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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/12/2005 1:29:47 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:35:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/12/2005 1:36:24 PM EDT by dalesimpson]
Importers holding ATF approved permits to import frames, receivers, or
barrels for otherwise nonimportable firearms for repair or replacement may continue to
use such permits through December 31, 2005. Effective January 1, 2006, these permits will
be suspended.


This is indeed good news.


ETA I just noticed this is my 666th post!
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:37:28 PM EDT
From the Waterboy. Mama says that's the Devil.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:50:14 PM EDT
Sounds like my investments aren't going to pay off for a few more months.

But hey, it's good news!

ben
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:51:35 PM EDT
I think everyone who payed massively inflated kit prices are going to be a little hacked off

Anyone going to bother telling the ripoff artists on GB? Come Sept 11th you'll hear "THESE KITS CAN NO LONGER BE IMPORTED! GETEM WHILE YOU CAN!"

ben
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 1:59:13 PM EDT
Who cares?
Make a bargain with the devil, you're only buying yourself more time before the inevitable...
And in this case it is the total ban of all imported firearms
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:03:41 PM EDT

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Who cares?
Make a bargain with the devil, you're only buying yourself more time before the inevitable...
And in this case it is the total ban of all imported firearms



Dang, those WASR-2s and WASR-3s must be illegal, they're probably coming across the border at night.....and let's not forget all those SAIGAS, VEPRs, and WASR-10s...

Dadgum undocumented rifles...


Link Posted: 8/12/2005 2:53:04 PM EDT
Oh what a wonderful gift they have given us. They have delayed the restraint on free trade for 3 months.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 3:08:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By robpiat:
Oh what a wonderful gift they have given us. They have delayed the restraint on free trade for 3 months.



The ATF ruling is bad mojo, but look what the lawsuit by that free trade group did..gave us several more months of plentiful kits.

Keep fighting it.

Ben
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 4:04:59 PM EDT
So how does this import permit thing work? Does this only apply to permit that have already been issued to import X number of parts kits between now and the end of the year, or can people with a permit get on the phone and tell Ivan to send all he's got, stat?
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 4:21:03 PM EDT

Originally Posted By METT-T:
So how does this import permit thing work? Does this only apply to permit that have already been issued to import X number of parts kits between now and the end of the year, or can people with a permit get on the phone and tell Ivan to send all he's got, stat?



Either.

I hope Ivan floods the market with Kits. I may have bought some for investment, but I'd take 69$ AMDs over making money.

Ben
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 5:54:51 PM EDT
But importers have to allready have a approved form 6.. If they don't have a 6 for specific kits, they woulnt get a new one approved.. What you see is what you get...
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 6:01:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By coltshorty14:
But importers have to allready have a approved form 6.. If they don't have a 6 for specific kits, they woulnt get a new one approved.. What you see is what you get...



So there are no more kits coming in than would have come in otherwise between now and 1 Jan, correct? Sorry if I'm thick here.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 7:13:10 PM EDT

Originally Posted By METT-T:

Originally Posted By coltshorty14:
But importers have to allready have a approved form 6.. If they don't have a 6 for specific kits, they woulnt get a new one approved.. What you see is what you get...



So there are no more kits coming in than would have come in otherwise between now and 1 Jan, correct? Sorry if I'm thick here.



If someone allready has a approved From 6 for something we havent seen yet.. Then they have plenty of time to get it.. But if they don't have a F6 to cover kits that poped up in a forgein country, then they will not get one..
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 7:27:40 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fadedsun:

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Who cares?
Make a bargain with the devil, you're only buying yourself more time before the inevitable...
And in this case it is the total ban of all imported firearms



Dang, those WASR-2s and WASR-3s must be illegal, they're probably coming across the border at night.....and let's not forget all those SAIGAS, VEPRs, and WASR-10s...

Dadgum undocumented rifles...





I believe that the next step is the ban on imported rifles that are converted state side to standard cap. Do you really think ATF just woke and said "Oh my, people are using these barrels to build new rifles that aren't importable" They know what is happening. The next "loophole" will be the sigle stack rifles converted over here.
Link Posted: 8/12/2005 7:48:26 PM EDT

Originally Posted By firedog51d:

Originally Posted By fadedsun:

Originally Posted By thedoctors308:
Who cares?
Make a bargain with the devil, you're only buying yourself more time before the inevitable...
And in this case it is the total ban of all imported firearms



Dang, those WASR-2s and WASR-3s must be illegal, they're probably coming across the border at night.....and let's not forget all those SAIGAS, VEPRs, and WASR-10s...

Dadgum undocumented rifles...





I believe that the next step is the ban on imported rifles that are converted state side to standard cap. Do you really think ATF just woke and said "Oh my, people are using these barrels to build new rifles that aren't importable" They know what is happening. The next "loophole" will be the sigle stack rifles converted over here.



