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Posted: 11/16/2009 7:27:28 AM EDT
Was at WallyWorld last night thumbing through same magazines and in the Nov 30 issue of SGN they did a comparison test of commonly available magazines.  They did a bunch of test but apparently no actual shooting.  Test included fitting into a magazine pouch, dropping on the feedlips, driving a truck over it, jumping on it, tilting the follower with a pencil(not again!)etc.  Results were a little surprising, Lancer seemsd to be the toughest, and the person writing the article seemed surprised how tough aluminum mags were (apparently they aren't brainwashed AR15.com followers).
Link Posted: 11/16/2009 7:36:22 AM EDT
[#1]
Hey, someone already posted this......never mind
Link Posted: 11/16/2009 9:18:56 AM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Was at WallyWorld last night thumbing through same magazines and in the Nov 30 issue of SGN they did a comparison test of commonly available magazines.  They did a bunch of test but apparently no actual shooting.  Test included fitting into a magazine pouch, dropping on the feedlips, driving a truck over it, jumping on it, tilting the follower with a pencil(not again!)etc.  Results were a little surprising, Lancer seemsd to be the toughest, and the person writing the article seemed surprised how tough aluminum mags were (apparently they aren't brainwashed AR15.com followers).


Fail.....if you had read the article, mags were tested with live fire throughout testing.

Link Posted: 11/17/2009 3:37:25 PM EDT
[#3]
You say that like you wrote the article.. O ya, you did...
Link Posted: 11/17/2009 5:00:03 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
You say that like you wrote the article.. O ya, you did...


He actually wrote it??  COOL.


Link Posted: 11/17/2009 5:21:59 PM EDT
[#5]




'Ol KurtVF got himself plinked by the Gunwriter...






Excellent article






Link Posted: 11/17/2009 5:37:17 PM EDT
[#6]
It was so void of typical AR15.com blather (other than the part about tilting followers with pencils or whatever) I would have never guessed it.  No I didn't read the whole thing, I was there to buy some milk.
Link Posted: 11/17/2009 7:14:22 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
It was so void of typical AR15.com blather (other than the part about tilting followers with pencils or whatever) I would have never guessed it.  No I didn't read the whole thing, I was there to buy some milk.


You would have never guessed what? That industry professionals might be members of the hive too?
Link Posted: 11/18/2009 6:13:07 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
It was so void of typical AR15.com blather (other than the part about tilting followers with pencils or whatever) I would have never guessed it.  No I didn't read the whole thing, I was there to buy some milk.


You would have never guessed what? That industry professionals might be members of the hive too?



Thats it  You should post here more often.  Currently the inmates (and dealers and manufacturers) are running the asylum.
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 10:41:15 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
Quoted:
It was so void of typical AR15.com blather (other than the part about tilting followers with pencils or whatever) I would have never guessed it.  No I didn't read the whole thing, I was there to buy some milk.


You would have never guessed what? That industry professionals might be members of the hive too?


C'mon, you see the stuff that gets posted here day in and day out.

Would you?





Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 12:22:57 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Quoted:
You say that like you wrote the article.. O ya, you did...


He actually wrote it??  COOL.




GUNWRTR is one of the FEW people writing articles today for various magazines that seem to me to actually KNOW what they are talking about. He also seems to have his shit together when you  see him on various TV shows as well. Not to mentioned he did a series of articles from The SandBox! To be honest, when I'm thumbing through SGN, I usually check to see what articles he has in there.

Link Posted: 11/19/2009 12:28:56 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
You say that like you wrote the article.. O ya, you did...


He actually wrote it??  COOL.




GUNWRTR is one of the FEW people writing articles today for various magazines that seem to me to actually KNOW what they are talking about. He also seems to have his shit together when you  see him on various TV shows as well. Not to mentioned he did a series of articles from The SandBox! To be honest, when I'm thumbing through SGN, I usually check to see what articles he has in there.




Pardon my naivete but which writer is he?

Link Posted: 11/19/2009 2:13:06 PM EDT
[#12]
David M. Fortier at your service.
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 2:24:36 PM EDT
[#13]
Mr. Fortier.   I would like to say thank you for your writings I look forward to reading them when they get delivered.   I thought this past review of AR mags was rather informative.  Keep up the good work.
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 3:31:34 PM EDT
[#14]
Quoted:
David M. Fortier at your service.



Mr. Fortier, what a pleasant surprise!!!...I've been reading your articles for years. It is good to know that someone from the industry hangs out here.
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 5:37:35 PM EDT
[#15]
Thanks!

