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Posted: 10/10/2007 3:56:23 PM EST
I have an ak-47 and enjoy it very much. I have always been interested in the AR and have decided that I better get one before another Dem. gets in the whitehouse and takes that right away from me. I have decided on an M-4 style carbine. Money is not much of an issue, but the one thing I have to ask is........
What is the benefit of paying $500-600 more for a colt than for a bushmaster or stag?
What is it exactly that makes the Colt so expensive?

I have never shot a .223 before. What differences can I expect out of the cartrige and gun from this and the 7.62x39 round?

Thanks from a super nube.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 3:57:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/10/2007 3:58:55 PM EST by ivchris]
I won't pay extra for a Colt. I have 1 and it's my pride and joy (early SP1), but I'm not going to pay for a new Colt when there are others that are just as good for half price.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 4:30:32 PM EST
http://cmmginc.secure-mall.com/shop/?shop=1&cart=799381&cat=33&
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 4:40:38 PM EST
Get a RRA..........
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 4:42:27 PM EST
IMHO: The only real advantage is in the resale value of a colt. If, in fact, the AWB does come home to roost (or should I say WHEN ???) I expect the prices of AR-15's to easily double overnight. The Colt that costs you $1400 today will bring $2800 then. The RRA that costs $900 today will bring $1800 then.

BUT, if you have no intention of selling yer goodies, I 'spect the only advantage of owning a Colt will basically amount to bragging rights....

After all, it is a Colt......
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 4:51:46 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/10/2007 4:53:50 PM EST by AJSully421]
get a RRA with the lighter profile barrel and know that you have the #2 rifle, and be ok with that... or get a stag or bushmaster, they're good too.

ETA: ditch that AK, or keep it around for zombies, I did in 05 and have been happy since, also, the .223 is QUIETER than that distinct boom from the AK, and better ergonomics on the rifle, and twice the accuracy. you won't be sorry you got an AR
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 4:56:57 PM EST
Not to start a flame war, but I really don't see the hoopla over Colt. I thought that nowdays most of their stuff is contracted out anyway. Plus, they have all those built-in safety features to prevent you from hurting yourself like the big blocky sear block and the over-sized FCG pins. Also, has anybody tried out their customer service? Good luck as a civilian. Of course, a lot of times their finish sucks, but before anybody starts I'll go ahead and beat you to the punch and say yes, I know, I need to:

1) grow a pair and
2) Get over it-- it's just a TOOL....


Link Posted: 10/10/2007 5:10:24 PM EST
I would just like to say, "ArmaLite," thats what AR stands for.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 5:21:39 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 6:04:55 PM EST
Colt is a good rifle. A lot of people just don't have one and talk a lot of smack. I don't have a Bushy, but I don't talk bad about them because that isn't what I have. People need to stop saying that this one and that one is just as good as a Colt. It has been posted hundreds of times, Colt does more QC on their weapons, plain and simple. If you want to pay for that great. If not then don't. Go ahead and post the childish he is "Drinking the Colt Koolaid". Again this is not true, I like almost all makes of AR's. I just get tired of all the Colt hate.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 6:15:49 PM EST
A Colt would make an excellent first AR.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 6:53:41 PM EST
If you want a colt, you will be buying a name. Look at Rock River Arms, Stag Arms, Del-Ton, DPMS, LMT, Bushmaster or any other brand. There are a ton. a list is available somewhere for you.
Just find one with a logo that you like. other than that, they are all pretty much the same thing except for the "extras" you put on it. but for your basic rifle, they are all very close.

As far as the 7.62 round vs. the .223/5.56, the AR platform has a lot less kick than an AK. You can also buy aftermarket flash hiders which will change the direction of the gas exiting the barrel and make it much more comforable to shoot.

Have fun with your first AR. you will enjoy it.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 8:31:15 PM EST
Please excuse the non-technical answer; I'm not qualified for that since I, too, am buying my first AR. At first I thought to just buy a Bushmaster, since they have the largest selection at the largest store in town. Plenty of history with B, Colt, and Armalite as well. However for all that I've read, it sounds like you get what you pay for, and if you want the configuration the Colt has, you'll get an excellent product. One way you can spend less and get the same quality is to simply purchase the upper and lower you like, then put them together. Spend the extra dough on mags which will surely be in the political crosshairs. There are many elements which will make your AR more reliable and accurate, but that's where price comes in. There's no concise answer, except it should fit your needs. I think a major consideration for a new AR buyer is the barrel, since that's the most costly part to replace. Go to Ammo Oracle and figure out which twist and length you want, consider the barrel profile, then buy the complete barreled upper which fits the big picture. CMMG has the best selection of complete barreled uppers I could find, which has helped me sort out what I need now and can upgrade later.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:20:11 PM EST
If you must go with a factory rifle, check out the latest Smith & Wesson offerings.
Link Posted: 10/10/2007 9:25:59 PM EST
my first was a bushmaster and love it.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 1:38:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By Emu:
IMHO: The only real advantage is in the resale value of a colt. If, in fact, the AWB does come home to roost (or should I say WHEN ???) I expect the prices of AR-15's to easily double overnight. The Colt that costs you $1400 today will bring $2800 then. The RRA that costs $900 today will bring $1800 then.

