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Posted: 6/7/2023 8:16:07 PM EST
anyone have a review yet?
fnh
Link Posted: 6/7/2023 11:09:18 PM EST
[#1]
Link Posted: 6/7/2023 11:11:42 PM EST
[#2]
This doesn't appear to have a cannelure. Asking people that know, does that matter?
Link Posted: 6/7/2023 11:25:29 PM EST
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This doesn't appear to have a cannelure. Asking people that know, does that matter?
View Quote


https://www.ar15.com/forums/Armory/Sierra-77gr-SMK-cannalure-vs-Non-cannalure/42-541000/

consensus by people that know more than me is no cannelure would be the way to go.
Link Posted: 6/8/2023 9:05:36 PM EST
[#4]
I got a bunch of AAC ammo in today and took measurements of the 77 TMK:
Nominal COAL = 2.230”
Nominal CBTO (Hornady comparator) = 1.795”

I found that TMK COAL to be very surprising (much shorter than I assumed it would be).
Their 77 SMK load was 2.240” (same as FGGM).

ZA
Link Posted: 6/9/2023 4:03:32 PM EST
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


https://www.ar15.com/forums/Armory/Sierra-77gr-SMK-cannalure-vs-Non-cannalure/42-541000/

consensus by people that know more than me is no cannelure would be the way to go.
View Quote


Thanks for posting
Link Posted: 6/10/2023 5:23:58 AM EST
[#6]
Mine arrived yesterday. First two boxes I opened had dinged cases. One had the projectile bent at the case neck. Kinda disappointed. Tried to get best pics as possible with ipotato. Have 25 more boxes to go through.

Attachment Attached File

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Link Posted: 6/10/2023 12:12:13 PM EST
[#7]
I just ordered 500, guess we’ll see. I’ve got some Stand Armory TMK from earlier this year and some bullets if I get motivated I can do a comparison
Link Posted: 6/10/2023 12:48:11 PM EST
[#8]
Link Posted: 6/10/2023 1:17:43 PM EST
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Mine arrived yesterday. First two boxes I opened had dinged cases. One had the projectile bent at the case neck. Kinda disappointed. Tried to get best pics as possible with ipotato. Have 25 more boxes to go through.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2144_jpeg-2846165.JPG
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2141_jpeg-2846166.JPG

View Quote

@Jman_JJE
Link Posted: 6/10/2023 3:57:11 PM EST
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Could all you guys post lot #'s as well.

Thank You
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Mine arrived yesterday. First two boxes I opened had dinged cases. One had the projectile bent at the case neck. Kinda disappointed. Tried to get best pics as possible with ipotato. Have 25 more boxes to go through.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2144_jpeg-2846165.JPG
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2141_jpeg-2846166.JPG



Could all you guys post lot #'s as well.

Thank You

So demanding.

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Thought it did perform well though. I suck at shooting and the Douglas is way more accurate than I am. Patiently waiting for Molons review.
Link Posted: 6/10/2023 4:02:16 PM EST
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

So demanding.

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2158_jpeg-2846729.JPG

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/236052/IMG_2152_jpeg-2846731.JPG

Thought it did perform well though. I suck at shooting and the Douglas is way more accurate than I am. Patiently waiting for Molons review.
View Quote


That is actually 50 yards?

Those “dings” don’t look outside the acceptable range to me.

I added a single box of the 77TMK to my most recent PSA order. I’ll be curious to see if the greater (but not hugely greater) accuracy potential of the projectile will make much difference compared to SMK or PSA 77 in AAC ammo that is more of a “field match” than a FGMM competitor.

Link Posted: 6/10/2023 4:11:07 PM EST
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


That is actually 50 yards?

Those "dings" don't look outside the acceptable range to me.
View Quote
What I ranged it at. Didn't shoot the ones that I posted although I'm sure they would be fine, except the bent one.
Link Posted: 6/11/2023 4:23:05 PM EST
[#13]
This likely reflects my poor shooting ability than the accuracy of the ammo. I’ll be regrouping this soon to confirm. Setup is tikka lite 223 in a CTR stock with a SWFA fixed 6x.

