Arrrrrrrrrrrgh.

Spent all day going through 20 pages of posts in this section.  Still not sure what would suit me best.

16" CQB/home defense is the primary aim of this weapon. Some range use, but pretty sure a magnified optic would be a waste of money as it's not a sniper rifle. Definitely want something with a red dot, but can't decide if I'm better off with or without a battery powered reticle.  Have seen the Eotech in person and like that, but have no experience with the tritium powered reticles of the Trijicon or Meprolight units.

School me.

I had a trijicon reflex, and I liked it. I sold it to fund a Trijicon Acog.

I'm looking at picking up another one, but i'll probablly end up picking up a tri-power instead.

I have the Trijicon Reflex and love it. I have shot with the Eotech and like it but prefer the Reflex. The MEPRO 21 seems way over priced.

ETA pic.

I too am having the same dilemma, I keep going back and forth between the two, price is not that big of a deal,  My department wont let me use magnified optics so the ACOG is out.  I think the aimpoint it too tall.  Like the fact no batteries on the trijicon, Dont really like the look of the tri-power.  

Pro and Cons of each?????

The Eotech, Aimpoint, and the Tripower are all excellent sights. The Triji Reflex and the Mepro 21 are dated, but still decent sights, but I believe your money is better spent on a Eotech/Aimpoint/Tripower. It all comes down to personal preference. I prefer the Tripower:


Which ever you choose, make sure you shop around. The Tripowers can be picked up for around $435-$475, and the retail or MAP (Minimum Advertised Price) on the Eotech or Aimpoint can be beat by plenty of the dealers on the Equipment Exchange here.

Quoted: Quoted: 16" CQB/home defense is the primary aim of this weapon. Some range use, but pretty sure a magnified optic would be a waste of money as it's not a sniper rifle.   There is some choices in the middle- it's not necessarily a CQB or a sniper rifle choice. Have you thougth about an ACOG 4X with a red dot on top?  Gives you the best of both worlds. Here's mine with a Doctor on top (w/ a JP mount). i98.photobucket.com/albums/l277/steveinva/100_1213.jpg

OK, let me add that I don't want to spend more than $500  If money were no object then I'd consider an ACOG or an Aimpoint/Eotech combo, but I'm trying to spend less on the optics than I did for the rifle itself.

It really boils down to battery vs no battery I think...

ACOG for home defense??  Alrighty then.  


Out of the choices you posted, the Eotech is FAR superior Reflex or the Mepro 21, both of which will have washout issues with a flashlight in certain lighting conditions.

You do have a flashlight on the gun, correct?  If you dont, spend your money on THAT for now and use the iron sights.

I've used all 3 and as stated earlier both the Reflex-II & Mepor are dated and suffer from reticle washout under certain conditions (plus impacts to the unit are absorbed directly by the windage/elevation adjustment mechanisms, not a good thing). While I prefer the Eotech's reticle I really like that the TriPower isn't 100% dependent upon batteries and so the TriPower graces both my PS90's. BTW, SWFA's SampleList has NIB dealer display TriPowers complete w/warranty card for $379 (that's where I bought mine).
Tomac

tripower hands down.

I  have 2 ta-24 acog's ( 1.5x magnification ) one is crosshair the other red triangle. Also a trijicon reflex.

the red triangle is good but to move laterally the magnification makes you loose bearing.
if it's only one target its easy and quick to bring it UP and on target but laterally NO.

the reflex i think is almost worthless, the lense is so tinted blue that light transmission suffers and in bright conditions the amber reticle disappears.

the tripower seems nice...it has no magnification and a nice big reticle...but to me it seems to have the clutter the aimpoint does( knobs and such) while the Eotech has a clean wide square profile and the fastest reticle and best field of view.

Yes there is a battery need, hand in hand with the Ammo need. Thats why there are BUIS and Tomahawks.

I've got a trijicon reflex and I love it, but in hindsight, I'd probably be happier with the tripower or eotech.  The reflex just has too many small problems that have already been addressed here, like blue tint/washout/hard impact throwing off zero.  

Quoted: ACOG for home defense??  Alrighty then.   Out of the choices you posted, the Eotech is FAR superior Reflex or the Mepro 21, both of which will have washout issues with a flashlight in certain lighting conditions. You do have a flashlight on the gun, correct?  If you dont, spend your money on THAT for now and use the iron sights.