BUT, if you have no intention of selling yer goodies, I 'spect the only advantage of owning a Colt will basically amount to bragging rights....

After all, it is a Colt......


Unless this time around there's a California style no sell stipulation.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 1:44:43 AM EST

Originally Posted By AROKIE:
my first was a bushmaster and love it.


+1

Any of the big names will be a good first rifle. Don't be sold on the koolaid.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 3:50:26 AM EST

Originally Posted By Smead:

Originally Posted By Emu:
IMHO: The only real advantage is in the resale value of a colt. If, in fact, the AWB does come home to roost (or should I say WHEN ???) I expect the prices of AR-15's to easily double overnight. The Colt that costs you $1400 today will bring $2800 then. The RRA that costs $900 today will bring $1800 then.

BUT, if you have no intention of selling yer goodies, I 'spect the only advantage of owning a Colt will basically amount to bragging rights....

After all, it is a Colt......


Unless this time around there's a California style no sell stipulation.



Good point! I hadn't considered that.....

D@mn commie B@ST@RDS!!!!!
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 4:08:03 AM EST
Noveske N4
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 4:30:12 AM EST
If I were buying my first I would go with LMT.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 4:40:26 AM EST
I got my NIB Colt 6721 for $1099. You can find good prices if you shop around.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 4:48:44 AM EST
Anything standard from: CRAB

Colt, Rock River Arms, Armalite, Bushmaster.

You'll be fine.

If money is not a prob, go with a colt. I don't even have one, but I know they are great rifles.

I have a 20" bushy, and it runs great.

I have a 16" RRA homebuilt, and it runs great.

Good luck, and welcome to the best weapons platform in the world.

TXL
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 4:56:33 AM EST
you can get a Colt LE6920 for around $1200 which is not much more than any other high end AR (LMT, CMMG, Sabre).

I own one Colt. It was my first AR (MT6400C). It runs like a top, always has, always will. No fancy maintenance, no fancy break in period. It shoots Wolf, American Eagle, XM193 loose pack/boxed, black hills 69/75/77gr, WWB... i have never had a problem with it...

the "Colt customer service sucks" line is bullshit, i've called them several times just to ask stupid questions and they were polite, helpful, and easy to reach.

since you are an AK guy, i'll give you this analogy... which would you rather buy? a Century Arms or an Arsenal? if the century is good enough for you (it throws lead downrange, it works okay, might need a couple things tweaked or fixed) than ANY AR will be fine (bushmaster, RRA, Stag, etc). if you would probably buy the arsenal, than you'll want to look towards the Colt or LMT, and even CMMG/Sabre (fairly new companies that make damn fine products)...
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 5:28:45 AM EST
Don't pay extra for a Cult.
Bushmaster, RRA, or Stag or just as good. It's like Browning versus Savage in bolt actions. One brand costs more, and is prettier, but is no more reliable or useful as the lower priced one. Show me what a Cult can do that my RRA's, Bushmaster's, DPMS, and Stag can't, and I will sell my other brands, and buy all Cults.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 7:27:24 AM EST

Originally Posted By Rescue43:
Don't pay extra for a Cult.
Bushmaster, RRA, or Stag or just as good. It's like Browning versus Savage in bolt actions. One brand costs more, and is prettier, but is no more reliable or useful as the lower priced one. Show me what a Cult can do that my RRA's, Bushmaster's, DPMS, and Stag can't, and I will sell my other brands, and buy all Cults.


Push 800 rounds down-range in a day, at the average rate of 6 magazines per hour with an hour cool-off/lube up before the next session. Repeat for five days without cleaning. Conduct once a month for one year.

If you do that, you will see why serious people buy Noveske, LaRue, LMT, Colt or custom (jury is still out on S&W, but looking good).

If you don't, you have reasonable expectation that your rifle will be able to perform to those standards. If you have no intention of training this hard, no problem, buy Olympic, or Bushy, or whatever makes you sleep at night.

