with an A2 stock... that spring noise pretty darn loud.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 12:12:30 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By mustangduckk:


I like the spring noise. It lets me know when I'm empty. And it's time to reload.

With my AKs, you don't get to find that out till it's too late and you're trying to shoot again.

View Quote

Yugo/Serbian mags, brah.

The follower comes up far enough when it's empty that it will catch the front of the bolt as it's going forward, and lets the bolt go forward when you drop the mag, so the rest of your reload is exactly the same as a regular mag.

They're all I run now-a-days.

If you like to do things on the cheap side, you can dremel the nubs out of a regular steel mag & reshape the back of the follower a bit and do the same thing. I have one surplus mag from whodafukknowsistan that I did that way, so it would work the same as my other ones. There's a tutorial for doing this over on the AK side of the site.

I think you could do the same thing with the polymer/5.45mm mags, but I can't say for sure since for once I was on the right side of a caliber war, and don't own anything chambered in that.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:44:45 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 2:45:53 AM EDT by Regalkismet]
I have several of the JPSCS and they definitely add a bit of refinement to the rifle... Clearly gets rid of sprung noise and seems to make the action slightly smoother... I'm a fan.... Is it a necessity? Nope.... But I use to run slashes buffers/Wolff Springs previously so the price is pretty comparable(especially if you get them on sale or using a Midwayusa coupon code) and it brings a little extra to the table.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 3:42:44 AM EDT
I run one on my 6.5 grendel. The biggest advantage in my mind wasn't the no spring noise. It is the spring pack you can buy. It help tune in which spring I needed when shooting supressed, essentially filling the role of an adjustable gas block..
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 3:57:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 4:00:17 AM EDT by TaylorWSO]
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
man what an improvement. I

"feels"

"smooth"

"more enjoyable".
View Quote
You value subjective upgrades, Others don't.

Your suppressed comment is BS BTW.

Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
It kept going full auto for the first 3-5 rounds of each magazine!

I installed a JP silent captured spring and the PRS stock.
View Quote
So you like f/a as well.


This is why most newbi comments are BS.

Link Posted: 5/19/2014 4:16:38 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By TaylorWSO:
You value subjective upgrades, Others don't.

Your suppressed comment is BS BTW.

So you like f/a as well.


This is why most newbi comments are BS.





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Originally Posted By TaylorWSO:
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
man what an improvement. I

"feels"

"smooth"

"more enjoyable".
You value subjective upgrades, Others don't.

Your suppressed comment is BS BTW.

Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
It kept going full auto for the first 3-5 rounds of each magazine!

I installed a JP silent captured spring and the PRS stock.
So you like f/a as well.


This is why most newbi comments are BS.







Had to find the thread you were quoting from. There is some interesting post from our new friend here. Very proud of that stock and spring.....
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 4:34:16 AM EDT
I could see where subjective could be seen as nice. I once swapped a match grade op rod spring guide, buffertech buffer, and ebr stock onto an m14. The previously backand right left up down op rod/charging handle movement that rattled all over the place became straight back with no metal contact to the receiver. Very smooth and soft in recoil. Seemed precise.

Granted im so used to the ar that ild have to use a jp settup to even understand what could be different. When I shoot suppressed I cant hear the action spring that I can recall.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 5:05:47 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By huanab:


You should know when you're empty when the bolt locks back, with or without the spring noise.
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Originally Posted By huanab:
Originally Posted By mustangduckk:


I like the spring noise. It lets me know when I'm empty. And it's time to reload.

With my AKs, you don't get to find that out till it's too late and you're trying to shoot again.



You should know when you're empty when the bolt locks back, with or without the spring noise.


AKs don't have a bolt lock back, except with yugo mags..
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 5:08:32 AM EDT
I may try one out in my .300, most of the noise from the gun that I hear is coming through my cheekbone when shooting subs suppressed.

I don't really see a need for it in any of my other guns, personally.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 6:47:09 AM EDT
It clearly sounds like there are three camps responding to this. One is the die hard AR as an original pedigree "don't touch it, it's been perfect". Then there are the guys which are so stuck in their ways or can't see a reason to part with $140 to make an upgrade. And last the ones who have tried and use it.
And heck yes I had a FA issue but that was a trigger pin issue nothing to do with the buffer assy.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 6:58:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 7:00:25 AM EDT by Brutus2]
I have a JP SCS in a 12" barreled AR pistol. I couldnt stand the clunk-scrape-sproing plus bolt bounce I got with a regular carbine spring/buffer set-up. The operation is now very smooth and quiet. This will be even more evident when my suppressor comes in. I have a few k in ammo stored up. The weapon is set up exactly the way I want it from muzzle device to trigger so i splurged a bit on the SCS. Was it worth the price for the improvement.... nope ...but neither is a $200 cerakote job and I dont hear any negative comments about those when threads pop up about "Cerakote "insert color". Given a choice about which to give up on my weapon... the cerakote job would go before the SCS.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 7:00:48 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By zwitterr:
I could be wrong but this smells like shilling to me.
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You're wrong. JP is a top notch company that's highly unlikely to be shilling.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 7:47:32 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By JoshAston:


You're wrong. JP is a top notch company that's highly unlikely to be shilling.
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Originally Posted By JoshAston:
Originally Posted By zwitterr:
I could be wrong but this smells like shilling to me.


