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Posted: 4/5/2006 7:46:14 AM EDT
I have been wanting to buy an AR since i got back from iraq a few months ago. I cant decide to go with the classic A2 or to go with the carbine length. I was wondering if anyone knew how much accuracy i would be giving up with the shorter barrel. It seems like everyone is moving in the direction of the shorter carbines unless they are building heavy barreled varminters (not interested).

really wanna start shooting so i'd love some info.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 7:57:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 7:58:17 AM EDT by JHaines]
This should help you decide:

Ammo Oracle
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 8:25:26 AM EDT
You will not lose any any accuracy by going with shorter barrel. Go with the carbine length as they are more versitile
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 8:27:00 AM EDT
You don't lose accuracy by going with a shorter barrel, you lose muzzle velocity (which can translate to slightly less fragmentation range of military ammo, as well as greater bullet drop at long range).

Personally, I see little use for barrels longer than 18 inches, unless there is a particular problem that the slightly greater velocity addresses.


A lot of people like the "midlength" systems with 16" barrels. Definitely check those out when you are making your decision.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 9:12:32 AM EDT
Buy them both.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 9:16:14 AM EDT
Depends on the application.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 9:43:03 AM EDT
............................kind of curious about your arabic writing and your prisoner pic.
That pic was taken from prison/base i was stationed at.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 9:55:40 AM EDT
I'd say it's pretty minimal. Buy both.

I have my M4 carbine now, and plan on the classic A2 plain jane later on down the line :)
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:21:57 AM EDT
+1 Get both.

You could get a 16" mid length gas system first then get the 20" A2 or even the A3/ A4 next time.

The advantages of the mid length with the CAR is smoother action, longer iron sight radius, more handguard room for your hand, VFG, tac light, etc., also a regular bayonet could be used if you wish.

I have only three ARs for now, 16" M4 CAR, mid length carbine and a 20" M16A2 clone.

I'm building my fourth (but not my last one ) starting with a 20" match A3 upper half then it's own dedicated lower half later on.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:43:35 AM EDT
BOTH SHOULD BE BANNED FROM CIVILIAN USE!
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 10:50:39 AM EDT
What's the difference between the carbine gas system and the midlength gas system? Carbine gas system no good?
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:10:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 11:16:20 AM EDT by ALPHAGHOST]

Originally Posted By Drav:
What's the difference between the carbine gas system and the midlength gas system? Carbine gas system no good?



the middy gives another 2in of gas tube (and if you got a standard FSB/front sight, another 2in of sight radius) over the carbine
supposidly the middy also puts less wear on your parts (buffer, BCG, etc) as it functions less 'violently' than the carbine system
imo, the middy also looks better for a 16in bbl

i'd get a 16in middy w/ a govt bbl for a general purpose AR--you get just about all the velocity you need for a 5.56, and the "benefits" of a middy (- the lesser parts availablity); i'm one of those who prefer a 20in just for irons or a varmiter
or get both (or all 3!)

--2 14.5+perm phantoms (carbine); 1 middy 16in+Phantom; 1 20in+A2--i need better pics
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:11:01 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Drav:
What's the difference between the carbine gas system and the midlength gas system? Carbine gas system no good?



The carbine gas system is shorter by about two inches. It’s perfectly fine, but…

The gases are tapped off while they are still under very high pressures. This means the carbine gas system is just a little more violent than a mid length or full length. If you are using a 14.5” barrel then it’s just a sacrifice you have to make. But of you have a 16” barrel then there’s no reason not to use a mid length gas system.

My 16” (carbine gas length) was made before mid length gas systems were commonly available. If I was buying another one I would get a mid gas setup but I’m honestly perfectly happy with it as is.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:15:17 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 11:16:00 AM EDT by I-M-A-WMD]
I use to think the carbines were better.

But now I just have a 1/1 ratio when comparing 16" to 20"...

My current spare lower is waiting the day to be matched up w/ a BFI 16" superlight. So again, the scale will be tipped toward the carbine.

In all honesty, since I can't use em all at once- my 20" Hbars (A2 & A3s) usually sit at home while the little M4/A3s go in hand to the field.

Sly
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:51:45 AM EDT
I would buy the Bushmaster A2 with Goverment 20 barrel!

Then buy a M4 upper to switch out! LMT 14.5 M4 the only way

you dont have to buy both AR`S but it would be nice
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:52:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By demigod:
BOTH SHOULD BE BANNED FROM CIVILIAN USE!





Why are you acting like MARKm?
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 11:56:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/5/2006 11:57:01 AM EDT by Mike_Mills]

Originally Posted By DK-Prof:
You don't lose accuracy by going with a shorter barrel, you lose muzzle velocity (which can translate to slightly less fragmentation range of military ammo, as well as greater bullet drop at long range).

Personally, I see little use for barrels longer than 18 inches, unless there is a particular problem that the slightly greater velocity addresses.


A lot of people like the "midlength" systems with 16" barrels. Definitely check those out when you are making your decision.



I agree except in one aspect - the lower muzzle velocity ALSO translates into more wind deflection and this reduces accuracy at all ranges, especially beyond 100 yards.

If he is going to be shooting at 300 to 600 yards/meters, he will want the longer barrel.

If he wants it for self defense, three gun, etc, the shorter barrel is better (more handy). The 20" is totally fine for self defense but the carbine is better.
Link Posted: 4/5/2006 12:01:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FMJ:

Originally Posted By demigod:
BOTH SHOULD BE BANNED FROM CIVILIAN USE!





Why are you acting like MARKm?



+1 plus
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