I have two Grendel rifles, both 16", but have the parts to build an SBR (11.5") and trying to source a 20" barrel that isn't a heavy weight.

Have plenty of Wolf steel case stocked for plinking, and a couple hundred rounds of AA loaded Barnes 120gr TSX, but at $40+ a box, it's not really economical to stock pile.

Wanting to stock up on a good defensive round that would mostly used from 0 to 300 meters. What would be the best choice?

Hornady 123gr AMAX? Hornady 123gr SST? Federal American Eagle 123gr OTM? They all cost within a couple bucks of each other.

It should not be that difficult to find a 6.5 20" barrel..
Call Hart in central Pa....

Can't help you on factory HD loads, our own 'bluefalcon' probably can though.

I have shot several different 6.5 Grendel bullets in one gallon jugs of water.  The 110 grain FMJ as sold by Prvi Partizan had started to yaw by the second jug and did not fragment.   This bullet loaded by PPU is a very deep penetrating round and wouldn't be my first choice for HD.  The 123 grain A-Max, 120 grain Nosler Ballistic tip and Nosler 100 grain BT hunting bullets have preformed great in my water test.

The Barnes 100 grain TTSX is a top performer but it exhibits to much penetration for me to consider it for use in urban areas.   For the price and availability the 123 grain A-Max and SST are probably the most cost effective.  PPU has recalled their 6.5 Grendel ammo but there has been no recall on the Wolf 120 grain MPT (Multi Pupose Tactical).   The Wolf 120 grain MPT bullet performed well in water and was accurate in my 6.5 Grendels and if I needed my Wolf ammo I'd use it for HD.


http://www.65grendel.com/forum/showthread.php?10791-Red-Neck-6.5-Grendel-Bullet-Test-Part-1

Faxon 20" group buy on 65grendel right now

123gr AMAX form Hornady if you are buying factory ammo.

It has good expansion and penetration.

120gr Nosler Ballistic Tip is good for expansion too, but costly.

I hand-load the AMAX a lot in batches.

The 123gr has good barrier defeat characteristics too, like on masonry blocks.

How would the hornady 123 sst work?

It's hard to tell the difference in gel between the two, honestly.

AMAX seems to expand at lower speeds.  SST has a cannelure and a lock in the jacket into the base of the lead core.

In tissue, these differences don't seem to be that pronounced.

123gr SST


123gr AMAX

I thank you for the help. You are the reason I am building my Grendel. Sounds like the Amax  may be little better from my 14.5"

Self-defense doesn't require a special bullet. Nobody shot with a high power rifle is going to critique the loads performance.

Hunting is a different story, but that's not what you asked about. I don't shoot steel cased ammo because the bi-metal bullets cut barrel life in half. Some justify that cost because the ammo allows them to shoot that much more. If the Wolf ammo performs reliably, is reasonably accurate and you're willing to live with premature barrel wear than I would buy it cheap and stack it deep.

My all purpose 6.5 Grendel load is 26.0 grains of VihtaVuori N530 under Sierra's 107 grain Match King. OAL is set at 2.250" and I use Remington 7.5 primers. Accuracy has been stellar, reliability 100%. It's not intended for deer, I would use an Nosler or Barnes bullet around the same weight for that. I like the higher velocity the lighter bullets allow.

If .264 / 6.5mm was my home defense caliber, I would like to see a 95 gr VMax or 85 gr Sierra HP Varmint. Explosive expansion, with minimal penetration through multiple walls.

Having said that, the only factory 6.5 Grendel round that makes sense to me is the Hornady 123 gr. Amax or SST.




I specify factory, because I would personally never use a hand loaded round for Home/Personal Defense. While some may disagree, (and they're welcome to do so), a common CCW school of thought is that using hand loads is just begging for trouble.  Reliability issues aside, you could be exposing yourself to a whole different level of legal concerns. In the event of a defensive shooting (even if perfectly justified and immaculately performed), any half-baked attorney could easily paint a picture for a jury. He would describe you sitting at your reloading press, fantasizing about the body count each time you pull the lever.  In today's schizophrenic gun culture there is no telling what a jury pool might look like, and I say that the fewer troublesome facts involved, the better.

