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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 4/27/2003 7:06:20 AM EDT
My first AR15, a Bushmaster, has a trigger that feel like pulling a log out from under a brushpile, so I've decided that I need an aftermarket trigger.

This rifle is mainly used for plinking, and sometimes rapid fire, so I figure that a single stage is best for me. (correct ?)

From what I can tell, I have three choices, Accuracy speaks, JP and Jard. (Any others that I have forgotten ?)

It seems to me that the Accuracy Speaks is the simplest (no set screws right ?), the JP I believe has one set screw (overtravel ?) and the Jard looks something like a Swiss watch with all of its adjustments.

While the engineer in me loves the flexibility of the Jard, I am concerned about consistency and reliability with all of those screws.

The Accuracy Speaks from what I hear needs some filing and fitting since it basically has no adjustments/ (but probably the most reliable)

I've just about settled on the JP, but I don't see it mentioned much on here.

Does anyone have any opinions out there that can help send me in the right direction ??

Thanks guys,

Ed


Link Posted: 4/27/2003 7:33:27 AM EDT
The JP trigger is very nice and it's easy to tune. Pretty sure mine had a [i]pair[/i] of set screws. I don't trust set screws on weapons, so I removed and sold the JP trigger. I replaced it with an ArmaLite 2-stage trigger. This was a literal drop-in. My main rifle, though, has had the the Accuracy Speaks single stage trigger for at least 5 years. Yes, you do have to fit it, but it's worth the effort. The ArmaLite is my second choice but I recommend it highly. I bought it to compare to the Accuracy Speaks and it's a keeper too. Neither has given me a bit of trouble. Neither has any set screws. -- Chuck
Link Posted: 4/27/2003 8:11:39 AM EDT
If the main use of your Bushy is going to be defensive or other 'serious' business just keep your factory trigger. They don't fail, and that's what counts! If, however, you're shooting paper, steel, varmints, or just want a good trigger feel any of those that you mentioned will do you well. If you're not experienced in custom fitting trigger systems my advice is to go for the adjustable type that you can set yourself and leave the honing, polishing, and fitting to a pro. I replaced the Colt "Match" trigger (yuk!) that came with my Colt Accurized Elite about two years ago with a JP. Its main use is varminting. I've never had a lick of trouble with it. Adjusting screws never gave me a bit of trouble! Here's how - after installing strictly according to JP's detailed instruction sheet and adjusting to a 3 lb. letoff, I worked the trigger about three hundred cycles using a Fulton dry firing device. I then put about fifty rounds through it at the bench, took it home and lubed it with Neco Moly Slide. It does make a difference!! Then I rechecked my adjustment screws - they both needed a little tweaking - and set them with Loctite 290. This is the capillary action type that is made exactly for this purpose. The screws won't come loose, but you still can readjust when and if it's needed. I'm a happy camper!! The Jp is just fine.
Link Posted: 4/27/2003 8:30:45 AM EDT
Ya left out a few chouces. 1) Jewell. Maybe the standard which others are measured against. Expensive but very reliable and adjustable. 2) Rock River Arms 2 stage. Reasonable price and drop in installation. If you want a varmint rifle with hair trigger, go for the Jewell or other "name" trigger that adjusts toi very light levels. For a "good" trigger get a RRA and drop it in yourself. I think they can be had for around $95 sometimes.
Link Posted: 4/27/2003 10:01:32 AM EDT
I have the AS, JP and the rock river and for the money and what you want the Rock River is the best choice the JP is to light for normal use, I have mine on an ar-10 set up for a counter sniper role . I liked the RR so much I just bought another one and its drop in and no screws
Link Posted: 4/27/2003 1:52:17 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Chuck: The JP trigger is very nice and it's easy to tune. Pretty sure mine had a [i]pair[/i] of set screws. I don't trust set screws on weapons, so I removed and sold the JP trigger. I replaced it with an ArmaLite 2-stage trigger. This was a literal drop-in. My main rifle, though, has had the the Accuracy Speaks single stage trigger for at least 5 years. Yes, you do have to fit it, but it's worth the effort. The ArmaLite is my second choice but I recommend it highly. I bought it to compare to the Accuracy Speaks and it's a keeper too. Neither has given me a bit of trouble. Neither has any set screws. -- Chuck
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I absolutely agree with Chuck, the Accuracy Speak trigger is the best single stage trigger on the market. no screw, no settings to go wrong. I have two in my rifles. As far as precision shooting trigger, Knights armament trigger is the best of the two stage trigger. it is expensive, but it has then best feel of any trigger or modified trigger on the market.
Link Posted: 4/27/2003 7:53:39 PM EDT
I guess everything's a tradeoff. I didn't even consider the Knight because of the high cost; from the remaining candidates, I went with the JP and love it -- wouldn't have anything else. (Of course, it helps that it's on an M16 and the JP is 100% compatible with the FA fire-control system; many of the other choices are semi-only). I adjusted it for zero overtravel and it is CRISP!!! Like the proverbial glass rod breaking. I'm running a three-pound trigger spring with a 4.5-pound hammer spring (for hard military primers) and it's a great combo. IMHO, having a choice of three weights for each spring gives you a lot more flexibility.