That boils it down nicely. Agreed that an ACOG (or any magnified optic really) is a poor choice for home defense. Reticle washout with the Reflex or Mepro would be bad. Yes, there is a light on the gun. Thanks

Quoted: I've used all 3 and as stated earlier both the Reflex-II & Mepor are dated and suffer from reticle washout under certain conditions (plus impacts to the unit are absorbed directly by the windage/elevation adjustment mechanisms, not a good thing). While I prefer the Eotech's reticle I really like that the TriPower isn't 100% dependent upon batteries and so the TriPower graces both my PS90's. BTW, SWFA's SampleList has NIB dealer display TriPowers complete w/warranty card for $379 (that's where I bought mine). Tomac img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/Tomac/ResizeofTriPower002.jpg img.photobucket.com/albums/v465/Tomac/ResizeofTriPower003.jpg

Excellent.  Very informative.  Yes, my only real concern with the Eotech is the battery situation.  I do have BUIS on the gun so maybe my only problem is strapping two AA batteries to the stock. Good points about impacts on the sight as well.  I'll check out SWFA too

Quoted: I  have 2 ta-24 acog's ( 1.5x magnification ) one is crosshair the other red triangle. Also a trijicon reflex. the red triangle is good but to move laterally the magnification makes you loose bearing. if it's only one target its easy and quick to bring it UP and on target but laterally NO. the reflex i think is almost worthless, the lense is so tinted blue that light transmission suffers and in bright conditions the amber reticle disappears. the tripower seems nice...it has no magnification and a nice big reticle...but to me it seems to have the clutter the aimpoint does( knobs and such) while the Eotech has a clean wide square profile and the fastest reticle and best field of view. Yes there is a battery need, hand in hand with the Ammo need. Thats why there are BUIS and Tomahawks.

Point taken on battery vs ammo.

Quoted: I've got a trijicon reflex and I love it, but in hindsight, I'd probably be happier with the tripower or eotech.  The reflex just has too many small problems that have already been addressed here, like blue tint/washout/hard impact throwing off zero.

Good stuff.  I see a trend developing... No wonder Eotech is so popular

Thanks for all the replies guys.

Dont forget that you will need a mount for whichever optic you choose. The Eotech does not "need" a mount, but the LaRue Eotech mount is a big improvement over mounting the Eotech directly to the receiver. Instead of your iron sights being right in the center of the Eotechs sight picture, with the LaRue mount it will be in the lower 1/3 which is preferred as it gives you a less cluttered sight picture, and more of a "heads up" both eyes open field of view. The LaRue mount also gives you the quick detach feature which is nice for a number of reasons. If you go with the Tripower or Aimpoint, LaRue makes the best mount for those as well.

Hadn't decided on the mount yet.  The rear sight on my rifle is a flip up type, so not really in the sight picture if it's down.  The front sight is fixed so I'm not sure how that will (or if it will) bother me.  I'm thinking that a direct co-witness might actually be less distracting than a lower 1/3 co-witness arrangement.

The new Eotech 553 has an ARMS type lever mount built in to it but not sure how high that sits.  Strangely enough, SWFA has both a 553 and a Tripower on their sample list. Almost the same price once you factor in a mount.

Quoted: Hadn't decided on the mount yet.  The rear sight on my rifle is a flip up type, so not really in the sight picture if it's down.  The front sight is fixed so I'm not sure how that will (or if it will) bother me.  I'm thinking that a direct co-witness might actually be less distracting than a lower 1/3 co-witness arrangement. The new Eotech 553 has an ARMS type lever mount built in to it but not sure how high that sits.  Strangely enough, SWFA has both a 553 and a Tripower on their sample list. Almost the same price once you factor in a mount.

