Is the Trijicon TA31RCO any better then the TA31F? (new-arguy, question for you on page #2)

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Is the Trijicon TA31RCO any better then the TA31F? (new-arguy, question for you on page #2)

Posted: 9/8/2005 4:00:45 PM EDT

What's the difference???

Posted: 9/8/2005 6:21:11 PM EDT

[#1]

Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5", A4 model for the 20"). the TA31F is callibrated to split the difference between 14.5" and 20" barrels to work reasonably well with either. Other than that, RCO models have horizantal stadia lines on the left and right of the reticle, and tethered adjustment caps. RCO model also comes with a coyote MOLLE compatible pouch.

Posted: 9/8/2005 7:43:59 PM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5", A4 model for the 20"). the TA31F is callibrated to split the difference between 14.5" and 20" barrels to work reasonably well with either. Other than that, RCO models have horizantal stadia lines on the left and right of the reticle, and tethered adjustment caps. RCO model also comes with a coyote MOLLE compatible pouch.

+1

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Here’s some testimonials about CS GunWorks for AR15 Board
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Posted: 9/9/2005 8:18:38 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5", A4 model for the 20"). the TA31F is callibrated to split the difference between 14.5" and 20" barrels to work reasonably well with either. Other than that, RCO models have horizantal stadia lines on the left and right of the reticle, and tethered adjustment caps. RCO model also comes with a coyote MOLLE compatible pouch.

+1

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Here’s some testimonials about CS GunWorks for AR15 Board
What do YOU have to say about CS GunWorks

+2

Posted: 9/9/2005 8:47:38 AM EDT

[#4]

+3

C4

Posted: 9/9/2005 10:09:14 AM EDT

[#5]

Thanks for the info!

I'm I right to think that both the RCO models and the TA31F are calibrated for use on flat tops only and not to be used on A2 carry handles?

Posted: 9/9/2005 10:17:50 AM EDT

[#6]

Trijicon will tell you that they will only work on a flattop but the people that use them will tell you it does not matter if they are on a carry handle or on flattop.

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Here’s some testimonials about CS GunWorks for AR15 Board
What do YOU have to say about CS GunWorks

Posted: 9/9/2005 12:20:39 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Trijicon will tell you that they will only work on a flattop but the people that use them will tell you it does not matter if they are on a carry handle or on flattop.

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Here’s some testimonials about CS GunWorks for AR15 Board
What do YOU have to say about CS GunWorks

So that's a yes to my question?

Posted: 9/9/2005 12:34:14 PM EDT

[#8]

there is a chart tacked up top with bdc for various bullets and mounts for the acog other than what is noted at the trijicon website.

here

so basically, yes

you can mount it which ever way you want, its basically user preferrence since its your scope after you bought it

Posted: 9/9/2005 12:36:48 PM EDT

[#9]

Yes.

Mike @ CSGW

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Posted: 9/9/2005 1:24:30 PM EDT

[#10]

Thanks guys!

Posted: 9/9/2005 5:39:46 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5",.

trijicon says:

"The TA31RCO is an Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight (ACOG) designed
for the M16M4 weapon system (16" barrel). "

Im confused...which is it?

Posted: 9/9/2005 6:29:49 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5",.

trijicon says:

"The TA31RCO is an Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight (ACOG) designed
for the M16M4 weapon system (16" barrel). "

Im confused...which is it?

Like I said Trijicon will tell you one thing but in reality there is more to it than what they say! The 14.5” barrel to the 16.5” barrel is not going to make that much of a difference. What will make a more of a difference are the altitude, temperature, and bullet coefficients. The BDC is a general guideline of what that round will do at a certain velocity. Most BDC software you use dose not use barrel length to help give your elevation dope.

Mike @ CSGW

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

Posted: 9/9/2005 8:03:00 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5",.

trijicon says:

"The TA31RCO is an Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight (ACOG) designed
for the M16M4 weapon system (16" barrel). "

Im confused...which is it?

i posted it earlier but i guess i was vague

here is bdc for different bbl. lengths and bullet wts. for the acogs.