Pics in order shot: sig 77gr otm control group, first 10 rounds of AAC 77gr TMK, 30 round composite group, and my setup.
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Link Posted: 6/12/2023 10:15:48 AM EST
[#14]
Link Posted: 6/12/2023 2:49:56 PM EST
[#15]
The TMK is a very lethal bullet above 1800fps. I didn't chrono these loads out of my 11.5, but if it was even above 2400fps that gives you quite a bit of range. My 11.5 is really what I would like to use this load out of, but my initial outing didn't look so promising.

This thread shows success using the 77gr TMK on bear, deer, elk, and moose.
Link Posted: 6/12/2023 3:21:23 PM EST
[#16]
Link Posted: 6/12/2023 3:56:41 PM EST
[#17]
I agree. Would be nice for them to to send some to Bryan Litz to get some accurate BCs on them
Link Posted: 6/12/2023 9:26:42 PM EST
[#18]
Link Posted: 6/13/2023 1:05:36 PM EST
[#19]
I had a chance to chrono the AAC 77gr TMK and directly compare it to some 2018 manufactured Black Hills 77gr TMK. I didn't have a chance to focus on shooting tight groups, but the ACC had most rounds touching at 50 meters. Black Hills wasn't quite as tight, but that could've been on me.

Here's a few pictures of the AAC next to the Black Hills for comparison.








Chronograph: MagnetoSpeed V3

Temperature: 75.9°F

Barrel: Centurion Arms 12.5" Lightweight Hammer Forged (Carbine). Surefire SF3P flash hider w/ Surefire Mini 2 Suppressor.


AAC chronograph results:

1.   2488
2.   2491
3.   2484
4.   2469
5.   2512
6.   2483
7.   2466
8.   2505
9.   2499
10. 2496

Average: 2489

Standard Deviation: 14.6

Lot Number: SCL1CF051


Black Hills chronograph results:

1.   2575
2.   2626
3.   2566
4.   2565
5.   2575
6.   2557
7.   2567
8.   2563
9.   2589
10. 2606

Average: 2578

Standard Deviation: 21.9

Obviously the AAC is a little slower, which was to be expected I think, but the SD some what surprised me. This is just a sample size of one, of course.





Link Posted: 6/13/2023 6:54:58 PM EST
[#20]
Link Posted: 6/17/2023 1:19:19 PM EST
[#21]
What's everybody's feelings about this round from AAC? It seems like there's a lot of mixed results between damaged casings, skewed velocities, etc. Would you buy these to defend your family?
Link Posted: 6/17/2023 7:23:31 PM EST
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
What's everybody's feelings about this round from AAC? It seems like there's a lot of mixed results between damaged casings, skewed velocities, etc. Would you buy these to defend your family?
View Quote


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 1:17:54 AM EST
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I had a chance to chrono the AAC 77gr TMK and directly compare it to some 2018 manufactured Black Hills 77gr TMK. I didn't have a chance to focus on shooting tight groups, but the ACC had most rounds touching at 50 meters. Black Hills wasn't quite as tight, but that could've been on me.

Here's a few pictures of the AAC next to the Black Hills for comparison.

https://i.imgur.com/yI8vt6Z.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jaAZDbw.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/155ursu.jpg


Chronograph: MagnetoSpeed V3

Temperature: 75.9 F

Barrel: Centurion Arms 12.5" Lightweight Hammer Forged (Carbine). Surefire SF3P flash hider w/ Surefire Mini 2 Suppressor.


AAC chronograph results:

1.   2488
2.   2491
3.   2484
4.   2469
5.   2512
6.   2483
7.   2466
8.   2505
9.   2499
10. 2496

Average: 2489

Standard Deviation: 14.6

Lot Number: SCL1CF051


Black Hills chronograph results:

1.   2575
2.   2626
3.   2566
4.   2565
5.   2575
6.   2557
7.   2567
8.   2563
9.   2589
10. 2606

Average: 2578

Standard Deviation: 21.9

Obviously the AAC is a little slower, which was to be expected I think, but the SD some what surprised me. This is just a sample size of one, of course.





View Quote
My shooting today concurs- AAC and Black Hill offerings are similar,
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 10:11:46 AM EST
[#24]
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 7:12:54 PM EST
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI
View Quote


What would a bonded soft point do to a bad guy that the TMK will not in your home?
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 8:00:56 PM EST
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
What's everybody's feelings about this round from AAC? It seems like there's a lot of mixed results between damaged casings, skewed velocities, etc. Would you buy these to defend your family?


