I've been doing a bit of research into buying my first AK and am completely overwhelmed with what I should be looking for. I am looking for something economical to shoot and will spend anywhere from 400-700 on an ak. I'm first trying to decide what kind of ammo I want to shoot. There is some dirt cheap 5.45x39 but it is steel so that limits where I can shoot it, so I guess I'm looking at 7.62x39. Now there are so many different variants I don't know what I should be looking for. I would consider a WASR10 if I could find a good one but even then I think I would rather spend a little more money for something nicer quality. I'm looking to find a decent non-folding variant with wood stock and foregrip that i can stain a nice dark cherry red and just have a clean classic AK look. What makes should I look out for? Anything in particular to avoid or be on the lookout for? I pretty much know what to look out for in a WASR10 but not really the other variants or even what I should search for and snatch up if I come across it. Thanks.

Why buy an AK? They're simply 3rd world refuge. Stick with AR's. Watch a high speed video of an AK and an AR firing in slow-mo...the AK is all over the place = poor accuracy. If you get hit anywhere with a .223 round, you have big problems.
If someone wants to argue AR vs AK, then suggest you one one end zone of a football field with an AR, them in the other end zone with an AK. No sane individual will take those odds.

I can't tell if you're trolling or not. I didn't ask if I should buy an AK or AR, I asked for AK help. There's a 99% chance I will never be in a situation where I will have to point a gun at someone, and it I did it would be at like 25 feet tops so that's irrelevant.

400-700

I would say 20" ak pick your poison.

The first thing you should be aware of is that Russian made commercial cartridges use a bullet with a steel jacket. Some ranges do not allow the use of that ammunition.
The only readily available 7.62X39 with copper jacketed bullets is US made (which is pricey) and Yugoslavian surplus (which is corrosively primed).

how damaging is the yugo stuff? If I clean the rifle regularly would it sill be an issue? I mean how harmful is the stuff and what will it do to the rifle?

It won't hurt the gun at all if you clean after you shoot

easy enough then

What variants should I be looking for? Is there a rank in terms of quality in this price range?

If I could only have one AK type rifle (within reason $) it would be a milled Bulgarian...

It's been said here often...

With AK's, spending more money doesn't necessarily buy you better accuracy, reliability or durability.  Spending more money can buy better fit and finish, and some other intangible (and occasionally tangible) things that are important to some people, and not important to others.

If you just want a shooter around $500, and an AK to "check out" to see how you like AK's, there's nothing wrong with buying a WASR or a Chinese MAK-90.  Both of these are inexpensive, and both will generally work fine.  You can also pick-up a partially-converted Saiga in this price range.  (All three of these rifles are factory rifles.  They are not kit builds.  Not that there's anything wrong with a good kit-build.)

If you go up the price scale, between $500-$800, there are many choices.  Arsenal is a popular one around here, as they convert "sporterized" Russian and Bulgarian rifles back into their original configurations.  If you just want one AK (hard to do) and want a "nicer" one, Arsenals are a safe bet.  I own four of them myself, and have never had any problems with any of them.  There are other choices in this price range too, like Interarms, Waffen Works, various converted Saigas offered by different companies, various kit builds, etc.  Atlantic Firearms has a good selection, and their website can give you a good idea of what is generally available these days.  Again, "quality" is a concept that has to be viewed differently with AK's vs. AR's.  While more money might get you a higher quality AR, that isn't necessarily the case with AK's. (Although, I think a lot of the AR guys overstate the quality issue too, since most AR's built these days will work just fine for 90%+ of the people who will ever buy one.)

Going up the price scale even more ($800+),  in this price range there are Chinese rifles (high quality, and no longer imported), VEPR's, older Arsenals, nice kit builds...really, there are a lot to choose from.  But it sounds like you're not looking in this space right now.

I'd probably get a WASR, a MAK-90 or a partially-converted Saiga for a first AK.  They're inexpensive, they just plain work, and if you decide you don't like it and want to sell, you'll probably be able to get most of your money back out of it.  Then again, that's true with most AK's these days.

I'll throw in my $0.02.

I have owned two WASRs and I really liked them!  They simply worked.  They didn't have the best finishes but I don't see that as a down side.  I've also owned other AKM style rifles from Vector, Henderson Defense (when they used to build them), and Arsenal.  While the higher end ones looked prettier, they did not function any better than the WASRs.  

If I were going to buy a new AK variant in 7.62x39, it would be one of the following, priced lowest to highest:

WASR 10/63

$400 tops for a basic one.

SAR-1

Look in the EE.  They pop up from time to time.  $450 tops for a basic one.

