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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 6/11/2003 10:48:41 AM EDT
Busmaster list one for AR15 on their web site.
Has anyone aut there in AR15 land used this scope, and what do you think of it?
Thanks
Tom
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 11:11:57 AM EDT
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 11:14:40 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2003 11:15:31 AM EDT by karlknapp]
I have one of these and it is very good. Excellent glass, very clear, good quality. If you want to read more, we had a lengthly discussion here: [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=159450[/url]. Here is a picture of my Colt with the IOR Valdada M2 attached via a ARMS #38 S-Ex swan sleeve and ARMS #22 high scope rings: [img]http://home.insightbb.com/~karlknapp2/Colt02.jpg[/img] I would highly recommend the scope for the money.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:03:34 PM EDT
Very nice rifle. Does that setup allow using the iron sight on the #38? I can't quite tell from the picture. I'm trying to decide whether to get the # 40, since I already have a set of high rings that would allow using the rear sight.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:21:32 PM EDT
Thank you for replying!
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:22:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Fenian: Very nice rifle. Does that setup allow using the iron sight on the #38? I can't quite tell from the picture. I'm trying to decide whether to get the # 40, since I already have a set of high rings that would allow using the rear sight.
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If you mount a scope such as the IOR Valdada or any other long scope, you will not be able to use your flip-up iron sight on the ARMS #38 and you can't use the ARMS #40 sight either. The scope will be your only way to target.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:22:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jregistrar: Busmaster list one for AR15 on their web site. Has anyone aut there in AR15 land used this scope, and what do you think of it? Thanks Tom
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Excellent scope!
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:22:35 PM EDT
Thank you for replying. I read the discussion stuff you referred. Interesting
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 1:37:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/12/2003 8:03:24 PM EDT by 5subslr5]
Originally Posted By QCMGR:
Originally Posted By jregistrar: Busmaster list one for AR15 on their web site. Has anyone aut there in AR15 land used this scope, and what do you think of it? Thanks Tom
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Excellent scope!
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Good !! Cause I've been thinking of an IOR 6X fixed power for a AR-10A4 carbine.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 2:43:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/11/2003 2:46:18 PM EDT by DOA]
I really like my IOR M2 scope. The rubber front and rear caps come of easily if you want to add flip ups later. Mine came almost boresighted to POI. That is a sign of a good scope. Also, mine is mounted on generic high mounts that just clear the front site directly on the FT. I have no rear backup sights.
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 3:35:43 PM EDT
I have an IOR M2 in 308 with the Drag recticle. IMHO, best bang for the buck in tactical scopes. Easy to use, well built and loaded with features. I especially like the green illumination compared to the red, it is easier to see and is differant than the red everyone seems to use. There is a guy on the FALFiles that offered a group buy on the IOR line if 10 buyers got together, $290 per M2 scope for example. Any mix or match of models. SorryOciffer
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 3:36:06 PM EDT
MarineNP is correct. If you mount the scope rearward you CANNOT use an ARMS #40 BUIS. The ARMS #38 Swan Sleeves have the BUIS mounted lower, and the scope clears it. The set up is not meant for see thru use of the BUIS. If the scope fails, flip the throw levers on the scope mount (#22), and then flip the BUIS up. Then you are ready to go. I went with the S-Ex length Swan Sleeve for future scope mounting options. It seems that several of the red dot variety scopes are best mounted forward. With the extra rail up front I have more flexibility in scope mount location. (I did have to sand down a bit of the top M4 handguard to get it to fit over top. Not a big deal. Even looks ok with the Swan Sleeve off.)
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 4:54:30 PM EDT
I have one on my G3 clone, and it is a excellent scope. for a scope that is reasonably priced, it's the same quality as 6 or 700 dollar scopes. I would stay away from bushmaster they want too much money for them.....SNIPERCOUNTRY.COM has them for 292.......best price on the net. http://www.snipercountrypx.com/IOR_Scopes.asp [img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/048525.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 6/11/2003 5:51:31 PM EDT
I just bought one of these babies. It's an ATN Professional 5x33L tactical scope. It has the rheostat which allows the crosshairs and built-in range finder to illuminate red in low light conditions. It also has a bullet drop compensator which is made for 5.56/.223 rounds. Haven't decided on which rifle I'm going to put it on, probably my HK SL8 (G36 clone) but maybe one of my ARs. I am absolutely in love with this scope. [img]http://www.aimdiscount.com/AMT5X33L.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 4:45:01 PM EDT
sfcrete thanks. Oh I wasn't going to buy from Bushmaster, I just wanted to see what kind of scopes the recommended. I went to the sniper link you provided - question what is the difference between the M1 vs M2 model other than cost? (about $28 there)
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 5:36:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MarineNP: I just bought one of these babies. It's an ATN Professional 5x33L tactical scope. It has the rheostat which allows the crosshairs and built-in range finder to illuminate red in low light conditions. It also has a bullet drop compensator which is made for 5.56/.223 rounds. Haven't decided on which rifle I'm going to put it on, probably my HK SL8 (G36 clone) but maybe one of my ARs. I am absolutely in love with this scope. [url]http://www.aimdiscount.com/AMT5X33L.jpg[/url]
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Sorry but here it goes, The ATN is a pile of junk. Sell it and buy an IOR. The difference in optics alone is like night and day.
