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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:02:45 PM EDT
[#1]
You're not the first to have a kaboom with Frontier ammo.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/Witnessed-a-KABOOM-today-Updated-pics-on-page-5/5-2145296/ |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:03:31 PM EDT
[#2]
Didn’t someone else recently just KB with frontier ammo?
Dammit. What he said 
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:07:15 PM EDT
[#3]
Interesting. The swirl patterns on the target are maybe a clue to bad ammo?
I don’t remember ever seeing that. Have you googled that ammo to see if any one else reported a bad batch? -ETA, well there ya go. 
Maybe you can get them to pay for a new rifle. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:07:19 PM EDT
[#4]
Contact Hornady, that Frontier ammo is shaping up to be flat out dangerous.
ETA: SAVE ANY BOXES FROM THE AMMO YOU HAVE |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:09:34 PM EDT
[#5]
Too hot
Hornady should be liable and issue you a check for the rifle and the ammo |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:10:27 PM EDT
[#6]
I bet there's a lot of blown out primers in the fired brass, too. Hornady fucked up a whole batch of Frontier ammo and you should be saving the evidence and giving them a call.
I think they're going to be buying a lot of blown up rifles soon. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:16:59 PM EDT
[#7]
To me that looks like it fires out of battery
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:20:37 PM EDT
[#8]
If it fired out of battery, the bolt would be in the buffer tube.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:22:44 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting. The swirl patterns on the target are maybe a clue to bad ammo? I don’t remember ever seeing that. Have you googled that ammo to see if any one else reported a bad batch? -ETA, well there ya go.
Maybe you can get them to pay for a new rifle. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:23:44 PM EDT
[#10]
Word on the street is that this ammo is running hot as in overpressure
Possibly to much powder Ammo: Hornady Frontier |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:26:37 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To me that looks like it fires out of battery |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:32:28 PM EDT
[#12]
Yeah, apparently that stuff has a rep of kabooming.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:35:15 PM EDT
[#13]
Never seen contrails on target before!
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:41:37 PM EDT
[#14]
Shit. I don't think I will be buying and Frontier ammo for a long time, if at all. I will be sticking with good old AE Nato 193 and 855.
Glad you're OK. Document everything and contact Hornady, they owe you an explanation and a rifle. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:48:29 PM EDT
[#15]
Let us know what Hornady says
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:51:31 PM EDT
[#16]
I've been hearing alot of kabooms happening with this Frontier ammo. Sorry to hear about your rifle.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:55:17 PM EDT
[#17]
Note to self...FU Frontier ammo!
Glad you're ok. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 3:55:37 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The swirl patterns are from lead evaporating from the base of the bullet. Waaay too hot! |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 4:11:48 PM EDT
[#19]
Wow, just peeled back the bottom of your BCG...!! Hornaday is going to be buying you a new rifle, the other kaboom guy a new rifle, and a bunch of people rifles if they don't issue a recall pretty soon.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 4:14:54 PM EDT
[#20]
Well, that sucks.
I have never had a Kaboom but I do always wear safety glasses just in case. Glad the rifle was the only thing that got killed. If that was caused by ammo known to be from a bad batch then they owe you a new rifle and something extra for the trauma and inconvenience. Shipping out ammo that blows up guns borders on terrorism. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 4:50:33 PM EDT
[#21]
Sounds like too much or over powder charged round.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:01:08 PM EDT
[#22]
Do you still have the boxes? They'll have the lot number on them. Could you post it (the lot number) please?
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:04:44 PM EDT
[#23]
Wow another one.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:16:58 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting. The swirl patterns on the target are maybe a clue to bad ammo? I don’t remember ever seeing that. Have you googled that ammo to see if any one else reported a bad batch? -ETA, well there ya go.
Maybe you can get them to pay for a new rifle. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:36:25 PM EDT
[#25]
Glad you are safe OP. I take it that such a kaboom and your are uninjured is a testament to the AR's design and what happens when it blows.
So what is the deal with this Hornady ammo? Can someone post to the other guy who had a kaboom? I like Hornady ammo but guess won't be buying Frontier. Is this supposed to be a high velocity ammo or loaded hot on purpose? |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:41:23 PM EDT
[#26]
OP here, Below is the Lot# info:
https://i.imgur.com/rs8rmIm.jpg I purchased this on 7/8 from SGAMMO. Is it unreasonable to expect Hornady to replace my rifle? |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:45:36 PM EDT
[#27]
Tag for results. Hornady is in trouble.
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:47:56 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OP here, Below is the Lot# info: https://i.imgur.com/rs8rmIm.jpg I purchased this on 7/8 from SGAMMO. Is it unreasonable to expect Hornady to replace my rifle? |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 5:56:09 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Depends i have seen this with pistol bullets at close range. It could be powder. |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 6:14:21 PM EDT
[#30]
Glad you are okay!!
From the Frontier Cartridge box Hornady Manufacturing Co. PO BOX 1848 Grand Island NE 68802 |
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Posted: 9/15/2018 6:24:38 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To me that looks like it fires out of battery 
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Posted: 9/15/2018 6:41:25 PM EDT
[#32]
I'm glad you're ok.
