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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/15/2005 7:06:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/15/2005 7:12:19 PM EDT by PigGuy]
I'm lost... I dropped $230 for my first case of XM193 this week, in boxes. I've never had any XM855 look this bad, though, I've only had about 50 rounds ever.

Here are pictures, they're freaking huge, so dial-uppers beware.
XM193

Those were the worst of the two boxes I opened... 1/4 of them were that badly dented. Is that normal?

ETA: This was Lot 103 purchased from www.wideners.com
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:20:22 PM EDT
they should go bang.

alot of people have had reports of not so pretty brass.

I don't think they tumble 193 brass.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:23:37 PM EDT
Well, I know they'd go bang, but I'm affraid of a boom. The uglyness doesn't phase me, it's the little dents around the neck that get me kinda worried.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:27:17 PM EDT
The PD ammo is even worse than the "over runs" that were being sold. Basically they look almost as bad as the PD version, but without the dents.

I quit buying any XM-193 for any purpose other than shooting. I bought over 2,000 rds. of it and was not impressed with the poor quality of the finished product as compared to ammo that would pass the military requirements.

It should shoot fine and it will probably be the only ammo you buy that will look better after you shoot it than it does before.

Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:33:53 PM EDT
So, you're saying it looks more like PD? Would it be a bad idea to shoot it?
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:35:07 PM EDT
The cartridges shown in your photos have a few cosmetic dents, but nothing to worry about.

You really need to reduce both the file size and the physical size of those photos, those photos are 1.4 mb each, you should shoot for less than 100 kb each.

Your camera probably came with a photo editor, if you don't have one here is an article about FREE photo editors.

Top 5 Free Photo Editors
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:36:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:37:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/15/2005 7:40:32 PM EDT by PigGuy]
I just posted them as high res as my camera would take. That's why I left them in a folder, rather than posted them in the thread.

My camera seems to bullshit it's way to 3.3 megapixles or whatnot... it just doesn't seem all that crisp. I probably could shrink them without losing much image quality.

ETA: But lazyness gets the best of me.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:39:35 PM EDT
Ok, that's the second time I've seen the pretzel reference, and I'm just lost.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:44:10 PM EDT
No, they should not look like that!
Send them to me! Now!!


Seriously, don't worry about it. Expect to find 5 to 20 per thousand that you don't want to shoot because of bullett seating, crushed cases or primers and that's just the way it is these days.

Brass color means little.

Rick
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:45:05 PM EDT
Ok, brass color means little, I know that... but you guys don't worry about the little dents around the necks either?
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:46:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:54:01 PM EDT
Re neck dings. I figure the small ones should fit into a generally "mil spec" tool and don't expect accuracy.

Rick

Major crushes and neck dings that would increase pressure dangerously are a different matter. I sort them out, throw them away, and chalk it up to the modern era. Nothing I can do about it.

Rick


I wish we had some WW2 guys to ask about this. 'Nam vets, any comments?
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 7:54:33 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PigGuy:
Ok, that's the second time I've seen the pretzel reference, and I'm just lost.



archive.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=218579

pics are not up anymore but you will get the idea.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 8:01:04 PM EDT
Ah, thank you. That was almost not knowing:
The word Arizona got banned
Not to ask about Heat
Not to "post pics" after...

You get the idea.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 8:20:48 PM EDT
Are these re-loads? I just bought 1k of these and the seller (local shop ) says that they are factory loaded Federal?! All of mine look like those in the pics. There are cases dated 00, 01, & 03. I'm not a ammo buff so excuse my ignorance.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 8:36:31 PM EDT
They are new. Lots of rough new rounds in federal and other .mil suppliers that make it to .civ

Read the Ammo Oracle for a really good overview.

Rick
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 10:01:03 PM EDT
just to stir the shit up www.thegunzone.com/556xm.html

And I used to like the gun zone.
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 10:11:40 PM EDT
Damn!! my lot 100 and 105 didn't look anything like that!!!
Link Posted: 9/15/2005 10:48:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By yekimak:
just to stir the shit up www.thegunzone.com/556xm.html

And I used to like the gun zone.



Well, there is no way I'm going to use this stuff in my up comming class due to the info I've read here and on other threads.

