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Posted: 7/14/2016 7:44:30 PM EDT
[#1]
Posted over in the SGAMMO forum, guess I should have came here first
Just tried some my shipment. Out of 7 only 3 fired.... Cycled a couple thru twice and neither would fire.... 
Anyone got any suggestions? |
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Posted: 7/14/2016 9:13:23 PM EDT
[#2]
We shipped almost 1 million rounds of that ammo since last friday and have had reports back already from many clients using it with good success, and not a single email or contact form message with any problems. Do you have some pictures? What kind of firearm are you using? Other than when used in bolt action rifles, steel case Russian 223 is pretty dang reliable in AR15 and other semi auto rifles provided they have not had any sort of trigger jobs that reduce how hard the firing pin strikes the primer. This ammo uses primers made by Tula since the Vympel factory does not have equipment to make a boxer primer, however Vympel can only make 223 cases that accept boxer primers so they have to source the primer from Tula and it is the same primer Tula uses in all of their 223 ammo. The rest of the components are manufactured in house by Vympel and loaded there too, I tested a small quantity in a colt SP1 carbine and a DPMS and it worked great, I will try to make some youtube videos on this friday if I have time. The ammo should be 100% functional in AR15 platforms, not sure why we are gettign this report, but I will buy the ammo back if it does not work for you
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Posted: 7/14/2016 9:55:03 PM EDT
[#3]
Hi Sam,
Yeah, it surprised me just as much, as I LOVE LOVE LOVE GT in 7.62 x 39. My rifle is a home built, but it shot just fine last weekend and today using S&B 223 (which I shot first). I am trying to figure out my picture host password, but I will upload some pics and hopefully someone will make them hot. I'm hoping another rifle will fix the problem. -Dubbel EDIT: Pics added 
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Posted: 7/14/2016 11:01:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Wow! I'll be checking back to this thread
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Posted: 7/15/2016 9:18:16 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The ammo should be 100% functional in AR15 platforms, not sure why we are gettign this report, but I will buy the ammo back if it does not work for you THIS is why I buy from SGAmmo! You guys need to start including some stickers in your shipments. Embrace the low cost advertising of your customers. |
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Posted: 7/15/2016 9:52:47 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hi Sam, Yeah, it surprised me just as much, as I LOVE LOVE LOVE GT in 7.62 x 39. My rifle is a home built, but it shot just fine last weekend and today using S&B 223 (which I shot first). I am trying to figure out my picture host password, but I will upload some pics and hopefully someone will make them hot. I'm hoping another rifle will fix the problem. -Dubbel EDIT: Pics added http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx221/dubbeltap69/Mobile%20Uploads/20160714_214659_zpsj8xykkjv.jpg http://i758.photobucket.com/albums/xx221/dubbeltap69/Mobile%20Uploads/20160714_214806_zpsglt4qajr.jpg What kind of trigger do you have in there? Any chance your hammer spring is on backwards? That looks like a pretty good strike, on a hard primer, but looks like it ran out of steam. |
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Posted: 7/15/2016 10:26:09 AM EDT
[#7]
Pretty sure it's a stock trigger. Will also double check the spring is in correctly. I will take another rifle and a sample from a different case (bought several) next time I go to the range.
And SGAMMO 's customer service has spoiled me to the point where my UPS driver is looking for a new career. "You sure do ALOT OF HEAVY BOXES...." 
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Posted: 7/15/2016 11:46:38 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pretty sure it's a stock trigger. Will also double check the spring is in correctly. I will take another rifle and a sample from a different case (bought several) next time I go to the range. This problem is VERY common, and will yield those exact same results when the hammer spring is installed backwards or otherwise incorrectly. Soft primers light off ok, but hard primers will not. |
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Posted: 7/15/2016 12:17:42 PM EDT
[#9]
It works fine in my colt SP1 AR15, here is a video I made this morning. It also ran flawlessly in my Chinese AK84S. It is possible that there could be issues in some guns depending on firing pin protrusion and hammer spring strength as I had a second report of this issue this morning. I am going to pull the ammo from the website and see if there are others that have the same problem before moving forward. If anyone has problems with the ammo I will buy it back, but it passed the test here
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Posted: 7/15/2016 12:44:18 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It works fine in my colt SP1 AR15, here is a video I made this morning. It also ran flawlessly in my Chinese AK84S. It is possible that there could be issues in some guns depending on firing pin protrusion and hammer spring strength as I had a second report of this issue this morning. I am going to pull the ammo from the website and see if there are others that have the same problem before moving forward. If anyone has problems with the ammo I will buy it back, but it passed the test here  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BcTeXzwE_Uvery responsive! that's why I buy from you! |
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Posted: 7/15/2016 8:02:11 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Posted over in the SGAMMO forum, guess I should have came here first Just tried some my shipment. Out of 7 only 3 fired.... Cycled a couple thru twice and neither would fire....
