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Posted: 9/4/2003 5:57:00 AM EDT
The more I use FP-10 the more I like it.  I came back from a Highpower training match after firing 80 rounds through the rifle.  I took out the bolt and carrier and found very little fouling.  What fouling was there came of easily with a paper towel.  The inside of the bolt carrier came clean with one wipe.  All of the fouling was "dry" and looked like soot. I used a tooth brush to reapply a small amount of FP-10 to the bolt carrier and bolt.  Added a drop to the gas rings and cam pin.  Swabbed the chamber with an lightly oiled mop.  Put it back together.  Didn't bother with the bore this time.  The chrome bore always wipes clean with a patch or two, and I was planning on shooting again next week anyway.  Total time to clean rifle - about 10 minuites.  When I was using Breakfree I always felt like I was changing the oil in my car, and my hands looked like it.  It was usually an oily, sloppy mess.  The FP-10 website claims that their CLP actually repells carbon fouling by an electro-static process (kind of like those air purifiers).  I don't have any proof that is true, but I can say for sure that my rifle has less gunk in it when I use FP-10.  Just for the record I don't own any stock in the company.  I just want to pass along my experience with a great product to other board members.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 8:21:32 AM EDT
I've only used FP10 for a little while and I love it too.  I've only gotten their free sample and I'm running low.  I'm going to order from them when I get close to empty.  Another advantage is that FP10 smells much better than CLP!
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 8:40:55 AM EDT
This is the same stuff:

[url]http://www.shooters-choice.com/products/fp10.html[/url]

And is usually easier to find in local gun shops.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 3:20:58 PM EDT
IMHO, FP-10 is better than Militec-1. Isn't the Shooters Choice FP-10 the older version of MPC's FP-10? I've heard that the older version of the FP-10 isn't as good as the new stuff.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 4:02:04 PM EDT
Another vote for FP-10 best thing since canned beer!
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 5:42:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2003 5:45:29 PM EDT by Blankwaffe98]
I also think FP-10 is the best clp on the market.Second to none.Ive tried it,tested it and I love the stuff.The folks at MPC put the service in customer service.Outstanding customer support.
Not to mention MPC supports our gun rights and is actively engaged in the sport of shooting.
In fact I ran into George at the Tactical 3-gun championship here in Dickson last weekend.
He was more than willing to stop what he was doing(having fun) and talk shop.And for a long time too.
All I can say is he is a serious firearms enthusiast.

Originally Posted By hickboy:
IMHO, FP-10 is better than Militec-1. Isn't the Shooters Choice FP-10 the older version of MPC's FP-10? I've heard that the older version of the FP-10 isn't as good as the new stuff.
View Quote


Yeah back when the FP-10 formula was changed to meet the MIL-L-63460D Amd.6 requirements of low temp operation back in the spring 2002,the formula was different.The reason is that Shooters Choice had not purchased the new updated formula during the change over.So yeah the older bottles of SC FP-10 were the old stuff.
I have since been told by George Fennell thathe current Shooters Choice FP-10 and the Firepower FP-10 are the same new,updated formula.That is unless you buy an older bottle of Shooters Choice thats been on the shelf for awhile.
The new formula is clear,shaken or not.
The old formula had a cloudy haze look to it,shaken or not.
From what I understand the low temp operation was enhanced as well as the corrosion inhibitor in the new formula.
The old formula did not have the performance qualities of the new.
HTH
Raymond
Link Posted: 9/6/2003 2:47:38 PM EDT
Canned beer is a good thing?  Bottled, yes, canned, definitely not.  Anyway, I have slowly started to warm up to FP-10 from Breakfree, but would still use breakfree on a beater firearm over FP-10 since rust is a bigger concern.
Link Posted: 9/6/2003 2:51:40 PM EDT
Now try TW25B...leaves FP10 collecting dirtand grit.
Link Posted: 9/6/2003 4:48:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By hickboy:
IMHO, FP-10 is better than Militec-1. Isn't the Shooters Choice FP-10 the older version of MPC's FP-10? I've heard that the older version of the FP-10 isn't as good as the new stuff.
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-------

It appears FP-10 is a very good product. One which I would use and recommend.