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 5:37:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/12/2003 9:14:03 PM EDT by sfcret]
jregistrar only difference between the M1 and M2 scope is the length and weight, M1 10in., M2 8.75in. 16 and 12 oz...........other then that it is excatly the same scope.
Link Posted: 6/12/2003 8:07:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sfcret: I would stay away from bushmaster they want too much money for them.....SNIPERCOUNTRY.COM has them for 292.......best price on the net.
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sfcret, thanks for the pricing info as $292 is the best price I've seeen.
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:07:33 AM EDT
My next optics buy is the Super M2 with the 223 Nato recticle. Drooool... Bushmaster has them at like $650 but the guy on the fal files can sell them at like $400 with a group buy. SorryOciffer
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:22:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/13/2003 8:24:01 AM EDT by Boomholzer]
Originally Posted By MarineNP: I just bought one of these babies. It's an ATN Professional 5x33L tactical scope. It has the rheostat which allows the crosshairs and built-in range finder to illuminate red in low light conditions. It also has a bullet drop compensator which is made for 5.56/.223 rounds. Haven't decided on which rifle I'm going to put it on, probably my HK SL8 (G36 clone) but maybe one of my ARs. I am absolutely in love with this scope. [url]http://www.aimdiscount.com/AMT5X33L.jpg[/url]
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I've been eyeballing one of those for some time now. $199 in the Sportsman's Guide. QCMGR: Have you owned one?
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:27:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/14/2003 11:35:47 PM EDT by Jake_Cutlass]
The difference between M1 and M2: M2 has an adjustable ocular for dioptries, M1 has not. I think IOR is a top quality brand that has no direct peer when compact tactical scopes are concerned. I have one on my HK SL 6 and never regretted the purchase, although it was a bit pricy here in Germany... [b]@sfcret:[/b] is that a [b]B&T (Brugger & Thomet) picantinny rail[/b] on your G3-clone? If so, what is the model no.? Several web dealers on B&T mounts list different model #s for G3-type guns (21256, 21262, 21176). I (hopefully) get my HK-clone soon and also plan to use a B&T rail scope mount with ARMS QR rings to mount a (probably IOR, either 6x30 M2 Super or 2,5-10x42 Ill.) scope on it. The rails, that are designed for the MP 5 are significantly shorter due to the shorter receiver and I would prefer a rail as long as possible for the greatest flexibility in scope mounting (eye relief, charger lever clearance etc.). Thanks In Advance! Jake C.
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 5:05:42 PM EDT
5subslr5 you IM box id full.....here is the link to the scope. http://www.snipercountrypx.com/IOR_Scopes.asp
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 7:06:38 PM EDT
Two things -- I have a BM A3 shorty, with a Valdada M2 on high quick-release Valdada mounts. Three things: 1. At 50 yards, I can group under an inch, consistently, off a bench. At 100 yards, I can't shoot groups at four inches: Surely nothing to brag about. Frankly, I can do almost as well with iron sights. (Still, nothing to brag about). So, to the point: People at the range tell me that the 4X scope really isn't that much good at 100 yds. None of the them. I figure the reason for the open groups is part scope, part 16" barrel. Comments? 2. I'm still wondering if the sight holds zero that well. Anyone with experience who wants to comment? 3. Has anyone checked out Valdada's service? They're aftermarket care makes me afraid to return the sights for a minor repair. They don't answer their phone. Dont' have e-mail. And I don't want to mail my scope into a black hole. Anyone dealt with Valdada directly? SIG
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:16:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sfcret: 5subslr5 you IM box id full.....here is the link to the scope. http://www.snipercountrypx.com/IOR_Scopes.asp
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Sorry guy and I've cleaned out my IM. OK, I've tried the link and that doesn't work ?? I've been to the Sniper Country site but just can't find the IOR's. Probably I'm just blind.