Anyone got any suggestions? Replace your hammer spring and try again. I assume you are having FTF type failure and not FTE or something like that. |
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Posted: 7/16/2016 3:06:47 PM EDT
[#12]
It looks like a lot of people are having problems with the primer hardness of this ammo. The reports of this issue are pouring in on me via email from clients that went shooting this morning and I hate to say it but it looks like AR15 with stock hammer springs may not reliably fire this ammo, as well as several other types of firearms that were reported to have ignition issues. I personally test fired this ammo in several different guns including 2 AR15s and a Chinese AK-84s and it worked fine for me so please do test the ammo you get, but there are too many similar complaints now to disregard the issue is real. I believe that using a heavy hammer spring like the Wolff XP spring will solve almost all ignition problems in AR15, however I understand that many clients will not want to do that. While this error in primer selection by the factory may end up leading 'brand suicide' for Vympel in the US commercial market I will not let it happen to SGAmmo nor will I leave my clients hanging, and if needed I will buy back all 1063 cases of this stuff I sold even if i have to take the $250,000 loss personally. I encourage anyone who bought this ammo to test fire and sample a 20 round box and if it does not work in your gun the options are looking at a heavier hammer spring like the Wolff XP, or a return to me for a full refund, I will pay return costs. All that is needed is a friendly email to me thorough the SGAmmo 'contact us' section or in reply to an SGAmmo order confirmation email.
Thank you, Sam Gabbert SGAmmo Owner |
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Posted: 7/16/2016 4:47:05 PM EDT
[#13]
Ugh. Total bummer for you.
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Posted: 7/16/2016 4:55:55 PM EDT
[#14]
This and fast shipping is why I love you guys.:)
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Posted: 7/16/2016 5:08:41 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It looks like a lot of people are having problems with the primer hardness of this ammo. The reports of this issue are pouring in on me via email from clients that went shooting this morning and I hate to say it but it looks like AR15 with stock hammer springs may not reliably fire this ammo, as well as several other types of firearms that were reported to have ignition issues. I personally test fired this ammo in several different guns including 2 AR15s and a Chinese AK-84s and it worked fine for me so please do test the ammo you get, but there are too many similar complaints now to disregard the issue is real. I believe that using a heavy hammer spring like the Wolff XP spring will solve almost all ignition problems in AR15, however I understand that many clients will not want to do that. While this error in primer selection by the factory may end up leading 'brand suicide' for Vympel in the US commercial market I will not let it happen to SGAmmo nor will I leave my clients hanging, and if needed I will buy back all 1063 cases of this stuff I sold even if i have to take the $250,000 loss personally. I encourage anyone who bought this ammo to test fire and sample a 20 round box and if it does not work in your gun the options are looking at a heavier hammer spring like the Wolff XP, or a return to me for a full refund, I will pay return costs. All that is needed is a friendly email to me thorough the SGAmmo 'contact us' section or in reply to an SGAmmo order confirmation email. Thank you, Sam Gabbert SGAmmo Owner Sam, I have AK's that will likely fire this ammo without problem. Remind me next payday and I will take a couple of cases of this off your hands. I don't want you to get stuck with anything. It could be a case issue as the primer pocket could be a tad too deep BTW. |
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Posted: 7/16/2016 6:26:41 PM EDT
[#16]
Just got back from the range w different rifle and with another lower that has a WOLF hammer spring installed.
Different rifle did much much much better. Fired approx 50+ more rounds. Only 1 rd ftf. Also it set off 2 of the 4 that wouldn't fire in original rifle. Switched to WOLF spring rifle, tried the 3 rounds that would not fire in other rifle, and only 1 fired. So 2 out of 60. I'm completely fine with that failure rate, Here is pic. 1 rd per second, at 50 yards using aim point pro. Sam, I'm keeping the ammo and will be ordering more. 
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Posted: 7/16/2016 6:31:51 PM EDT
[#17]
Will be ordering from SG for all my ammo needs. Thanks for your great business ethic.
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Posted: 7/16/2016 6:43:18 PM EDT
[#18]
Been buying from SG for 6+ years never a problem. This thread reaffirms why. .good people.
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Posted: 7/16/2016 9:51:30 PM EDT
[#19]
Was going to buy some of this last week. Glad I waited for some feedback.
Sam's response, however, reinforces why SGAmmo is the first place I look when I need ammo. Think I'll buy some of that MEN M193 tonight! |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 12:58:55 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Will be ordering from SG for all my ammo needs. Thanks for your great business ethic. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 8:48:57 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Will be ordering from SG for all my ammo needs. Thanks for your great business ethic. Needs to be quoted again. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 9:40:13 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Needs to be quoted again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Will be ordering from SG for all my ammo needs. Thanks for your great business ethic. Needs to be quoted again. And again |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 11:42:13 AM EDT
[#23]
I bet if somebody has one of the extended 5.45 AR firing pins it will light them all.
