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Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:16:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: _LandCruiser_] [#1]
*****
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:22:38 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Jman_JJE] [#2]
Originally Posted By sdrake100:

Well, there's another batch of marked H&R lowers set to be released by IntMilCo in April of 2022. Seems like there's trademark and tradename infringement going on.
View Quote


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:37:07 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
Originally Posted By sdrake100:

Well, there's another batch of marked H&R lowers set to be released by IntMilCo in April of 2022. Seems like there's trademark and tradename infringement going on.


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc

If you’re doing M1s and M14s, it would be pretty cool if you made 308 Garands that utilized M14 magazines. That’s not an uncommon modification, so it should be easy to do.

Old SMGs would be awesome too, but I’m guessing those would be expensive to produce.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:46:14 PM EDT
[#4]
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

If you’re doing M1s and M14s, it would be pretty cool if you made 308 Garands that utilized M14 magazines. That’s not an uncommon modification, so it should be easy to do.

Old SMGs would be awesome too, but I’m guessing those would be expensive to produce.
View Quote


We were going to do the m1 Garand in 308 with an AR10 magazine and re-tool the old AR10 waffle mags for it.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:47:31 PM EDT
[#5]
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

If you’re doing M1s and M14s, it would be pretty cool if you made 308 Garands that utilized M14 magazines. That’s not an uncommon modification, so it should be easy to do.

Old SMGs would be awesome too, but I’m guessing those would be expensive to produce.
View Quote


We are looking at some SMG, but need some clarification on the brace regulations before we make a decision.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:50:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Sputnik556] [#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


We were going to do the m1 Garand in 308 with an AR10 magazine and re-tool the old AR10 waffle mags for it.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

If you’re doing M1s and M14s, it would be pretty cool if you made 308 Garands that utilized M14 magazines. That’s not an uncommon modification, so it should be easy to do.

Old SMGs would be awesome too, but I’m guessing those would be expensive to produce.


We were going to do the m1 Garand in 308 with an AR10 magazine and re-tool the old AR10 waffle mags for it.

That would be really cool, hope you guys are able to make it happen.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 8:54:37 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


We are looking at some SMG, but need some clarification on the brace regulations before we make a decision.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

If you’re doing M1s and M14s, it would be pretty cool if you made 308 Garands that utilized M14 magazines. That’s not an uncommon modification, so it should be easy to do.

Old SMGs would be awesome too, but I’m guessing those would be expensive to produce.


We are looking at some SMG, but need some clarification on the brace regulations before we make a decision.

Don’t blame you there.

I doubt that it’s one you’re looking at, but I’ve always really wanted a proper MP40 clone. GSG basically stuffed a 9mm inside of an airsoft shell and it was a huge letdown.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 9:02:21 PM EDT
[#8]
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

Don’t blame you there.

I doubt that it’s one you’re looking at, but I’ve always really wanted a proper MP40 clone. GSG basically stuffed a 9mm inside of an airsoft shell and it was a huge letdown.
View Quote


Mike and I thought there might be a similar opportunity with a sterling with a brace using our AK-V mag. The biggest hesitation is the brace rega.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 9:06:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: grondike] [#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MatthewDS:
I'm deeply disappointed that I won't be able to complete my T91 clone lower as a result of this.

Obviously I can engrave an A2 lower with the correct markings, but it will always bother me.
View Quote
PRI still sells 80% A1 lowers. Maybe not as good as Nodak, but surely better for your T91 than an A2.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 9:10:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Sputnik556] [#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


Mike and I thought there might be a similar opportunity with a sterling with a brace using our AK-V mag. The biggest hesitation is the brace rega.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
Originally Posted By Sputnik556:

Don’t blame you there.

I doubt that it’s one you’re looking at, but I’ve always really wanted a proper MP40 clone. GSG basically stuffed a 9mm inside of an airsoft shell and it was a huge letdown.


Mike and I thought there might be a similar opportunity with a sterling with a brace using our AK-V mag. The biggest hesitation is the brace rega.

It might look goofy, but what about a 16” barrel to start off with?

I’ve seen 16” Stens before and they don’t look awful IMO.

ETA: An integral faux suppressor might fix the look.
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 9:29:35 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By MatthewDS:
I’m deeply disappointed that I won’t be able to complete my T91 clone lower as a result of this.
View Quote


Why?  Is Nodak somehow involved in T91 clone lowers?  I got mine elsewhere and finished it off just fine
Link Posted: 12/21/2021 10:07:25 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote




Link Posted: 12/22/2021 12:16:16 AM EDT
[Last Edit: techno_000] [#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote


Yes, this means i won't be making the lowers we made for the last 2 years anymore. I pulled the product from the site. The logo I was using was expired for 40 years.