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI

This is about the furthest from the truth you can be. The TMK is an excellent performer and will exhibit larger wounds than a bonded soft point and especially a mono. Federal and black hills both load this as a duty load. Corbon did as well.
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 8:06:39 PM EST
[#27]
Just wanted to provide an update on my poor shooting and the AAC TMK loads from earlier in this thread. Decided to shoot it off of bags today and that seemed to tighten things up. I’d say it’s worth buying.
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Link Posted: 6/18/2023 10:32:42 PM EST
[#28]
Link Posted: 6/19/2023 8:48:37 AM EST
[#29]
I’m going to order some of the TMK’s to try out. I believe the precision of these rounds should be better than what we’re seeing thus far from the reports. The SMK/OTM rounds were sub moa, so I would think these would be as well.

Maybe I’ll get some gel and test the SMK, OTM, TMK, Sabre all in one go.
Link Posted: 6/19/2023 9:35:19 AM EST
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
What's everybody's feelings about this round from AAC? It seems like there's a lot of mixed results between damaged casings, skewed velocities, etc. Would you buy these to defend your family?


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI


The TMK is very good terminally if barrier performance isn’t a major concern.  I’m normally a bonded or copper solid guy, but the TMK is one of the few that fall outside of those categories that I’d recommend in a first line defensive ammo choice.

Main concern for duty ammo is does it go bang without taking my gun out of the fight?  Have we heard any complaints about dud rounds or ammo blowing up guns with AAC?  Those would be my two primary concerns.  Comparatively slower velocities (so long as it’s still well within the performance envelope of the projectile) and so-so accuracy performance at 200y aren’t a huge consideration for me when I’m clearing man size targets at 10yds.
Link Posted: 6/19/2023 9:56:59 AM EST
[#31]
where does this idea that TMK doesn't work against common barriers in home defense situation come from?

Best 5.56 Ammo Part 3 - Black Hills 77gr TMK

Link Posted: 6/19/2023 1:55:41 PM EST
[#32]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I’m going to order some of the TMK’s to try out. I believe the precision of these rounds should be better than what we’re seeing thus far from the reports. The SMK/OTM rounds were sub moa, so I would think these would be as well.

Maybe I’ll get some gel and test the SMK, OTM, TMK, Sabre all in one go.
View Quote

This is the main reason I was posting my results in comparison to other available ammo options. It really shows I'm not a good group shooter across the board. Mind you, I shoot these fairly fast with no cooling time during the group, which means around shot #15 mirage starts to set in.  I believe a better shooter can get much better accuracy out of these loads.
Link Posted: 7/19/2023 5:16:31 PM EST
[#33]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Defend your family? No
Thats what a bonded soft point is for.

It may be a reliable accurate round for practice/target and have a similar POI to duty/HD loads.... IMO

Until they release their bonded and solid copper loads I dont think anyone should be considering these loads for self defense.

Splurge the extra $5/box on an actual duty load, and practice with a load that has similar POI
View Quote


Bad take. If you don't care about barrier blindness, this is THE BEST POSSIBLE  home defense bullet in the .223/5.56 caliber. Does far more tissue damage than any bonded or monolithic .224 bullet out there, and has an established track record of taking down game larger than deer. Acting like it's just some target bullet is ridiculous. Even though it's not barrier blind, it can still penetrate household barriers decently well, as mcantu stated. It also expands down to the 1500-1600fps range.

Far superior terminal ballistics compared to the "actual duty loads" you're referring to, unless you're shooting through autoglass all day.

Link Posted: 7/27/2023 5:35:14 PM EST
[#34]
Any updates or more testing from anyone?
Receiving mine today and plan to test velocities from 11.5 and 18" barrels and accuracy to 50 yds, and possible 100.
Link Posted: 7/28/2023 6:16:03 AM EST
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


https://www.ar15.com/forums/Armory/Sierra-77gr-SMK-cannalure-vs-Non-cannalure/42-541000/

consensus by people that know more than me is no cannelure would be the way to go.
View Quote



That is a discussion of the SMK. It has nothing to do with a TMK.

The cannelure on a TMK is not really used IMO it is a fake one for looks only as found on Black Hills. The slots are just seating depth indicators and there is no lock into the brass on my examples of BH 77 TMK. Though the pics above of BH 77 TMK show some light crimping, mine don't appear to have any significant crimp to prevent set back. It is just there because of an end user requirement/request. Best accuracy is accomplished with relatively light neck tension anyway. The TMK bullet is not sealed and crimped like M193/M855 at the neck in anyone's TMK loading I have seen and you would not want it to be if you care about precision.