IAC 47 wood

$550 - $600

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct947.aspx

SGL21

$750 - $800

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct838.aspx

SLR-107

$850 - $900

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct814.aspx

Atlantic Firearms gives board members a discount too.  Just let them know your username.

Unfortunately, it's a little more complex than that.
The speed at which the metal corrodes after firing corrosively primed ammunition varies with the relative humidity. When it's very humid the rifle can begin to corrode very quickly.
In addition, in order to prevent the rifle from corroding after firing corrosively primed it must be THROUGHLY cleaned, unless the humidity is very low.
If you're unfamiliar with cleaning a rifle after firing corrosively primed ammunition, consider purchasing an AK on the low end of the price scale. A little damage to the finish from corrosion won't result in a large reduction in value, should you make a mistake in not cleaning it quickly or throughly enough.

for me the best bang for the buck would be the wasr 10/63, reason being for the price of $399,99 you get as close to a variant ak built from the cugir factory with a bayonet lug and comes with bayonet,chrome lined barrel,slant muzzle brake,side mount for a scope,cleaning rod, working on gettin one myself.  have seen pics of people staining and refinishing the whole rifle with great results

Your chance of survival at the end zone would not be that high with either rifle.



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Who gets the first shot off.

I'll take your argument.  Let me know what football field.  I'll bring my AK.

Since you have such a superior rifle I get to take the first shot.  Shouldn't matter, right?

Look at some of the deals you can find here on the equipment exchange...
Used Arsenal (Bulgarians and Russians) are affordable and are around the $700 ish area
Century Yugos are really high quality (They were subcontracted out) and a used Chinese MAC
is a great rifle as well...

I am just not a WASR fan ... especially for the prices they are asking on them now.

As far as the furniture.. there are MANY choices of finishes and wood - check out Iron Wood designs..

The idea is not to be overwhelmed - sit back and enjoy !!

Look at some of the pics of other members rifles on the forum

Join date:
Post count:
Sounds like a troll to me... I shot a doomsday match with my AK and got a hell of a lot better score then some guys with AR.
AND yes I do own ARs, however I own a lot more AKs
As far as AK goes get a Polish or Yugo variant. you won't be dissapointed.

The thing to keep in mind about shopping for AKs is that more money doesn't get your a better rifle.  They all work fine (few lemons like anything) and are in the same accuracy range (4-5moa for a AK47, 2-4moa for an AK74).  The most expensive ones are just prettier looking with either blued of painted finishes that look nicer than a cheap park job.

I would try to get an AK with a foreign made barrel.  The US barrels aren't quite as good quality yet.

..... I play Call of Duty on XBOX360 too

So do I! But I still equip the AK! hahaha

I can't hit chit with the AK on Warfare II...lol     OP..Get a starter rifle...that is what I call the WASR 10/63. It will go bang EVERY time you squeeze the trigger. Plain and simple. The "AR" guy is talking smack...MOST SHTF gun fights will be 100 yrds or less....I can hit a head sized target with my WASR every time I fire!! From there you can play around with different flavors of the AK world...add rails, scopes, all the "bling" you want.
  Fact is...the AK is the most used rifle in the world, the most easiest weapon system in the world, and has killed more people than any other rifle if you care to know that type info.
If you want more accuracy/less recoil, lean towards the 5.56 or the 5.45 flavor....you want to blast the a concrete wall and take out your target and whatever is behind it, get the 7.62  

Yeah a WASR could be alright. I just really want the dimples in the mag well. That's the one thing that is turning me off, I can stain the wood dark and nice but can't fix a screwed receiver. What's one step up that has the dimples and a slightly better fit and finish?

How about a polish Tantal? I just got one of the newer ones from ClassicArms and it is great. Obviously it does not have a side rail. But the fit and finish is great.
I own my fair share of AKs and although that Tantal is not the best out of the ones that I own, it is far up there in the middle.

You can pick up a saiga under 400 and convert it back yourself..it's not that hard, and PLENTY of vids and instructions on how it's done. You will then own a RUSSIAN AK, solid, accurate, and you can add ALL the bling you want. You can get it in 5.56/5.45/7.62/308  or even 12gauge shotty  

OP; since you seem to have a flexible budget, you might want to try to find a 100% European factory-built AK, like a '90s FEG SA85M. There were two versions imported from Hungary - a pre-1994 ban and a post-1994 ban. The pre-ban looks like and the post-ban looks like

It's easy to put a regular stock and pistol grip on the post ban and make it compliant with the 922r law. You can find these for around $500. The pre-bans are pricier, at least $1000 and usually higher. But, there is a world of difference in a factory-built AK made in Europe by the people who made the military ones and the others you can now get made of surplus military parts kits and built on a USA-made receiver. All these rifles tend to have alignment problems and twisted sights and gas blocks because the so-called 'manufacturers' do not have the factory jigs and other equipment for the proper manufacture of an AK. In addition to the Hungarian rifles that came in during the ban, I think there were some Chinese versions also with the 'thumbhole' stock. The FEG rifles had the bolt and carrier numbered to the rifle, so check for that if you look at one of those.