As a wise man once said, "I am glad that Bushmaster is in business, they just aren't in MY business."
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 7:48:03 AM EST
stick to the ABCDRS, CMT for brands

colts are just expensive; mostly for name, less availabilty, and quality (per say)

the .223/5.56 rnd is way more versitle imo than 7.62x39; better ballistic quality, range, accuracy, variety of loads, etc

h/w, the short AK rnd is fair for mid range ballistics
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 8:05:46 AM EST
LMT or Colt 6920 would be your best bet for a M4 style AR-15.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 8:39:52 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2007 8:40:23 AM EST by warpig8654]
I bought a 6920 a while back & it's a dern nice rifle. Now that I own CMMG, I won't buy another Colt.

edit: spelling
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 9:05:25 AM EST
Shop around, build it yourself its cheaper, recently I got a Colt 9mm lower, sbr'ed, found upper and bolt carrier, then 10.5'' barrel; all for $1050.00 all said and done. It took me 4 months to piece it together and wait on the atf and all that but I got what I wanted. This was my first Colt out of 7, in the end its your money get what you like.
Chris
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 9:14:29 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2007 9:20:29 AM EST by CopM4]

Not to start a flame war, but I really don't see the hoopla over Colt. I thought that nowdays most of their stuff is contracted out anyway. Plus, they have all those built-in safety features to prevent you from hurting yourself like the big blocky sear block and the over-sized FCG pins. Also, has anybody tried out their customer service? Good luck as a civilian. Of course, a lot of times their finish sucks, but before anybody starts I'll go ahead and beat you to the punch and say yes, I know, I need to:

1) grow a pair and
2) Get over it-- it's just a TOOL....




Exacta-mundo..!!! not to mention shaved bolt carriers. I compared a NIB 6920 and a 6721 to a factory LMT .. the Colts (Colt Defense) both had sloppy fitting receivers and most deales do not carry them anymore beacasue they take up too much space and do not sell like the other brands...
You will see the same foundry markings on a Colt upper that you see on a Bushmaster/RRA etc... Some say Colt does some sort of magic with their rifles - I don't see it. - def not worth $300-$400 more

A friend of mine who shoots ALOT of 3 gun matches wanted some new receiver pins for his 6920 fire control group - since they are OVER-SIZED - called Colt and is still waiting 3 months later for them to come in.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 10:56:10 AM EST
The colt will always be worth more. Thats all there is to it. If you put a Colt on a gunstore shelf next to other brands, it will have a higher price and it will generally sell quicker. Is it a better gun? Probably not, but thats just the way it goes.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 11:21:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/11/2007 11:32:39 AM EST by Rescue43]

Originally Posted By Failure2Stop:

Originally Posted By Rescue43:
Don't pay extra for a Cult.
Bushmaster, RRA, or Stag or just as good. It's like Browning versus Savage in bolt actions. One brand costs more, and is prettier, but is no more reliable or useful as the lower priced one. Show me what a Cult can do that my RRA's, Bushmaster's, DPMS, and Stag can't, and I will sell my other brands, and buy all Cults.


Push 800 rounds down-range in a day, at the average rate of 6 magazines per hour with an hour cool-off/lube up before the next session. Repeat for five days without cleaning. Conduct once a month for one year.

If you do that, you will see why serious people buy Noveske, LaRue, LMT, Colt or custom (jury is still out on S&W, but looking good).

If you don't, you have reasonable expectation that your rifle will be able to perform to those standards. If you have no intention of training this hard, no problem, buy Olympic, or Bushy, or whatever makes you sleep at night.

As a wise man once said, "I am glad that Bushmaster is in business, they just aren't in MY business."


Brother, I got news for you! A damn Colt IS NOT the only rifle that will do the job. A Bushmaster or RRA will do it every bit as reliably as a Colt, but without the big price tag, or the big head!

Oh, if you will look around, you will see that a lot of other people here that share my views, so you are NOT going to single me out of the crowd just because I don't like your precious little prancing pony.

All these other companies further refine the parts they build their weapons with. Most of us on here do the same thing as we build our rifles. so, in the end , it don't make a swamp-monkey's ass who built the parts.

If you will re-read my first post, you will notice I did NOT mention a damned Olympic. Go eat a candy bar or something, I think your sugar is acting up.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 11:22:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By kel3at:
The colt will always be worth more. Thats all there is to it. If you put a Colt on a gunstore shelf next to other brands, it will have a higher price and it will generally sell quicker. Is it a better gun? Probably not, but thats just the way it goes.


Given the same condition/accessories, your Colt will always be worth more than my RRA.

Like it or not....agree or disagree..... facts is facts, and Kel3 just hit the nail on the head.

Link Posted: 10/11/2007 11:38:09 AM EST

Originally Posted By Failure2Stop:

As a wise man once said, "I am glad that Bushmaster is in business, they just aren't in MY business."

What has this got to do with anything? The Maytag repairman could have said it for all we know.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 11:51:11 AM EST
Paging OP: just find via google AR "comparison chart," and you'll find an interesting display of many reasons why some people think Colts are worth more. It's not worth MY extra $$, however there it is, and I respect why they buy Colt.
Link Posted: 10/11/2007 11:53:05 AM EST
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