That would take an act of congress, which to say the least is completely in our favor.

ben
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 3:24:23 AM EDT
I don't see the difference as being huge. It just allows already approved permit holders more time to get the kits in. If the form isn't already approved, you're out of luck.
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 4:21:03 AM EDT
Since we've already been screwed, I like to think that every barrel we can get in the country is one more rifle being built and out on the market ...
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 5:14:46 AM EDT
If I understood the K-var Admin's response over on the Migeta forum correctly, they had approved import documentation for some 74s but couldn't get the kits de-milled and shipped ahead of the sept. 10th deadline. I for one hope that is true. Surely other importers are in the same situation. (Maybe I WILL be able to get one of those IMBEL receivers.)
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 11:18:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/14/2005 10:13:02 AM EDT by JIMBEAM]
On the bright side it gives importers more time to fight the ban and more time to get kits into the US.

I really hope someone can get some Imbel FAL receivers. $350 for a receiver that once cost <$200 sucks.


Maybe I have time to get that 1919 kit now.


Link Posted: 8/13/2005 11:24:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 11:28:29 AM EDT

Originally Posted By medicmandan:
Time to warm up the credit card while I still have time to get some stuff.

3 AK's isn't enough is it?



Not even close...

More time is good. I bet the cost on kits will definitely be up no matter what since the importers will probably decide to use air freight instead of shipping them a slower method. Permits are no good unless they are here and cleared by 01/01/06...

Spooky
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 12:47:22 PM EDT
Tried the link and all I got was numbers?
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 1:32:04 PM EDT
U.S. Department of Justice
Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco,
Firearms and Explosives
Assistant Director
August 12, 2005
REVISED OPEN LETTER TO FEDERALLY LICENSED FIREARMS IMPORTERS
AND REGISTERED IMPORTERS OF U.S. MUNITIONS IMPORT LIST ARTICLES
The purpose of this open letter is to provide important updated information to importers
concerning the lawful importation of certain frames, receivers and barrels.
Extension of Time to Effect Importation of Approved Permits for Frames, Receivers or
Barrels of Firearms Under Title 18 U.S.C. § 925(d)(3)
As noted in our prior Open Letter dated July 13, 2005, section 925(d) provides “in any case
where the Attorney General has not authorized the importation of the firearm pursuant to this
paragraph, it shall be unlawful to import any frame, receiver, or barrel of such firearm which
would be prohibited if assembled.” ATF concluded that this language permits no exceptions that
would allow frames, receivers or barrels for otherwise nonimportable firearms to be imported
into the United States. Accordingly, ATF announced that it would no longer approve ATF Form
6 applications for importation of any frames, receivers, or barrels for firearms that would be
prohibited from importation if assembled. No exceptions to the statutory language, for example
for “repair or replacement” of existing firearms, will be allowed.
In the July 13, 2005, Open Letter, ATF recognized that importers relying upon ATF’s prior
policy may suffer economic harm, particularly those who hold approved permits. To mitigate
the impact of the new policy, ATF provided that it would forego enforcement of section
925(d)(3) for 60 calendar days from the date of the Open Letter for those importers who had
obtained import permits for barrels and receivers for nonimportable firearms for "repair or
replacement."
Following consultations with the industry and further examination of the number and types of
barrels and receivers authorized for importation on approved permits, ATF has decided to extend
the period of time for importers to act upon previously approved import permits. ATF believes
this extended period affords ample time for importers who have entered into binding contracts in
reliance upon approved permits to bring their shipments into the United States for entry into
commerce. Importers holding ATF approved permits to import frames, receivers, or
barrels for otherwise nonimportable firearms for repair or replacement may continue to
use such permits through December 31, 2005. Effective January 1, 2006, these permits will
be suspended.

-2-
Importers holding unexpired approved permits will be receiving a letter notifying them that their
permits will be suspended effective January 1, 2006. ATF will advise Customs and Border
Protection that in no event should these permits be accepted to release these items for entry into
the United States on or after January 1, 2006.
Importers are reminded that no new permits for these items will be issued, including the issuance
of permits that would be necessary to remove frames, receivers or barrels that are currently held
or may be placed in a Customs Bonded Warehouse or Foreign Trade Zone. Importers are also
advised that ATF previously approved permits for nonimportable barrels and receivers are for
repair or replacement only, and this restriction was stamped on the face of the permit. Importers
who import such components for any purpose other than repair or replacement of existing
firearms, e.g., for assembly into new firearms, will be exceeding the scope of the import
authorization in violation of law. If ATF determines, through inspection or otherwise, that an
importer willfully violates the import provisions of the GCA, the importer's license is subject to
revocation pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 923(e).
Maintaining open lines of communication is vital to the successful future of ATF’s partnership
with the import community. The Firearms and Explosives Imports Branch staff is available to
answer your questions about the issues addressed in this letter. You may reach us by phone at
(202) 927-8320 or by fax at (202) 927-2697. Additional information regarding this issue will be
provided on our Website at www.atf.gov.
Sincerely yours,
Lewis P. Raden
Assistant Director
Enforcement Programs and Services
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:33:37 PM EDT
I did a quick check on the web since it's Sunday at 00:30 and I can't really call anyone. Some web links already show 0 stock or "Price on Request".