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Posted: 7/17/2016 12:59:48 PM EDT
[#24]
SGammo is good peoples.
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Posted: 7/17/2016 4:44:23 PM EDT
[#25]
I've got a couple of cases on the way...if there's a problem I'll do the firing pin/bolt tail trick that I've done for my AR47. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 5:55:57 PM EDT
[#26]
I wouldn't go grinding on your bolt but a firing pin with a longer tip for commie caliber ARs would likely do the trick.
They are out there The stronger spring is also an option.. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 6:34:19 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I wouldn't go grinding on your bolt but a firing pin with a longer tip for commie caliber ARs would likely do the trick. They are out there The stronger spring is also an option.. I'm using a Timney self-contained 4 pound trigger unit, will look into the extended firing pin...probably wouldn't hurt to store a few away. Thanks for the tip. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 6:50:42 PM EDT
[#28]
First google hit:
http://www.blackriflearms.com/AR-762x39-Enhanced-Firing-Pin_p_9.html |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 9:31:31 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It looks like a lot of people are having problems with the primer hardness of this ammo. The reports of this issue are pouring in on me via email from clients that went shooting this morning and I hate to say it but it looks like AR15 with stock hammer springs may not reliably fire this ammo, as well as several other types of firearms that were reported to have ignition issues. I personally test fired this ammo in several different guns including 2 AR15s and a Chinese AK-84s and it worked fine for me so please do test the ammo you get, but there are too many similar complaints now to disregard the issue is real. I believe that using a heavy hammer spring like the Wolff XP spring will solve almost all ignition problems in AR15, however I understand that many clients will not want to do that. While this error in primer selection by the factory may end up leading 'brand suicide' for Vympel in the US commercial market I will not let it happen to SGAmmo nor will I leave my clients hanging, and if needed I will buy back all 1063 cases of this stuff I sold even if i have to take the $250,000 loss personally. I encourage anyone who bought this ammo to test fire and sample a 20 round box and if it does not work in your gun the options are looking at a heavier hammer spring like the Wolff XP, or a return to me for a full refund, I will pay return costs. All that is needed is a friendly email to me thorough the SGAmmo 'contact us' section or in reply to an SGAmmo order confirmation email. Thank you, Sam Gabbert SGAmmo Owner Wow. 
I have 2 cases of this en route. You just earned my repeat business. 
Now that's customer service. |
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Posted: 7/17/2016 11:22:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Thanks guys, I will stand behind this product for any returns, its going to be a hard month dealing with it but we will get past it, if anyone needs help from me contact me through the SGAmmo 'contact us' section, I will probably be off of AR15.com for a while as we sort out this, but will follow up on this thread once in a while
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Posted: 7/20/2016 11:40:07 AM EDT
[#31]
It turns out that the factory changed the formula on this ammo, and used a primer that is normally used in 5.45x39 mil-spec ammo instead of sourcing the commercial primer from Tula. The primer used is harder, and would require a longer than stock firing pin and a heaver than stock hammer spring to work perfect in most AR15s
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Posted: 7/20/2016 1:56:12 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It turns out that the factory changed the formula on this ammo, and used a primer that is normally used in 5.45x39 mil-spec ammo instead of sourcing the commercial primer from Tula. The primer used is harder, and would require a longer than stock firing pin and a heaver than stock hammer spring to work perfect in most AR15s Ha! I told ya needed.a longer fp! |
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Posted: 7/20/2016 2:46:27 PM EDT
[#33]
My case is supposed to arrive today. I'll test a box and report back.
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Posted: 7/20/2016 3:02:05 PM EDT
[#34]
I'll have to test mine this weekend. Be a shame if it doesn't work as it was good looking lacquered and sealed ammo and I really like the stuff I got several years ago.
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Posted: 7/20/2016 9:07:37 PM EDT
[#35]
Ordered a half-dozen enhanced FP's from Red X Arms, never hurts to have spares. 
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Posted: 7/22/2016 4:28:53 PM EDT
[#36]
I still got failure to fires in the M85 PAP. Way less than both ARs. Shame it had good velocity and it was sealed.
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Posted: 7/22/2016 11:32:10 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Will be ordering from SG for all my ammo needs. Thanks for your great business ethic. No kidding... Doesn't get any better than this. I have used SGAmmo in the past but this thread has convinced me that this is who I want to do business with. |
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Posted: 7/23/2016 11:15:14 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ordered a half-dozen enhanced FP's from Red X Arms, never hurts to have spares.