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Posted: 9/16/2018 6:06:25 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Specs: PSA CHF (FN) Premium upper+BCG PSA Complete Lower Ammo: Hornady Frontier 5.56 62gr BTHP Match This upper (was) flawless, 1700 rounds of steel, match, bulk, etc and never an issue, ever. Background: Was firing at 25 Yards, first experience with this ammo, attempting to re-zero. On about the 10th round, pulled trigger and gun nuked. Mag exploded, gas everywhere (including my face, always remember your safety glasses). Blew out the bottom of the bolt. Rounds scorched and flying everywhere. Mag ballooned like a tumor. I don't think it was a squib, I counted my shots and all landed on the target, however on this shot the round hit almost 1 foot left and keyholed. Also, after looking, I found scorch marks on the targets swirling with the rifle pattern, pictures included in the album below, never seen that before? Super hot ammo? After the shock wore off, I attempted to see what happened. I tried to mortar it, couldn't because a piece of the bolt had blown out into the magwell locking it up. Found a punch and a hammer and went to town on the bolt. It looks like the round failed to extract, and blew a hole in the casing on the extractor side, back into the chamber. It cracked the carrier in half. There was no obstruction in the bore upon inspection after removing the bolt and blown case... Needless to say, upper is completely fucked, barrel is fucked, lower is fucked so I'm out a complete rifle. Luckily was able to salvage the optics, handguards, buffer and spring, and grip. What do you guys think happened? I feel like if it had been a squib, it wouldn't have blown out through the barrel? I'm thinking maybe a fucked up powder charge from Hornady? I didn't think and Out of Battery Det was possible with AR's but this is new territory for me? I'd like to find out if I can get the rifle replaced. Anyone had anything like this happen before? Pictures Here |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 6:22:25 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The swirlies on the target are from the jacket rupturing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Interesting. The swirl patterns on the target are maybe a clue to bad ammo? I don’t remember ever seeing that. Have you googled that ammo to see if any one else reported a bad batch? -ETA, well there ya go.
Maybe you can get them to pay for a new rifle. |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 11:43:01 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Interesting. The swirl patterns on the target are maybe a clue to bad ammo? I don’t remember ever seeing that. Have you googled that ammo to see if any one else reported a bad batch? -ETA, well there ya go.
Maybe you can get them to pay for a new rifle. 
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Posted: 9/16/2018 1:54:53 PM EDT
[#36]
i've read that half filled cases can be worse than compressed ones because it cause the flash over thing. not sure how true it is but i've hand loaded plenty of hot rounds and never seen them blow like this unless a fast powder was used.
i had a similar occurrence with the old radway green 855 that was imported 10-15 yrs ago. blew the base out like that and destroyed the bolt. |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 2:16:47 PM EDT
[#37]
Kabooms usually ocurr with factory ammo if you have an obstructed bore.
Your rifle was blowing primers prior to the blow up. Unfortunately you didn't stop shooting. Blown primers are the last stage of excessive pressure prior to grenading a rifle. Pressures are close to 100,000 psi to blow primers clean out. Even 70,000 psi proof loads rarely show ejector marks, let alone blown primers. DO NOT ALLOW ANYONE TO USE THAT AMMO. Contact Hornady and get a return authorization number. If they discover their ammo is defective they will replace it and maybe fix your firearm. Fortunately you still have your eyesight and all of your fingers. Not everyone gets that lucky. |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 2:19:26 PM EDT
[#38]
Save pictures of the lot number and fired brass and forward them to Hornady.
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Posted: 9/16/2018 2:34:18 PM EDT
[#39]
Saw another one of these with frontier on Facebook last week.
