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Posted: 6/5/2003 10:15:21 AM EDT
[#1]
18 inch cold hammer forged barrel 1:8 twist
Knights armament URX full length handguard, or 16 inch cold hammer forged barrel Knights armament URX mid length handguard LMT flat top upper PRI flip up front sight or KAC flip up front sight ARMS #40 BUIS Trijicon ACOG TA31a with ARMS #19s, Gemtech bi-lok flash hider with Gemtech M4-96D Surefire M962SU, Tangodown battle grip. Vltor Stock AN-PEQ2a, and AN-PVS14. Magazines and lots of 77gr Match king. Oh, damnit, 1500 dollars limit?? okay, Bushmaster M4 with KAC free float RAS, EOTech 552 and ARMS #40 BUIS and a Surefire M962SU. a bit over 1500 but pretty close. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 10:20:42 AM EDT
[#2]
I guess this one is going to revolve around the following question.
Which is better, a heavy 16"bbl like the SEALs wanted. Or a medium 18" like the SPR has? ACOG for optic. Its made for this kind of short/medium range work. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 11:17:11 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: 18 inch cold hammer forged barrel 1:8 twist Knights armament URX full length handguard, or 16 inch cold hammer forged barrel Knights armament URX mid length handguard LMT flat top upper PRI flip up front sight or KAC flip up front sight ARMS #40 BUIS Trijicon ACOG TA31a with ARMS #19s, Gemtech bi-lok flash hider with Gemtech M4-96D Surefire M962SU, Tangodown battle grip. Vltor Stock AN-PEQ2a, and AN-PVS14. Magazines and lots of 77gr Match king. Oh, damnit, 1500 dollars limit?? okay, Bushmaster M4 with KAC free float RAS, EOTech 552 and ARMS #40 BUIS and a Surefire M962SU. a bit over 1500 but pretty close. I was preparing an email to send to you as I was reading the beginning of your list, to know where I could obtain said items for such a deal!! Was getting all excited, and then you go and through the catch in. [slap] The Bushy M4 setup does sound interesting though. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 11:19:23 AM EDT
[#4]
Quoted: I guess this one is going to revolve around the following question. Which is better, a heavy 16"bbl like the SEALs wanted. Or a medium 18" like the SPR has? ACOG for optic. Its made for this kind of short/medium range work. That was for the SPR they were requesting I thought, not for a general fighting rifle. Or did I miss something? |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 11:23:34 AM EDT
[#5]
Bushmaster M4A1. Phantom flash suppressor, DD FF RAS, ARMS 40, M68 CCO on #22M68.
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Posted: 6/5/2003 11:36:51 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted: Quoted: I guess this one is going to revolve around the following question. Which is better, a heavy 16"bbl like the SEALs wanted. Or a medium 18" like the SPR has? ACOG for optic. Its made for this kind of short/medium range work. That was for the SPR they were requesting I thought, not for a general fighting rifle. Or did I miss something? [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=161856[/url] It was for a general fighting carbine that was high enough quality that it could be used as a SPR in a pinch-velocity being the limiting factor-by SEAL snipers when they were not tasked with carrying a sniper rifle. It was more about enabling the snipers to make better use of their training on those occasions when a full sniper weapon was not appropriate. Which is why they dubbed it the Recon Rifle. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 1:31:34 PM EDT
[#7]
M4A1 type rifle
Knights RAS Masterkey shotty Aimpoint M2 30 round mags (duh) |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 1:38:41 PM EDT
[#8]
With an Eotech on it. Close quarters Urban.
[img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/047928.jpg[/img] Crap, I'm over budget too. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 1:50:32 PM EDT
[#9]
I'm hoping that $1500 limit is just for the upper, not the complete rifle.
