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Posted: 7/20/2010 5:05:17 PM EST
Just wondering about how much you can reduce the flash and what not for night firing, any ideas?

Thanks!
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:11:45 PM EST
Here's a comparison at night of a few: Comparison.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:19:19 PM EST
AAC blackout or Smith Vortex
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:20:03 PM EST
I tried out 3-4 different ones on my night time pig hunting rig and ended up with the smith vortex. Doesn't obstruct or blind my vision when using a scope.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:22:59 PM EST
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:35:16 PM EST
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:44:19 PM EST
Awesome, thanks peoples.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 5:58:01 PM EST
Originally Posted By rychencop:
AAC blackout or Smith Vortex


+1

A can is the best way to go if that suits your purposes.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 6:00:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2010 6:09:07 PM EST by ironsauce]

Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.

I've been considering a set of tritium site replacements for my AR and I am curious as to why you feel this way? I should also add you are not the first to have noted these sentiments but I have never actually heard a reason. I do not have an optic on this particular gun and only have irons.

I understand you would normally be shooting shorter distances with a handgun and may be able to resolve your target better in low light, however, the only situation I would have my AR out at night would be a self defense situation where I would be most likely shooting within 50 YDS which is pretty much handgun range. I don't think I would be shooting for MOA groups at 200 YDS, just trying to put lead in center mass. Anything better than staring off into the pitch black distance should help, right? At least I would know where my barrel was pointed.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 6:34:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2010 6:34:44 PM EST by LazyJoe]
Originally Posted By ironsauce:
I've been considering a set of tritium site replacements for my AR and I am curious as to why you feel this way? I should also add you are not the first to have noted these sentiments but I have never actually heard a reason. I do not have an optic on this particular gun and only have irons.

I understand you would normally be shooting shorter distances with a handgun and may be able to resolve your target better in low light, however, the only situation I would have my AR out at night would be a self defense situation where I would be most likely shooting within 50 YDS which is pretty much handgun range. I don't think I would be shooting for MOA groups at 200 YDS, just trying to put lead in center mass. Anything better than staring off into the pitch black distance should help, right? At least I would know where my barrel was pointed.


My dad has them on one of his AR's. The front works well, but the rear dots are way to small and way to close to your eye to be usable.
They appear to be small fuzzy dots when your aiming down the sights. I would say buy the front tritium sight, but dont waste your money on the rear.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 6:56:43 PM EST
The standard A2 works pritty well to

Smith Vortex & Black Out work even better.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 6:59:18 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2010 7:08:48 PM EST by TacRedline]
Originally Posted By bobweaver:
I tried out 3-4 different ones on my night time pig hunting rig and ended up with the smith vortex. Doesn't obstruct or blind my vision when using a scope.


Found the Smith Vortex for $40.99 from midwayusa.com with 20% off coupon code 171510, coupon only good until July 31st

https://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=711620

Item Total:$50.99
Discounts:- $10.00
Postage, Handling & Insurance:$4.27

Grand Total:$45.26
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 7:04:13 PM EST
Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.


You don't like the green fuzzies?

Link Posted: 7/20/2010 7:43:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By ironsauce:

Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.

I've been considering a set of tritium site replacements for my AR and I am curious as to why you feel this way? I should also add you are not the first to have noted these sentiments but I have never actually heard a reason. I do not have an optic on this particular gun and only have irons.

I understand you would normally be shooting shorter distances with a handgun and may be able to resolve your target better in low light, however, the only situation I would have my AR out at night would be a self defense situation where I would be most likely shooting within 50 YDS which is pretty much handgun range. I don't think I would be shooting for MOA groups at 200 YDS, just trying to put lead in center mass. Anything better than staring off into the pitch black distance should help, right? At least I would know where my barrel was pointed.


the rear sights are so close to your eye that they are very fuzzy. not anything like a handgun. the front sight works ok along with the standard rear sight, but unless you have a light to illuminate your target it really serves no purpose either. just my opinion though, but our dept. got a few sets to try and no one liked them. $$ could be well spent on other items.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 7:52:19 PM EST
Originally Posted By Molon:
Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.


You don't like the green fuzzies?



no sir!
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 8:30:52 PM EST
Might also consider picking your ammo that has a low flash signature. Longer barrels will also burn the powder better/efficently (hence short barrels have a larger flash signature)


CD
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 8:58:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2010 10:20:10 PM EST by CJan_NH]
I'd also add a white light to the list of must haves for a low-light defensive carbine. If it's too dark to see your sights without tritium then it's also too dark for proper target identification.