Posted: 9/10/2005 6:38:41 AM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5",.

trijicon says:

"The TA31RCO is an Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight (ACOG) designed
for the M16M4 weapon system (16" barrel). "

Im confused...which is it?

Like I said Trijicon will tell you one thing but in reality there is more to it than what they say! The 14.5” barrel to the 16.5” barrel is not going to make that much of a difference. What will make a more of a difference are the altitude, temperature, and bullet coefficients. The BDC is a general guideline of what that round will do at a certain velocity. Most BDC software you use dose not use barrel length to help give your elevation dope.

Mike @ CSGW

www.csgunworks.com
[email protected]

ah, I forgot that I posted that before. we really need to be able to suscribe to threads, i can never find my posts.

Thanks X 2

Posted: 9/10/2005 2:35:25 PM EDT

[#15]

paying member can subscribe. Just $20 per year!

Posted: 9/10/2005 4:38:58 PM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
paying member can subscribe. Just $20 per year!

ill do it next month

Posted: 9/10/2005 9:22:47 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
paying member can subscribe. Just $20 per year!

$24 per year now.....

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:25:17 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
Quoted:
paying member can subscribe. Just $20 per year!

$24 per year now.....

Still worth it.

I have a TA31 and TA31F and like both alot. I've shot a carbine with a TA31A and that is nice too. If I ever buy another 4X ACOG, I don't see any reason not to buy an RCO.

Posted: 9/11/2005 3:39:09 AM EDT

[#19]

One thing I have noticed about the RCO vice a 31 or 31F, is the RCO is a bit slower to use. The mil lines seem to slow people down just a bit.

Posted: 9/11/2005 6:52:09 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
One thing I have noticed about the RCO vice a 31 or 31F, is the RCO is a bit slower to use. The mil lines seem to slow people down just a bit.

Why does it slow people down?

Posted: 9/11/2005 8:57:35 AM EDT

[#21]

Some find it a bit busy. The reticle pattern is trying to do too many things vice focusing one one.

Posted: 9/11/2005 12:31:14 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Some find it a bit busy. The reticle pattern is trying to do too many things vice focusing one one.

Yeah that's what I thought.

Posted: 9/12/2005 1:07:58 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5", A4 model for the 20"). the TA31F is callibrated to split the difference between 14.5" and 20" barrels to work reasonably well with either. Other than that, RCO models have horizantal stadia lines on the left and right of the reticle, and tethered adjustment caps. RCO model also comes with a coyote MOLLE compatible pouch.

I just got an E-mail back from Trijicon and they said that the TA31F was calibrated for only the 14.5" barrel and that the TA31RCO-M4 was calibrated for the 16" barrel.

So how did you get different info from what they're giving out?

Posted: 9/13/2005 2:26:23 PM EDT

[#24]

Now I have a dumb question on zeroing. The ACOG manual is written and talks about a 30 meter zero. I cannot lay my hands on a 25M zero target for the ACOG, so used the regular one and guesstimated. I guesstimated wrong, the elevation is still off. I'm having to put the tip of the chevron on the sillhoutte's chin so I don't sail the round over the heads.

They are pretty drop resistant though, it got knocked off my desk ten minutes after I got it on the rifle for range day, I was about ready to kill the kid that did it.

Posted: 9/13/2005 2:43:18 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Now I have a dumb question on zeroing. The ACOG manual is written and talks about a 30 meter zero. I cannot lay my hands on a 25M zero target for the ACOG, so used the regular one and guesstimated. I guesstimated wrong, the elevation is still off. I'm having to put the tip of the chevron on the sillhoutte's chin so I don't sail the round over the heads.

They are pretty drop resistant though, it got knocked off my desk ten minutes after I got it on the rifle for range day, I was about ready to kill the kid that did it.

IM your .mil address, when I get to the office tomorrow I will send you an e-copy of the BZO target.

Posted: 9/14/2005 2:25:43 PM EDT

[#26]

BTT.