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Posted: 9/16/2018 3:54:39 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Saw another one of these with frontier on Facebook last week. |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 6:18:07 PM EDT
[#41]
Quoted:
I don't think it was a squib Hence even if a case lets loose at the case web for even a Nato 62K pressure round, the pressure blows out around the back of the bolt to blow the mag to hell, it take an obstructed bore to cause all the pressure to cause enough over pressure to snap a bolt lug off (short of a sub part bolt that was not heat treated correctly, and the lugs already brittle to start with). Now if the rig had a tight 223 chamber, you're shooting hot Nato ammo through it, then the rest of the spent rounds should be showing the tale of major over pressure to start with. Hence either primers blow out of all the case, or the primers showing signs of major over pressure isntead. Granted that Hornaday will want the rig sent to them to determine if if was an over pressure load problem or obstructed bore problem isntead. In the later with obstructed bore, most of the time you can run your hand down the outside of the barrel at the chamber section to see if it was second bullet in bore obstruction or not to balloon the OD of the barrel, while others, you just need to use a bore scope to spot the bore bulge balloon section right after the chamber was the second bullet was instead. Once Hornady gets the rig and determines the cause of the problem, then post back with the results. |
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Posted: 9/16/2018 9:25:32 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This make me think that maybe you had a failure of the bolt to lock up/ the previous round not to fire, ejected out a live round (case only), leaving the bullet from the last round still in the bore when just the case was ejected out,New round hand cycled in with it bullet and the last round bullets now in front of the round pushed deeper into the bore, to cause an obstructed bore for the KB to happen. Now if the rig had a tight 223 chamber, you're shooting hot Nato ammo through it, then the rest of the spent rounds should be showing the tale of major over pressure to start with. Hence either primers blow out of all the case, or the primers showing signs of major over pressure instead. In the later with obstructed bore, most of the time you can run your hand down the outside of the barrel at the chamber section to see if it was second bullet in bore obstruction or not to balloon the OD of the barrel, while others, you just need to use a bore scope to spot the bore bulge balloon section right after the chamber was the second bullet was instead. Once Hornady gets the rig and determines the cause of the problem, then post back with the results. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I don't think it was a squib Now if the rig had a tight 223 chamber, you're shooting hot Nato ammo through it, then the rest of the spent rounds should be showing the tale of major over pressure to start with. Hence either primers blow out of all the case, or the primers showing signs of major over pressure instead. In the later with obstructed bore, most of the time you can run your hand down the outside of the barrel at the chamber section to see if it was second bullet in bore obstruction or not to balloon the OD of the barrel, while others, you just need to use a bore scope to spot the bore bulge balloon section right after the chamber was the second bullet was instead. Once Hornady gets the rig and determines the cause of the problem, then post back with the results. Also, It's a 5.56 chamber, not .223. Regardless, There is no bulge in by barrel, and no obstruction. I've seen pics of barrels with squibs cut in half, and all the rounds are smashed against each other. Mine is completely clear... The bolt was completely locked forward, I tried mortaring it, and then tried hammering the charging handle (which broke). The only thing that unlocked the lugs was me leveraging the front of the carrier with a punch. |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 12:08:56 AM EDT
[#43]
Have you inspected any of the empty casings from the ammunition you had fired? If so, were there any signs of over pressure, punctured primers, missing primers, creased or deformed cases, etc, that would give any type of indication as to what is going on?
You state that you have shot 1700rds of mixed ammunition through the rifle, but I do not see any information in regards to maintenance. Have you cleaned the rifle, if so then could you explain when and how? Your specs listed above indicate you have a PSA CHF upper, and PSA complete lower, was this something you assembled yourself into a rifle, or did it come direct from PSA as a built rifle? If the upper receiver assembly was purchased separately, did it come from PSA with the bolt carrier assembly installed, or was the bolt carrier assembly purchased separately? Have you inspected and gauged anything on the rifle for things like proper headspace, firing pin protrusion, etc? Have you changed out anything on the rifle like the buffer, action spring (buffer spring), trigger group, hammer spring, etc? CY6 Greg Sullivan "Sully" SLR15 Rifles TheDefensiveEdge.com (763) 712-0123 |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 12:09:42 AM EDT
[#44]
In case these two threads aren't already cross-linked:
https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/Witnessed-a-KABOOM-today-Updated-pics-on-page-5/5-2145296/ |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 8:41:22 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To me that looks like it fires out of battery |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 8:53:47 AM EDT
[#46]
The cause of the kaboom was case failure. This is clearly a locked chamber, bolt closed, and the case failed. It failed in the direction they always fail - a ballooning around the case head where the case is slightly unsupported, and then rupture at the lease supported point - the extractor. The gases vent inside the carrier at much higher psi than it was designed for, and it fails.
The root cause of the case failure is what you need to know. It is either overpressure, or bad brass, or both. Your barrel is a well used NATO chambered FN barrel.... seriously doubt anything is suspect there. The ammo is suspect. This is almost identical results to the other thread on this topic. |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 8:55:35 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Your rifle was blowing primers prior to the blow up. Unfortunately you didn't stop shooting. He didn't. So you are simply assuming this that all the ammo was equally overpressure or poor brass hardness..... or are you quoting the wrong thread? |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 11:50:30 AM EDT
[#48]
I was going off the linked pictures, apparently another shooter having the same problem with this ammo.
My mistake. |
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Posted: 9/17/2018 11:51:59 AM EDT
[#49]
I cant view images on Imgur. Anyone care to post them here?
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Posted: 9/17/2018 5:44:53 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Have you inspected any of the empty casings from the ammunition you had fired? If so, were there any signs of over pressure, punctured primers, missing primers, creased or deformed cases, etc, that would give any type of indication as to what is going on? You state that you have shot 1700rds of mixed ammunition through the rifle, but I do not see any information in regards to maintenance. Have you cleaned the rifle, if so then could you explain when and how? Your specs listed above indicate you have a PSA CHF upper, and PSA complete lower, was this something you assembled yourself into a rifle, or did it come direct from PSA as a built rifle? If the upper receiver assembly was purchased separately, did it come from PSA with the bolt carrier assembly installed, or was the bolt carrier assembly purchased separately? Have you inspected and gauged anything on the rifle for things like proper headspace, firing pin protrusion, etc? Have you changed out anything on the rifle like the buffer, action spring (buffer spring), trigger group, hammer spring, etc? |
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