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10/20/2017 1:01:18 AM
9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/13/2005 10:32:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 10:37:35 AM EDT by TheBushman]
I'm currently looking into buying my first AR15 type rifle,
and have narrowed my search down to the M16 style Bushmaster A3 20" target rifle,
and the M4 style Bushmaster M4A2 Shorty.
I'm considering the pros and cons of the obvious differences in the models, and have come
to a halt... I just don't know which one...

Could anyone that has had experience with either models,
tell me the pros and cons that they've noticed about the models?

And, not that it will have much of an effect on my purchase,
but what model would you purchase of the two, and why?
(I'm asking this because it might lead to some helpful info.)

Thanks,
---Kyle
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:41:10 AM EDT
Couple things, I dunno if NH still has an AWB, its a northeastern state and most do. Also unless you go thru the Form4 hassle and pay 10k for a true M16 anything you build will always be an AR15.

As far as building or buying one, ya gotta see how itll be used the most and then go from there, the joy of ARs are they are modular, make anyway you want (within the law of course)
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:43:53 AM EDT
^Nope, NH has always been very light on their firearm laws.
No more AWB for us Nearly every (if not every) state that borders me still has higher regulations though.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:50:59 AM EDT

Welcome

It really boils down to what you will be doing most with it. I would say that the shorter barrel would be more in the spirit of a light weight personal defense/plinker. If you plan to do some longer range target shooting the 20" comes to mind. You could always buy two seperate uppers.

Or if you want to split the difference and only have one upper you could go with an SPRish type and get an 18". What ever you do, I would recommend the flattop upper regardless of barrel length.



Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:53:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 10:55:13 AM EDT by Buzz70]
It really doesn't matter. You will eventually end up getting them both.
I personally prefer the M4 as I enjoy up close defense style shooting
more than long range bench shooting. It's really your personal preference.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 10:59:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Couple things, I dunno if NH still has an AWB, its a northeastern state and most do. Also unless you go thru the Form4 hassle and pay 10k for a true M16 anything you build will always be an AR15.

As far as building or buying one, ya gotta see how itll be used the most and then go from there, the joy of ARs are they are modular, make anyway you want (within the law of course)


I think he means M16A2 clone...

And I say you should get the 20"er first and then get used to that and then buy the M4gery (M4 clone). Just remember to KISS!
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 1:37:47 PM EDT
BOTH!

get the 20in first, since you do not seem to want it primarily for SD/HD

Link Posted: 8/13/2005 1:45:17 PM EDT
+1 Get both.

That's what I did, darn BRD.

Pic link to my M16 clone and M4gery
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 2:37:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 4:16:22 PM EDT by wes15a2]
Get the 20" first.
Then get the M4A2.
Read the threads from FUZ1ON, he seems damned happy with his.
Lucky Bastard.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 2:54:02 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Blanco_Diablo:

Originally Posted By die-tryin:
Couple things, I dunno if NH still has an AWB, its a northeastern state and most do. Also unless you go thru the Form4 hassle and pay 10k for a true M16 anything you build will always be an AR15.

As far as building or buying one, ya gotta see how itll be used the most and then go from there, the joy of ARs are they are modular, make anyway you want (within the law of course)


I think he means M16A2 clone...

And I say you should get the 20"er first and then get used to that and then buy the M4gery (M4 clone).

Just remember to KISS!
call me dumb, but whats "KISS"

thanks

Travis
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:00:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 3:00:56 PM EDT by Keebsley]
From what I've always been told and smacked upside the head, KISS means:

Keep It Simple Stupid

I'm sure people can come up with a more...colorful...thing for the last 'S' but stupid works for me.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 7:01:15 PM EDT
Yep Keep It Simple Stupid is correct and the best way to go. I would also recommend a 20" as your first AR. You will eventually get the M4gery.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 7:52:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 7:54:23 PM EDT by FUZ1ON]

Originally Posted By wes15a2:
Get the 20" first.
Then get the M4A2.
Read the threads from FUZ1ON, he seems damned happy with his.
Lucky Bastard.



Yes I am and....well...Yes I Am!!! LOL!!!

And uh...in the words of the laste great elvis?....

Thank you very much. LOL!!!

Bushman...the best advice I could give you is this..."Figure Out Whatcha Wanna Use It For First"...in other words?....what will be the environment/primary mission for this particular arm?...If your employing it at 200yards max? I can see little reason to go 20"er as the M4 16'er is faster handling and lighter to carry....but if your primary game is shots out past 300+yards?...again...I can see little reason for a 20"er...and I'd recomend the BM 24" Flat-Top Varminter.