Posted: 9/18/2005 12:16:55 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Better? No. Just different. Quality and function of the two are quite equal. RCO models are calibrated to specific barrel lengths (M4 version for the 14.5", A4 model for the 20"). the TA31F is callibrated to split the difference between 14.5" and 20" barrels to work reasonably well with either. Other than that, RCO models have horizantal stadia lines on the left and right of the reticle, and tethered adjustment caps. RCO model also comes with a coyote MOLLE compatible pouch.

I just got an E-mail back from Trijicon and they said that the TA31F was calibrated for only the 14.5" barrel and that the TA31RCO-M4 was calibrated for the 16" barrel.

So how did you get different info from what they're giving out?

Bump for answer.

Posted: 9/18/2005 1:53:25 PM EDT

[#28]

My info came from 3 different Trijicon reps at Shot Show, 2005 in Las Vegas. All three of which told me the same. When they developed the TA31F model, the split the difference in calibration between the 20" and 14.5". I can tell you that Trijicon does have conflicting info when bullet drop callibration questions come up. Im not saying I am right and whomever you spoke to is wrong. I am just affirming that we have two different answers to the same question from the same company.

However, I do find it odd that if the TA31F is actually callibrated specifically for the 14.5" model, how is it that this was the optic that the Marines bought from Trijicon to put on all their 20" flat tops for about 2 years? Or, why the RCO-M4 model is callibrated for a 16" when the military M4's they were developed to go on all have 14.5" barrels.

I also must add that with few exception, you can take about any ACOG despite what barrel length it was designed to be used with or what style reciever, and make it work on your gun. The difference between them all is almost always marginal and too fine for most people/guns to make a difference (most... not all, sometimes it can make a difference). Anyhow... I'll see if I can get confirmation one way or the next.

Posted: 9/18/2005 5:17:55 PM EDT

[#29]

Thanks for the info.

I also think it's very strange though that theTA31RCO-M4 is optimized for a 16" barrel when it was ment to be used on a 14.5 M4 barrel. But the E-mail that I got from David Spencer at Trijicon did say "Typically, barrel length has very little influence on trajectory and the realized difference in point of impact is within the thickness of the stadia lines." So I guess were good to go.

Posted: 9/19/2005 2:21:07 PM EDT

[#30]

Here's what I got...

Hey Neil,

Let me clarify this for you; you're on the right track!

The TA31RCO-A4 is calibrated for the M16A4 20" barrel using LC M855 62 grain ammunition. The calibration was done based on firing tables provided by the USMC.

The TA31RCO-M4 is calibrated for the M4A1 (flat top) 14.5" barrel using LC M855 62 grain ammunition. Again, the calibration was done based on firing tables provided by the USMC.

The TA31F is calibrated for a 62 grain bullet traveling at 3050 fps. The calibration was done by our engineers on a commercial ballistics calculator. The 3050 fps. is basically an average velocity of .223 ammunition and a 14.5"-20" barrel.

The TA31F provides "Combat" accuracy from a 14.5" to 20" barrel. Remember, all ACOGs are "combat" optics and are not designed for 1 shot 1 kill accuracy. Too many variables in combat dictate ballistic indifference, especially old weapons and mass produced ammunition. Others include altitude, temp., barometric pressure, etc. Snipers are trained to overcome these later obstacles and they have equipment to compensate for them. Snipers also have the time and distance advantage. Soldiers and Marines using the ACOG need a simple dual role sight (close quarters to 800m) that does not require mechanical adjustment between shots. Point (aim) and shoot!

The TA31F is still the best dual illuminated ACOG for those that are going to switch the optic between weapons with different barrel lengths.

I hope this helps Neil. Keep in touch.

Shaun M. Rategan, Manager
Trijicon's Military and Federal Law Enforcement Division

Posted: 9/19/2005 6:48:50 PM EDT

[#31]

Thanks, good info!

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Is the Trijicon TA31RCO any better then the TA31F? (new-arguy, question for you on page #2)

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