The TriPower comes w/a usable but not fancy 30mm ring. I opted for the ARMS TX10 QD mount made specifically for the TriPower, got mine for $80 shipped here:
cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220057094391&ssPageName=MERCOSI_VI_ROSI_PR4_PCN_BIX_Stores&refitem=220047242067&itemcount=4&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&refwidgettype=osi_widget Risers are available if needed.
Tomac

go for the larue mount.  it'll give you the added flexibility of being able to adjust the tension of the throw lever in case you ever get an upper with a not so perfect rail

Quoted: Hadn't decided on the mount yet.  The rear sight on my rifle is a flip up type, so not really in the sight picture if it's down.  The front sight is fixed so I'm not sure how that will (or if it will) bother me.  I'm thinking that a direct co-witness might actually be less distracting than a lower 1/3 co-witness arrangement. The new Eotech 553 has an ARMS type lever mount built in to it but not sure how high that sits.  Strangely enough, SWFA has both a 553 and a Tripower on their sample list. Almost the same price once you factor in a mount.

I have both the Reflix and the EOTech 552. the reflix is a good lightweight sight that works well IF you shoot with both eyes open and have the sight on a carry handle mount. If the sight does wash out you have the sight right there.I have mine on a u/l carbine 5.5 lbs total weight with 18 rd mag.
The EOTech is a a great sight that works best on a flattop. It works if you close your week eye, It does not need a mount and if you use the 512/552 with AA litheum batts, they will last a long time.
If I could only have one it would be the EOTech.
jmo

It is a flat top and I do prefer to shoot with both eyes open...a holdover from pistol training i suppose.

I'll have to see if one of the local shops will let me try an Eotech with and without a mount to check on the cowitness placement.

As GiantCarp stated, get a LaRue mount regardless for which optic. LaRue is the best available. Better materials, better design, better construction, better customer service, and priced right. You get what you pay for

Quoted: It is a flat top and I do prefer to shoot with both eyes open...a holdover from pistol training i suppose. I'll have to see if one of the local shops will let me try an Eotech with and without a mount to check on the cowitness placement.

I have a Aimpoint, EOTech and Scoped AR-15s.  My next build is a pure CQB home/ ranch defense gun.

The EOTech is about the only one I would even consider as a inside room clearing optic, but it has some slight drawbacks.

1)The HUD is slow to adjust brightness on mine (512). I have it set mid-range since most likely it will be needed at night.  

2)I have actually (dont laugh...lol) Walked around my house at 2am (wife and kids gone for the weekend) as if I was woken by a noise.  Just to see what it would be like.  It was clumsy focusing my eyes from a dark room attempting to "see" the room through the HUD, then identifying a target..(standing lamp) and aiming at it.

3) its fat on the gun.  the HUD is smaller then you think, and the thickness forces you to basically look straight into the optic just like your BUIS, but it would be quicker to acquire a target with it then a BUIS.

My aimpoint was even worse.  The tube decreases your aim time since you have to look through it at a specific angle to see the dot.  Aimpoints and room clearing,.. alone,.. at night, ..dont mix.

The scope is a great weapon to throw at an intruder...other than that..anyone who has an ACOG on a CQB weapon hasn't thought things through.

I am looking at either a C-More rail or a Kobra EKP-8-14.  The ATN is junk..on a .22 plinker its ok...

I had the chance yesterday to check out both from a guy I know.  He allowed me to swap his C-More off his shotgun and on to my AR.  It was nice, quick and easy to see over, around and aim-up quickly.  He also let me run through some mags with this AR set up with a Kobra...very nice set up.  Little fatter then the C-More, little more rugged too.  I think I am going for a Kobra myself.

Its up to you.  I bought my EOTech for a CQB home gun also, but Its not as great in the house, at night.. as it was on the store room sales floor.

Quoted: Its up to you.  I bought my EOTech for a CQB home gun also, but Its not as great in the house, at night.. as it was on the store room sales floor.

Very informative, thanks.

I guess the only question I have is whether or not you had a light on the gun when trying to subdue the lamp ;)  That might make all the difference.  I'm also not likely to be clearing any rooms but rather take up position in a defensible spot and call 911. I'll let the fucker walk into my field of fire as I wait for reinforcements.

