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Posted: 7/17/2011 10:25:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 2:14:32 PM EST by zollen]
Pressure Relief Valve (PSV) for standard Direct Impingement AR's.

Standard Gas Block with integrated PSV


Disassembly Diagram


Belleville Springs Washers Reference (explaining the strength of spring washers)
https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=0B9XSnDKMwpPONGRmYjU4NzUtZTU0My00Y2NlLWEzYWQt­OGRjOGUzMGMwNGQy&hl=en_US

Design and Animation (created by Google Sketchup8 Free Edition)
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0B9XSnDKMwpPOOGNhMjQzMTUtOGQ1Ny00NTliLWEyYWUt­ODkzOGUwNDc5N2Ux&hl=en_US




Features and Advantages
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals.
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc)
5. Simple and durably design
6. Interchangable spring groups for different barrel lengths (i.e. 7.5", 10.5", 12.5", 14.5" and 16"..etc)
7. Decrease the possibility of receiver explosion or catastrophic failure as a result of extreme gas pressure.

Link Posted: 7/17/2011 10:33:33 AM EST
As soon as i read the title,i knew you would be the OP!Curious,did you get a working firearm yet to practice your inventions on yet?
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 11:08:10 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 11:09:14 AM EST by gunner_71]
seems like a fix to a non issue.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 3:51:23 PM EST
This is designed as a drop-in kit for existing DI AR's. This kit would comes with two favors. A2 style front sight with built-in PSV, or rail gas block with built-in PSV.

The existing standard Gas blocks are basically a block of solid metal (with internal gas channel). I thought we could introduce a little complexity to turn it into a auto-adaptable gas block.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 3:59:48 PM EST
i dislike things that add more moving parts to my AR's.

your next invention should make the system more simple... not more complex.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:03:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By durabo:
i dislike things that add more moving parts to my AR's.

your next invention should make the system more simple... not more complex.


If you do this,you'll have much more interest in your inventions.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:04:35 PM EST
One problem I see is with that tube sticking off the side it may get in the way of various accessories - flashlight, canted sight, etc

Cool idea though!
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:19:45 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:25:20 PM EST
Originally Posted By bigbore:
Originally Posted By gunner_71:
seems like a fix to a non issue.


seems pretty silly to me.  I wonder how many rounds before the thing carbons up into a solid piece of dead weight?


I was thinking this my self but don't you think the gas going through it would blow everything out?
I still don't need one, even if they do work. It just seems like something else that could fail for a gun that if built right won't.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:34:20 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 4:39:31 PM EST by zollen]
Originally Posted By bigbore:
Originally Posted By gunner_71:
seems like a fix to a non issue.


seems pretty silly to me.  I wonder how many rounds before the thing carbons up into a solid piece of dead weight?


The Front exhaust nozzle could be very easily opened for cleaning.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:36:09 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 4:36:38 PM EST by zollen]
Originally Posted By 007Kevin:
One problem I see is with that tube sticking off the side it may get in the way of various accessories - flashlight, canted sight, etc

Cool idea though!



The PSV could be placed at the bottom, or the other side of a gas block. This drop-in kit offers several options for buyers to get their desired orientation.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:40:56 PM EST
The AR-15's already a self regulating system. Also, for all the carbon fiber and machined titanium your plans show, it would probably cost more to purchase than a piston retro-fit kit.





"7. Decrease the possibility of receiver explosion or catastrophic failure as a result of extreme gas pressure." I'm not saying that can't happen, But I HIGHLY doubt that a round could leave the case, make it most of the way down the barrel past the gas tube, THEN have the gas travel back to the bolt carrier group with enough pressure to cause a catastrophic failure, instead of blowing up in the chamber in the first place.

Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:42:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 4:45:53 PM EST by zollen]
Originally Posted By storminnorman:
Originally Posted By durabo:
i dislike things that add more moving parts to my AR's.

your next invention should make the system more simple... not more complex.


If you do this,you'll have much more interest in your inventions.


You probably misunderstand what I am trying to do. I am trying to increase a rifle functional values by introducing a little complexity.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:43:46 PM EST
i may not kno much about anything, but i dont think the receivers explode because of excess gas going threw the gas tube...they explode when the case fails...
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:51:45 PM EST
Originally Posted By zollen:
Originally Posted By storminnorman:
Originally Posted By durabo:
i dislike things that add more moving parts to my AR's.

your next invention should make the system more simple... not more complex.


If you do this,you'll have much more interest in your inventions.