As soon as I saw the attempt to retrademark the old lion H&R logo that has been dead for 40 years on 12/10/21 and then the lower Mike posted I knew we were done with these. I’m a customer of Mike/Harlan and have nothing but respect for them and I’m exited to see these products.

I planned to do this in good faith prior to reading all this, I hope this will work as I don't want trouble/drama. I will be focusing on my other products and would like to be left out of this discussion.

Lets refocus on the topic at hand now that this is cleared up.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 1:56:58 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
....I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote


Another retro line of AR10's?  So many choices in terms of what to make and how faithful to the 1950's design.  

Hoping for many parts to be compatible with the Dutch guns.

Link Posted: 12/22/2021 2:02:11 AM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By HHollow:
Another retro line of AR10's?  So many choices in terms of what to make and how faithful to the 1950's design.  

Hoping for many parts to be compatible with the Dutch guns.
View Quote


Oh yes!  Please!  Let's have another proprietary .308 AR platform w/ dimensional incompatibilities with all the other .308 AR platforms already on the market!
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 2:18:51 AM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History

Got one of those too
H&R 340
Attachment Attached File


CD
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 2:31:58 AM EDT
[#17]
M1 Garands!!! Thank the gods! Please tell me you'll sell stripped recievers, I've got one of those rewelds that is dying to be replaced.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 5:09:52 AM EDT
[#18]
This is beyond freaking good news!!

I just hope that people understand that most of us clearly know, without question, that we’re building clones of the real M16A1s and are more than fine with something that “looks” like a real M16A1.  

I just hope that we, who are into retro firearms don’t sabotage this project with overly critical comparisons with USGI issued weapons that most of us have carried in the past.

Seriously, I’m hoping for H&R marked clone receivers for my XM16E1s, M16A1s and M16A2 (Early) builds that I’ve put on hold after hearing about this several months ago.   I’ve been “stockpiling” NoDak Spud receivers since 2016 and once I get my hands on these H&R receivers, I’ll be selling them off.

Honestly, the prototype photo of the H&R M16A1 receiver is some serious boner material!!

I would also be interested in a couple of H&R marked M14 receivers as well.  

I would think that a semi-auto PISTOL clone of a M3A1 SMG that’s “SBR ready” would be nice to round out American Cold War firearms… OR a PISTOL clone of a Smith and Wesson Model 76 would be cool.

Also, a Sterling semi-auto PISTOL clone of a MK4 with an 8” barrel and a MK7 with either a 4” or 6” barrel that are also “SBR Ready” would be nice too!!
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 7:11:40 AM EDT
[#19]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 7:17:20 AM EDT
[#20]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 7:35:59 AM EDT
[#21]
Please give me an opportunity to show my very limited knowledge base here. So, for those folks wishing to build 601s or 607s and the like, will there still be lowers produced that do not have H&R logos on them? I've got my 605 and 607 stuff, asking for others.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 7:43:04 AM EDT
[#22]
Originally Posted By techno_000:


Yes, this means i won't be making the lowers we made for the last 2 years anymore. I pulled the product from the site. The logo I was using was expired for 40 years.

As soon as I saw the attempt to retrademark the old lion H&R logo that has been dead for 40 years on 12/10/21 and then the lower Mike posted I knew we were done with these. I’m a customer of Mike/Harlan and have nothing but respect for them and I’m exited to see these products.

I planned to do this in good faith prior to reading all this, I hope this will work as I don't want trouble/drama. I will be focusing on my other products and would like to be left out of this discussion.

Lets refocus on the topic at hand now that this is cleared up.
View Quote


Thank you! We appreciate that and appreciate your love and respect for the 2nd amendment.

We make custom and mil spec parts for a lot of the industry, if we can assist you with any of your projects in any way, please contact Mike.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 8:08:51 AM EDT
[#23]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 8:30:26 AM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mike_nds:




We will have a GX-5857 marked lower for 607 builds.

If there is enough demand we can do minimal markings on certain models.

I don’t want to get into a “Baskins Robbins” 31 flavors mode here.

At the beginning I need to concentrate on getting the M16A1 receivers perfect first.

Our production team is going to have to rewrite the book in order to make my parts.

I’ve already given them fits I’m sure.
View Quote

My 607 build just got put on ice. I'll wait on the GX lower no matter what it takes.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 8:31:51 AM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By mike_nds:
Mausers are my crack, and I’ve already been formulating a plan.

Just give it time.
View Quote


Do be careful.  Even the mighty FN took shortcuts.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 8:51:36 AM EDT
[#26]
An H&R SMG - Now that would be cool.