Also assuming the lower you've already got is a pre-ban. Pretty much all of this can be had on the EE Colt 14.5 1/7 upper - $900 Knights RAS w/grip - $300 SureFire M2 - $140 KAC 1" mount - $50 [red] Sell Colt CH - $100 [/red] [red] Sell Colt M4 HG's - $40 [/red] EOTech 552 - $300 CQB sling - $35 Phantom/Vortex - $35 ------------------------------------ Total $1620 And then stock up on lots of USGI 30's and 75gr Hornady |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 1:58:59 PM EDT
[#10]
How about this:
Eagle Arms Lower: $100 J&T 16" Expedition kit with Fobus M33 handguards: about $550 ARMS #40: about $100 EOTech 522: about $380 Surefire M900: about $450 ARFX short skeleton stock: about $100 (bling!) Dump the bling! and it comes in at about $1500. Then add a RRA two stage trigger for another $100. And another $250 to upgrade to the RAS. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 2:14:14 PM EDT
[#11]
Wilson Combat lists this ( UPPER ONLY ) for
$700 [img]http://www.wilsoncombat.com/images/shops/city/products/UT-15UP.jpg[/img] |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 2:45:34 PM EDT
[#12]
Interesting. All very cool ideas. Some are not quite what I expected, but interesting none the less.
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Posted: 6/5/2003 4:55:44 PM EDT
[#13]
I'm doing this as we speak and am pretty close to your budget now:
RRA stripped lower w/RRA N.M. parts kit-$250 Ace Arfx w/buffer,tube,spring -$125 RRA M4 upper post ban chrome 1/9 14.5" w/fixed brake,M44's,GG&G flip front sight, TacHandle,bolt/carrier/charging handle -$885 Trijicon sight set(front and rear) -$75 GG&G vertical fore grip -$40 Hogue rear grip -$18 5-English 30rd mags&greenies -$95 2-Fobus mag clamps -$16 _________ $1504. tac.light components(Fobus/G2,P61,clickie tailcap and shock isolated bezel assy) are on the way and will total about $125 which will leave me +/- $375 of the $2k budget that I set for optics(Comp M2 and Arms mount)and a sling so it looks like I'm gonna have a little cost over run but oh well. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 5:15:09 PM EDT
[#14]
I call foul here. The ARFX stock is pure bling. I have a couple myself--even recommended one, but their still bling. Now put a standard A2 or a tactical stock on it and you'll come in under budget.
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Posted: 6/5/2003 5:31:17 PM EDT
[#15]
Start with a Bushmaster A3/A4 configuration, with a mid length (18 inch) heavy barrel.
Add a belt fed upper, with ammo in a backpack, Predator style. Add full auto. (Selective fire, really) Retain the standard 5.56mm caliber. Add a reliable triple beam (Red, green, and IR) laser pointing device of considerable power. Install a collapsible stock for convenience's sake. Add a well regarded, combat proven sighting system like an ACOG. Add an M209 and carry a variety of grenades for all occasions in your grenade vest. That's all I'd really want or need. Quite sufficient to clean out a good sized building and the occasional pillbox. CJ |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 6:00:30 PM EDT
[#16]
Not "PURE" bling
(1)light weight (2)optimal length of pull(for me) (3)ambi side sling mount So if you do away with the stock only you save $95 but you have to buy a $50 canoe paddle or tactical entry stock so short it is worthless so you saved $45.I'd rather be over budget. And incidentally in my opinion the purest form of bling(read crap here) is the non-collapsing collapsable stocks. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 6:13:36 PM EDT
[#17]
M4A1 w/ M68 and 100gr magazine length ammo (anyone know the XM designation for this ammo?).
civvie version? 14.5" flat-top 1/7 twist upper w/ 1.5" muzzle device, semi-auto-only lower, collapsable stock pinned in the position best for you (for me, it's one click up from the shortest on the military M4 stock), aimpoint M2, and 77gr ammo. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 6:21:24 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted: Set up a dedicated AR for Urban fighting. Barrel length, sights, optics, other accesories etc. No bling. Everything must serve a true functional purpose. Also do it as if you were on a budget, say, $1500 max. Just interested in your ideas. 11.5" A3 w/collapsible stock, Eotech 551 , Arms #40, RAS w/ Surefire M900.It's short and to the point. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 6:22:32 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted: And incidentally in my opinion the purest form of bling(read crap here) is the non-collapsing collapsable stocks. Have to disagree here. Personally, I LOVE the fixed collapsable stocks. I have had them on ALL my carbine, and for me they are darn near perfect. True collapsables dont do anything for me as the only way I can shoot one is fully extended. I dont store or carry any any of my weapons in any position except that of a state of immediate readiness. When I had a preban, I never collapsed the stock because I wanted to be able to pick it up and shoot without doing anything, other than charging it if need be. I prefer the full length buffer tube on the fixed collasp. styles as well. They give me a slightly more streamlined setup, and I prefer the built in sling mount in them. This is all personal mind you, but definitely nothing but function for me. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 6:28:42 PM EDT
[#20]
Personally, to me, 90% of the rifles you guys are describing fit the bill of a CQB gun for me, not an out door urban fighting rifle. To me, an Urban rifle need to be effective out to about 200-250 meters. With the shorter barrels, you start loosing some effectiveness, especially with the 11.5's. In my mind, and this is not overly specific, yet, and urban rifle would be something like the following.
