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Posted: 1/20/2008 6:25:43 AM EST
I know some of this is in several different posts but i cant seem to connect them in any semblance of order. So here we go again. Please bear with me.

There are 5 different 9mm Magazine conversion blocks in Brownells. They all seem to use UZI mags of one sort or another

Hahn Top load
Hahn Bottom load
Hahn dedicated
VM HYTECH
Rock River conversion kit.

Top to bottom, how would you rate these?
Based on reliability, rigidity, features, durability.

Which ones allow for mag release using the stock mag release.
do any of themn have bolt lock feature?
which one is best with UZI milsurp mags.

I can mill mags if neccesary, thats not an issue.


They all are in Brownells. Brownells doesnt usally sell junk.
Is this the way to go or should i just buy a Rock River  and be done with it. Can the RR use milsurp UZI mags, unmodified or modified.

Does the dedicated block get permanently installed, drilled and pinned?
I take it that most of these use some sort of set screw interference fir mechanism to hold in place?

Can anyonepost a photo of a Colt Mag and an UZI milsurp mag to illustarte why the colt holds the bolt open and the UZI doesnt?

I see DSA has good deal on UZI mags. I am leaning otwards whatever will work with these maghs. Mag realse like std M4 ismore important than bolt lock but both would be nice.
My main purpose is to have an AR Platform to train with that allows for cheaper than 556 pricies for ammo and as close to M4 functioning /controls etc as I can get.

Who makes a good BUIS , not too expensive that will be good for 9mm. I am not worried about calibration, this is a 100 yard gun anyway.  Just want something for back up for Trijicon Reflex !!.

For you guys who have suffered too man y of these questions bear with me. I am very familiar with the M4/AR platform, just no experience at all with the 9mm AR and there is no one where i live that I know of that has one.

Any recommendations on a buiild would be appreciated.



cmmg
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:38:38 AM EST
[#1]
1 - Rock River conversion kit
2 - Hahn Bottom load or dedicated

I am using the Rock River block and C product mags on my build.
I can still use modified UZI mags but, bolt hold open will only work
on the Colt and C product mags, they have a channel on the back
of the mag and follower to push up the bolt stop,
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:42:50 AM EST
[#2]
Doesn't Kurt from Kurts Kustom Firearms still make one? That would be #6! I used the mag block he made, and it worked very well. (9mm Oly style system)
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:57:17 AM EST
[#3]
SNS makes (made?) magblocks for Sten mags, in versions for oly and for colt.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:58:03 AM EST
[#4]
The only problem with modified Uzi mags is, if you still want to use them in your Uzi they are going to hang on the slot for the AR mag catch, making it neseccary to push the mag release button twice.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 7:45:46 AM EST
[#5]
doesn't garrison make one too?
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 7:47:31 AM EST
[#6]
Maybe the reason I haven't yet gotten a pistol caliber AR is because there are so many different and incompatible systems.  


Personally,  I want an AR in .45 ACP.  


CJ
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 8:05:12 AM EST
[#7]

Quoted:

Personally,  I want an AR in .45 ACP.  


CJ


Contact site member TANGOCHASER, he is the .45 ACP AR expert.


As far as 9mm mag blocks are concerned, the Hahn dedicated is the best of them all. Use Colt mags or CP-mags and leave the Uzi mags for the Uzi's. There is zero reason to use an Uzi mag now that CP has released their mag.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 8:11:15 AM EST
[#8]
Living in NY its a big reason to use UZI mags since they are available as MILSURP that is pre ban.
Yes, I wish I could use the current commercial but thats not an option.

so its a toss up between UZI or STEN mags.  And it is apparent that the UZI mags get the nod.

Doesnt the Han allow use of modified UZI mags?
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 9:42:32 AM EST
[#9]

Quoted:
Living in NY its a big reason to use UZI mags since they are available as MILSURP that is pre ban.
Yes, I wish I could use the current commercial but thats not an option. I understand.

so its a toss up between UZI or STEN mags.  And it is apparent that the UZI mags get the nod. If I were in your situation, I would use the Uzi mags.

Doesnt the Hahn allow use of modified UZI mags? Yes, but you will have no bolt hole open feature.


Sorry, I didn't realize you lived in a ban state.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 9:44:17 AM EST
[#10]

Quoted:
Maybe the reason I haven't yet gotten a pistol caliber AR is because there are so many different and incompatible systems.  


