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Posted: 9/7/2004 4:27:37 PM EST
I was checking my rifle out tonight and noticed the flash hider is not on there right. It looks like it is missing a washer behing it or something. When you screw the hider all the way down the solid peice is on the right hand side instead of on the bottom like it is suppose to be. It only has a small thin washer that looks like aluminum or something. Can you guys help me out with this problem? I bought this rifle about 6 months ago never paied any attention to it. Thanks in advance!
Link Posted: 9/7/2004 8:52:48 PM EST
Sounds like someone might have overtightened the FH and flatened the crush washer a little to much. Order a new crush washer then tightened it down "crushing" the crush washer til the FH indexes right.



Link Posted: 9/7/2004 9:56:44 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/8/2004 12:15:32 AM EST by Tweak]
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:19:23 PM EST
Maybe you guys can help me. I had my MB removed a few weeks ago by a gunsmith. It was attached to a threaded barrel. The GS drilled out the pin and removed the MB without issue. He then ordered a crush washer (or so he said) and installed the FH. When I picked up the rifle it has three stainless washers stacked below the FH. I asked him what was up and he says the FH wouldn't screw down any further. I contacted ADCO (where I bought the upper and FH) and Steve said it could be a bad FH.

Bad FH or bad install?

Check out the pict.


Steve said he'd send me a new FH and crush washer soon.

Thanks in advance
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:26:09 PM EST
Can you remove the flash hider? Sounds like either a bad flash hider OR the threads were screwed up where the pin was. If you can take off the flash hider check and see.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:34:58 PM EST
I might be able to remove the FH, but I am worried about not having a vice. Might ask the GS to take it off next week and check it out.

I am sure the MB did not hurt the threads. It was not pinned all the way through! (sneaky ADCO)

However, it was red locktited on. Maybe left over LT on the threads?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 1:51:10 PM EST
Red loctite will release with alil heat from a torch, heat it up slow when you see smoke and smell burnt rubber you are ready to remove it.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 2:04:54 PM EST
How long is the bbl?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 2:17:14 PM EST
Pretty sure it standard: 16-16.25. I asked for cut down, permanant install with the MB, but don't think I got it. Length of dowel inserted into bore to breach is 17"+ with MB installed. Same with FH installed.

Thoughts?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 2:34:30 PM EST
I was wondering if he didn't put all of those washers in there to get the standard A2 FS to stretch to the legal limit.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 3:05:11 PM EST

Originally Posted By Stryfe:
I was wondering if he didn't put all of those washers in there to get the standard A2 FS to stretch to the legal limit.



Still wouldn't be legal without pinning it.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 3:07:56 PM EST
AF-Blue
Whoa WTF?
3 washers? Your 'smith might want to get his story straight.
The threads were already on there if I understand correctly.
Might try chasing the threads on both the FH and the muzzle, so they may screw down closer together. If the FH is AFU just try with a different one.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 3:10:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By SHIPSNIPE1:

Originally Posted By Stryfe:
I was wondering if he didn't put all of those washers in there to get the standard A2 FS to stretch to the legal limit.



Still wouldn't be legal without pinning it.


I don't know, that's why I asked how long it was.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 4:08:32 PM EST
Flash hider looks fine definately too many washers unless its a 14.5 and he did that for the extra legnth.Get a crush washer or peel washer wich I like they are a little finicky to work with but I like em better.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 4:26:28 PM EST
Thanks for the feedback all. This smith is hit and miss. Some stuff great, some not so great.

A little too much improv on this one though.

I'll get the new FH, crush washer and start over. With a new smith.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:12:07 PM EST

Originally Posted By AF_Blue:
Thanks for the feedback all. This smith is hit and miss. Some stuff great, some not so great.

A little too much improv on this one though.

I'll get the new FH, crush washer and start over. With a new smith.



What is the barrel length you are using?
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:32:56 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/7/2004 7:23:45 PM EST by Jimmy_Hoffa]
Some smiths aren't used to working with military style weapons, in my oppinion it is a different world working on any military weahan EDITED
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:44:40 PM EST
I'm not usually a big Spelling Nazi, but you HAVE to spell it "weapon", not "weppon" here of all places, please.

Thank you. I'll go take my medication now.
Link Posted: 10/7/2004 5:58:16 PM EST
AF_Blue - could you take a picture of the whole barrel up to to and including a little of the upper receiver? If you could lay a tape measure next to it, that would be even better. I think that pic would go a long ways towards figuring things out.
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 12:28:40 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 1:08:44 AM EST
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 3:26:32 AM EST
Yes. That is the same barrel.

I am fairly certain the overall legnth is from breach to bore is 17"+. I used a plastic dowel droped into the bore until I could touch it in the breach. Marked the top and it consistently measured 17" with the MB and now with the FH.

Barrel is standard "pre-ban" unless someone tells me otherwise.

Link Posted: 10/8/2004 3:47:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/8/2004 7:16:04 AM EST by omar]
AF_Blue,

You don't need a gunsmith to remove that flash suppressor. All the hard work is done. Clamp the barrel and use an appropriate size wrench to remove the FS and slide off the washers. Install the new washer, screw on the FS back on and tighten as needed. Just be careful when you are approaching the final index point. I just do that by eyeball.