You probably misunderstand what I am trying to do. I am trying to increase a rifle functional values by introducing a little complexity.


i still am not seeing a functional value increase here.  

is this going to make my already perfectly functioning rifle function better?

all i see is more things to go wrong.  haven't you ever heard of "the less steps in a plan the less likely it is to fail"?

Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:54:06 PM EST



Originally Posted By zollen:



Originally Posted By storminnorman:


Originally Posted By durabo:

i dislike things that add more moving parts to my AR's.



your next invention should make the system more simple... not more complex.




If you do this,you'll have much more interest in your inventions.




You probably misunderstand what I am trying to do. I am trying to increase a rifle functional values by introducing a little complexity.



Adding a failure point does not increase functionality.



 
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:54:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By gunner_71:
seems like a fix to a non issue.


Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:55:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2011 4:56:38 PM EST by zollen]
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals.
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc)

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 4:58:16 PM EST
Basically, you're taking the front half of a gas piston system, which has been fine for decades using regular steel, and turning it into a vent that hangs off the side of the gas block right?





Who knows, it might work fine.   Or, you might have to put so much spring weight on it to make the rifle cycle reliably, instead of venting all the gas that it's not worth having on.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:07:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By zollen:
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals. is the current longevity a cost factor for 99% of shooters?  how often do you replace your bolt?
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor what happens when carbon builds up in your system and effects your tight tolerances of the small parts?
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands see above
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc) other adjustable gas blocks already do this without the failure points.

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands. with more parts to fail.


Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:14:04 PM EST
Have you fabricated a fully functional prototype yet, or is this all theoretical at this point?

I'm not sure that I see an industry need for this, but good on you for taking the initiative to build a better mousetrap I guess With the right marketing, this could be bigger than KNS anti-rotating pins

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:14:41 PM EST
Originally Posted By durabo:
Originally Posted By zollen:
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals. is the current longevity a cost factor for 99% of shooters?  how often do you replace your bolt?
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor what happens when carbon builds up in your system and effects your tight tolerances of the small parts?
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands see above
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc) other adjustable gas blocks already do this without the failure points.

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands. with more parts to fail.




The Front exhaust nozzle could be very easily opened for cleaning.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:22:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By zollen:
Originally Posted By durabo:
Originally Posted By zollen:
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals. is the current longevity a cost factor for 99% of shooters?  how often do you replace your bolt?
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor what happens when carbon builds up in your system and effects your tight tolerances of the small parts?
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands see above
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc) other adjustable gas blocks already do this without the failure points.

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands. with more parts to fail.




The Front exhaust nozzle could be very easily opened for cleaning.


how often will this need to be cleaned?  how much work is it to clean?  is this something that can be done in the field?

when it fails from becoming fouled up... what then.. how long until the rifle is ready to be used again?


I mean.. i really am impressed by your understanding of mechanics from a complexity stand point.. but EVERY thing you come up with makes the system more complex.  

possibly you should try designing a complete new firearm system with your ideas instead of trying to shoehorn tons of small parts into a proven system?
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:28:49 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 5:37:51 PM EST
Originally Posted By bigbore:
Originally Posted By zollen:
Originally Posted By durabo:
Originally Posted By zollen:
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals. is the current longevity a cost factor for 99% of shooters?  how often do you replace your bolt?
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor what happens when carbon builds up in your system and effects your tight tolerances of the small parts?
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands see above
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc) other adjustable gas blocks already do this without the failure points.

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands. with more parts to fail.




The Front exhaust nozzle could be very easily opened for cleaning.


So once the springs and moving parts carbon up it can be cleaned? The user can reach into their pocket, pull out an end wrench, remove the cap, pull out the parts, insert a carbon scraper and clean the thing?  You're adding more parts, more moving parts, additional maintenance, and additional reliability issues.

And when this gadget quits working,  the user will have to perform a transition drill, while making double sure the extra hot thing sticking out the side doesn't burn them.





This ^
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 8:33:47 PM EST
It's an expensive pop off valve.





If anything, scale it up and market it to tuners for guys running turbos as blow off valve.  
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 8:42:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By bigbore:
Originally Posted By zollen:
Originally Posted By durabo:
Originally Posted By zollen:
1. Improve durability and longevity of AR internals. is the current longevity a cost factor for 99% of shooters?  how often do you replace your bolt?
2. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when equiped with sound suppressor what happens when carbon builds up in your system and effects your tight tolerances of the small parts?
3. Automatic adjust internal gas pressure when chambered with ammo of different brands see above
4. Completely disabling gas pressure by removing PSV internal (i.e. springs groups and main seal..etc) other adjustable gas blocks already do this without the failure points.