A "brace" "blade" of the M55 Reising would be cool for a pistol version.



Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:04:37 AM EDT
[#27]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:21:31 AM EDT
[#28]
Tag
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:27:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Jman_JJE] [#29]
Originally Posted By cherenkov:
An H&R SMG - Now that would be cool.

A "brace" "blade" of the M55 Reising would be cool for a pistol version.

https://image.invaluable.com/housePhotos/julia/58/613758/H0019-L128557046_thz.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Model-55-Closed.jpg
View Quote


I’m a huge Riesing fan, In my personal collection I have the entire family of Reising guns including two transferable M55 and Reisings submission to Aberdeen trials for the M1 carbine.

Mike and I discussed this and it is something we are interested in depending on the brace issue etc
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:33:48 AM EDT
[#30]
I'd also suggest doing C7 uppers, whether it be under H and R or PSA, proper. The big C7 thread I started in the PSA thread a couple of years ago was pretty popular. We tried convincing Josiah to offer them at PSA and he said he liked the idea. Mentioned he sent it up the flag pole, though there never was a follow up, after the thread got archived. I'd been meaning to follow up on the subject but got so busy.

I'm sure 20" A1 barrels are in the works but it's worth suggesting anyway.

I'd also echo the request for minimal marking lowers and parts. While I appreciate the historical significance of the company and its logo, I believe many people won't care for it. It's pretty bad looking and I believe many will see it the same way. I love the project but the logo will turn many off. Easy to please both sides, in this case.

Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:50:29 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By cherenkov:
An H&R SMG - Now that would be cool.

A "brace" "blade" of the M55 Reising would be cool for a pistol version.

https://image.invaluable.com/housePhotos/julia/58/613758/H0019-L128557046_thz.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Model-55-Closed.jpg
View Quote


Not sure how many of yall have experience with the Reising but its a pain in the ass to take apart. The full autos also require tweaking to get running right and the mags are stupid expensive.

Wile a M55 pistol and stock sold separately would be cool I think JJE/ Nodak would be better off dumping that time into something else.

JMO wet blanket rant over lol.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 9:50:48 AM EDT
[#32]
Side note here. As a gun guy, I find the thought of industry campfire talk to be pretty interesting. I bet Jman and Mike probably have tons of interesting tales.

Jman, I admit that I find myself curious about AAC. Any stories you could share with us? Must be one heck of a thing to watch from your perspective. They're still in the Remington facility, right?

Mike, one of your previous posts in this thread put the idea into my head again. I always found Federal Arms to be an interesting company. Used to enjoy flipping through their catalog. Any interesting stories you or Harlan could share? What happened to them, anyway? I never did dig into it but it seemed like they were everywhere, then one day they vanished.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 10:02:10 AM EDT
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By swampfoxoutdoors:


Not sure how many of yall have experience with the Reising but its a pain in the ass to take apart. The full autos also require tweaking to get running right and the mags are stupid expensive.

Wile a M55 pistol and stock sold separately would be cool I think JJE/ Nodak would be better off dumping that time into something else.

JMO wet blanket rant over lol.
View Quote


I'd suspect they are wise enough enough to engineer a version that makes sense for robustness, and cost of Mfr. and uses less expensive mags - Maybe in 9mm using uzi mags as an example.  I think the idea on any remakes is to offer a good resemblance to the average buyer. (GSG MP40 is an example of extremely inexpensive outward facsimile to a real MP40).
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 10:09:27 AM EDT
[#34]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 10:17:44 AM EDT
[#35]
Originally Posted By mike_nds:



Other than the delayed blowback design, the rest of the Reising is hot garbage IMHO.

It follows the pattern I've seen in a lot of the old, pre-1970's price-point designs.

Too many parts, and weird design aspects that are not conducive to modern manufacturing techniques.

YMMV
View Quote


Agreed, more of a nostalgic thing for me, the guns I grew up lusting over.....
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 10:36:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: jhoffman] [#36]
What is going to happen with pending orders from NoDak Spud?
I'm on the wait list for an 80% M16A1 lower, said to be available early 2022.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 10:46:30 AM EDT
[#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote
Oh my
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 11:03:51 AM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:  I’m a huge Riesing fan, In my personal collection I have the entire family of Reising guns including two transferable M55 and Reisings submission to Aberdeen trials for the M1 carbine.

Mike and I discussed this and it is something we are interested in depending on the brace issue etc
View Quote


You can't mention such w/o posting pics.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 11:04:19 AM EDT
[#39]
The T48 will be interesting. A little competition shouldnt hurt the open market. Will also be interesting to see if my brn-10 becomes less desirable soon.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 11:07:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: HenryKnoxFineBooks] [#40]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


Thank you! We appreciate that and appreciate your love and respect for the 2nd amendment.

