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Posted: 7/12/2008 10:50:03 AM EDT
It is my understanding that no new iported parts kits coin with there barrels,due to the fact that the barres have no sporting purpose? Now my question is that alot of us take our ak's to the range and shoot from 50-100yrds now if those guns were bult from a imported parts kit is tt not your intended sportinng purpose? Because that is mine. I seem to think we got the shaft on this one, also if they are cut up do they not already complt with federal law?? What do all of you think and what can we do about it?
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 11:06:26 AM EDT
Sporting purpose has nothing to do with the right to keep and bear arms.
We need to make a stand on this issue, and now is the time, the longer we wait the harder it will be to change.

This is a big deal, especially to the AK community.

Link Posted: 7/12/2008 11:55:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/12/2008 1:24:14 PM EDT by Akalvarez]
Please use your spell checker!

It's not the barrels that have no sporting purpose (sic) its the complete rifle. Funny things is A lot of European countries only outlaw the barrels and allow you to own a functioning full auto receiver. It is kind of hard to build a rifle without a barrel. The idiots that make these laws don't understand the determination or amount of money people that collect and use these for a sport are willing to do to make firearms out of these kits, but by 2004-2005 they kind of figured it out.

First there where no receivers made in the US.
Then there where no barrels made in the US.
Now there is both.

It is a shame that colt has not picked up making the AK. They bought the rights or contracted to make Thompson, and the AR-15, when the U.S. military did not want them. I know I would love to have a Colt marked AK.
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 12:47:27 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 12:50:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By dalesimpson:

The only issue with a Colt made AK is that it would cost at least double what a comparable quality AK would cost.



So it would be on par with Arsenal how ever it would include the collateral benefit of world class QC?
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 5:07:53 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 5:12:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/12/2008 5:13:04 PM EDT by PhreakMode]
When you state it like that, Arsenal is already synonymous to Colt in my book.
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 6:58:28 PM EDT

Originally Posted By RPD:
We need to make a stand on this issue, and now is the time, the longer we wait the harder it will be to change.

HR 4900.


Can't the barrels be imported by a separate company? You can't really say a .30 cal barrel is unsporting.
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 8:03:48 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 11:51:19 PM EDT
If it is a ruleing, or is it a law sporting purpose is defined by how you use it lets ban together and get it overruled?? I feel we can acomplish it if WE all ban together and do whatever it takes ( on legal ground of course).
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 5:48:54 AM EDT
Well there is a bill in congress now that would reorganize the ATF and in doing so would do away with the barrel ban too! Wish I could remeber the bill's number. I'm sure someone will come along and remeber it.
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 6:33:14 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bakelite47:

Originally Posted By RPD:
We need to make a stand on this issue, and now is the time, the longer we wait the harder it will be to change.

HR 4900.


Can't the barrels be imported by a separate company? You can't really say a .30 cal barrel is unsporting.


Unfinished AK barrels are already being imported. See the Zastava "virgin" AK barrels that Centerfire had a while back. They weren't fully completed (gas port holes weren't drilled, wasn't drilled for FSB pins, etc.) so they weren't AK barrels, so they were importable.
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 8:57:15 PM EDT
+1 ...This barrel ban BS needs to go away...far,far away....to never be heard from again.
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 10:25:42 PM EDT

Originally Posted By silentweapon338:
Well there is a bill in congress now that would reorganize the ATF and in doing so would do away with the barrel ban too! Wish I could remeber the bill's number. I'm sure someone will come along and remeber it.

Look up three posts.


Originally Posted By 53vortec:
Unfinished AK barrels are already being imported. See the Zastava "virgin" AK barrels that Centerfire had a while back. They weren't fully completed (gas port holes weren't drilled, wasn't drilled for FSB pins, etc.) so they weren't AK barrels, so they were importable.

Why did they stop importing them, and why don't we see more of this?
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 1:08:08 AM EDT
I finally got the answer I was waiting for from the barrel plating company.

I can begin production of chrome lined and unchromed AK barrels as soon as kits reappear on the market so that there is a demand for them.

The $2,000 up front charge for barrel chrome is a disappointment, it may force me to ask for deposits on sales.

I'm holding off on production just yet, still waiting for more than a hand full of kits to become available.
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 7:35:37 AM EDT
Richard, nitriding would probably be a better way to go. Matter of fact, IIRC, nitriding is a bath and does not require an electrode in/on the area to be plated- meaning you can dunk a gas port-drilled barrel, and have the port coated as well. No erosion or need for scraping, just shoot with brake cleaner... I believe it was H&M Metal Processing, maybe in Ohio, that I spoke with sometime ago. I can look up the contact info, if you want.
Link Posted: 7/18/2008 8:14:34 AM EDT
The barrel ban was derived from the ATF's ruling that the AK, Uzi and FAL had no sporting purpose.

IIRC, the "sporting purpose" doctrine was dreamed up at about the same time the FOPA came along, under the rationale that the right to keep and bear arms had something to do with hunting. I think this was done in part to fool hunters and sportsmen into thinking that their hunting firearms weren't going to be affected, only "evil" military-style arms. Apparently, no one was pointing out the origins of the Mauser action, the 1903, the Garand...

Now that SCOTUS has clarified what the RKBA actually has to do with, the rug has been pulled out from under the sporting use rationale, and it should be difficult for the ATF to rule that AKs, etc. have no self-defense use.

There is a bill addressing the excesses of the ATF; it's H.R. 4900: The “Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives Reform and Firearms Modernization Act of 2007.” (Link is to NRA fact page.)

Among many other things, HR 4900 "Restores a policy that allowed importation of barrels, frames and receivers from non-importable firearms, when they can be used as repair or replacement parts." That last language is a problem, though, and needs to be eliminated so those parts can be imported to make new guns.
Link Posted: 7/19/2008 6:52:22 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Rob72:
Richard, nitriding would probably be a better way to go. Matter of fact, IIRC, nitriding is a bath and does not require an electrode in/on the area to be plated- meaning you can dunk a gas port-drilled barrel, and have the port coated as well. No erosion or need for scraping, just shoot with brake cleaner... I believe it was H&M Metal Processing, maybe in Ohio, that I spoke with sometime ago. I can look up the contact info, if you want.


The difficulty there is that not every AK variant has the gas port in the same location, not even with the same model.
The com bloc standards are pretty loose, gas port placement may vary by up to .250 even for consecutive number guns. That is just enough to block the gas port if you are not lucky!
This pretty well dictates drilling the gas port AFTER trial fitting all parts if you are building with a virgin barrel.
The same sort of issue comes up for head-space and the barrel retaining pin.

I know buyers want their build to be as easy as possible, but it's not really going to be possible to cut every notch and hole accurately in advance.
If they are pre-done, and then the pin holes for the gas block, front and rear sight bases, etc. do not line up perfectly the barrel maker will be blamed.

I have taken apart and reassembled about 1000 AK variants, the commies really bring new meaning to "hand fitted"!

For the best quality build the builder will need to fit-up their small components, it will be a PITA, but it's not that hard if you can use a drill press or mill.

The days of assembling an AK with just a hammer, vise, and press may be over, but with just a little more work we will still be able to assemble good quality AK's once kits become available again.

Those here who have assembled a "Krink" kit will already be familiar with these issues.
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