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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/8/2005 8:07:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/9/2005 4:24:13 AM EDT by CbtEngr1]
now the choice of receiver seems to be Global with parkerizing.

what other tools will I need and how difficult is this to build? Everyone says its easy.

I have built AR's and working on a .45 but never done the AK thing.

Seems to be a lot of custom fitting from what I have read at the Pookie site but
I wouldn't have thought that being this is a mass prodouced weapon when in production.


any help or thoughts are appreciated

essayons
Link Posted: 8/8/2005 12:58:36 PM EDT
Just make sure that you have quite a selection of tools around the shop. Are you planning to screw build or rivet? Do you have access to a press? Building an Ak is easy in comparison to an experianced builder so to speak. But to someone just starting out, it can be a a huge headace at times, but the outcome is well worth the feeling. What type of receiver are you planning on? They're only a few choices to start, but the best for a novice in my opinion would be the "100%" receiver which requires your F.F.l. to make the transfer. "Pookies" site is also a great source for information, but if you're unsure of anything feel free to ask other board members but the final decision is up to you. A great site (forum) that I recomend would www.gunco.net we would like to have you join us. There's tons of usefull information on the site and plenty of boys that know the game. I just happend to brush your post browsing, but for the info. that your going to need will be on another board it seems that it takes a while for questions to get answered here. No offense at all to "AR" but there's just not enough on the Ak for the answers you may need.
Good luck, when your done with the first it's an addiction that you might not be able to crack!
-Shadow-
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 4:23:49 AM EDT
wow, 159 views and only 1 response?

thanks shadow.

I am not sure what kinda press you mean...drill press?? to drill out the rivets and to add the holes for the trunnion?

I would go for a 100% receiver with parkerizing already from global.

I guess I didnt think it would be hard to build looking at the kit but perhaps from my reading of the boards and the sites that it could be. I thought perhaps that it would be "drill out the old rivets, get a set of new rivets, get the holes right and re-rivet (however you do that I don't know)"

seems like adding the holes, putting the rivets in and then just popping the parts back in would be relatively simple procedure but maybe I am wrong.

I have ak's already but like the romanian version...and would like to learn to build these...maybe get another set or two before the barrels become unavailable.

Essayons

Link Posted: 8/9/2005 4:44:43 AM EDT
The rivets are the fun part. Guys have cobbled up squeezers from a set of cheap bolt cutters or used shop presses and jigs to do them "right". There are also options for a screw-together build that might be easier for the home thumbwhacker, but will still require you to drill and tap the holes.

I can and have assembled an AR over the computer desk. An AK takes a certain amount of shop time.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 5:33:37 AM EDT
Believe it or not, about 10 bajillion people have asked this same question. Read read read for general info. When you have specific questions, ask those. Everything on basics of building is in the AK Discussions, Build it yourself, and AK ABC's forums.

By "press", they mean a hydraulic press that can be used to push out the barrel, barrel pin, and smash rivets.


Originally Posted By CbtEngr1:
wow, 159 views and only 1 response?

Link Posted: 8/9/2005 9:18:35 AM EDT
thanks for the replies guys, it clears up some stuff. Believe it or not, I spent a good day + time reading and absorbing info before asking anything. I even did a search for specific things and for general knowledge. It seems to be scattered around.

I wanted some general info before I purchased a receiver for sure to start on this.. I figured it had been asked but in the limited search results I got...it wasn't very evident to have been asked in general terms in the last couple of weeks.

my search-fu must be weak.

essayons
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 11:49:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/9/2005 11:52:08 AM EDT by Quarterbore]
I don't consider myself an expert but I am trying to learn as well and I have bought a ton of tools to do some better builds... Here are some links that might help you some...

Building AKs using the screw method:
www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=163


Some other tools:

Plinker's Jig: www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=161
Xybec barel Press : www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=162
Bending your own flats : www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=164

Some legal info (dated now that the crime bill is dead):
www.quarterbore.net/forums/showthread.php?t=159
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 1:54:28 PM EDT
With a simple kit like a Romy (as compared to an underfolder for instance), there are basically 4 tasks.
1. Remove the old rivets by drilling/punching(and possibly receiver pieces depending on where your kit came from)
2. Remove the barrel pin and barrel with hammer/punch or press or pulley puller
3. Drill rivet holes in your receiver to match your trunnions (search for "tape trick")
4. Rivet (numerous ways to do this, press, bolt cutters, hammer...)
5. Reinstall barrel and barrel pin (pipe clamp method, press, hammer)

If you had a more difficult kit, then step 3 would involve makeing extra cuts in your receiver.
Someone really needs to do these steps and take pics of each process. I was going to on my Tantal, but I'm such a hack it would be pointless.
Depending on your compliance parts, you may also have to remove the gas piston and replace it. I recommend drilling all the way through the pin with a fairly small bit, then stepping up to a larger bit that your punch will fit in. Drill a little way in with the larger bit, this will allow the swaged(?) head to break off as you drive the pin out.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 3:22:49 PM EDT
Your first analysis is correct The steps in the build are basic. Its all in the execution. I am in no way an expert but I have stayed at Holiday Inn. These nice guys here talked me thru all my screw ups. You need a drill press.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 3:29:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rrc870:
Your first analysis is correct The steps in the build are basic. Its all in the execution. I am in no way an expert but I have stayed at Holiday Inn. These nice guys here talked me thru all my screw ups. You need a drill press.