16 inch barrel flat top with BUIS, Aimpoint or Acog solid stock of your preference A bit larger than a CQB gun since lots of compactness is not an issue, but a bit smaller than a fullsize for easier portablity in and around houses, vehicle's and such where you would be fighting outdoors mostly, but not in the more open distances that a fullsize would be better for. |
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Posted: 6/5/2003 10:21:11 PM EDT
[#21]
I think a 14.5" with 75 grain or heavier ammo should be effective to 150-200m, which I think is the most you'd need in urban. and you have to take into consideration that urban includes CQB, so you don't want to neglect it.
I agree, though, that 11.5" is too short. |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 2:19:44 AM EDT
[#22]
I have the perfect CAR-15
bushmaster 14.5 fluted heavy w/vortex SIR-M PRI flip up front sight/arms 40 rear MSS stock abi safety and mag release Aimpoint M68 |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 2:32:30 AM EDT
[#23]
Quoted: Personally, to me, 90% of the rifles you guys are describing fit the bill of a CQB gun for me, not an out door urban fighting rifle. To me, an Urban rifle need to be effective out to about 200-250 meters. With the shorter barrels, you start loosing some effectiveness, especially with the 11.5's. In my mind, and this is not overly specific, yet, and urban rifle would be something like the following. 16 inch barrel flat top with BUIS, Aimpoint or Acog solid stock of your preference A bit larger than a CQB gun since lots of compactness is not an issue, but a bit smaller than a fullsize for easier portablity in and around houses, vehicle's and such where you would be fighting outdoors mostly, but not in the more open distances that a fullsize would be better for. Well, that sounds like my current setup.I have a 16" flat top w/Arms #40, Eotech 511,A1 stock and Fobus M33 handguards w/ KAC grip and Surefire light mounted for target id in the dark. |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 5:18:19 AM EDT
[#24]
For a current post-ban config...
Bushmaster lower with fixed folder...$279 or so Flat top upper with: 16" Chrome lined M4 config barrel...no brake...not HB...standard front sight...standard carrier with fitted bolt...Frank White at Compass Lake can do it for you and keep it in state...about $500 or so RAS II...$330 ARMS #40...$95-100 So now we are at $1200 or thereabouts. Aimpoint ML2/22M68...about another $450 You may be able to play with the numbers a little, but this should be all quality, no bling and pretty close to the $1500 limit. |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 8:08:45 AM EDT
[#25]
My rifle is the following:
PWA lower with trigger job--$300 DPMS A3 upper with BM 16" barrel, turned down from HBAR and attached Cav Comp--$290 (I traded in a A2 RRA upper with Mini-Y) Hogue grip--$10 Knight's RIS--$270 (from a friend) EOTech 552--$330 GG&G A2 BUIS--$110 GG&G Foregrip--$49 CQB Solutions Sling--$40 Badger Taclatch--$20 Tacstar Light--$70 I'm ditching the A2 buttstock for a Cav Arms C1--$40 Total so far: $1489 I know, the light I got isn't a SF or Streamlight, but will be upgrading sometime soon. Another option would be a anybrand lower--$250 20" gov't profile 1:7 chrome-lined DPMS A3 with Cav Comp installed (coversion from pre-to-post)--$500 Hogue grip--$10 Aimpoint--$320 Total so far: $1080 Then you could change out your stocks, add a different BUIS, put a rail on (Advanced Armament) for a light. Functional, perhaps a tad long for CQB, but fine outside. Of course, YMMV. -Zmeja |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 8:43:53 AM EDT
[#26]
An urban fighting rifle by definition almost needs to be a CQB. That is where the exitement will happen. if you go with a 20 inch or longer barrel then you will inhibit the useabiliy of the weapon indoors. which is where a significant amount of actual urban warfare occurs. Outdoors the shorter barrel will not hurt any use. Ill keep it simple on the recomendation. A wilson combat 16 inch or aBushmaster standard 16 inch heavy barrel A2($900) with trijicon night sights($75)Streamlight ($150),Aimpoint($300), and a beta mag($600.) The beta mag being a later addition and totally trivial.