IMHO I'd lean toward an Eotech for an HD setup.I've got a 512 on one of my carbines. The 65moa outer ring with the 1moa dot really makes target acquisition easy (I say this referring to switchng between 50 & 100m range paper targets). It's also really easy to keep both eyes open to maintain a wider FOV if needed.
TO

Quoted: Quoted: Its up to you.  I bought my EOTech for a CQB home gun also, but Its not as great in the house, at night.. as it was on the store room sales floor. Very informative, thanks. I guess the only question I have is whether or not you had a light on the gun when trying to subdue the lamp ;)  That might make all the difference.  I'm also not likely to be clearing any rooms but rather take up position in a defensible spot and call 911. I'll let the fucker walk into my field of fire as I wait for reinforcements.

If I were thinking of going outside, I would most likely grab the EOTech with the M4 surefire.  Inside its going to be the Kobra and the 9P Surefire.

CWDraco,

From what you have typed, it sounds like you suffer from a bad case of tunnel vision. The Aimpoint, Eotech and Tripowers were designed to be shot with both eyes open, with more of a heads up sight picture. When used properly, there are no such issues with these optics, as they are as good as it gets.

Never had an issue with clearing rooms with either a Aimpoint, Eotech, or a Tripower. These are the most widely used CQB optics available, used by guys everyday to clear buildings, houses, rooms, because they are the best option available for this specific purpose. The C-More and the Kobra sights are well, best used for target practice.

The C-More sights are notorious for loosing their zero on a regular basis. Just walk away.

I guess the only question I have is whether or not you had a light on the gun when trying to subdue the lamp ;)  That might make all the difference.  I'm also not likely to be clearing any rooms but rather take up position in a defensible spot and call 911. I'll let the fucker walk into my field of fire as I wait for reinforcements.

Seriously though...I'm not trained to clear rooms/buildings. It's one of the most hazardous things faced by law enforcement personnel but they train for it and you don't see them clearing rooms on their own, always with a team. I'm able to wait it out knowing I have enough firepower to hold down the fort as it were.

Anyway, back to our regularly scheduled discussion.

Lots of great info in this thread guys, appreciate all the input.

Quoted: CWDraco, From what you have typed, it sounds like you suffer from a bad case of tunnel vision. The Aimpoint, Eotech and Tripowers were designed to be shot with both eyes open, with more of a heads up sight picture. When used properly, there are no such issues with these optics, as they are as good as it gets. Never had an issue with clearing rooms with either a Aimpoint, Eotech, or a Tripower. These are the most widely used CQB optics available, used by guys everyday to clear buildings, houses, rooms, because they are the best option available for this specific purpose. The C-More and the Kobra sights are well, best used for target practice. The C-More sights are notorious for loosing their zero on a regular basis. Just walk away.

You do realize Kobra's are used by more Military units then Aimpoint and EOTech...right?

There are C-More's designed to be mounted DIRECTLY to a handgun slide, and are used in competitions all across the world.  I'm not saying they are the best, but to state they are crap is a little over the top Aimpoint /EOTech coolaid drinkin...dont you think?

I'm not saying My Aimpoint and EOtech are crap...they are GREAT optics, but they have limitations that others choose not to see (coolaid drinking).

The C-More and Kobra have limitations also.

IMHO no site is even needed if you are going to sit in a corner or behind cover and wait for the threat to seek you.  You gain almost no benefit from an optic,  Unless the threat knows where you are.  In that case it would be quicker to shoot it out with an optic helping you acquire your target in the gun fight from behind cover.  If you plan on taking the first shot from behind cover in a surprise fashion then no optic is needed.

An Optic is only needed when you are actively moving to seek and secure areas in CQB.

Fact is most home based threats happen in the day time...not at night.  The night time robberies are of unoccupied homes, (for the most part).  Of those at night only 1/2 are armed intruders, of those armed intruders, only a VERY small percent make any noise breaking in.  The home invasion type will bust the door down as you answer it...what you gonna do then?  Run, arm up, hide and wait for the cops?

If you live in the sticks and dont own a dog, or a motion sensor system on the outside..its time to think hard on what your options would be in the middle of the night to each scenario of threats to your home.

If you want an optic, cuz everyone else has one...everyone owns an Aimpoint or a EOTech......