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 8:58:20 PM EDT
Sig, if your shooting 4 inch groups at 100yds with a scope something is wrong. Either you need more practice or something is wrong with the gun/scope/ammo is wrong. What ammo are you using? How are you shooting (position)? How much use has the rifle seen? Kit or factory built? How much experience do you have? New to scopes? SorryOciffer
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 9:01:21 PM EDT
I am using a 6x42 Tactical with the MP-8 reticle as my "test bed" scope. It has seen service on several .458 SOCOM uppers, as well as .338 Spectre uppers. The first one I bought, failed after an abusive session of full power 500 gr loads. I called IOR, told them what had happened. The reply was simple: "No Way! Send it, and we'll replace it". And they did, no questions asked. This one (#2) has performed flawlessly. I am using an ARMS 36S-EX and IOR rings, and it will out shoot me easily. Several folks who are using Leupold scopes have commented on the clarity and the quality for the price. One is even getting an IOR because performance with the Leupold wasn't up to his satisfaction and he wanted to mount the Loopy on another rifle. For the price, they are hard to beat. I really like the MP-8 reticle, with the 458 I can zero the cross hairs for the 300 gr JHP load, and use one of the lower intersections as the cross hairs for the 500 gr subsonic ... The picture of it mounted on a 458 20" is in the Photos section under 458 SOCOM Uppers Marty
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 9:05:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SorryOciffer: Sig, if your shooting 4 inch groups at 100yds with a scope something is wrong. Either you need more practice or something is wrong with the gun/scope/ammo is wrong. What ammo are you using? How are you shooting (position)? How much use has the rifle seen? Kit or factory built? How much experience do you have? New to scopes? SorryOciffer
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When was the last time you used a strong copper remover to clean the copper fouling ?
Link Posted: 6/13/2003 11:37:42 PM EDT
5subslr5, Try this site for the IOR's: http://www.snipercountry.com/PX/SC_PX.asp
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 2:19:05 AM EDT
One other possability, has the scope been off the rifle and left somewhere where someone could have dropped or knocked it onto the ground/floor when you weren't around? Could the rifle been knocked over or dropped by a child or other adult? It could happen and you not know because no one wants to tell someone they may have just broke their rifle/optics. SorryOciffer
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 7:48:33 AM EDT
SIG, Sorry to hear about your troubles. At 50yds the scope performs perfectly, I would rule out the scope and rings. At the bench are you using a rest? Also, I would look at breathing control and possible flinching. I am using a 16" barrel as well and get approx. 2-2.5" groups and I am just getting back into the AR15's again after about a 10 year lapse. Have a buddy shoot your rifle and see what they can do with it. It will rule out the shooter or scope. Also, use the best ammo you can afford to test the gun. Some ammo isn't consistant. Good luck.
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 7:52:03 AM EDT
5subslr5, when you go to the SNIPER COUNTRY PX site, click OPTICS on the left hand side. then click on IOR, then IOR TACTICAL SCOPES
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 9:30:32 AM EDT
Originally Posted By sfcret: 5subslr5, when you go to the SNIPER COUNTRY PX site, click OPTICS on the left hand side. then click on IOR, then IOR TACTICAL SCOPES
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sfcret, thanks much..........I've been to the Sniper Country PX and the scope I want is not listed there. The scope I've been admiring is the "Super M-2" with a 35mm tube and 30mm objective - yes I know the tube is larger than the objective - and comes with a set of 35mm tactical rings. List is $599. It's the Super M-2 that I'm looking for the best price on.
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 12:32:25 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: The scope I've been admiring is the "Super M-2" with a 35mm tube and 30mm objective - yes I know the tube is larger than the objective - and comes with a set of 35mm tactical rings. List is $599. It's the Super M-2 that I'm looking for the best price on.
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if you use a search engine you can find what your looking for...... http://www.cactustactical.com/valdada/superm2tact.html
Link Posted: 6/14/2003 2:20:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sfcret:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5: The scope I've been admiring is the "Super M-2" with a 35mm tube and 30mm objective - yes I know the tube is larger than the objective - and comes with a set of 35mm tactical rings. List is $599. It's the Super M-2 that I'm looking for the best price on.
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if you use a search engine you can find what your looking for...... http://www.cactustactical.com/valdada/superm2tact.html
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Yep - I use google quite a bit and have Cactus bookmarked..............$499 is probably not too bad on this scope as it does come with rings.
Link Posted: 6/16/2003 8:08:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer:
Originally Posted By MarineNP: I just bought one of these babies. It's an ATN Professional 5x33L tactical scope. It has the rheostat which allows the crosshairs and built-in range finder to illuminate red in low light conditions. It also has a bullet drop compensator which is made for 5.56/.223 rounds. Haven't decided on which rifle I'm going to put it on, probably my HK SL8 (G36 clone) but maybe one of my ARs. I am absolutely in love with this scope. [url]http://www.aimdiscount.com/AMT5X33L.jpg[/url]
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I've been eyeballing one of those for some time now. $199 in the Sportsman's Guide. QCMGR: Have you owned one?