This info comes direct from the "grapevine" here at ARF.com
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 5:31:14 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/16/2005 5:37:01 AM EDT by P-245]
PigGuy-

You think that's bad, take a look at some of Lake City's finest that I got with my last order:



The "Gun Zone" article? Be wary of anything a company comms/marketing person says! They will sell you snake oil in a heartbeat.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 12:23:51 PM EDT
Well if you are worried about the ammo, I can drive over and pick it up.

For proper disposal... of course..
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 12:25:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PigGuy:
So, you're saying it looks more like PD? Would it be a bad idea to shoot it?



I have XM193PD that looks better than your XM193.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 6:25:10 PM EDT
Someone once claimed they found a pretzel inside the cartridge case mixed in with the powder for this ammo. The idea was to illustrate just how poor the quality control is on the LC surplus ammo that is being sold out there. That's the pretzel reference. Since this is all machine loaded ammo, and since machines don't eat pretzels, I don't buy it. But it made a good story.

(You gotta ask yourself one thing....of the billions of rounds available, how did he pull the tip from the one and only round that just happened to have a pretzel inside? He sould run down to the 7/11 and get tonights $90 million Power Ball lotto ticket if he is that good).

Like I said, it makes a good story.....but he made his point. For ammo this expensive, it ought to look first class in all respects. The way it looks now, it should be selling for a dime a pop at the most.
Link Posted: 9/16/2005 8:37:18 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Spacegun:
Someone once claimed they found a pretzel inside the cartridge case mixed in with the powder for this ammo. The idea was to illustrate just how poor the quality control is on the LC surplus ammo that is being sold out there. That's the pretzel reference. Since this is all machine loaded ammo, and since machines don't eat pretzels, I don't buy it. But it made a good story.

(You gotta ask yourself one thing....of the billions of rounds available, how did he pull the tip from the one and only round that just happened to have a pretzel inside? He sould run down to the 7/11 and get tonights $90 million Power Ball lotto ticket if he is that good).

Like I said, it makes a good story.....but he made his point. For ammo this expensive, it ought to look first class in all respects. The way it looks now, it should be selling for a dime a pop at the most.



That was me, and no I didn't win Powerball. The cartrige in question was visually out of spec, whith the bullet barely in the case neck, which is why I could pull it easily by hand. THere is no problem with ugly brass, as most mil ammo is not pretty, It does not need to be. Just check each round before you load it. I stopped posting in that thread because it came down to those who believe me and those who don't, not a big deal since it is the internet and all. That said, your ammo looks fine, just check each one for neck splits and improperly seated rounds.
Link Posted: 9/17/2005 1:13:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rick_Lind:
No, they should not look like that!
Send them to me! Now!!


Seriously, don't worry about it. Expect to find 5 to 20 per thousand that you don't want to shoot because of bullett seating, crushed cases or primers and that's just the way it is these days.

Brass color means little.

Rick



Oh sure - expect 5 to 20 per thousand that will blow your gun up. Seriously - don't worry about it.
Link Posted: 9/17/2005 3:49:22 PM EDT

Oh sure - expect 5 to 20 per thousand that will blow your gun up. Seriously - don't worry about it.

Zhukov



Ouch! General, I didn't say that.

Leme 'splain. You have to look through them and pull out the bad actors.

I don't advocate closing your eyes and loading mags. I don't like the fact that this "new factory ammo" sometimes looks like the ugly pictures but it shoots pretty good. All of the pictured stuff should be pulled out but none pictured should blow up anyone's gun.

I have seen lots of ugly looking ammo over the years including boxed .mil and commercial stuff and think you always have to do a visual inspection of anything you will put in your gun and even then have to pay attention (ever had any factory squibbs?)

BTW, I hear Wolf will destroy your gun!

Rick

Link Posted: 9/17/2005 7:43:46 PM EDT
Alright, alright. You're forgiven. But next time, please call me "Marshal Zhukov", OK?

I dunno about the XM193PD. If ammo is unreliable and may jam every once in a while - that's one thing. When there's a chance it can blow up your gun because it slipped past their and your QC - then I stay away. Just my $0.02.
Link Posted: 9/18/2005 4:35:35 PM EDT
I didn't die today. Though, I did have one feed problem where the round hit the magazine and stopped, denting the tip of the bullet. I think it was the magazine's fault.
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