Quoted: Quoted: CWDraco, From what you have typed, it sounds like you suffer from a bad case of tunnel vision. The Aimpoint, Eotech and Tripowers were designed to be shot with both eyes open, with more of a heads up sight picture. When used properly, there are no such issues with these optics, as they are as good as it gets. Never had an issue with clearing rooms with either a Aimpoint, Eotech, or a Tripower. These are the most widely used CQB optics available, used by guys everyday to clear buildings, houses, rooms, because they are the best option available for this specific purpose. The C-More and the Kobra sights are well, best used for target practice. The C-More sights are notorious for loosing their zero on a regular basis. Just walk away. You do realize Kobra's are used by more Military units then Aimpoint and EOTech...right? *NO, I DONT "REALIZE" THAT* There are C-More's designed to be mounted DIRECTLY to a handgun slide, and are used in competitions all across the world.  *A SHOOTING COMPETITION IS A GAME. DID SOMBODY MENTION SOMETHING ABOUT KOOLAID?* I'm not saying they are the best, but to state they are crap is a little over the top Aimpoint /EOTech coolaid drinkin...dont you think? *I NEVER SAID THEY ARE CRAP, BUT THEY ARE NOT AS WELL MADE OR RELIABLE AS THE AIMPOINT/EOTECH/TRIJICON SIGHTS* I'm not saying My Aimpoint and EOtech are crap...they are GREAT optics, but they have limitations that others choose not to see (coolaid drinking). *ANY OPTIC WILL HAVE LIMITATIONS, BUT THE EO/AIM/TRIPOWER ARE THE BEST OPTIONS AVAILABLE. I HAVE CLEARED MANY A ROOM WITH EACH OF THESE OPTICS, WITHOUT THE ANY OF THE "LIMITATIONS" YOU SITE BEING A FACTOR. THEY WORK. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH KOOLAID OR "COOLAID" OR WHATEVER* The C-More and Kobra have limitations also. *YES LIKE, DONT PUT A C-MORE ON A CARBINE AND EXPECT IT TO HOLD ITS ZERO* IMHO no site is even needed if you are going to sit in a corner or behind cover and wait for the threat to seek you.  You gain almost no benefit from an optic,  Unless the threat knows where you are.  In that case it would be quicker to shoot it out with an optic helping you acquire your target in the gun fight from behind cover.  If you plan on taking the first shot from behind cover in a surprise fashion then no optic is needed. * IT ALL COMES DOWN TO THE SHOOTERS APPLICATION OF THE OPTIC, AND HOW HE TRAINS WITH HIS GEAR. YOUR LOGIC WOULD HAVE A SHOOTER REMOVE HIS OPTIC FOR CERTAIN SITUATIONS, AND RE-MOUNT IT FOR OTHERS?* An Optic is only needed when you are actively moving to seek and secure areas in CQB. Fact is most home based threats happen in the day time...not at night.  The night time robberies are of unoccupied homes, (for the most part).  Of those at night only 1/2 are armed intruders, of those armed intruders, only a VERY small percent make any noise breaking in.  The home invasion type will bust the door down as you answer it...what you gonna do then?  Run, arm up, hide and wait for the cops? *IM SORRY, BUT YOUR STATISTICS ARE INDEED FULL OF CRAP* If you live in the sticks and dont own a dog, or a motion sensor system on the outside..its time to think hard on what your options would be in the middle of the night to each scenario of threats to your home. If you want an optic, cuz everyone else has one...everyone owns an Aimpoint or a EOTech......