More the question that needs to be asked is what options and accesories are your needs? Our advice is better left to personal experiences with products that you deem nessisary. |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 12:21:44 PM EDT
[#27]
I'm in the process of changing up my main arm from a pure CQB gun to an all around decent fighting gun. So far, here's what I'm thinking:
Bushy Flattop 20" HBAR Chopped to 16" and lightened to .825 under the handguards, then fluted to death by KKF $400 for Like New Upper, $150-ish for work PRI Front BUIS $180 ARMS #40 BUIS $90 ARMS Full length Rifle SIR $400 Rock River Lower (complete, sans buttstock) $175 Old beat up A1 stock with new guts $30 Ergo Grip w/ gapper $20 Surefire M2 w/ ARMS mount and long SU tape $250 $1695 total. I'll prolly get an TA31F when i get the cash... For a BUDGET fighter? Bushy M4 Dissy A1 upper $500 RRA Lower $175 Ergo Grip w/ gapper $20 A1 Buttstock with new guts $30 $725 Total Options: Aimpoint w/ an ARMS #39 $500 Surefire M2 w/ Cheapo mount and SU long tape $175 So, that's $1400 of pure function... -Cap'n Edited for errors... |
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Posted: 6/6/2003 8:52:35 PM EDT
[#28]
Well my current build is what I think is best for an “Urban Rifle”.
1. 14.5 inch lightweight 1/7 barrel (Like the old 653’s) 2. Gemtech bi-lok flash hider with Gemtech M4-96D 3. ARMS SIR 46 or 50 4. ARMS #40 BUIS 5. Trijicon ACOG TA31 or TA11 with ARMS #19s 6. Monolock for the ACOG and NVD to work together as a NV Scope 7. Surefire M900 with IR nav. lights 8. Vltor Stock 9. AN-PEQ2A IR Laser 10. AN-PVS14 or ITT 6010, 6015 Yes my list is very similar to SMGLee’s with just a few changes based on preference. You can go cheaper by subbing an Aimpoint for the ACOG and a Corsak for the PEQ-2A. To stay in your budget and to keep things simple you could go with: 1. Bushmaster 16 inch lightweight A1 upper. 2. Surefire M659 light 3. Aimpoint ML2 on a gooseneck. 4. If you had enough get the Vltor carbine stock if not go with what ever you like. This would be very light and do just about anything you want and stay in your budget. As you can see I have a strong preference for the lightweight barrels. |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 7:56:10 AM EDT
[#29]
Hmmm...Bushmaster C7? style upper with a light weight barrel and an ARFX stock. Not perfect, but it is going to be my first AR. Then when the ban goes away I might get the muzzle threaded for a flash hider. ACOG will mate with the channel on that style upper won't they? The channel is the same right? Then I can enjoy the ACOG while I get enough money for the tricked out ARMS rifle .
Good ideas everyone. If you used 75-77 grain ammo, does a person even need a 20 inch barrel? I mean the heavier weight bullets are less depended on velocity and therefore barrel length for performance??? A 16 inch would get just a hair more than the 14.5 and have a removeable muzzle device. |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 8:04:33 AM EDT
[#30]
Here's what I'm working on...*ZERO* bling included!