Not only is cannelure not really needed on the TMK, it should have ZERO impact on terminal performance since the TMK is a front opening projectile vs a yaw fragmentation projectile.

I think the short OAL of 2.23X as loaded by AAC is the bigger issue. Every Black Hills lot I got in each successive year got shorter and less accurate by a tiny bit. The TMK shape puts the ogive futher from the lands. This AAC was less accurate than Black Hills, only hitting 1.25 to 1.5 MOA in barrels that shot 77 TMK Black Hills and handloaded 2.245 to 2.255 OAL TMKs .65 to 1.1 MOA. Then again, this was 100 degrees weather for the AAC and the Black Hills was 10-15 F cooler temps, so perhaps not a fair comparison.

I would like to see the AAC load stretched to 2.450 or greater OAL and add 0.1 or .0.2 grains of powder. But this is wishful dreaming.
Link Posted: 7/28/2023 6:21:47 AM EST
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I had a chance to chrono the AAC 77gr TMK and directly compare it to some 2018 manufactured Black Hills 77gr TMK. I didn't have a chance to focus on shooting tight groups, but the ACC had most rounds touching at 50 meters. Black Hills wasn't quite as tight, but that could've been on me.

Here's a few pictures of the AAC next to the Black Hills for comparison.

https://i.imgur.com/yI8vt6Z.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/jaAZDbw.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/155ursu.jpg


Chronograph: MagnetoSpeed V3

Temperature: 75.9°F

Barrel: Centurion Arms 12.5" Lightweight Hammer Forged (Carbine). Surefire SF3P flash hider w/ Surefire Mini 2 Suppressor.


AAC chronograph results:

1.   2488
2.   2491
3.   2484
4.   2469
5.   2512
6.   2483
7.   2466
8.   2505
9.   2499
10. 2496

Average: 2489

Standard Deviation: 14.6

Lot Number: SCL1CF051


Black Hills chronograph results:

1.   2575
2.   2626
3.   2566
4.   2565
5.   2575
6.   2557
7.   2567
8.   2563
9.   2589
10. 2606

Average: 2578

Standard Deviation: 21.9

Obviously the AAC is a little slower, which was to be expected I think, but the SD some what surprised me. This is just a sample size of one, of course.





View Quote


So that is around 35y less terminal performance distance I would guess? Something like 325 vs 360 yards or so? Just guessing off the top of my head, not run any math on it.

[UPDATE] Ok... just ran some math and it is about 350 vs 310 yards to drop under 1900 fps to the poor performance zone. The TMK drops off in performance dramatically under 1900 fps. Claiming it is optimal all the way down to 1800 fps is not a realistic expectation IMO.
Link Posted: 7/28/2023 10:05:19 AM EST
[#37]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Any updates or more testing from anyone?
Receiving mine today and plan to test velocities from 11.5 and 18" barrels and accuracy to 50 yds, and possible 100.
View Quote

I've got some left to test but finding agreeable weather has been difficult. A source on Rokslide is saying 1.5 MOA, which is acceptable to me if we're talking 10-20rnd groups.
Link Posted: 7/28/2023 12:50:24 PM EST
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I've got some left to test but finding agreeable weather has been difficult. A source on Rokslide is saying 1.5 MOA, which is acceptable to me if we're talking 10-20rnd groups.
View Quote
Yeah, I shot some at 50 yds yesterday and got a little over 2MOA groups.
I think I could do better though.
Link Posted: 7/28/2023 4:08:32 PM EST
[#39]
Keep it mind that this stuff is like $0.85 a round.  (gud enuff)

I put it in the same ballpark as the AAC 110gr V-max (which is a little slow).

Great bullet, marginal loading, good price, AND actually being available = unbelievable value.  I'm sold
Link Posted: 7/30/2023 9:12:41 PM EST
[#40]
Shot the AAC ammo today in my 20” CLE Bartlein and my 16” WOA.

The TMK loading was decent.

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 7/30/2023 9:55:56 PM EST
[#41]
Tried both 77tmk and 75gr Sabre earlier today.

The Sabre didn’t group as well in my barrel, but it may be like the 75gr Hornady’s. They don’t shoot great in my barrels, but if they do in yours, you should probably give them a shot. They seem to have a similar shape, so that’s what I’m basing my assumption on.