For the uppers, there's only two off-the-shelf systems.  The olympic system and (the system just about everybody else uses) the colt system.  Colt system upper parts are interchangeable.  Hahn and SNS make magblocks for using Sten mags with olympic uppers.  Hahn, SNS, and a bunch of others make magblocks for use with colt style uppers.

OK, the various magblocks does make it a little confusing.



Personally,  I want an AR in .45 ACP.  


Olympic makes a .45acp upper with a blowback bolt.

Teppo Jutsu has been experimenting with direct impingement gas system uppers in .45acp.

There has been mention of KKF working on a gas piston upper in .45acp.


And to throw a little more diversity into the mix, I'm waiting on a barrel for the direct impingement gas system 9mm upper I'm putting together.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 10:33:05 AM EST
[#11]

Quoted:
Maybe the reason I haven't yet gotten a pistol caliber AR is because there are so many different and incompatible systems.  
Bah, poppycock. Get a Colt mag block, Colt mags and you'll be good to go.

Everyone always forgets about Colt mags blocks. They're not hard to get, you just have to know where to find them (hint: site sponsor J&T Distribution).
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 11:21:17 AM EST
[#12]
I checked the JT site, cant seem to find the Colt Mag block. How much different is it than the RR or the others?
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 1:44:15 PM EST
[#13]

Quoted:
I checked the JT site, cant seem to find the Colt Mag block. How much different is it than the RR or the others?
You have to use the search function on their site to find it.

Colt 9mm Mag block

It's a 1 piece block bottom loading block (IIRC) that can be held in place but either pins in the receiver or via a hex tension screw. The Hahn 1 pc bottom loading is modeled off the Colt (thought the Colt is $50 less...go figure). I had mine semi-permanently installed via a hex screw in the front of the mag well. M60 Joe did the work.

I use Colt 20 and 32 rnd mags and it runs like a top. Using Colt mags (or something similar) you get BHO.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 3:52:36 PM EST
[#14]
height=8
Quoted:
SNS makes (made?) magblocks for Sten mags, in versions for oly and for colt.


They still do. The SNS block works with Oly, RRA & Colt systems. Great guys there and excellent service.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 3:57:45 PM EST
[#15]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Personally,  I want an AR in .45 ACP.  


CJ


Contact site member TANGOCHASER, he is the .45 ACP AR expert.


As far as 9mm mag blocks are concerned, the Hahn dedicated is the best of them all. Use Colt mags or CP-mags and leave the Uzi mags for the Uzi's. There is zero reason to use an Uzi mag now that CP has released their mag.



+1 I agree 100%. Second best would be the Colt/RRA mag block.

ETA: If your in a ban state use the mag blocks above with preban Colt mags or Modified UZI mags.
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:19:51 PM EST
[#16]
what is website for SNS
Link Posted: 1/20/2008 6:25:42 PM EST
[#17]

Quoted:
what is website for SNS


here ya go

www.snsindustriesinc.com/index.htm
Link Posted: 1/21/2008 2:14:42 AM EST
[#18]

Quoted:

Quoted:
SNS makes (made?) magblocks for Sten mags, in versions for oly and for colt.


They still do. The SNS block works with Oly, RRA & Colt systems. Great guys there and excellent service.


Unless they've changed it, they make it in two versions.  One is for the Oly uppers only.  The other has a slot for a RRA 9mm ejector (about $8 from RRA) and can be used with any of the 9mm blowback uppers - leave the ejector off for Oly uppers, or install the ejector for use with colt style uppers (Colt, RRA, Garrison, etc.).

The only complaint I had, was that they were a little slow to fill my two orders.  I don't know if they were temporarily out of stock, swamped with orders and running behind, or what, but they were very apologetic about the delay and made an effort to see that I was satisfied with my order (I was).


ETA: a few things about the Sten mags.

Sten mags can be a bit of a pain to load.  They can be loaded to around half capacity by hand, but require a Sten mag loader (there are two or three versions floating around) to fully load.

The SNS block positions the Sten mag so that it uses the AR's standard mag catch.  A slot has to be cut in the mag for the mag catch.  Do not cut the slot too deep.  Cutting too deep (I made the mistake of using a drill bit to drill out the front of the slot and kept drilling till I broke completely through) damages the internal rib that guides the double stack of rounds into a single stack at the top of the mag.  If that internal rib is cut, the mag may not feed if loaded with more than about five rounds (the rounds hang up on the damaged rib).
Link Posted: 1/21/2008 9:25:06 AM EST
[#19]
Where is the cheapest place to get uzi mags?
Link Posted: 1/21/2008 10:59:50 AM EST
[#20]

Quoted:
Where is the cheapest place to get uzi mags?


the EE.