And just to add to the confusion...

I had the same decision to make and I researched the hell out of it.
IMO the best of the best are the Valmets and Gallils. Out of your price range.
In that range what I chose was a factory Bulgarian from Centerfire. My reasoning was the get the best barrel and receiver combination put together by a reputable original factory at a reasonable cost. I can add sexy stocks later. Mine was a single stack (that was all that was offered at the time).
Now they offer double stacks at reasonable prices as well.
The other choice was a VZ-2000 (VZ-58) Not an AK but similar. Some say better.
They are pretty much gone at the cheap pricing of a few months ago.

It should be pointed out that if you want to do the complete conversion and don't have the skills or tools to do it all yourself, it'll basically cost you the same as buying an Arsenal SGL rifle.

Saiga conversions are great for guys that don't care about doing a complete conversion, or if they can do all the work themselves.

There are some good values out there for the money.. ALOT of good info
in this thread by people who have practical experience...I've Ben onto Ak's since
I bought my first one in 1989..(Polytech Spiker)

Buy well and buy once and then stock up on magazines/ammo

Yeah I want to be able to shoot it regularly on my budget and the cheapest non steel 7.62x39 is the yugo stuff which is corrosive, so I don't want to mess up a nice gun. What's the next cheapest non-corrosive, non steel ammo?

The surplus Yugo ammo is really good stuff and as long as you clean the rifle then you will have no issues.
I really cant think of the next cheapest non corrosive, non steel ammo ... the steel ammo is going to be the cheapest period..and any AK will run it with no issues.
Take your pick with Wolf, Tula, Silver Bear and Brown Bear .... most ranges will allow hollowpoints

There's no such thing as "cheap" brass cased 7.62x39 ammunition except the Yugoslavian made surplus.
OTOH, the AK was designed to fire steel cased ammunition so while using it may concern you, it doesn't bother the rest of us.

I don't care about firing steel case at all, I just need to find out if the range will allow it...

I went and checked out the store's selection. They have way more ARs than AKs and a lot of their AKs are very pricey/milled/etc. They have a nice SAR-1 that comes with a russian side mounted scope and 3 mags that looks really nice for 600 and they said they can go lower. So if that's still there in a couple weeks I might grab it.

Get a Draco. You can sbr it. And still b
e in budget.

Get a Tantal.... $390
30rd bulgarian mags are awsome and are cheap.
45rd RPK mags are fairly priced
Folder stock is awsome.
No recoil, so it shoots great.
1080rd ammo can =$130 cant beat that.
So why are you still deciding?

Just find an SGL in one of it's flavors and be done with it. Probably the best factory gun being built with great resale value. You can find 21s all day long under 700.00.

That cheap ammo is steel cored so can't really shoot it most places and the next cheapest is the same as cheap 7.62 or 556

..most ranges allow the use of hollow point ammo...

the cheap 5.45 is steel cored

....you do realize that there are more places to shoot than commercial ranges .... right?

Then WTF are you doing in the AK forums

Well thats funny, cause I can ring a 18" steel plate at 300 yards all day long with my SGL31

You must really suck if you can't hit a man sized target at 120 yards with an AK with minimal effort

Now that we have that settled, general discussion it that way ––––––->


To the OP

I would highly suggest an Arsenal SGL21 (7.62)or SGL31(5.45), I have both and they are both fantastic but my favorite has to be the SGL31, I love some 5.45 from AIM for $139 shipped

And about the ammo, just find somewhere on private property to shoot, but either way you really can't go wrong with a Russian AK

I wish I knew where... I just moved to south florida- palm beach county. maybe you can point me in the right direction.

I'm in the same boat, I live 30 miles from a major city, there are very few options for places to shoot.  Theres the NRA range, rip off public ranges, and private clubs with a two year waiting list.  The other options involve a 3 hour drive.

start off with a cheap beater (WASR or some Century 5.45), then move on to "nicer" fit an finish AK's, and once you're on your 3rd or 4th AK you can modify your beater without feeling bad about it

you think I'm exaggerating when I say 3rd or 4th AK... wait until you're on your 8th and 9th, by then you can't stop

get the sar1 and talk them down

great factory rifle, very true akm pattern

What would be a reasonable price with the scope?

Iif you want accuracy, true accuracy then I'd suggest getting a 5.45 or a 5.56 AK. Preferably one with the option of adding a scope.