[u]What I Have:[/u] Tromix Stripped Lower - $125 RRA Lower Parts Kit - $60 RRA Flat-Top Upper - $95 RRA B/C/CH - $125 RRA A2 Stock Kit - $60 Bushmaster 1-in-9" twist 16" Heavy Barrel Kit w/BMAS 3-rail Gas Block installed - $265 $730 Spent So Far... [u]What I Need:[/u] EO-Tech 552 "E" - $380 Bushmaster BMAS Detachable Front Flip-Up Sight - $75 Bushmaster BMAS Rear Flip-Up Sight - $75 $530 More To Go... $730 + $530 = $1260 Total Package. Theoretically, that would leave me with $240 to put some sort of light on it, if I so chose... Any suggestions for a light that falls within that price range? No vertical grip types, either. I might have to go prone sometime and I'll want to keep as low a profile as possible... I've already got a couple of the old original aluminum SureFire 6P's. Any way to mount one of those on one side of the 3-rail Gas Block and rig up a pressure switch or click switch? |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 8:59:37 AM EDT
[#31]
Bushmaster 16" flat top with no muzzle device. Shortest length without a tax stamp, same size package as a 14.5 w/fs or brake, far better ballistics, don't need expensive-rare ammo to frag at reasonale distances.
A-1 or C-1 stock Firsh (fine for light and foregrip, not sure I'd mount optics) Surefire M952p Your preference of foregrip Daniels defense single point mounting plate and simple sling Aimpoint Arms #40 BUIS |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 10:14:25 AM EDT
[#32]
MY IDEA OF OPTIMUM FOR WHAT YOU DESCRIBE, CLOSE SOCIAL ENCOUNTERS IN AN URBAN SETTING, IS THE BOTTOM WEAPON IN THIS PIC:
[IMG]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/IG_LoadImage.asp?iImageUnq=8547[/IMG] I ADD A SUREFIRE M952C FOR LIGHT. I USE A CQB SOLUTIONS HST #121 SLING AND A KNIGHT'S SINGLE POINT SLING MOUNT. IF I HAD "FRIENDS", I'D LIKE EVERY 4TH ONE TO HAVE A SIMILAR PLATFORM BUT WITH A 14.5" BARREL AND TRIJICON ACOG IN 3.5 OR 4X. IF I HAD A LOT OF FRIENDS, THE MIX WOULD GO TO LARGER CALIBERS & BELT FEDS, ON-CALL CLOSE AIR SUPPORT, REAL-TIME SATELLITE RECON, ETC. WAS THERE A PRICE LIMIT ON ALL THIS THAT I MISSED? WES |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 12:00:13 PM EDT
[#33]
A Colt SP1, Thats all.
GG |
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Posted: 6/7/2003 5:38:57 PM EDT
[#34]
All of the above! OH! And a few bucks left for lots-o-practice!
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Posted: 6/7/2003 5:40:05 PM EDT
[#35]
All of the above! OH! And a few bucks left for lots-o-practice!
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Posted: 6/8/2003 11:04:27 AM EDT
[#36]
Quoted: MY IDEA OF OPTIMUM FOR WHAT YOU DESCRIBE, CLOSE SOCIAL ENCOUNTERS IN AN URBAN SETTING, IS THE BOTTOM WEAPON IN THIS PIC: [IMG]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/IG_LoadImage.asp?iImageUnq=8547[/IMG] I ADD A SUREFIRE M952C FOR LIGHT. I USE A CQB SOLUTIONS HST #121 SLING AND A KNIGHT'S SINGLE POINT SLING MOUNT. IF I HAD "FRIENDS", I'D LIKE EVERY 4TH ONE TO HAVE A SIMILAR PLATFORM BUT WITH A 14.5" BARREL AND TRIJICON ACOG IN 3.5 OR 4X. IF I HAD A LOT OF FRIENDS, THE MIX WOULD GO TO LARGER CALIBERS & BELT FEDS, ON-CALL CLOSE AIR SUPPORT, REAL-TIME SATELLITE RECON, ETC. WAS THERE A PRICE LIMIT ON ALL THIS THAT I MISSED? WES [slap] Silly rabbit. [;)] Some very interesting ideas. Just FYI, I threw the $$ amount in there just as something to go by. Its easy to design your dream gun with no money limits involved. I have in my mind what I think is a good UCR. Will probably begin building it soon. I think everyone has mentioned all the pieces I will use, just not all in the same post. [:D] |
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Posted: 6/8/2003 11:09:38 AM EDT
[#37]
I would get and M16 A2, take it out of the box, and you're done!
