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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 9/25/2003 6:23:56 PM EDT
I know the word 'best' is situational and
dependant upon everyones likes/dislikes.

I need to find a good fold down/flip up back up rear sight to mount onto my RRA M4 Tactical Entry LE rifle. I removed the RRA tactical riser mount and mounted an EOtech directly onto the pict rail on the upper receiver.......so I can co-witness once I find/mount a back up rear sight.

I have seen various flip up style rear sights, such as: DPMS Mangonel, American Spirit Arms Tactical Rear Flip Up Sight, GG&G MAD, GG&G A2, and I believe there are a few ARMS flip up rear sights out there.

Also, will there be any problems mounting a flip down rear sight onto my upper's pict rail with only 1 5/8" length left on the rail after I mounted the EOtech?

Any and all information and recommendations are appreciated concerning helping myself to decide which BUIS will be best suited for my needs.
Link Posted: 9/25/2003 6:45:14 PM EDT
ARMS #40, KAC 300m or GG&G A2 are three fo the best on the market. Even the awesome LMT stand along rear sight will fit on your receiver rail with an EOTech mounted.
Link Posted: 9/25/2003 8:34:24 PM EDT
SMGLee, Thanks for the reply. What is the LMT rear sight?.......never heard of it. I am leaning towards the generally utilized ARMS #40. Does anyone know what the 'folded down' overall height of the AMRS #40 is?? From the top of the pict rail on my receiver to the bottom of the EOtech glass is about 1" and I just wanted to make sure the rear sight (folded down) would NOT protrude up into the EOtech's viewing area. Also, do night sights affect the EOtech at all????.........especially a front night sight pin?? I am thinking about getting a front/rear night sights the same time I buy a rear sight and just installed a night sight aperature into the ARMS #40. THANKS AGAIN!!!
Link Posted: 9/25/2003 9:06:11 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/25/2003 9:12:14 PM EDT by JTinIN]
From the[url=http://www.armsmounts.com/list.html#40]ARMs[/url]web page the height is [green][size=2]0.95 inches[/green][/size=2] [img]http://www.armsmounts.com/images/prod_40.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 9/26/2003 2:17:55 AM EDT
While the LMT is a great sight it doesn't fold so not quite what your looking for. I believe SMGLee was just using it as a base comparison to show that you still have enough space left over. I've used the ARMS # 40 and it's a great sight, I switched to the KAC 300 meter because it's flat and would fit underneath the 4x ACOG TA01NSN when it's mounted. I personally wouldn't do "night sights" in conjunction with your EOTech. Unless you were using a fold down front and rear set up, which I suspect your not.
Link Posted: 9/26/2003 5:47:15 AM EDT
Correct, I would not be using a front fold down sight, I was just going to buy a night sight pin for the front tower. I was just toying with the idea since when we do our low light shoots, it becomes difficult do acquire darkened tagets. Since I now have an EOtech, I do not have to worry about low light target problems. Anyone else think having BUINS (Back Up Iron Night Sights) with my EOtech is bad? I just trying to cover all bases when I redo my sighting system. How does everyone else shoot in low light/no light conditions with their rifles with stock sights????? Whenever I try to shoot in these conditions, it takes me long to effectively acquire a target and even then aiming is difficult also. If the consensus is that BUINS are bad when used with my EOtech, then great........I wont use them and just buy a normal ole ARMS #40. Thanks again.
Link Posted: 9/26/2003 6:00:45 AM EDT
I have an 8 yr old front bar nightsight on my Aimpoint AR that I bought used for cheap. It is so tired and dim that it doesn't really interfere with the Aimpoint in low/no light. When its pitch black and the Aimpoint is off or better yet, gone, it is just bright enough to pick up without being annoying. I thought it was a neat solution, but I could live without it either way...
Link Posted: 9/26/2003 7:38:00 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/26/2003 7:39:56 AM EDT by SMGLee]
1001001 is correct, I just use the LMT as a reference, since the LMT is by far the biggest rear sight on the market. here is picture of a LMT [img]http://www.thermaldynamics.com/pictures/guns/buis3.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 9/27/2003 5:58:33 AM EDT
SMGLee - Nice hardwood floor. Did you do it yourself? Oh, the LMT is nice, too.
Link Posted: 9/27/2003 6:57:37 AM EDT
I strongly prefer the GG&G MAD. It's exremely durable, rock solid, and doesn't have a bunch of useless (at carbine distances) stuff hanging on it. You can switch apeture sizes with a flick of your thumb. It folds down completely out of view. Luck, SD
Link Posted: 9/27/2003 7:09:20 PM EDT
The #40 is the only one able to always go back into battery if hit by accident. It uses the std. mil std. M16A2 aperature that don't block the sight picture when deployed, and don't block the optic when folded and locked. Good shootin, Jack
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 1:18:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 8:59:36 PM EDT
I second the ARMS 40!, with an Eotech 551 it fits perfect,plenty of room and a great sight!
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 9:02:06 PM EDT
ARMS 40 handsdown. get the 40A2 version with full peep apeture w/out cut horizon line.
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 1:50:35 PM EDT
ARMS 40 [@:d]
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 2:51:00 PM EDT
Always like a fowty! [booze]
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 4:28:32 PM EDT
I cant see why the majority feel the arms 40 is best.I think alot of it is because its made by arms.Not a problem.I use one also.I also use a GG&G A-2.I like my arms 40 and my GG&G,but with the GG&G i dont have to fiddle with a spring tension lever.The GG&G is much less fiddling then the 40,but i still like the 40,so what!The 40 will bounce back if hit by brush or what ever,fine.The new GG&G locks in place now,thats good to.My next in progress M-4gery is going to have a GG&G MAD.why?why not!You can make a case for what ever one you want.Pick one and be happy.Its always 6 of one half a dozen of another.Just my thoughts,unless you are going to use a swan or SIR then you best get the 40.