Link Posted: 1/21/2008 5:33:30 PM EST
[#21]
height=8
Quoted:
height=8
Quoted:
height=8
Quoted:
SNS makes (made?) magblocks for Sten mags, in versions for oly and for colt.


They still do. The SNS block works with Oly, RRA & Colt systems. Great guys there and excellent service.


Unless they've changed it, they make it in two versions.  



ETA: a few things about the Sten mags.

Sten mags can be a bit of a pain to load.  They can be loaded to around half capacity by hand, but require a Sten mag loader (there are two or three versions floating around) to fully load.


You're right they do make two versions.

The Sten mags are more than a pain to load by hand and a loader is needed to fully load, they're cheap though. So are the mags, 10 32rd mags for about $43 shipped is fantastic.
Link Posted: 1/22/2008 1:35:34 AM EST
[#22]

Quoted:
10 32rd mags for about $43 shipped is fantastic.


In the last couple of years, I've seen them as low as $3 each (plus shipping) for the ones with some of the finish missing.
Link Posted: 1/22/2008 7:57:02 AM EST
[#23]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Quoted:

Quoted:
SNS makes (made?) magblocks for Sten mags, in versions for oly and for colt.


They still do. The SNS block works with Oly, RRA & Colt systems. Great guys there and excellent service.


Unless they've changed it, they make it in two versions.  



ETA: a few things about the Sten mags.

Sten mags can be a bit of a pain to load.  They can be loaded to around half capacity by hand, but require a Sten mag loader (there are two or three versions floating around) to fully load.


You're right they do make two versions.

The Sten mags are more than a pain to load by hand and a loader is needed to fully load, they're cheap though. So are the mags, 10 32rd mags for about $43 shipped is fantastic.


Where at for that price?
Link Posted: 1/22/2008 6:46:39 PM EST
[#24]
height=8

Where at for that price?


http://www.ohioordnanceworks.com/parts/magazines.html
Link Posted: 1/23/2008 12:13:46 AM EST
[#25]

Quoted:
Where is the cheapest place to get uzi mags?

www.coledistributing.com/MM054.ASP?cat=Magazines&i=&pageno=31&start=11
Link Posted: 1/23/2008 4:54:12 AM EST
[#26]
Ok maybe this is a high-jack, if so I do not mean it that way.  As far as the blocks go why do most people go with the bottom loading?  Reason I ask, I have a no name block that came with the gun I purchased that's top loading.  Since I'm changing uppers it seems easier to me to drop the block in instead of inserting from the bottom?  Am I missing something?  BTW the block has no markings anywhere hence the "no-name"
Link Posted: 1/23/2008 8:18:35 AM EST
[#27]

Quoted:
As far as the blocks go why do most people go with the bottom loading?
Since I semi-permanently installed mine, it didn't matter whether it was top or bottom loading. Besides that, I wanted a Colt mag block and that's the only version Colt offers.
Link Posted: 1/23/2008 10:35:53 AM EST
[#28]

Quoted:
Ok maybe this is a high-jack, if so I do not mean it that way.  As far as the blocks go why do most people go with the bottom loading?
Quick install, quick to remove when going from 9mm to 223/556.  Drop it out, shove a mag full of 223/556 in its' place and set a 223/556 upper and run. Problem with bottom loader is there is no constant reference point for the block to install, so you need to work a little more to verify you have it at right height. This is wjy a few people have the block set in the magwell, then use a capscrew through the lower into the block, so now it has a reference point to go back to.

Reason I ask, I have a no name block that came with the gun I purchased that's top loading.  Since I'm changing uppers it seems easier to me to drop the block in instead of inserting from the bottom?  Am I missing something?  
Depends, there is (2) style of top load, 1st drops into lower to fill the magwell and position the mag,,, and 2nd drops into lower and requires removal of bolt catch to allow block install/ operate bolt hold, so better to dedicate the lower for 9mm in this case. Takes too long to switch from 223/556 to 9mm.

BTW the block has no markings anywhere hence the "no-name"
Really does not matter, all are based off the COLT system as far as approx position of the ejector, and filling the magwell so the smaller 9mm mag is held in the correct position.

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