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Posted: 6/8/2003 6:47:57 PM EDT
[#38]
Quoted: 18 inch cold hammer forged barrel 1:8 twist Knights armament URX full length handguard, or 16 inch cold hammer forged barrel Knights armament URX mid length handguard LMT flat top upper PRI flip up front sight or KAC flip up front sight ARMS #40 BUIS Trijicon ACOG TA31a with ARMS #19s, Gemtech bi-lok flash hider with Gemtech M4-96D Surefire M962SU, Tangodown battle grip. Vltor Stock AN-PEQ2a, and AN-PVS14. Magazines and lots of 77gr Match king. Oh, damnit, 1500 dollars limit?? okay, Bushmaster M4 with KAC free float RAS, EOTech 552 and ARMS #40 BUIS and a Surefire M962SU. a bit over 1500 but pretty close. yeah, what he said. |
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Posted: 6/10/2003 9:04:39 AM EDT
[#39]
I am beginning to put this together now. Ordered the first bit of stuff today. Very interesting replies. I am not going to disclose exactly how this one is going to be put together, yet. A few of you came really close. As with anything, I am sure there are those who will like the way I set this rifle up, and those who wont. I have decided that I need to put one together based on what "I" feel is right for me, for its intended usage. I think this is going to be a good rifle, that *might* be able to serve two roles at once. We shall see.
So, I will have pics and info up on my UCR as soon as it is ready enough to post. Hopefully wont take long to get it all together. |
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Posted: 6/10/2003 10:36:32 AM EDT
[#40]
Hawkeye, Y'know, you've got it figured out. Build what you want, and add/subtract things to get the end product: The Perfect Carbine for You. Heck, that's what I've done.
Now, if it was only as easy as it sounds, hehehe. -Cap'n |
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Posted: 6/10/2003 2:30:26 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted: An urban fighting rifle by definition almost needs to be a CQB. That is where the exitement will happen. if you go with a 20 inch or longer barrel then you will inhibit the useabiliy of the weapon indoors. which is where a significant amount of actual urban warfare occurs. Outdoors the shorter barrel will not hurt any use. Ill keep it simple on the recomendation. A wilson combat 16 inch or aBushmaster standard 16 inch heavy barrel A2($900) with trijicon night sights($75)Streamlight ($150),Aimpoint($300), and a beta mag($600.) The beta mag being a later addition and totally trivial. More the question that needs to be asked is what options and accesories are your needs? Our advice is better left to personal experiences with products that you deem nessisary. You must not know much about urban combat? All I need is a 20" rifle and to do the house clearing part, is fire and gasoline. Like who is going to go clear houses navy seal style? I'll burn their a$$ out and then shoot whoever. GG |
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Posted: 6/10/2003 2:50:15 PM EDT
[#42]
Originally Posted By Gun Guru: Quoted: An urban fighting rifle by definition almost needs to be a CQB. That is where the exitement will happen. if you go with a 20 inch or longer barrel then you will inhibit the useabiliy of the weapon indoors. which is where a significant amount of actual urban warfare occurs. Outdoors the shorter barrel will not hurt any use. Ill keep it simple on the recomendation. A wilson combat 16 inch or aBushmaster standard 16 inch heavy barrel A2($900) with trijicon night sights($75)Streamlight ($150),Aimpoint($300), and a beta mag($600.) The beta mag being a later addition and totally trivial. More the question that needs to be asked is what options and accesories are your needs? Our advice is better left to personal experiences with products that you deem nessisary. You must not know much about urban combat? All I need is a 20" rifle and to do the house clearing part, is fire and gasoline. Like who is going to go clear houses navy seal style? I'll burn their a$$ out and then shoot whoever. GG What about your own house, parent's house, friend's house, with loved ones inside? |
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Posted: 6/10/2003 3:33:37 PM EDT
[#43]
ok i am gonna buck the gadgeteer trend here:
any lower with an a1 or a2 stock $285 anygood bolt/carrier group $120 bushmaster a1 upper $120 bushmaster 16 inch light weight pre ban barrel with a cav comp or 4 slot break permently attached and the bayonet lug ground off $225 ashley express same plane night sights $75 total $825 20 30 round brit mags: $300 from rguns total: $1125 3 cases of wolf $300 total $1425 PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE: priceless |
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