I'm looking at the thickness of the three washers compared to the thickness of the FS collar they butt up against. I don't see any reason why a crush washer won't index the FH properly as your barrel externally appears fine (I have crush washers on all my rifles).

There is a remote possibility the barrel end was turned town a few 1000ths, but I wouldn't really be able to tell without a better pic, or looking at it in person.

If that's the case, just use one of those three washers to shim it behind the crush washer. It'll still be better looking than that lash up. I reused a crush washer like this for a short term fix before, and I'll post a pic of it to show you what I mean.


Jim
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 4:00:08 AM EST
Thanks. I may give it a shot.

To "clamp the barrel" should I use some soft blocking material to hold the front sight/barrel? Or should I actually clamp the barrel (only) in some soft material. I obviously don't want to damage the front sight or gas tube by twisting it.

Another gunshop in town installs scope mounts all the time and they have a great vice I might ask to use.

On the crush washer. Damn these things are hard to come by. Can I get one at Lowes/Home Depot/Hardware. No shop I have been in recently has them. Think they would be a dime-a-dozen in shops...

Link Posted: 10/8/2004 4:05:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By AF_Blue:
Maybe you guys can help me. I had my MB removed a few weeks ago by a gunsmith. It was attached to a threaded barrel. The GS drilled out the pin and removed the MB without issue. He then ordered a crush washer (or so he said) and installed the FH. When I picked up the rifle it has three stainless washers stacked below the FH. I asked him what was up and he says the FH wouldn't screw down any further. I contacted ADCO (where I bought the upper and FH) and Steve said it could be a bad FH.

Bad FH or bad install?

Check out the pict.
members.aol.com/scovode/Photos/AR_FH

Steve said he'd send me a new FH and crush washer soon.

Thanks in advance




Looks like a piss poor install, wtf did he use regular washers?
Link Posted: 10/8/2004 11:27:46 AM EST

Originally Posted By AF_Blue:
To "clamp the barrel" should I use some soft blocking material to hold the front sight/barrel? Or should I actually clamp the barrel (only) in some soft material. I obviously don't want to damage the front sight or gas tube by twisting it.


You may be able to hold the rifle in one hand, and work the wrench with another. You could also have a buddy hold it down on a wooden table, or wooden block.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:37:53 AM EST
OK, the photo server finally came back up. Here is a FS and crush washer:
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:41:12 AM EST
Here is a reused crush washer mated with an also reused aluminum crush washer to achieve the same index. It looks OK, so I just left it on versus installing a new one.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 5:56:46 AM EST
Here is a home made vise with wood inserts. You don't need this much clamping pressure, but look at the pieces of wood. They are two pieces of oak salvaged from a pallet. I cut a rounded channel in them using a dremel across the grain. I also use these in a regular bench vise. I wrap the barrel with electrical tape and then place it in the blocks when I don't wish to mar the finish, otherwise I just put some resin powder (available at any sporting goods store) on it and clamp it.



It sounds like you have little or no tools, so if I wanted to remove this using only one appropriate size wrench. I'd find two pieces of 2x6x4 planks, lay them on a bench horizontally, sandwich the barrel between them and pile ten or so bricks on the top. That should accomodate 20 or so foot pounds of torque.
Link Posted: 10/9/2004 10:27:35 PM EST
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 7:07:05 AM EST
Got the FH off today. Threads are perfect, FH is perfect. The FH hand tightens all the way down the threads. The GS used three peel washers (they look like peel washers). I tried to use just one and get the FH to index. I put alot of force on the FH, but could not get it to turn anymore. (in a vice of course) I thought the peel washer would allow it to spin some more, but obviously not.

GS didn't do a bad job, he obviously couldn't get it to index either. SO he he stacked on washers until it did index. Not a bad improv but how about using a crush washer like I asked...

So that's the solution. Back to ADCO for the crush washer and then I'll install it correctly.

Thanks for the advice all.

Oh and Lawman107, my apologies for hijacking your thread. I hope my solution works for you too!
Link Posted: 10/11/2004 7:42:07 AM EST

Originally Posted By AF_Blue:
Got the FH off today. Threads are perfect, FH is perfect. The FH hand tightens all the way down the threads. The GS used three peel washers (they look like peel washers). I tried to use just one and get the FH to index. I put alot of force on the FH, but could not get it to turn anymore. (in a vice of course) I thought the peel washer would allow it to spin some more, but obviously not.

GS didn't do a bad job, he obviously couldn't get it to index either. SO he he stacked on washers until it did index. Not a bad improv but how about using a crush washer like I asked...

So that's the solution. Back to ADCO for the crush washer and then I'll install it correctly.

Thanks for the advice all.

Oh and Lawman107, my apologies for hijacking your thread. I hope my solution works for you too!



If its a peel washer then PEEL it! Removing Layers from the washer will let you turn the FH farther onto the threads and you will be done.
Link Posted: 10/12/2004 4:28:58 AM EST
Alright, alright! I tried the peel washer thing and I think it worked

I split one, (carefully) with needle-nose pliers and a utility knife. It split down the middle but it still didn't fit. I sanded it on 600 grit emory paper for about 15 minutes with little effect, then I peeled the cover off and by god I am about 1/8 of a turn from index by hand. I'll tighten it later this week in a vise and be done with it.

It's so thin you can barely see it now

Peel does = PITA, but if you can't get a crusher washer its definately doable.
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