And I believe a lot of industry people hang out here.
Link Posted: 11/19/2009 11:41:28 PM EDT
[#16]



Quoted:


Mr. Fortier.   I would like to say thank you for your writings I look forward to reading them when they get delivered.   I thought this past review of AR mags was rather informative.  Keep up the good work.


I concur.  And your article is the only reason I bought the magazine at my local bookstore.  I wanted to save it for reference.......



 
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 2:13:57 AM EDT
[#17]
No shooting = worthless exercise. I've had mags that looked great and hand cycled great, only to barf when actually fired and vice versa. Hope they had fun
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 6:10:36 AM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
No shooting = worthless exercise. I've had mags that looked great and hand cycled great, only to barf when actually fired and vice versa. Hope they had fun


Did you read the rest of the thread? Fortier, who wrote it, corrected KurtVF's error in stating that there was no shooting.

Link Posted: 11/20/2009 9:33:21 AM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Quoted:
No shooting = worthless exercise. I've had mags that looked great and hand cycled great, only to barf when actually fired and vice versa. Hope they had fun


Did you read the rest of the thread? Fortier, who wrote it, corrected KurtVF's error in stating that there was no shooting.



My bad, gotta stop posting at 5am
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 1:37:04 PM EDT
[#20]
So if there was shooting which magazine was most reliable???
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 3:17:37 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
So if there was shooting which magazine was most reliable???


Dude, maybe you should have just taken the time to read the article........
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 3:48:18 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted:
Quoted:
So if there was shooting which magazine was most reliable???


Dude, maybe you should have just taken the time to read the article........


Because this is a discussion forum.
Link Posted: 11/20/2009 4:16:29 PM EDT
[#23]



That's pretty good...










Link Posted: 11/23/2009 5:07:02 PM EDT
[#24]
I just tested a variety of different AR mags for Shotgun News and the article is currently on the shelves.
Included PMAG, Tango Down, CProducts SS, Brownells, Bravo Company, Lancer, MSAR and Tapco.

Regarding videos of magazines being run over, after testing them myself, I don't think they prove anything, but
they do look cool.

For example, I used an M35A2 cargo truck to run over all the different magazines.


This is a 13,000+ pound 6x6
truck. Magazines were run over loaded on dirt, loaded on cement and unloaded on cement.


ALL the magazines, including the aluminum mags from Brownells and Bravo Company, still functioned.



Much harder was an 8.5 foot drop test. This was done standing in the bed of the Deuce, from shoulder
height, onto cement. Mags were dropped down a chute to ensure they hit on the feed lips.

Left to Right
Tango Down, PMAG, TAPCO



The Tango Down, PMAG and TAPCO all split down the spine.

Here's a close-up of the very rugged feeling Tango Down

The CProducts Stainless steel mag also died on impact with flattened feedlips.

The aluminum mags still functioned and the Lancer and MSAR suffered little or no damage (but both needed to be reloaded to function)
Two aluminum mags and Lancer


Many more tests than these were performed. For the full write-up check out the Shotgun News article.
My thoughts:
PMAGs are very good, but not as indestructible as some think.
Aluminum mags are not as bad as some think.
You should consider checking out Lancer's mag.....they surprised me.
If MSARs mag dropped free they would be an interesting option.
Dropping mags onto cement is A LOT tougher on them then running them over with a SUV....
but all those videos from the various mag companies sure did work wonders for advertising didn't they.....

Link Posted: 11/23/2009 5:24:56 PM EDT
[#25]
Much appreciated!
Link Posted: 11/23/2009 5:33:30 PM EDT
[#26]
no more ordering PMAGs...this curbed my appetite
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 4:13:14 AM EDT
[#27]
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 5:48:50 AM EDT
[#28]
I enjoy Dave's articles so much that I save them for future reference.  He wrote an article on improving his NDM-86 that has inspired me to do the same with mine.  He provides plenty of good information regarding new products, older ones and even surplus rifles.

Thanks Dave!
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 7:06:21 AM EDT
[#29]
Is dropping fully loaded mags, 8 feet, onto concrete, feed lips first, down a chute, something that happens a lot in the real world?
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 7:07:49 AM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
I enjoy Dave's articles so much that I save them for future reference.

+1  It's an honor to have him among us.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 7:48:03 AM EDT
[#31]
Lancer mags for $10 (at recent gun show) are pure, unadulterated win.

<––––––––––- owns Pmags, Fusils, USGI, etc etc etc
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 8:04:27 AM EDT
[#32]
Nice work!  I haven't bought a magazine (as in paper publication) in years due to lack of quality articles.  Glad to see some good work is out there.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 8:40:59 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
David M. Fortier at your service.