Although, I currently use Militec and have not had a malfunction since switching from CLP. All I have to do to clean the weapon is simply wipe it off and apply another light coat of militec.

I call cleaning my weapon changing the oil. It works perfectly for me.
Link Posted: 9/6/2003 7:36:32 PM EDT
Originally Posted By W-W:
Now try TW25B...leaves FP10 collecting dirtand grit.
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Yeah I love the TW-25B.Its great stuff and I use it all the time,but it is not a CLP.
Raymond
Link Posted: 9/6/2003 7:44:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/6/2003 7:46:33 PM EDT by hickboy]
Originally Posted By jason_h:
Canned beer is a good thing?  Bottled, yes, canned, definitely not.  Anyway, I have slowly started to warm up to FP-10 from Breakfree, but would still use breakfree on a beater firearm over FP-10 since rust is a bigger concern.
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Are you saying that Breakfree is better than FP-10 when it comes to rust preventance [>:/]? I don't think so!!

Edited to ask: Why is bottled beer better than canned? Taste? I'd think beer in cans is better cause you can recycle them and get a lot more money for alumminum than glass. Or is beer in bottles cheaper than cans? (Don't make fun of me for asking this, I don't drink, i'm 15!!)
Link Posted: 9/7/2003 6:27:21 PM EDT
Hickboy, it's about taste, that said, cans are cheaper and if you are drinking domestics, it doesn't really matter anyway.

I was going to link to a previous test done by a poster named crufflerjj over on gunboards, but unfortunately the post has been lost due to a bulletin board software upgrade.  He had compared FP-10, Breakfree, and a number of other lubes for corrosion protection.  Long story short, Breakfree had shown itself to be better at protection compared to FP-10.
Link Posted: 9/7/2003 9:05:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/7/2003 9:13:10 PM EDT by Blankwaffe98]
I followed the tests that Jeff/crufflerjj did as well.
There seems to have been a possibility of corrosive agent like acids in the humidity cabinet.Jeff noted that the tank had not been cleaned and that it was very possible.
That may have been the reason the results of the two tests had come out differently using some of the same products.
The product that really took a turn in the second test was eezox.In the first test eezox came out after over 1000 hours spotless.
In the second test the eezox failed completely.
The lack of repeatable test results using the same products made alot of questions come up for me.
But that did not explain why the break free was somewhat consistent in both tests.Although it did have corrosion on the panel.
But if you read the test requirements of the mil-spec it does allow corrosion around the edge of the test panel and in isolated spots no larger than 3mm.Again from memory.Correct me if Im wrong.
I was also very concerned about the tests and my favorite clp,FP-10,until I did my own environmental test using a old K98 barrel.
That pretty much convined me that the FP-10 is excellent as a protectant and better at it than BF clp.Especially in the rain.BF seems to wash away in the rain completely failing and allows complete rust coverage of the area.
So I have absolutely no problem using FP-10 with confidence on my weapons.
Do your own test,get some steel,clean it up and throw it outside coated with your favorite lubes and see what happens.
All I can say is I have been using FP-10 since last December and have no complaints of corrosion.
Raymond

Link Posted: 9/8/2003 3:21:32 PM EDT
Not to impugn on a specific manufacturer's claim, but there seems to be a lot of snake oil and fancy marketing going on in lube business.  Unless I see unbiased imperial data supporting those claims, I'll just stick with the original clp.