The TMK’s shot well, but not as tight as a previous range trip. May have had an off day or need to give the barrel a good cleaning.




Previous testing of the TMK’s
0.9 moa 10 shot group, 2729fps. I think my magnetospeed loosening up caused the last two rds to go high left, but that’s just speculation. I have observed that in the past.
Link Posted: 8/1/2023 7:00:39 AM EST
[#42]
So I just measured 10 random rounds from lot SCL1CF021 for OAL.

The OAL ranged from a high of 2.241" to low of 2.227" OAL. A spread of 0.014"

3 of the rounds were 2.24X" OAL

6 off the rounds were 2.23X" OAL

1 of the rounds was 2.227" OAL

The 2.23X lengths were not clustered.

I would guess they are trying to hit 2.235" OAL plus or minus 5 or 6 or 7 thou. This is too short IMO.

I measured 10 random rounds of Black Hills 77 TMK from lot 1209252698 for OAL

I measured a low of 2.245" and a high of 2.250" a spread of 0.005"

4 of the rounds were 2.249"

2 of the rounds were 2.247"

It looks like they were trying to hit 2.248" plus or minus 2 or 3 thou.

This, to me, is the biggest difference, aside from the 75-100 fps lower velocity. This is also probably why it is less accurate than Black Hills 77 TMK.


EDIT: I also think culling bullets from the AAC 77 TMK that might have suffered set back during shipping that measure an OAL of 2.230" or less may eliminate flyers. I intend to test this theory next time I shoot. There were only 2 out of 20 that were  2.230" or under in the box I measured.

Link Posted: 8/1/2023 9:15:53 AM EST
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
So I just measured 10 random rounds from lot SCL1CF021 for OAL.

The OAL ranged from a high of 2.241" to low of 2.227" OAL. A spread of 0.014"

3 of the rounds were 2.24X" OAL

6 off the rounds were 2.23X" OAL

1 of the rounds was 2.227" OAL

The 2.23X lengths were not clustered.

I would guess they are trying to hit 2.235" OAL plus or minus 5 or 6 or 7 thou. This is too short IMO.

I measured 10 random rounds of Black Hills 77 TMK from lot 1209252698 for OAL

I measured a low of 2.245" and a high of 2.250" a spread of 0.005"

4 of the rounds were 2.249"

2 of the rounds were 2.247"

It looks like they were trying to hit 2.248" plus or minus 2 or 3 thou.

This, to me, is the biggest difference, aside from the 75-100 fps lower velocity. This is also provably why it is less accurate than Black Hills 77 TMK.

View Quote

5.56x45mm, 77gr OTM, MK262 Mod 1-C, Black Hills Ammunition


On this video, the BH Mk262 Mod 1-C OAL is 2.2465.

Edit: sorry OTM OAL not TMK.
Link Posted: 8/21/2023 3:55:19 AM EST
[#44]
Got numbers for this one yesterday. 81 degrees, 21 feet from the muzzle. No meaningful accuracy testing, we were on the 50 yd line. The rifles were both Colts, 6920 & A4.

16"
High 2697
Low 2634
Avg 2656
SD 24

20"
High 2849
Low 2758
Avg 2798
SD 37
Link Posted: 8/21/2023 6:04:38 AM EST
[#45]
IIRC, there was a long thread about this round which involved a tour of the factory in order to determine the reasons behind the dinged cases. Hopefully, they got it all sorted. 77 Gr is the best performing ammo in SBR/Pistol AR configs. Ballistic tests are extremely impressive.

IMI also makes a similar round, nicknamed the 'Hebrew Hammer', and searching it using those terms will yield some impressive results in ballistic gel from an SBR configuration. There's also at least one video floating around of the AAC in ballistic gel demonstrating terminal performance.

All in all, probably a good round for the money. The condition of the cases has hopefully, improved, or, at least, the source of the issue identified.
Link Posted: 8/23/2023 6:19:12 PM EST
[#46]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
This doesn't appear to have a cannelure. Asking people that know, does that matter?
View Quote

Link Posted: 8/24/2023 2:06:30 PM EST
[#47]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

View Quote


IMO, no it does not matter for civilian self defense or law enforcement use.

If you get your ammo delivered by parachute on pallets pushed out the back of a C130, your requirements might be different.

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