We make custom and mil spec parts for a lot of the industry, if we can assist you with any of your projects in any way, please contact Mike.
View Quote


And so it begins.

A hard core clone builder doing a H&R wants a correct copy, so he wants a correct SN and a left side FCG pocket that looks like this:

Attachment Attached File


Somebody chasing down a correct bolt catch and takedown pins among other items may not find a different SN and a Spartenburg, SC marked lower to be a desirable product even with the correct logo.

A market participant who could do that has been crowded out. Doesn/t matter on the Garand or M14 clones as that was before manufacturer's info had to be placed on the receiver, or now that it has to be .....

Thus, either H&R decides to market correctly marked 80% lowers for builds, or that part of the market looks for 80% lowers and like Colt clones, somebody who does the engraving on the sly, and gets it anodized. Of course, the even more distressing news for the retro enthusiast, we don't sell 80% lowers for 601s. XM16E1s, and M16s because of potential trademark abuse.

Which brings us to the matter of what drives the retro market. Is it the desire to shoot rifles with the 1/12 twist rate and 20 inch barrels? Is it a desire for a link to the past and that nostalgia? While I think 80% of the market will be satisified with something that looks like past weapons, the other 20% that are the market leaders and influencers and are the people who look at the Colt re-issue firearms and say so close, yet so far. No, thanks.

It is that 20% who are constantly raising the bar in retro land, and have others ask them - Where can I get one of those? While most are OK with the close enough, I have others who say -"no, I want an exact copy like yours. How much will that cost?"
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 11:24:44 AM EDT
[Last Edit: AWZ1287] [#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I am sending that on to legal and they will handle this, however, I want the focus of this thread to be on our upcoming H&R Retro line of AR-10, AR-15, M1 garand, M14, T48 etc
View Quote




Any plans on doing m1 carbines also?
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 11:40:28 AM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By jhoffman:
What is going to happen with pending orders from NoDak Spud?
I'm on the wait list for an 80% M16A1 lower, said to be available early 2022.
View Quote

That’s my thought as well, I’m on the waiting list for a partial fence 80. Hopefully these are still gonna be available
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 12:34:37 PM EDT
[#43]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 3:01:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Funderbunk] [#44]
Well seeing as how it looks like we're all throwing out our retro goodness wishlist, I'll throw my nutjob idea out there:

I'd like to get my hands on the offspring of a C7 and 605 upper marriage - brass deflector, no/shaved off forward assist. Definitely nothing that was ever done officially, but why not be weird?  I suppose I could get a C7 upper and have someone weld up/machine off the assist, but if I didn't have to...

Something like this photoshop...

Link Posted: 12/22/2021 3:23:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: mike_nds] [#45]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 3:45:23 PM EDT
[#46]
Mike

I hope in your list of suggestions that you possibly look at making a version of the NDS-15 under H&R? Hopefully, you will give those of use on the wait list for 6 months or more to pre order m16a1 receiver sets in which I was one.

Also, I hope that you will provide us on the sub forum a heads up where we can order these products when you have them avaliable.



Link Posted: 12/22/2021 3:55:56 PM EDT
[#47]
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 4:07:55 PM EDT
[#48]
Will your ar10 use dpms pattern mags like the Brownells or use original armalite mags
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 5:06:32 PM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:


I’m a huge Riesing fan, In my personal collection I have the entire family of Reising guns including two transferable M55 and Reisings submission to Aberdeen trials for the M1 carbine.

Mike and I discussed this and it is something we are interested in depending on the brace issue etc
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Jman_JJE:
Originally Posted By cherenkov:
An H&R SMG - Now that would be cool.

A "brace" "blade" of the M55 Reising would be cool for a pistol version.

https://image.invaluable.com/housePhotos/julia/58/613758/H0019-L128557046_thz.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/72/Model-55-Closed.jpg


I’m a huge Riesing fan, In my personal collection I have the entire family of Reising guns including two transferable M55 and Reisings submission to Aberdeen trials for the M1 carbine.

Mike and I discussed this and it is something we are interested in depending on the brace issue etc


My great uncle would've probably carried a Riesing on Gavutu, so owning a semi would be pretty awesome. F/As are a bit out of reach.

If we're just throwing out rando retro SMG product suggestions, just about any of the interwar wood and metal SMGs are cool. Sig MKMO/PO is on my "grail guns I will never own" list.
Link Posted: 12/22/2021 5:21:51 PM EDT
[Last Edit: mike_nds] [#50]
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