This FP-10 seems to be the rave of late. I plan to conduct my own Breakfree clp vs FP-10 saltwater corrosion test. If FP-10 can beat Breakfree, it just might persuade me to make the switch.
Link Posted: 9/8/2003 8:23:06 PM EDT
I did a little test with Breakfree CLP by accident. I wiped down a SAR 1 AK47 with BF CLP and mailed to a well known and hated gunsmith. He kept my rifle and many others hostage for a long time and the Legal system had to recover them.Alot of people got theres back all rusted up and pitted. I feared the worst. Mine came back looking like it did when I mailed it.The Breakfree held up for 2 years in a shed ( chicken coop )  really in the weather and elements.Now as far as corrosion protection CLP did my rifle wonders. But I bought some FP_10 to try out. WD  
Link Posted: 9/9/2003 1:33:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By WarDawg:
I did a little test with Breakfree CLP by accident. I wiped down a SAR 1 AK47 with BF CLP and mailed to a well known and hated gunsmith. He kept my rifle and many others hostage for a long time and the Legal system had to recover them.Alot of people got theres back all rusted up and pitted. I feared the worst. Mine came back looking like it did when I mailed it.The Breakfree held up for 2 years in a shed ( chicken coop )  really in the weather and elements.Now as far as corrosion protection CLP did my rifle wonders. But I bought some FP_10 to try out. WD  
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-----

That's a great testament to the effectiveness of BF CLP, on unmaintained rifles left in a shed/chicken coop out in the weather.

My rifle gets a little more use than that.


Link Posted: 9/9/2003 4:45:53 PM EDT
Like I said ,Im not praiseing the lube propertys and cleaning ability of Breakfree CLP just the rust protection.My  rifle came back to me with no rust at all on it. Alot of people wasn't as lucky as me. I bought a big container of FP-10 and going to give it a try. I will continue to buy BF clp for wipeing down rifles for the sole reasons its so cheap,$3.99 at Wally world.And Its at Wally world.But will lube with FP-10 . I don't care for the lube propertys of the New BF CLP . I have several containers from the 80's of BF CLP and its great. I still use it for lubeing up my AR's. Cheers WarDawg
Link Posted: 9/9/2003 6:16:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By WarDawg:
Like I said ,Im not praiseing the lube propertys and cleaning ability of Breakfree CLP just the rust protection.My  rifle came back to me with no rust at all on it. Alot of people wasn't as lucky as me. I bought a big container of FP-10 and going to give it a try. I will continue to buy BF clp for wipeing down rifles for the sole reasons its so cheap,$3.99 at Wally world.And Its at Wally world.But will lube with FP-10 . I don't care for the lube propertys of the New BF CLP . I have several containers from the 80's of BF CLP and its great. I still use it for lubeing up my AR's. Cheers WarDawg
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-------

Yeah, the old yellowish formula was decent.

The new formula sucks as a lubricant, and is a half azzed solvent. It has the consistency of water. Dries off about as fast also.
Link Posted: 9/9/2003 10:13:02 PM EDT
I just use spit and follow it up with some WD-40 sprayed judiciously over the entire gun.

Is that wrong???

;)
Link Posted: 9/11/2003 11:10:43 AM EDT
I don't have any FP-10 and with all the stuff I do have, I'm not fixing to buy any soon.

I still have plenty (like half a gallon) of the old BreakFree.  It's a good lube, an average solvent, and a great protectant.  I haven't bought any of the "improved" BF, and I don't think I will.

I also have a couple pints of Royco's CLP, which is an amber fluid with no apparent ingredients in suspension. Right now it's my main go-to CLP, because I have so much of it and it's so cheap ($5 a pint). It's a better solvent and protectant than it is a lube, though. I rely on Tetra oil for heavy duty lubrication.  
Link Posted: 12/7/2003 9:10:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By W-W:
Now try TW25B...leaves FP10 collecting dirtand grit.
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Actuall, you got that backwards, my friend.

FP-10 rejects dirt, sand, and dust.

I'd rater not go into a dissertation about the rheology of semi-solids, PTFE, and their "so-called" abilities (dis-abilities, to be exact), so why don't we just leave it at that.