As far as flash hiders go, I've had great luck with the Smith Vortex, and I run several of them on my training and defensive ARs

ETA: Years ago I purchased a set of tritium sights for one of my ARs. I agree that the rears were far too close to my eye to be of any benefit. I ended up ditching the sights, installed a white light, and then took a low-light carbine class to figure out what the hell I was doing

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 9:39:47 PM EST
I do lots of night hog hunting with ARs. I use an aimpoint, and a tlr-1 for light.

One setup has a standard type A2 hider, it does ok. The best I have is the smith vortex. I t keeps the flash out of the optics when I unload on a herd of hogs. The next problem is a small amount of smoke from each cartridge x maybe a dozen rounds fired = a bunch of smoke and the light just illuminates it and blocks follow up shots on the last few hogs running away.

I switched to Black Hills' 55 grn SP and all has been well.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 10:52:41 PM EST

Originally Posted By AJSully421:
I do lots of night hog hunting with ARs. I use an aimpoint, and a tlr-1 for light.

One setup has a standard type A2 hider, it does ok. The best I have is the smith vortex. I t keeps the flash out of the optics when I unload on a herd of hogs. The next problem is a small amount of smoke from each cartridge x maybe a dozen rounds fired = a bunch of smoke and the light just illuminates it and blocks follow up shots on the last few hogs running away.

I switched to Black Hills' 55 grn SP and all has been well.

When it's cold out, the cloud from firing gets even worse, as the temp differences produces condensation.

The best solution for shooting in the dark is to have a suppressor, haha.
Link Posted: 7/20/2010 11:30:42 PM EST
Originally Posted By BadassWeakling:
The best solution for shooting in the dark is to have a suppressor, haha.
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Plus night vision.
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 5:15:19 AM EST

As said before....the rear tritium insert is almost uselesss, but I liked having the front insert. I prefer my aimpoint over either tho!

I would recommend an AAC Blackout that's a mount for either an M4-2000 if you want a really great can, or an M4-1000 that's a great can with a good pricepoint. Shooting coyotes at night I prefer my M4-2000 on as short a barrel as I can (14.5, but soon to be 12.5)....at night I'm not shooting for distance afterall and most shots are within 75 yards.
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 7:27:06 AM EST

Originally Posted By TacRedline:
Just wondering about how much you can reduce the flash and what not for night firing, any ideas?

Thanks!




Um, besides a suppressor?
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 10:17:36 AM EST
Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By SIG-shooter:
Id use a Vortex, IIRC it flat the best when it comes to reducing flash at night(or was a few years back)

Id also add tritium sights to the AR, you can buy a set of replacements for the rear aperature and front sight post


rear Tritium sights are all but useless on an AR. just say'n.


I have to disagree with you on that.I use my front and rear Trijicon Night Sights on my AR.Actually I have 2 AR's set up this way and they work great on both guns.The night sights seem to work good for me. I can hit what I can see at night. I also have night vision goggles and an IR laser sight too. I pretty much own the night in my neighborhood

Link Posted: 7/21/2010 10:34:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/21/2010 10:51:29 AM EST by papasasquatch]
I've never had tritium sights on my ARs until recently and it's outstanding. I'm out in the boonies and I'm always checking our acreage with my AR which has a 700 lumen light which let's me see around 200 yards to ID things. I keep a green laser zeroed at 100 yards, and my microdot at 25/300. The laser and red dot give me a good range finding platform so I can be more accurate out at night. I have always had a standard A2 muzzle device and using the ammo I use (BVAC or HuntingShack rmfr'd), it was pretty bright and there was no reliable hope for decent follow up shots adjusting from that flash. Now I have a 14.5" carbine with a pinned YHM Phantom 5c2 ($20) and the problem is solved. Granted, the phantom is not as good as that AAC Blackout, and nearly as good as the smith vortex, it's fine for my use...not that I have a choice, it's pinned/welded. :)

Anyway, the tritiums is why I replied. Without my light or laser, the rear fuzzies and solid front sights are perfect. With clear skies full of stars and no moon, after several minutes of adjustment, I could roam anywhere on my property and feel confident to hit something with those tritiums..and likely be more accurate because I can line up the rear and front. I don't know why anyone would want only a front and presumably rely on their cheek placement for good alignment. The rear tritiums being fuzzy is actually better than being sharp with all green tips...otherwise, I'd do a yellow out front and green rear or vice versa. I have a rear magplu MBUS and putting my trijicon rear sight on it was perfect.. and switching between the big and little aperatures works..of coruse there's no tritium in the small one, which is fine.