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 7:01:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By SMGLee: As far as precision shooting trigger, Knights armament trigger is the best of the two stage trigger. it is expensive, but it has then best feel of any trigger or modified trigger on the market.
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Not that I'm trying to hijack this thread, but why is it that various people believe a two stage trigger is not appropriate for a combat worthy rifle?
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 7:58:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Muad_Dib: Not that I'm trying to hijack this thread, but why is it that various people believe a two stage trigger is not appropriate for a combat worthy rifle?
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Two stage is just fine for combat, I just don't like the set screws thathas to be loc tie into the trigger group. it is just one more possibility to go wrong on a comabt gun. actually the stock group is what I prefer in a combat any way.
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 1:14:02 PM EDT
Regarding two stage vs single stage, I'm under the impression that other than being more complex, two stage trigers have a longer pull. This is no problem for target shooting, but can be a problem with rapid fire shooting. Am I wrong on this ??
Link Posted: 4/28/2003 2:13:00 PM EDT
you are correct! the difference is minor, but enough for some people.
Link Posted: 4/29/2003 2:24:17 PM EDT
I asked a question in the past which was essentially the same type of question for my bushy M4A3. What I chose to do was to keep things simple and improve the stock trigger by just upgrading springs (JP) which made a dramatic improvement and was exactly what I was looking for. No screws or anything else to go wrong when it counts. Spend about $10.00 and it was better than spending $100-200. Got my springs from Brownells with good service. Easy to install. Just my experience. Night and day difference from the stock trigger feel.
Link Posted: 4/29/2003 6:58:37 PM EDT
Is there an issue with aftermarket triggers such as the Accuracy Speaks not igniting military primers? What is the hammer spring weight on it and what is recommended to be reliable with military ammo? What are the weights on the JP hammer spring?
Link Posted: 4/29/2003 7:54:53 PM EDT
Never had a problem with the AS trigger, I have heard problem with JT trigger but never witness any problem.
Link Posted: 4/29/2003 8:10:21 PM EDT
JP makes three weights of springs (both hammer and trigger springs): Lightest, for match use, is 3-3.5 pounds; tactical is 4 pounds; and DCM is 4.5 pounds (to meet competition rules). You can mix them, though -- I run a 3-3.5-pound trigger spring with a 4.5-pound hammer spring, to work better on hard military primers.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 6:43:11 AM EDT
Anyone know what the milspec hammer spring wt. is? It would be helpful to know the baseline before messing with aftermarket stuff. TIA
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 7:29:15 AM EDT
Don't know about the hammer, but I think the factory trigger spring on mine was about 25 lbs. [:)]
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 9:14:10 AM EDT
The Accuracy Speaks trigger uses standard GI springs. Never had a failure to fire. Same for the ArmaLite. -- Chuck
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 11:25:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2003 11:28:02 AM EDT by Mike_L]
I never had a problem with the JP on any .223 ammo I tried, even with the yellow springs. It had about a 2.5lb pull, which was nice on the bench, but may be a little light for general plinking. It didn't work with the Ciener kit though, so I put the stock hammer spring in. Trigger pull went up to about 4.5lb when I did that. I wish I'd measured the stock one before I replaced it. I had a 'smith install my JP, but I've read the instructions and I think I could do it myself. If the Accuracy Speaks comes with instructions as good as the JP I don't think you'd have any trouble. I've heard very good things about the RRA 2-stage, but it'll probably be a little slower for rapid-fire due to the longer pull. I might have to get one to try it out on the bench/target gun. Since you're just plinking, you might want to try the [url=http://www.sargenthome.com/15_Minute_AR_Trigger_Job.htm]15 Minute Practical Trigger Job for the AR-15[/url]. You've got nothing to lose, since you were going to replace those parts anyway, and it could save you $100-200.
Link Posted: 4/30/2003 7:59:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/30/2003 8:00:09 PM EDT by rlp2600]
FWIW, I just removed the yellow JP springs from my carbine and re-installed the stock springs. Had two ignition failures out of approx. 150 rds. of XM193. My other AR has an Accuracy Speaks trigger; over 1000 rds. of mainly XM193 through it with no problems. Regards, Randy
Link Posted: 5/10/2003 4:16:39 PM EDT
I have the JP triggers on two AR's and the Accuracy Speaks trigger on an SR-25. There are sound arguments in favor of both. While the AS does require some filing to fit, the JP requires a fair amount of noodling with to get the adjustments right. While I do respect the argument that for social as opposed to athletic contest application, less complexity is better; the fact of the matter is that I have shot the holy, living !@#$%^&* out of my JP-equipped guns with nary a problem nor re-adjustment required. With either supplier you get people who absolutely stand behind their product. I have had technical discussions with both manufacturers and they both will bend over backwards to help you out. Good luck.
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