nicely done NickDrak

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: CWDraco, From what you have typed, it sounds like you suffer from a bad case of tunnel vision. The Aimpoint, Eotech and Tripowers were designed to be shot with both eyes open, with more of a heads up sight picture. When used properly, there are no such issues with these optics, as they are as good as it gets. Never had an issue with clearing rooms with either a Aimpoint, Eotech, or a Tripower. These are the most widely used CQB optics available, used by guys everyday to clear buildings, houses, rooms, because they are the best option available for this specific purpose. The C-More and the Kobra sights are well, best used for target practice. The C-More sights are notorious for loosing their zero on a regular basis. Just walk away. You do realize Kobra's are used by more Military units then Aimpoint and EOTech...right? *NO, I DONT "REALIZE" THAT* There are C-More's designed to be mounted DIRECTLY to a handgun slide, and are used in competitions all across the world.  *A SHOOTING COMPETITION IS A GAME. DID SOMBODY MENTION SOMETHING ABOUT KOOLAID?* I'm not saying they are the best, but to state they are crap is a little over the top Aimpoint /EOTech coolaid drinkin...dont you think? *I NEVER SAID THEY ARE CRAP, BUT THEY ARE NOT AS WELL MADE OR RELIABLE AS THE AIMPOINT/EOTECH/TRIJICON SIGHTS* I'm not saying My Aimpoint and EOtech are crap...they are GREAT optics, but they have limitations that others choose not to see (coolaid drinking). *ANY OPTIC WILL HAVE LIMITATIONS, BUT THE EO/AIM/TRIPOWER ARE THE BEST OPTIONS AVAILABLE. I HAVE CLEARED MANY A ROOM WITH EACH OF THESE OPTICS, WITHOUT THE ANY OF THE "LIMITATIONS" YOU SITE BEING A FACTOR. THEY WORK. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH KOOLAID OR "COOLAID" OR WHATEVER* The C-More and Kobra have limitations also. *YES LIKE, DONT PUT A C-MORE ON A CARBINE AND EXPECT IT TO HOLD ITS ZERO* IMHO no site is even needed if you are going to sit in a corner or behind cover and wait for the threat to seek you.  You gain almost no benefit from an optic,  Unless the threat knows where you are.  In that case it would be quicker to shoot it out with an optic helping you acquire your target in the gun fight from behind cover.  If you plan on taking the first shot from behind cover in a surprise fashion then no optic is needed. * IT ALL COMES DOWN TO THE SHOOTERS APPLICATION OF THE OPTIC, AND HOW HE TRAINS WITH HIS GEAR. YOUR LOGIC WOULD HAVE A SHOOTER REMOVE HIS OPTIC FOR CERTAIN SITUATIONS, AND RE-MOUNT IT FOR OTHERS?* An Optic is only needed when you are actively moving to seek and secure areas in CQB. Fact is most home based threats happen in the day time...not at night.  The night time robberies are of unoccupied homes, (for the most part).  Of those at night only 1/2 are armed intruders, of those armed intruders, only a VERY small percent make any noise breaking in.  The home invasion type will bust the door down as you answer it...what you gonna do then?  Run, arm up, hide and wait for the cops? *IM SORRY, BUT YOUR STATISTICS ARE INDEED FULL OF CRAP* If you live in the sticks and dont own a dog, or a motion sensor system on the outside..its time to think hard on what your options would be in the middle of the night to each scenario of threats to your home. If you want an optic, cuz everyone else has one...everyone owns an Aimpoint or a EOTech......

So you and several other LEO/Military soldiers have cleared rooms with the standard optics...cool, well done.  FYI, so have I.  

The man was asking about an Aimpoint, EO or Reflex for home defense...ALONE..not SWAT or Military tactical use of a Red Dot / Holosight.  

In a house, at night, alone, attempting to search it, the best choice would be a Reflex or Kobra.  If you are going to lay-in-wait.. anything of quality will do, that does include a C-More, even on a semi-auto Carbine.  You dont need anything if this is your plan. I was giving advise on what is the best to use if you plan on searching the house based on my own experience with both the Aimpoint and EOtech.  I do not own a Reflex..yet..next build maybe.  I have heard that there is alot of wash-out outside in bright light.  I will be the judge of that (for me)...not what others say.

If you want an overall good optic for day/night, inside/ outside, CQB / Mid range it would be the Aimpoint,  EOTech or Kobra.  

I have now spent 2 days shooting with my buddies Kobra on his AR.  I've dumped over 500 rounds though it. It hasn't lost zero, or any other idiotic thing people say about non-cult optics.  (BTW thats what is meant by Coolaid drinking, the fact everyone else does it means you have to do it too...Jim Jones ring any bells?).  

A Kobra is going on my latest build due to my independent research and use.  I really dont care what everyone else (who may or may not have even seen one) says.

And I find it real hard to take you seriously when you state my facts on home break ins are crap.  If you are saying most home robberies are committed at night by armed intruders...no way you are a LEO.  If you are LEO, you have less then 1 year experience several years in a row...there is a big difference between 1 year experience 10 years in a row and 10 years of experience.

Fact- Most robberies are committed during the day when home owners are at work.

Fact- Most robberies at night are committed when the house is unoccupied.