Sorry no pic of the sights at night.


This is a great demo also showing non-supressed, then A2 birdcaged, then Phantom 5C2 from brownells, includes slo-mo and FA firing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7s3YZ5H8B8

Also, for the OP, this comparison is much better than the one above as it deals with 16" barrels and the FHs mentioned, the AAC blackout and the Smith Vortex both in naked eye and then with night vision.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM5ih_c_4yo

And a lesser quality, but thorough representation of the YHM Phantom 5C2, which in my humble opinion supresses more flash for the buck, and looks the coolest of them all (and probably is a better strike surface than others).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SoR6Etbl1XY&feature=fvw
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 2:33:46 PM EST
You can't remove a "pinned/welded" flash hider? My Bushmaster 14.5" flash hider is pinned/welded I think.
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 4:17:13 PM EST

Originally Posted By TacRedline:
You can't remove a "pinned/welded" flash hider? My Bushmaster 14.5" flash hider is pinned/welded I think.

That's the point of it being pinned.
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 6:07:50 PM EST
Originally Posted By Waveform:

Originally Posted By TacRedline:
You can't remove a "pinned/welded" flash hider? My Bushmaster 14.5" flash hider is pinned/welded I think.

That's the point of it being pinned.


well dam, guess ill go buy that DPMS upper ive been looking at
Link Posted: 7/21/2010 6:14:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2010 11:07:00 AM EST by shadowcop]
I've got a set of Trijicons on my K.I.S.S. rifle. But after having them, I really don't see much use. In a battle field where anyone in front the line would be the enemy, maybe. But in this life, a light is much more useful. I can light up/blind who ever is in front of me and distinguish if they are a threat. The light will also allow use of my sights.
I use a TLR on 2 of my rifles. A G2 on one and a 200 lumen light on another.
A can is definetly the best flash kill but a Blackout does a great job also.
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 6:06:59 AM EST
Originally Posted By TacRedline:
Originally Posted By Waveform:

Originally Posted By TacRedline:
You can't remove a "pinned/welded" flash hider? My Bushmaster 14.5" flash hider is pinned/welded I think.

That's the point of it being pinned.


well dam, guess ill go buy that DPMS upper ive been looking at


It doesn't mean it CAN'T be removed, it means it can't be removed EASILY, you may have to drill out a welded pin or chop/thread/recrown the barrel....but nothing is absolutely final.
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 7:26:13 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/22/2010 7:27:38 AM EST by 1LSWON]
Hands down a suppressor, with NV! I personally like AimPoint's with my NV, and a 3X mag on my NV. ACR w/PVS-14 and AimPoint CompM3

Link Posted: 7/22/2010 7:31:18 AM EST
blackout
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 7:33:13 AM EST
TA31 ACOG
ATS-100 or PEQ-2
PVS-14
Vortex, Blackout, or FSC 556

Outstanding night fighting rifle right there.
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 8:14:31 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 10:29:14 AM EST
Originally Posted By rychencop:
AAC blackout or Smith Vortex


Those, and a suppressor are the best bets. If you can't do a suppressor, I would suggest Smith Vortex. I have them on all my duty/practice rifles...
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 11:30:05 AM EST
How effective are suppressors? Obviously not the right subforum, but since we're on the subject...
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 11:46:15 AM EST
Originally Posted By Burnsy87:
How effective are suppressors? Obviously not the right subforum, but since we're on the subject...

they are teh best flashsupressor out there

Link Posted: 7/22/2010 3:30:09 PM EST
Originally Posted By aggiez28:
Originally Posted By Burnsy87:
How effective are suppressors? Obviously not the right subforum, but since we're on the subject...

they are teh best flashsupressor out there



The sound reduction part is nice as well.........don't expect hollywood quiet, the bullet is still supersonic, i'd say its more like a HV .22 being shot 25-100 yards away depending on surrounding landmarks/buildings.

Love my M4-2000 and wouldn't trade it for anything.
Link Posted: 7/22/2010 4:52:26 PM EST
AAC blackout or Smith Vortex...

Or a Suppressor.

Link Posted: 7/22/2010 5:08:53 PM EST
Every time I ask ANYTHING about suppressors, everyone points me to the M4-2000. How much does it run you after the $200 to the Banners of All Thing Fun and Exciting?
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