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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 9/3/2003 3:01:50 PM EDT
is $300 a good price for an ML2? I believe it is the unit that does not have NV compatibility. i dont think i'll ever need NV, but perhaps i should pay the extra bucks for it?

opinions?
Link Posted: 9/3/2003 4:48:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/3/2003 4:49:37 PM EDT by Kihn]
Yes it is good. They are not supposed to sell below a set price, something about that distributor/reseller agreement much like ARMS maintains with their suppliers IIRC. New from a retailer? Refurb? I'd grab it while the grabbing is good if it is a new one. You are correct, the L series are without NV settings.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 6:43:10 AM EDT
I believe that a dealer can sell below a certain price, they just can't advertize below a certain price due to MAP policy. If Aimpoint forced dealers to not sell below a certain price, that would be price fixing and would be illegal (I sell optics, not rifle scopes, just binos and spotting scopes for a living, so I know how it works). Anyway, from my limited experience at looking at Aimpoint prices I believe that $300 for the ML2 is very good. Usually I see around $330-350. I wouldn't worry about it not having the NV compatibility. If for some reason you find that you actually needed NV then I'm sure that you could easily sell that ML2 and get the NV version...besides, if you could afford NV then I think you could afford the hit yoou take on selling the Aimpoint used right? ;)
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 12:21:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Kihn: Yes it is good. They are not supposed to sell below a set price, something about that distributor/reseller agreement much like ARMS maintains with their suppliers IIRC. New from a retailer? Refurb? I'd grab it while the grabbing is good if it is a new one. You are correct, the L series are without NV settings.
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Although the distributor may set a minimum sale price this is highly illegal. Allthough it goes on, this is called price-fixing and is an anti-trust violation. If they are giving advertising money to said distributor to ensure even further that they don't sell below a minimum price or threaten to not do business with them anymore....again anti-trust.... big time illegal. Problem is this business although I love it is filled with people who like many businesses don't know the laws. You cannot tell someone what to see their goods for, this is not China.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 1:29:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By patriot73:
Originally Posted By Kihn: Yes it is good. They are not supposed to sell below a set price, something about that distributor/reseller agreement much like ARMS maintains with their suppliers IIRC. New from a retailer? Refurb? I'd grab it while the grabbing is good if it is a new one. You are correct, the L series are without NV settings.
View Quote
Although the distributor may set a minimum sale price this is highly illegal. Allthough it goes on, this is called price-fixing and is an anti-trust violation. If they are giving advertising money to said distributor to ensure even further that they don't sell below a minimum price or threaten to not do business with them anymore....again anti-trust.... big time illegal. Problem is this business although I love it is filled with people who like many businesses don't know the laws. You cannot tell someone what to see their goods for, this is not China.
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Yes, you are absolutely right. Unfortunately, companies do have ways around the laws to enforce MAP. For instance, company A may say that item X has MAP of $400. If retailer B advertizes it for less than $400 then mysteriously company A may all of a sudden be out of stock on item X and not be able to ship it to them. When retailer B sets their advertized price back to $400 then mysteriously again company A all of a sudden gets more item X's in stock. My company has dealt with these kinds of tactics before. Personally, I don't think that MAP is necessarily a bad thing though. The problem comes from companies that don't enforce their MAP policy on every retailer that they sell to. I've also had this problem in my business. If I sell at MAP then there are any number of other "shady" dealers and not so "shady" dealers breaking MAP and taking away sales from me. If I drop below MAP then all of a sudden I mysteriously stop getting shipments of product, but somehow other dealers don't seem to have this problem. The big companies are selective about who they enforce MAP with and who they don't. I can't go into all of the reasons why, but there are reasons why they do this and it is to their advantage. If MAP were enforced across the board what it protects against is this basic scenario: Big name dealer A moves a lot more product than small time mom&pop dealer B. Since dealer A moves so much more product they have more capital and can order in much larger quantities, therefore getting a discount. Then because dealer A moves product much quicker they can pay their bills faster and get a further discount. Taking these discounts into account, that dealer B doesn't get, they can sell at a lower price and still make enough money to cover their costs. So, dealer B is forced to sell at a higher price than dealer A in order to make enough money. What happens then is that people go into their local mom&pop store to look at a product, take up time from that store's staff and then turn around and walk out the door an order it cheaper on line. With a strict MAP policy this helps the small time shops make some money too. Now, before anyone goes saying that this isn't fair and basically makes every dealer on an equal playing field, I'll tell you that it doesn't and it actually makes things better for the consumer. Namely, this makes customer service and convenience the deciding factor on where a customer will buy. This forces the many "shady" dealers out there that screw their customers on a regualr basis out of business and leaves only good businesses around, and customer service is what my optics company is all about! :) Well, hopfully all my A's, B's, and X's weren't too hard to follow! ;)
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 1:56:50 PM EDT
I paid $295 for my ML2 from one of the on-board dealers, but that was many months ago. I believe they have increased in price since then. Anyways, I wanted to voice my opinion on this whole price-fixing thing that seems to be rampant right now. Many moons ago I use to be in the computer business - back when hardware cost a lot of money. Anyways, it was quite common to be threatened by manufacturers on a routine basis about selling their products below a certain price level. IBM was one of the BIGGEST culprits! I know we're talking about apples and oranges here, but it's the same situation. If a manufacturer decides to determine an outlandish MSRP for their product, and then discount it heavily to their dealers, well, they get what they deserve. From what I've seen with certain companies, like ARMS, the discount isn't that deep, and it forces most dealers to be within a few dollars of each other. On the other hand, products like Leupold and Trijicon scopes can vary as much as $250 from dealer to dealer - for the same item! To me, that's obsurd. Remember people, this is America, land of the free - UNLESS YOU'RE A RESELLER!!!
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 2:36:53 PM EDT
To be technical, enforcing standard pricing is called "resale price maintenance" and is a per se violation of antitrust laws.
Link Posted: 9/4/2003 3:03:08 PM EDT
If you had $20k and ordered directly from the factory , you could undersell most dealers too. Welcome to CAPITALISM [:D]
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