Yes, a drill press is needed... I just got one at HF for $45 (I think)... worked great at removing the old rivets.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 3:57:09 AM EDT
Man, now this is some great info!

I realize I need a drill press...it was going to be on the list for Christmas but I may not be able to wait. I have a Dremel press (same thing but fits a dremel tool as the drill) but I am sure I need a bigger more heavy duty one. We have a harbor freight here so I may stop by and get one soon.

We also have centerfire here so I may go over and get one more kit when they get their resupply in.

My worry will be getting the holes in the receiver correct and getting the barrel in and out. I read something about a hot/cold method which seems simple enough (anyone tried it?) but may go with the I-bar C clamp method.

thanks again for the info (Off to search for the tape trick)

Essayons
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 4:40:00 AM EDT
Common advice is to run your drill press as slow as it will go. Drilling the rivets generates a lot of heat. Dremel's run very fast, like 20-30k rpm. I periodically drip 3in1 oil into the hole while I'm drilling. Some say you can do it with a hand drill. I snapped a bit drilling a short rivet with a hand drill, Lord only knows what I'd do on a long rivet.
Use the tape/post-it trick, and start with a small bit, like 1/16 or 1/8. Drill your holes then check for alignment. In my case I was off a bit, but still able to drill with the next size up. I tried to eccentric (not actually a verb, but who cares) the holes with my Dremel and exploded the grinding bit. Eventually I just chucked up the proper size and drilled it. It seems that as long as you're pretty close to center, the bit will walk over and hit the center. Even if your hole ends up a little eccentric, your rivet head will cover a lot.
The barrel is the hard part for me (since someone local has done my rivets). I think you need a very solidly mounted vise (which I don't have) then pad the breech with pennies, then put a bolt or something hard against the pennies, then pound on it with a hammer. All this after you get the barrel pin out.
The only bar clamp method that I've seen was for putting the barrel back in. Haven't tried it.

Originally Posted By CbtEngr1:
I have a Dremel press (same thing but fits a dremel tool as the drill) but I am sure I need a bigger more heavy duty one.
My worry will be getting the holes in the receiver correct and getting the barrel in and out. I read something about a hot/cold method which seems simple enough (anyone tried it?) but may go with the I-bar C clamp method.

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 5:21:24 AM EDT
The only real thing I disagree with in the advise above is the using a very small drill bit. Start your drilling with the 5/32 COBALT drill bit. It is slightly undersized for the tap so you can come back with the proper #21 drill bit but there is no real reason for undersize drilling and you will ruin good drill bits trying to ream out those holes unless you plan to buy a set of reamers to ream it to size but why bother?

The way I did the screw builds I did was to take a dremmel with a cut off wheel and grind the rivets flush with the trunion. Then take a center punch and carefully get yourself a small divet in the center of the rivet you need drilled out. Then, as suggested above, drill (USING THE 5/32 COBALT drill bit) at the slowest speed you can with LOTS of oil! The trunions are very hard and the drill will follow the rivet as opposed to trying to drill cut that trunion but you still want to go slow and use a drill press.

ALSO... BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT HOW DEEP YOU GO IN THE FRONT TRUNION IF YOU DRILL THESE!!! Lots of guys have had to toss a barrel because they drilled too deep...

Link Posted: 8/10/2005 6:28:28 AM EDT
In my experience the drill bit will not follow the rivet. I've drilled into the trunnions on both kits I've worked on. It doesn't seem to matter. The Romy still riveted up fine. Not to that point on the Tantal yet. Although, if it's a screw build I can see that getting into the trunnion could cause threading problems.
As to using the 5/32 on the receiver holes, if you can hit the center, that's good. I was off center with my punch marks and drilled an off center hole. I was very glad that I used a small bit so I didn't end up with a large off center hole. That's pretty much how I do everything though, start small, test fit, go larger, test fit....
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 7:36:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By JimTh:
That's pretty much how I do everything though, start small, test fit, go larger, test fit....



With AKs, that is the best advise... along with think hard before you start, start a little and THINK, if things are working keep going while thinking and looking at what you are doing... If anything looks wrong you need to stop before you go on and do another hole or step...

You can assemble an AR-15 in an hour... a first time AK build can take a full day or more... you can screw up an AK kit in under an hour...
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