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Yes, I got it through Sportsman's Guide a few years back. I sent it back as soon as I could. Get the I.O.R. scope. You will not be disappointed.
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 11:37:29 AM EDT
SorryOciffer and DOA, Thanks for your interest and comments. I guess I'm guilty as charged. I am a newbie at this. Let me count the ways: 1. New to ARs -- four months or so. 2. New to scopes -- two months or so. 3. New to bench rests -- Protekto Model rifle rest (from Dillon), front and back bags. Two months. 4. To the best of my knowledge the rifle was NIB. 5. It's clean and cared for. First point, after two more sessions on the range I'm shooting 2.5" groups with one or two fly offs out of each 20-rnd mag. That could be me or the ammo. Dunno. I'm shooting my best groupings with 55 gr Winchester Q3131a = IMI M193. I also shoot 62 gr Winchester .223. Not a heckuva lot of difference. The 5.56 seems a little better. I know the scope's BDC is set for 62 grn... maybe the Israeli ammo is more cosnsistent? I think the issue in my case is experience and range time... Someone on the line remarked that Bushmasters should shoot 1 MOA groups but, then, he might have been referring to the longer 20" barrel. I didn't think to ask. Another guy told me that the 1:9 twist wants a 67 gr round. I'm grateful for you comments. SIG
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 2:00:51 PM EDT
SIG, Bushy's can generally shoot 1 MOA when properly sandbagged (no matter the barrel length). This also assumes the use of high quality ammunition. Ammunition is the key part of getting good accuracy. Feed it junk and expect junky results. Even Q3131A which is very popular and of reasonable quality is not a very 'accurate' round - it was never loaded to be a 1moa round. Next time your out try some Black Hills in 68gr or 69gr. Assuming your doing your job (breath, trigger control, proper placement of the bags) you should get that group much smaller.
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 2:11:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By QCMGR:
Originally Posted By jregistrar: Busmaster list one for AR15 on their web site. Has anyone aut there in AR15 land used this scope, and what do you think of it? Thanks Tom
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Excellent scope!
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Good !! Cause I've been thinking of an IOR 6X fixed power for a AR-10A4 carbine.
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I put the 10x56 ill. reticle on my AR10
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 2:29:02 PM EDT
I don't have one but I want one or two!
Link Posted: 6/19/2003 4:33:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By W-W:
Originally Posted By 5subslr5:
Originally Posted By QCMGR:
Originally Posted By jregistrar: Busmaster list one for AR15 on their web site. Has anyone aut there in AR15 land used this scope, and what do you think of it? Thanks Tom
View Quote
Excellent scope!
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Good !! Cause I've been thinking of an IOR 6X fixed power for a AR-10A4 carbine.
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I put the 10x56 ill. reticle on my AR10
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W-W, I can't see far enough these days to use 10X !! I'm assuming you put that scope on an AR-10 rifle ?? How do you like it ??
Link Posted: 7/12/2003 7:05:50 PM EDT
the Valdada M1 was the companys first entry into the CQB tactical line. The M2 came out several years later, adding an adjustable lense feature and it is also more compact. Approximately, 1 1.4 inches shorter. The M2 is a generational improvement over the M1 well worth the cost. The company is planning on re-vamping the M1 line very soon making it mainly for .308 rifles since the eye relief is better on it for 308 than the M2. The product line focus will be: M1 towards .308 and M2 towards .223. The factory has been working on this for part of this year, but there is no definite time frame for when the re-vamped M1's will be available. The Super M2 is a fixed 6 power scope with a 35 mm tube. It is geared towards more long range applications and the scope, if bought from a reputable dealer, will include a set of 35mm rings. Largest sources for these products: the Valdada importer himself, www.valdada.com, the southwestern distributor, www.cactustactical.com or DS Arms and Bushmaster selling under their proprietary brand names.
Link Posted: 7/12/2003 9:00:46 PM EDT
I had an M2, and it was a good scope, but for some reason, it and myself just didn't "click". The (IIRC) 1.5-4x scope they brought out awhile back looks like it'd be worth checking out.
Link Posted: 7/12/2003 9:47:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rifle_guy: The Super M2 is a fixed 6 power scope with a 35 mm tube. It is geared towards more long range applications and the scope, if bought from a reputable dealer, will include a set of 35mm rings.
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I'm considering the Super M2 for an AR-10 carbine. Definitely on my short list.
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