I guess now that I got my paws wrapped around my 1st Bushmaster Patrolmans Carbine which basically is a 16" A2M4gery I can see little reason for 20"ers at all anymore these days....and lov'in it!!! LOL!!!

L8R, Bill.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 7:57:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 8:01:01 PM EDT by YELLOWV]
I also have the Bushy Patrolman and feel the same way Fuzion does about his. Still I think a 20" is better for the first AR. My first was a Bushy DCM and it was a great rifle but I do have much more fun with the M4gery. Ah what the hell get the carbine I do recommend the A3 though. The flat top gives you so many options. See?


Link Posted: 8/13/2005 7:59:12 PM EDT
+1 , pretty much the longer the distance you want to shoot the longer the barrel. m4 style is good for 0-300m, and the 20 inch is good for 50- 600m (depends on the twist rate too).
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:57:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 9:17:30 PM EDT by FUZ1ON]
One other thought you may consider that I've finally come to learn and accept after many years is this...

Outside of zealouse prarie dog hunters who love 24" AR's for bust'in dog towns all day long?...the AR (for most civi's) is viewed as a "Defensive Tool"....primarily for a "Fetilizer Has Hit The Fan/National Crisis" personal defense weapon...and in imho?...in that situation/role/mission?.....most fighting (in populated areas) is going to begin to occur at not much over "shouting distances"...and closer....like 10-100 yards.

In such an environment I want my primary firearm to be extremely fast handling annnnd...light enough that it's never uncomfortable for me to leave hanging around my neck, dangling from my shoulder, carry on patrol, and wear it 24/7 ready to immediately employ with extreme prejudice at a moments notice...and never be tempted to lay it down somewhere...even close by...because it's become to heavy and/or cumbersome requiring that I detach myself from it for a break..cause as murphys law dictates?..that's exactly the moment all hell will surely break loose.

Conversly?...shooting at someone at distances of much over 200-300 yards IS NOT in any way, shape or form..."Defensive Survival"...it's "Picking A Fight"....so if your looking to engage in "Offensive Actions" and/or you consider 300 yards a short shot?...then a carbine is most likely not for you and you would be far better served by a 24" Flat-Top or bolt action sniper arrangement..however a 16" carbine in the hands of a competent rifleman will readily and handily dispatch evil-doers at such 0-300 yard (insert key words here) "Defensive Distances" without even breaking a sweat.

And that's the reasons why I've come to suddenly aqquire a deep affection for my new found love...

The M4 Carbine.

L8R, Bill.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 9:11:08 PM EDT

Originally Posted By YELLOWV:
Yep Keep It Simple Stupid is correct and the best way to go. I would also recommend a 20" as your first AR. You will eventually get the M4gery.


which is why I'd say start with that instead of spending more money.... of course I did that then down the road I wanted an A1 setup.... so it didn't really work too well for me becasue afte that I wanted a Colt LE M4ish setup.... and there goes the money
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 11:53:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/13/2005 11:54:40 PM EDT by topgunpilot20]

Originally Posted By Buzz70:
It really doesn't matter. You will eventually end up getting them both.

It's true. Don't try to convince yourself otherwise; just accept your fate. My futility at combatting Black Rifle Disease.

What will be your primary uses? That will be the determining factor in which one you get first.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 4:41:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2005 4:41:57 PM EDT by TheBushman]
OK, finally made my decision.
This weekend I'll be ordering the Bushy M16 type A3 20" target rifle,
just with a stainless match grade barrel, for accuracy's sake.

Soon I will catch the disease
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 5:12:32 PM EDT
Your being here on this forum is evidence you have allready caught the disease, You just might not be aware of it yet!
I have two Colt Comp HBAR's and for the type of shooting I do( no competion or long range stuff) a M4gery would do me just fine and I wouldnt have to lug aroung a rifle thats twice as heavy, so I am currently converting one to an M4 style rife. Unless your going to be shooting long and I mean long distances a 16" model is fine.
And you might check out the equipment exchange here , you can get some great deals on complete uppers that users are trading off to build up something new. What ever you get your going to want the other soon so get out your wallet and have fun,

oh yah and welcome to the board!
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 5:15:20 PM EDT
^I chose the longer barrel because I love longer ranged shooting.
Yeah, I know it won't be as accurate as a bolt action, but I'm positive it will be more fun to shoot
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 7:05:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By TheBushman:
^Nope, NH has always been very light on their firearm laws.
No more AWB for us
Nearly every (if not every) state that borders me still has higher regulations though.



You're cool in Vermont and Maine. NY and Mass suck donkey balls, though.
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