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 5:50:42 PM EDT
The ones that don't flex and lock up, are the ones that get broken cause they didn't flex. I'd rather fiddle than diddle with a broken sight. The hold down lever locks it down and most trained monkeys don't have any trouble managing the good positive lock of a simple lever. Good shootin, Jack
Link Posted: 10/8/2003 6:22:29 PM EDT
Regarding the arms #40. Why get the one without the horizon line. Doesn't having it give you more options. Also it the horizon line set up to coincide with a 20 or 16 inch barrel?
Link Posted: 10/10/2003 8:34:38 AM EDT
I would go with GGG's A2. It is made from soild machined billet Alumnium. Using unmodifed Mil-Std parts. The other sights on the market are cast and they have to use modified apeatures.
Link Posted: 10/10/2003 8:59:18 AM EDT
I like and use ARMs #40 on all my M4 for one simple reason, if the sight is knock down, the spring tension will bring it back up. the release lever is fast and accessible, all you have to do is pull on the lever and the sight pops up, you can't get any faster then that. in my opinion, the #40 is THE BEST back up iron sight available on the market. This is not because it is an ARMs product. it is just the best.
Link Posted: 10/10/2003 11:38:01 AM EDT
Originally Posted By akconvert: Regarding the arms #40. Why get the one without the horizon line. Doesn't having it give you more options. Also it the horizon line set up to coincide with a 20 or 16 inch barrel?
View Quote
The horrizontal line and notch are there for clearance. The notch to me is VERY hard to try to use as the sight radius is just too long for a pistol type set up and when you ty to use the small aperature as its meant to be used as a peep or ghost sight the removed material makes the aperature appear to be a U instead of an O so its harder to center the front sight and is annoying. It can still be used but for me its more difficult, slower and annoying. I dont really plan on using "back up" irons past 300m anyway.
Link Posted: 10/10/2003 1:17:10 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/10/2003 4:26:11 PM EDT
Where anyone could get the nutty notion that (ALL) other fold down rear sights are cast is beyond logic. Even if they were, which they ain't, so what. The number 40 for instance, it's easy to see that it isn't a casting, it's all machined, no casting marks. They come with either the std. A2 or modified A2 aperatures. The modified hoprizon line aperature was done for certain fast response shooting beyond the 300 meters that their red dot was only zero'd to. In other words, if your zero'd only to 300 meters and some bad guy is out to 5-600 meters you need a little more than just guessing how much to aim over the bad guys heads to get near them. I take my hat off to ARMS for giving our guys a little extra help where sights are very important to hitting back when other fold down sights only go to 300 meters and that's not accurate or healthy in those certain situations. Good shootin, Jack
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 12:14:02 AM EDT
I have both the ARMS#40 and the GG&G, and I like both. About the GG&G, it's more expensive but it lies flatter to give you more clearance room, and the lock button is beveled so if it is forced down, it's not going to break, I have tried this out myself, it just pops back in rather than break. Myself, I don't envision me whacking the rear sight a lot as mine is a range rifle. I actually prefer the GG&G but I have different requirments than most #40 owners. I also like the GG&G front BUIS over the PRI cause it has a bayonet lug (and we all need that, right? [;)]), however the PRI does have a better sight picture. BTW, the GG&G front also has a beveled lock button and would simply fold rather than break like the rear BUIS.
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 9:09:27 AM EDT
The ARMS #40 [b][u]is[/b][/u] the best fold down sight. There are many other good options out there, but none approach the #40 as being the best. The #40 does not fit all applications, like if you need to get some specific scopes over the top of the BUIS, but if a #40 will work for what you're doing, I would get it. Whats more, it will work for nearly all applications. I have and like GG&G's stuff. I have used it as long as I have used ARMS stuff. But I have also broken three of the last 6 GG&G items I have used. [u]TWO[u] MAD sights and a Cantilever mount have bit the dust on me. One MAD wouldnot stay flipped up and would fall partially after each and every shot. Granted, it was a VERY old MAD sight and GG&G replaced it right away for me with a new one. But after about 2 years, the replacement also broke. The coil on the one side of the mount that the screw goes into pulled right out of the housing. This made it impossible to use. They repaired this sight and it is working fine again, but I have to admit, it now sits on one of the rifles I use least. Just last week I bought a new Aimpoint and took a Cantilever mount I have been using for about 4 years. A roll pin holds the threaded end on to the one side. The tightening screw threads in to it. When I tightened it on to the rail, the roll pin sheered and it came right out. This was an easy fix and I just punched another roll pin in, but I was very suprised. Dont know what that has to do with which is the best BUIS, but it is something that just happened and I was fairly disapointed.
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 9:14:49 AM EDT
Gotta say, I'm a #40 fan as well. I went through this same thing a year or so ago. Looked at everything out there. ARMS, GG&G, Knights, etc. Finially settled on the #40 and have been hooked ever since.
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 12:07:50 PM EDT
I have the MAD, and the acompanying flip up front from GG&G. I like the fact that the MAD appears to be the flattest of the bunch.
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 12:40:06 PM EDT
ARMS #40 [url="http://www.hunt101.com/?p=57457&c=500&z=1"][img]http://www.hunt101.com/img/057457.gif[/img][/url] Joe
Link Posted: 10/12/2003 2:13:00 PM EDT
The #40 is by far the fastest as only the lever has to be pulled like a trigger and it's automatically in place as fast as a speeding spring, especialy under stress. The push up sights all have to be pushe/placed into position, sometimes more than once if hit by accident. Good shootin, Jack
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