Your info is unfounded and quite, untrue.
Just ask all the spec-ops in Afghan and Iraq.

Constant maintenence and cleaning is top billing in the desert. A good CLP is second billing.

Respectfully,
George
Link Posted: 12/7/2003 11:17:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Firepower-MPC:

Actuall, you got that backwards, my friend.

FP-10 rejects dirt, sand, and dust.

View Quote


Yeap I found that out for myself.
FP-10 is all Im using on my firearms.It works so well and is so easy to use it spoiled me.
Ive stopped using TW-25B and my whole arsenal of other lubes completely.
I had cut back on the TW-25B and was using it only in places that I needed a heavier lube(stayed put longer) like choke tubes,Breech plugs and barrel threads.Recently I found out how well MPC's PL-10 grease worked for those applications and the TW-25B was edged completely out for me.
Raymond
Link Posted: 12/8/2003 12:37:38 PM EDT
Hey, I'm just a user...

I've been pleased so far with my limited experience with FP-10. I'm in SE Alaska, known for moisture, and I live next to saltwater. (Sorry, no dust and sand issues to deal with here.) I use it as CLP on handguns and rifles alike. During the winter, condensation is a real problem. I clean 'em and give them a good wipe down when I come in, and have never seen any rust.

My only gripe, is I bought a 16 oz. bottle a little over a year ago. It is the old formula, but at the rate I use it, it will be a couple of years before I can try the new formula!
Link Posted: 12/9/2003 11:51:50 PM EDT
How can I tell if my bottle of FP10 is the new formula??
Link Posted: 12/14/2003 10:04:59 PM EDT
I have been using Tetra Gun for over 10 years with outstanding results. Can't believe it's not being mentioned here.

I haven't tried FP-10 yet, but have ordered a sample via email at George's recommendation.

I have a new Remington LTR .308 due in this week. It should be a good candidate to try the FP-10 on, even though I'm reluctant to NOT treat such a rifle with my proven, well loved Tetra Gun.

Link Posted: 12/16/2003 5:25:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/16/2003 5:34:42 AM EDT by Firepower-MPC]
Originally Posted By SIGNAL4L:
How can I tell if my bottle of FP10 is the new formula??
View Quote


Heya SIGNAL4L,
First, all the gray and red labels with the Army Ranger on the bottle are all new formulas.
On the older labels, (White/Black/Red) it's easy. Shake up the FP-10. Pour some out in a clear container. If the FP-10 is cloudy-like, then it's the older formula. If it's clear, medium-to-dark amber, it's the new.

Turbozag,

Glad you're giving it a go.

There's nothing better that you could treat your .308 with. FP-10 is the #1 choice of the Spec-Ops and Sniper Teams in Operation Enduring Freedom and Iraqi Freedom.

You'll get to see why.

Thanks for ordering, and giving it a try. You may just get "stuck" on it [;)]

Best regards,
George
Link Posted: 12/20/2003 6:24:44 PM EDT
look i live less than 100 yards from a salt water river. i have no rust issues with fp-10. i can lube up my guns, stick them in my cabinet (with no moisture absobers!) for months at a time and they don't get rusty.
Link Posted: 12/23/2003 5:46:25 PM EDT
George,

After doing my own testing with the free sample on a 4506(you posted the results on your website) I ordered 6, 4oz. bottles.  They do not have the Ranger on the label but a picture of a 1911.  The label also says "Shake well prior to use".  When I ordered, by phone, I was told I'd get the new formula.  It does not, however, appear cloudy when shaken.  Do I have the old or new formula?

Thanks,
Link Posted: 12/24/2003 10:12:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/24/2003 10:13:48 PM EDT by AZ-K9]
I got your back George. [:D]
[img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=20910[/img]
Left=New stuff    /    Right=Unknown, test by looking at product. Cloudy is old, clear is new.
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