Good read, thanks.





Bill
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 9:44:53 AM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
Is dropping fully loaded mags, 8 feet, onto concrete, feed lips first, down a chute, something that happens a lot in the real world?



Probably as likely as having a pickup truck drive over them  I've seen many magazines dropped, never seen one run over.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 10:53:56 AM EDT
[#35]
So,....it would seem that Tapco mags are the equal of Pmags.....

Oh boy, let the wailing and gnashing of teeth begin!
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 10:59:58 AM EDT
[#36]
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 11:07:30 AM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Dropping mags onto cement is A LOT tougher on them then running them over with a SUV....
but all those videos sure did work wonders for advertising didn't they.....



FYI: The truck video test was actually done impromptu to dispel any bias that the PMag was just like any other polymer magazine that preceded it.

We didn't know at the time it would become the standard mag benchmark test.

The PMag reputation was firmly formed in combat theaters over the last 3 years and not from a simple Youtube video.


Let me clarify my comment regarding this, as it was not directed at Magpul.
It was concerning ALL the videos regarding all the different mags that came out making it a mag benchmark test.
Keep in mind if you read the ENTIRE ARTICLE which includes a battery of tests NOT covered here that the PMAG did EXTREMELY
well. THE ONLY ISSUE WAS AT THE 8.5 FOOT DROP TEST. This test exceeds the mil requirement. While the PMAG did split
down the spine and spit some rounds out, it did function when I picked it up, placed it into a rifle and immediately fired the remaining
rounds and the bolt locked back.

This is a very hard test which even the stainless steel CProducts mag failed. Please keep that in mind.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 11:15:50 AM EDT
[#38]
I wish you had included the H&K mag.





Bill
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 12:34:22 PM EDT
[#39]
Why did the little Chevy pickup in the Magpul vid crush the USGI mag but the big cargo truck in this test didn't???

Link Posted: 11/24/2009 12:46:57 PM EDT
[#40]
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 12:50:31 PM EDT
[#41]


My experience is opposite, PMags and TD mags last far longer than aluminum mags in drop testing.



Every USGI mag that I drop test loaded is nonfunctional after 1 drop. CP SS mags die after 2-3 drops. I drop them from chest height - as if I fumbled a reload.



PMags and ARC mags, if you can squeeze the top into the mag well, they will still function. I have video of 5+ drops with ARC mags and they still work 100%.



PMag and ARC bodies can take approx 2x the crush load of any other mag - Lancer included. That was on a hydraulic press, measuring the force.

IM sent on another issue.

Link Posted: 11/24/2009 1:53:18 PM EDT
[#42]
Quoted:
I wish you had included the H&K mag.





Bill


I would have liked to see how they hold up also.  I have (6) Gen1 and (3) Gen 2 HK mags.  To this date the HK Gen 1 is the only mag I have ever experienced a double feed with.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 2:03:30 PM EDT
[#43]
They deform on the first drop.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 2:07:16 PM EDT
[#44]
Quoted:
They deform on the first drop.


They have a nice fit and finish, though.
Link Posted: 11/24/2009 2:33:13 PM EDT
[#45]
Quoted:

Quoted:
Why did the little Chevy pickup in the Magpul vid crush the USGI mag but the big cargo truck in this test didn't???


I didn't see the Magpul video...were the mags loaded in that video? It would probably make a difference.  


empty.  If you go on You Tube and type in pmag it is the first vid that pops up.
Link Posted: 11/25/2009 8:50:55 AM EDT
[#46]
Quoted:
David M. Fortier at your service.


Good as usual keep up the good work.
Link Posted: 11/25/2009 9:38:37 AM EDT
[#47]
Link Posted: 11/25/2009 3:32:49 PM EDT
[#48]
In your post you stated you ran them over both empty and full and they still functioned.
Link Posted: 11/25/2009 7:46:49 PM EDT
[#49]
Quoted:
Why did the little Chevy pickup in the Magpul vid crush the USGI mag but the big cargo truck in this test didn't???



Is the weight of the big ass military truck spread out over a larger area than the weight of the Chevy?  I honestly don't know the answer, but somebody might.  I can see how the contact patch of the tire, air pressure in the tire, and weight distribution of the truck could all be factors in crushing the mag.



I bought a few SS C Products magazines at a gun show, just to try them out.  They're lighter than the English SA80 mags, and the finish seems more rust resistant, but they feel kinda flimsy even compared to aluminum D&H mags.
Link Posted: 11/25/2009 9:02:31 PM EDT
[#50]
Dave, any chance you can post the full article since it's not longer on the news stands? All the issues around here are Dec 7
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