Does anyone made some experiences with the ciener .22 lr system? They are new in Germany and if accuracy and reliability is good it would be a usefull thing . Does it work well in DPMS made uppers? And are 270Euro(313$) far too expensive ( shipping and tax inclusive). I´m happy to read about your thoughts.

They work great but can be picky about ammo. Use jacketed high velocity rounds and you should be OK. I bought mine for about $110 a few years ago. Check the Pistol and Rimfire forum for more info.

For about $100US more, you could get a dedicated .22lr AR upper.i'm not sure if they're legal for export.They're not firearms so they may be ok.

Ciener works ok as long as you lubricate it well. I´m using Lapua ammo with mine in my Bushmaster M4. It´s damn accurate and funny to shoot.
BTW, Where can I get 30 round magazines?

MN

30 round mags for export might be available from the manufacturer. As for accuracy v price, I would say that they retail here in the states for about $139 US.  Accuracy is ok, I have mine on an old 1 in 14 barrel and it gets 1" at 50 yards.  A friend has a dpms .22lr upper and he gets about 1/4 inch at 50 yards with a 4x scope.  I think he paid about $350 US for the upper.  

Here is the website for ciener.
http://www.22lrconversions.com/atch-pg.htm

I have one for my Bushy M4 type. Works great. The high velocity jacketed ammo is inexpensive. I use Federal with mine. Clean and accurate. Really wish though that we could get the 30 rnd mags though. I zip through ten rounders really quick. The web site does say that the 30 rnd mags are available for export.

As long as you run it in semi auto they work pretty well. Are 30rnd magazines available to you? The 10ns do run out quickly. The dedicated CZ upper would probably be a more functional and accurate choice for your lower. Don't know the availabilty of those to you but they come from over there.

I would suggest you not bother.  While it seemed like a good idea, it didn't work out so well. Mine had to go back to Ciener 3 times to be worked on, and they never got it above 90% reliability (3 jams per 30 rd mag approx). It gets expensive shipping an upper back and forth...

I also had one of their 1911 pistol units (Commander length), and it was a total piece of crap. I sent it back at least 4 times with the gun, and it never did work well.

If you are willing to put up with constant jams, then get one, otherwise, don't bother.  And this was with several brands of high quality copper jacketed ammo.

While their accuracy was good, reliable they were not.

Thank you for your information. After my lokal dealer talked to Waffen-schumacher (http://www.waffenschumacher.com)  they are willing to send a conversion unit to for me to test it. Germany is a service- desert so it´s not usual to test somesthing ( normaly it goes "buy it or leave it")  Waffenschumacher sells Sabre Defense AR 15 they call it XR15 ( you know them?) and they don´t garantie that their ciener´s work with DPMS receivers. So I´ll have a nice weekend to find out. 30 rd Magazines are not legal for us to use but you can get them in France, maybe someday.....

What would the French do with firearms anyway.[;D]

NIB but dropped once.[;D]

[marines]