Noveske Switchblocks

I take one step further and convert a gas block into auto-adoptable gas block for sound suppressors and for ammo of different brands. with more parts to fail.




The Front exhaust nozzle could be very easily opened for cleaning.


So once the springs and moving parts carbon up it can be cleaned? The user can reach into their pocket, pull out an end wrench, remove the cap, pull out the parts, insert a carbon scraper and clean the thing?  You're adding more parts, more moving parts, additional maintenance, and additional reliability issues.

And when this gadget quits working,  the user will have to perform a transition drill, while making double sure the extra hot thing sticking out the side doesn't burn them.



No wrench. Just open the front nozzle like a bottle cap and the entire PSV could be removed effortlessly.

Please review my design document. It explains everything.
Link Posted: 7/17/2011 9:57:21 PM EST
Interesting, but as some others have commented, your idea makes AR15s heavier and more complicated.

I bet they would sell like crazy!
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 8:45:00 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2011 8:46:14 AM EST by Artiz]
Originally Posted By storminnorman:
As soon as i read the title,i knew you would be the OP!Curious,did you get a working firearm yet to practice your inventions on yet?


No, he doesn't have any firearms licence, to own an AR-15 in Canada he must have a restricted firearms licence (AR-15's and handguns), he doesn't even have a non-restricted firearms licence (long guns, rifles, shotguns, etc) so he can't own any gun of any kind. He probably never ever shot a gun in his life, let alone an AR-15, let alone OWNING an AR-15. He probably is underage, too.

I own an AR-15.
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 9:31:02 AM EST
Originally Posted By Artiz:
Originally Posted By storminnorman:
As soon as i read the title,i knew you would be the OP!Curious,did you get a working firearm yet to practice your inventions on yet?


No, he doesn't have any firearms licence, to own an AR-15 in Canada he must have a restricted firearms licence (AR-15's and handguns), he doesn't even have a non-restricted firearms licence (long guns, rifles, shotguns, etc) so he can't own any gun of any kind. He probably never ever shot a gun in his life, let alone an AR-15, let alone OWNING an AR-15. He probably is underage, too.

I own an AR-15.


Not surprised.He post these threads ALL OVER internet gun frums like spam.And ALWAYS get's the reactions.Nothing wrong with being creative,but listen to people's needs,wants ect...Complicating things is not the answer.
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 10:55:54 AM EST
Interesting...
How does it react to water?
How well does it drain if the weapon is submerged?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 2:44:40 PM EST



Originally Posted By WI57:


Interesting...

How does it react to water?

How well does it drain if the weapon is submerged?



Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


Pretty quick when it's blown off the side of the gas block.



 
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 2:59:19 PM EST
i applaud you on your technical incite to this issue. however, without a supressor, there is no need for this device. i have fired many different brands of 223, and 5.56 ammo through mine without failure. the rifles like one better than the other though, but it has nothing to do with the amount of pressure to the carrier key. i am not at all knocking your design as it looks like a worthy piece of equipment, and obviously well thought out. with skills such as yours, you should try your hand at a new platform for this piece to integrate into.
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 4:24:07 PM EST
Didn't know there was a problem. Why is someone always trying to make a simple system more complex?

So many solutions, so few problems.
Link Posted: 7/20/2011 4:35:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2011 4:38:05 PM EST by greyguy]





Originally Posted By MattNificent:



i may not kno much about anything, but i dont think the receivers explode because of excess gas going threw the gas tube...they explode when the case fails...



This...
ETA: So the goal is to decrease wear and tear that is currently considered to be normal?  Also wouldn't this preclude the use of a longer than gas-system hand-guard?





 
Link Posted: 7/21/2011 7:53:35 AM EST
I knew it.

Seen this guy's posts on two other forums, and they were all something like this:

"What do you think of this rifle configuration?" followed by a list of parts that would change daily, each time in a new thread.

I really don't understand the point of this product, you couldn't even give me one to T&E for free.

My lonely little gas tube does fine on it's own.

Next time you're going to post a bunch of bogus threads all over the internet, do us all a favor and just be upfront about your intentions.
Link Posted: 7/21/2011 9:11:40 AM EST
I'm guessing this thing does not fit under a rail either.
Link Posted: 7/21/2011 9:21:42 AM EST
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