You're wrong. JP is a top notch company that's highly unlikely to be shilling.


+1. They could afford much better shills

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 7:52:50 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Fooboy:


+1. They could afford much better shills

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Originally Posted By Fooboy:
Originally Posted By JoshAston:
Originally Posted By zwitterr:
I could be wrong but this smells like shilling to me.


You're wrong. JP is a top notch company that's highly unlikely to be shilling.


+1. They could afford much better shills



Link Posted: 5/19/2014 8:59:50 AM EDT
The JP SCS is pretty cool shit. I had one, sold it and am now back to the way God intended it to be! SPROING!!!
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 9:05:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 9:12:24 AM EDT by headless1916]
You know, the 'SPROING' echoing through my head after every shot was one of the main reasons I bought an AK as my first semiauto mag fed centerfire rifle. The only AR's I had shot to that point made such a SPRRRROROOOOIIING sound that it felt like they were about to fall apart every time I'd pull the trigger.
Obviously not really the case, but just saying'. I prefer a lack of reverberating SPROING.

Now I know there are buffer assemblies that eliminate the problem but retain last shot hold open and push-to-engage mags and...and...and...and...
I kinda wish I had just embraced the sproing.
But I couldn't. It was just too irritating. :) It makes mah jaw vibrayte.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 9:36:47 AM EDT
Dad just put together an 18" mid gas rifle with the JP low mass BCG and JP low mass buffer in a colt A2 butt stock with colt rifle spring. It was so horrible sounding when it slammed the carrier into battery that it reverberated the entire gun with noise, almost sounded like bolt bouncing. We called JP and they said it was very over sprung when using the LMOS system and the silent captured spring kit with lighter spring would fix us up. He ordered the new silent captured setup off of midway with a coupon so I will update everyone once its in place, its a MK12 Mod0 varient with 3gun race parts in it. We are still figuring out what scope mount to run on it for a Leupold VARI-X III 3.5x10 lrt.

Link Posted: 5/19/2014 9:42:52 AM EDT
No suppressors in my state. When I shoot, I'm wearing hearing protection. I hear the somewhat muffled bang and that's it. I've never heard the infamous sproing. Buying one of these would be a total waste of money.

Link Posted: 5/19/2014 9:59:23 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Hwk-I-St8:
No suppressors in my state. When I shoot, I'm wearing hearing protection. I hear the somewhat muffled bang and that's it. I've never heard the infamous sproing. Buying one of these would be a total waste of money.

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The first thing that jumped out at me when we fired our M16A2's in boot camp was the Sproing. With foam earplugs, to me the sproing was louder than the muzzle report. After growing up on 30-30s, 30-06's, and non-ar type rifles it was almost comical to me!

With a proper cheekweld on a fixed stock like that, it makes sense you would hear it very loudly. The sound and vibrations would easily transmit through the buffer tube, stock material, and then your bones, so I can see why it would seem louder than the muzzle report. If you were using a brake or a compensator, maybe not. If you have a can, then definitely the sproing would be percieved as very loud and apparent. It wouldn't be as obvious with a carbine stock because usually your cheekweld is different, and it's constructed differently.

Reference: Used a carbine extension/SOPMOD on my Mk12 project first, then switched to A1 fixed stock. Never heard or noticed the spring with the can on using the SOPMOD, but definitely hear it now with the A1. I have enough stuff to spend $$$ on right now, but I would like to take a JP for a spin. Not to fix anything, not because the sproing is annoying, just because.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 1:08:39 PM EDT
It just made the 2 rifles a little sweeter.

http://s13.postimg.org/f00qbp49z/IMG_0589.jpg
temp image upload
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:19:17 PM EDT
what the heck is a shilling? I don't figure it's the British unit of currency you guys are talking about.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:23:59 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
what the heck is a shilling? I don't figure it's the British unit of currency you guys are talking about.
View Quote



Shill or Shilling as defined in the Urban Dictionary:

"A person engaged in covert advertising. The shill attempts to spread buzz by personally endorsing the product in public forums with the pretense of sincerity, when in fact he is being paid for his services.
Who are you shilling for?

Ignore the n00b, he's just here to shill."

Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:26:33 PM EDT
I upgraded my spring by getting a Flat wire buffer spring. They last 500,000 rounds and much cheaper. I like it.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:36:22 PM EDT
I know what shill bidding is but I guarantee you I have no affiliation or monetary interest in JP or the sales of their products. I will say of them I bought the SCS for the above rifle used and they sent me a free spring upgrade. The newer ones have a better spring that is slightly longer than the older ones. The unit itself doesn't have any parts to really wear.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 2:37:33 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet:
I upgraded my spring by getting a Flat wire buffer spring. They last 500,000 rounds and much cheaper. I like it.
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I don't understand what the advantage would be to a flat spring.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 4:32:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 4:32:30 PM EDT by RDTCU]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:


I don't understand what the advantage would be to a flat spring.
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Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
Originally Posted By ArmyInfantryVet:
I upgraded my spring by getting a Flat wire buffer spring. They last 500,000 rounds and much cheaper. I like it.


I don't understand what the advantage would be to a flat spring.


Quieter, more linear rates and longer service life over a standard buffer spring.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 5:23:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/19/2014 5:27:53 PM EDT by NickOTime]
I bought one, only to bastardize the platform and piss off the purists. Same reason I bought KNS pins and then moved the piston to the front of the gun. I suppose its worth it if you have everything else, but its definitely not necessary.
Link Posted: 5/19/2014 5:34:22 PM EDT
The way I look at it guns and their accessories are just like having cash, it's all money in the bank and in some cases a wise investment. You are almost never throwing your money away unless you make a bad buy or purchase something during a panic and even then it's still worth something. That's why I have no problem spending big $ on the stuff and if you convince the wife of this you will never hear any shit over it.
Link Posted: 5/22/2014 9:19:36 PM EDT
Still...I never have noticed the sproing sound on my guns both suppressed and unsuppressed.
The only time I've heard it was firing an M16 that was uber dry.


I run my buffer tubes semi-wet. It makes for a nice and smooth action.
Link Posted: 5/22/2014 9:37:28 PM EDT
I bought one of JP's CS polished rifle buffer springs. I gotta say, this thing is a beauty! Completely dry, and not sound comes from it. JP does recommend you put lithium grease on the spring, though.

It's completely silent, and cost $110 less than the "Silent Capture" system. The rifle seems to be MUCH more consistent now also. Placebo? Maybe, but I doubt it..
Link Posted: 5/22/2014 10:07:41 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
The way I look at it guns and their accessories are just like having cash, it's all money in the bank and in some cases a wise investment. You are almost never throwing your money away unless you make a bad buy or purchase something during a panic and even then it's still worth something. That's why I have no problem spending big $ on the stuff and if you convince the wife of this you will never hear any shit over it.
View Quote



While I love my JP silent spring, gun accessories just like any other accessories are not investments. You buy them because you want them or they offer some benefit to you, but you will never get your money back selling them. If you're lucky and the accessory is in demand, you might be able to get 80% of it back. If it's not, you may be stuck with it or have to accept 50% or less to get rid of it.
Link Posted: 5/23/2014 12:22:11 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By comfortechinc:
It clearly sounds like there are three camps responding to this. One is the die hard AR as an original pedigree "don't touch it, it's been perfect". Then there are the guys which are so stuck in their ways or can't see a reason to part with $140 to make an upgrade. And last the ones who have tried and use it.
And heck yes I had a FA issue but that was a trigger pin issue nothing to do with the buffer assy.
View Quote


I have one. It now sits on the shelf.

No complaints, but it wasn't worth the price of admission to me. If I ever build an adjustable gas gamer gun I might throw it in there for the tunability factor, but for a more rack grade build I didn't really think it was all that.
Link Posted: 5/23/2014 12:26:30 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By dangerdan:
I have no idea what the OP is talking about.

I don't need anything to soften the springs noise.

The stock buffer spring does not and has not ever bothered be either suppressed and non-suppressed, from 10", 14", 16", 18", and 20" guns.
View Quote


Same here. To each his own, but some of the stuff people get worked up about and need to fix on AR's or other guns is sometimes a little strange to me.
Link Posted: 5/23/2014 3:22:20 AM EDT
Sorry, but the suppressed bit still bothers me. On my 5.56 rifle, I still consider it not hearing safe with a suppressor. Not gonna hear a spring. On my 9mm, with heavy buffer and spring, not a problem even with subsonic rounds. I don't thing this product would work for a 9mm AR anyway. On my .338 Spectre, once again, never heard this noise, supers or subs, probably due to the halved pressure of that caliber.

So I'm very curious as to what ammo/suppressor combo you boys are running, to be bothered by the internal emanations of the rifle.
Link Posted: 5/23/2014 5:03:17 AM EDT
I like the SCS because operation is so much smoother.
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