Big shock to me since I have not followed the import thread close. I am going to a show in about 8 hours and thought I would read up on AK's thinking of buying my first. Now it sounds like the prices are going to be sky high.

I actually wanted a HK91 clone and a AK, I am guessing that both will be sky high. I was thinking of a PTR in addition to that AK and since both of these are built from kits what should I expect ? It's been about 8 months since I have been to the show and I think I am going to need to bring the KY Jelly along with that wad of cash!

Rich
Link Posted: 8/13/2005 8:48:02 PM EDT
None of this applys to pistols, right? So why don't some genius call AMD65 barrels "pistol" barrels? Seems logical to me. Krinks to. Problem solved. That's why I make the big bucks!
Link Posted: 8/14/2005 7:54:23 AM EDT

Originally Posted By fadedsun:
I think everyone who payed massively inflated kit prices are going to be a little hacked off



Just because they have 3 more months to get the approved kits in doesn't mean that they will lower prices. There is still a deadline in sight, so they'll keep on charging a premium.
Link Posted: 8/14/2005 10:59:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By M4Madness:

Originally Posted By fadedsun:
I think everyone who payed massively inflated kit prices are going to be a little hacked off



Just because they have 3 more months to get the approved kits in doesn't mean that they will lower prices. There is still a deadline in sight, so they'll keep on charging a premium.



I expect kit Prices will drop slightly or remain level for longer, at the least.



Link Posted: 8/14/2005 1:01:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fadedsun:

That would take an act of congress, which to say the least is completely in our favor.

ben



Actually, that wouldnt.. All the ATF would have to do is lump rifles that share the same "action" as banned rifles, and they are done.. Thats how CA got rid of Saigas.
Link Posted: 8/14/2005 2:44:18 PM EDT
Will "Post-ban" barrels and recievers still be imported?
Link Posted: 8/14/2005 3:06:29 PM EDT

Originally Posted By FLRich:
I did a quick check on the web since it's Sunday at 00:30 and I can't really call anyone. Some web links already show 0 stock or "Price on Request".

Big shock to me since I have not followed the import thread close. I am going to a show in about 8 hours and thought I would read up on AK's thinking of buying my first. Now it sounds like the prices are going to be sky high.

I actually wanted a HK91 clone and a AK, I am guessing that both will be sky high. I was thinking of a PTR in addition to that AK and since both of these are built from kits what should I expect ? It's been about 8 months since I have been to the show and I think I am going to need to bring the KY Jelly along with that wad of cash!

Rich




You should be A-ok for a PTR, the PTR's receiver and BBL are made here in the USA..
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 4:20:06 PM EDT
My question is... how much will this affect(if any) the value of complete rifles available in the US.

I'm looking for a good reason to "invest" in one of them before the end of this year and this would sell me.
Link Posted: 8/23/2005 12:15:39 PM EDT
So the ban basically effects every weapon type that is assembled in the US from imported parts?

I am feeling a little slow today.
Link Posted: 8/24/2005 9:43:17 PM EDT
Soooooo, is the ATF going to go after people who allready built kit into rifles? Will they be checking credit card statments from CFS and going door to dour seeing if we built one?
Feeling faint!
Link Posted: 8/26/2005 9:32:31 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Jimmy_Hoffa:
Soooooo, is the ATF going to go after people who allready built kit into rifles? Will they be checking credit card statments from CFS and going door to dour seeing if we built one?
Feeling faint!



NONONONONONONONONONO!

I­t ONLY regards the importation of said kits into the country. What you do with them in your basement, stays in your basement. The ATF won't like you building new weapons out of the kits (That's why they wrote this new ruling) but there is NOTHING they can do about it. If you build a rifle out of a kit, you have nothing to fear.

Link Posted: 8/28/2005 2:41:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Lollypop_69:
None of this applys to pistols, right? So why don't some genius call AMD65 barrels "pistol" barrels? Seems logical to me. Krinks to. Problem solved. That's why I make the big bucks!



This seems logical. Cut and thread a barrel at 15.9 inches and weld some kind of thread extender once it's over. That might actually work!
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