The SST would be more of a "barrier blind" load than the A-max, with it's bonded core.  If use in/around vehicles and other common types of cover is a possibility, this may be a plus.  However, for home defense, many people prefer a load with minimal barrier penetration, hence the popularity of 5.56 for that role.  You can go with a varmint bullet to minimize barrier penetration, but then you risk inadequate penetration in a human target.  You want to be able to penetrate through the vitals on any size man from any angle.  I'd say stick with one of the open tip match or hunting bullets.  Any of those should deliver adequate ballistic performance.  Unfortunately there isn't nearly as much scientific data on ballistic performance on Grendel loads as there is for 5.56, so as far as I know there is no 6.5G equivalent of Dr. Gary Roberts' "approved list" of self defense/duty ammo.  With the Grendel you're mostly looking at informal gel tests and people's hunting results... so about the best you can do is to stick to what the community agrees is most effective on medium game of similar size to humans.The 123 A-max and SST are where I would start.

SST isn't bonded.  At close contact speeds, it's hard to tell the difference between the SST and AMAX.

We documented that in the 6.5 Grendel Reloading Handbook Volume II, with multiple samples in calibrated Perma-Gel.  Results are identical to recovered projectiles from animals, aside from the bone fragments embedded in the lead.

A 95gr VMAX load would be good for HD as well. Same with 90gr TNT.  95gr Lehigh Controlled Chaos is another affordable option.

Have a link?

This ^

BS. The exact opposite can be argued.
You need to stop a threat ASAP so they can't shoot back, keep stabbing/robbing etc not let them bleed out in 20 minutes. Plow a deer through the heart and you've got a blood trail to track, no dance bullet needed.

See how that argument can be flipped?

buy in now

I have shot critters at close range and those big fast moving bullets tend to pass right through them if you don't hit a bone you just have a pissed off critter.
If you have someone on drugs that needs stopping you need a devastating bullet that that is destroying meat and incapacitating them now not just bleeding out 20 minutes from now.
SD should be the best you can buy.

A 6.5 Grendel has four times the energy of a +P .40 S&W or +P .45acp round fired at point blank range. Anyone who thinks the bullet design is going to effect whether it will work effectively and immediately underestimates the power being used in the extreme. High power rifles are in a different league. Shot placement is a requirement, but the impact energy is devastating.

^ Primarily when the energy is efficiently transferred to the mass. I've seen prairie dogs scurry down their hole to die when shot with the wrong bullet - in this case a Nosler Custom Comp. The bullet went right through without so much as a how do you do. Same rifle with similar charge weight pushing the Amax or VMax? Utter devastation.

tag

It is not necessarily the amount of energy produced but the amount transferred to the target, ( i.e. assailant) that counts. For this situation the best choice would be a bullet in the varmint or fragmenting style designed to immediately expand on small bodied animals, thus transferring the most energy upon impact. If the bullet doesn't expand and develop enough surface area after contact with the soft tissue "mushroom effect"  to over come the velocity then it will pass through with minimal energy transfer and very little damage to the target. The comparison mentioned of the handgun bullets is not a good one, as these bullets are designed to expand rapidly at relatively low velocities allowing the transfer of energy to happen quickly before completely penetrating the assailant. Rifle bullets intended for hunting larger game are designed to remain intact at much higher velocities for deep penetration.(unless they are intended for extremely small bodied animals such as varmints, as mentioned before). While shot placement is in fact critical, bullet design plays a huge role in the "stopping power ".  Quick expansion upon impact transferring the most energy while producing a large wound channel and limiting over penetration to protect the innocents.The same ideology needs to applied any defensive application whether it be rifle, shotgun or handgun.