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob 
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Posted: 7/24/2016 12:12:40 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ordered a half-dozen enhanced FP's from Red X Arms, never hurts to have spares.
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob That one should work. |
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Posted: 7/24/2016 3:33:22 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That one should work. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ordered a half-dozen enhanced FP's from Red X Arms, never hurts to have spares.
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob That one should work. thanks, ordered a couple last night.
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Posted: 7/24/2016 6:55:16 PM EDT
[#41]
And THIS is why we love SGAMMO
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Posted: 7/24/2016 10:35:36 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ordered a half-dozen enhanced FP's from Red X Arms, never hurts to have spares.
did you purchase the 7.62x39 enhanced pin? that's the only one i could find on their website. thanks, bob That's the one.
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Posted: 7/25/2016 1:48:27 PM EDT
[#43]
Got my GT last week and took it out yesterday to test it out.
Had 5 failures to fire out of 10 rounds. Disappointing as I had high hopes due to my experience with all of the GT 7.62 I have fired over the years. I love SG ammo and purchase a lot of ammo from them. Huge props to Sam for taking care of anybody that has issues with the ammo. |
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Posted: 7/25/2016 1:58:11 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
THIS is why I buy from SGAmmo! You guys need to start including some stickers in your shipments. Embrace the low cost advertising of your customers. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The ammo should be 100% functional in AR15 platforms, not sure why we are gettign this report, but I will buy the ammo back if it does not work for you THIS is why I buy from SGAmmo! You guys need to start including some stickers in your shipments. Embrace the low cost advertising of your customers. F that. Just another way for people to know what I ordered. |
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Posted: 7/25/2016 2:52:19 PM EDT
[#45]
OK gents, good news! As I suspected, the enhanced firing pin from Black Rifle Arms works like a charm, and I didn't have to try the Wolff XP spring! My rifle has a a Geissele SSA trigger, and I opted not to try the Wolff XP hammer spring as it was eating the GT ammo beautifully with just the firing pin. We fired 100 rounds of GT .223 with zero failures, whereas before the enhanced firing pin, I was getting 7 or 8 failures out of each box of 20!
Furthermore, the firing pin worked perfectly with the 6 types of "normal" ammo I tried it with. Zero pierced primers out of 120 rounds! I tried Wolf/Barnaul 55gr, PPU m193, Federal/Lake City m855 and m193, Carl Gustaf m855, and Hornady .223 TAP 75 Training. Also, accuracy was acceptable with fairly consistent 3 holes touching groups at 25 yards. Overall, I'm quite pleased and more than a little relieved that I don't have to figure out how to ship the ammo back for a refund. I will do some real accuracy testing when I get out to the 100 yard outdoor range. |
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Posted: 7/25/2016 6:50:10 PM EDT
[#46]
I wonder if GT will be adjusting their manufacturing to make this ammo work with standard firing pins?
Quote HistoryQuoted:
F that. Just another way for people to know what I ordered. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The ammo should be 100% functional in AR15 platforms, not sure why we are gettign this report, but I will buy the ammo back if it does not work for you THIS is why I buy from SGAmmo! You guys need to start including some stickers in your shipments. Embrace the low cost advertising of your customers. F that. Just another way for people to know what I ordered. Bad news 
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Posted: 7/27/2016 8:22:06 PM EDT
[#47]
Just registered to say what a great guy Sam at SGAmmo is. As my first purchase ever from him, I bought a case of the Golden Tiger .223. After reading about the problems others were having, and seeing a couple of posts on forums that it failed to work in the same gun I have, I emailed Sam and explained that being a new AR owner I wasn't really comfortable with the prospect of modifying the rifle just so one brand of ammo would work it. He took it back with no questions asked and refunded my money, including shipping. He even paid to ship it back to him.
It's really refreshing to see a business take care of their customers, even a new one like me that has absolutely no history with them. He's definitely earned my future business! Thanks again, Sam. |
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Posted: 7/29/2016 7:32:35 PM EDT
[#48]
just ran 120 rounds through my Rock River Arms ATH today.
installed the enhanced firing pin: http://shop.redxarms.com/ENHANCED-FIRING-PIN-FOR-762-X-39-AND-545-X-39-BCGS-EFIRINGPIN.htm zero FTF's it shot well also.
bob |
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Posted: 7/30/2016 3:10:07 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
just ran 120 rounds through my Rock River Arms ATH today. installed the enhanced firing pin: http://shop.redxarms.com/ENHANCED-FIRING-PIN-FOR-762-X-39-AND-545-X-39-BCGS-EFIRINGPIN.htm zero FTF's it shot well also.
bob Did you try the RedXArms firing pin with any other kinds of ammo to check for pierced primers? Thanks. |
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Posted: 7/30/2016 6:07:38 PM EDT
[#50]
not yet.
will let you know when i do.
bob |
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