Fact- Most Robberies where the home owner is there, are committed without the knowledge that they are in the house.

Fact- If the robber believes the homeowner is in the house...he's not going to break a window..yell, "I'm coming in... please wake up and call the cops on me." He will silently pry open a window, patio door, or back door and move directly to what he is after.  If he needs to make noise to get what he is after he will go after the homeowner first. Most likely he is after items not in the bedroom, like the garage or living room.  If he is after items in the bedroom he will go after the sleeping homeowner...most of the time its the home owner they are after..IE Rape, and robbery is second.

Fact- Nearly 50 percent of all robberies of an occupied home, report the attacker was in the bedroom before the owner was awakened.

Fact- Most non-gang related home robberies are committed without a firearm on the criminal. Subtracting any robberies where the homeowner was thought to be home.

Fact- Most gang related home robberies are planned, and at least one will carry a firearm.  The gang-banger who's "lick" they are dealing has knowledge the owner is gone, and has knowledge of the house, homeowners and what they are going for.

Fact- Most gang-bangers robberies are committed within 5 miles of their home. Of those within the 5 miles, Nearly all are committed in their own block or housing tract. It is very rare for a gang-banger to arm up and cross town to randomly pick a dark house in the middle of the night to rob.

Fact- If a gang-banger knows the home will be occupied they will use home invasion tactics, not silent, in the middle of the night type stuff.

To sum it all up....buy whatever you want.  

You have covered all of the bases. Which one of your scenarios would the optic be removed, and which ones would it be put back on for??? Please enlighten me.

Quoted: You have covered all of the bases. Which one of your scenarios would the optic be removed, and which ones would it be put back on for??? Please enlighten me.

Easy.

If you plan on laying-in-wait, (inside a house) for an attacker, and choose to use a carbine, (not the best choice of weapons I might add), then you dont need anything, but if you want an optic any reasonably good one will do.  But once again....you dont need one.

end of story for that.

If you want a weapon that can both serve you well inside a home, outside, both from behind cover and searching, Aimpoint, EOTech, or Kobra will do.  In any event, I agree training is a better tool then the optic you choose.

If you want an optic, for home defense, where you are going to search rooms for whatever it maybe...gang banger or threatening lamp...IMHO the optic with the least amount of blind spots will be the Kobra.  Second would be the Reflex.  Third would be the EOTech, and the Aimpoint comes in last.

If you need an overall good optic, and are in a team of whatever, going from outside to inside...blah blah blah...Its an Aimpoint first then EOTech and Kobra come second.

Once again, I gave him my opinion based on the fact I thought he was going to clear his house, not take cover.  If he had, I would have said, "buy a shotgun or handgun...a carbine makes a poor choice for that tactic.".


I never said to take off the optic and put it back on...man someone should make a mount where you have a quick detachable lever or something so you could do that,,,,ummm

Quoted: Quoted: You have covered all of the bases. Which one of your scenarios would the optic be removed, and which ones would it be put back on for??? Please enlighten me. Easy. If you plan on laying-in-wait, (inside a house) for an attacker, and choose to use a carbine, (not the best choice of weapons I might add), then you dont need anything, but if you want an optic any reasonably good one will do.  But once again....you dont need one. end of story for that. If you want a weapon that can both serve you well inside a home, outside, both from behind cover and searching, Aimpoint, EOTech, or Kobra will do.  In any event, I agree training is a better tool then the optic you choose. If you want an optic, for home defense, where you are going to search rooms for whatever it maybe...gang banger or threatening lamp...IMHO the optic with the least amount of blind spots will be the Kobra.  Second would be the Reflex.  Third would be the EOTech, and the Aimpoint comes in last. If you need an overall good optic, and are in a team of whatever, going from outside to inside...blah blah blah...Its an Aimpoint first then EOTech and Kobra come second. Once again, I gave him my opinion based on the fact I thought he was going to clear his house, not take cover.  If he had, I would have said, "buy a shotgun or handgun...a carbine makes a poor choice for that tactic.". I never said to take off the optic and put it back on...man someone should make a mount where you have a quick detachable lever or something so you could do that,,,,ummm

It's always nice getting answers to questions you never asked.  You guys really brought out the best of internet buffoonery here...thanks for the laughs.

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