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1/16/2020 9:48:49 PM
Posted: 11/3/2012 11:11:31 AM EST
Hello all,

This is my first post but I've been a longtime lurker for a number of years (Mostly in the AR Forums) anyways:

I want to get my son an AK for Christmas and have been looking around at all the variants and the one I believe I will be settling on is the Saiga 7.62 from Atlantic firearms or Centerfire systems:
Saiga 7.62x39 Rifle with 16" Barrel #SAI-762HC-CEN

My question is how is the quality of this partial conversion? From what I've read the partial conversions are done by Century, correct?
I've handled the Sporter version of this rifle at a shop and the fit and finish is what got me eyeballing the Saigas to begin with compared to other variants that I have handled and since this one is "close enough" and has pretty much all the major parts done I figured the price is about right.

Anybody running one of these and any issues/concerns? The other variant that has been popping up on my radar is the M10 AK47 from Atlantic Firearms.. it's also in the price range I am looking to spend, $500-$600, but I think the Saiga will be the wiser choice.

If anybody wants to share some knowledge I would greatly appreciate it, thanks.



Link Posted: 11/3/2012 1:01:04 PM EST
Honestly... the best AK on the market right now is the Vepr. They take a little work if you want to set them up for milsurp mags (20 minutes to install a bullet guide and file down the mag catch by a couple thousands) and 40$ of extra parts to keep it 922R compliant, but a Vepr conversion is far easier than a Saiga, and the rifles are nicer in the end. Veprs have heavy barrels, chrome-lined everything, and the workmanship on them is excellent. I just got my third, ordered my fourth, and all of them so far have the smoothest action of any AK I've seen. The only negative I can think of on a Vepr is the slant cut reciever, but even that's no big deal, you just need an adapter which are readily available to accept standard AK stocks or a bonesteel side folding mech.
Link Posted: 11/3/2012 1:12:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/3/2012 1:17:29 PM EST by Dragynn]
Link is bad, you mean this one?
http://centerfiresystems.com/SAI-762HC-CEN.aspx

If so, that seems like an awesome price, but I do believe those rifles are being converted by Century, and to some folks that's a roll of the dice I believe. Looks like it's out of stock anyway.

For around that same price, I would try to find an M&M M10 (though they may be all sold out again currently), awesome rifle in the 500 dollar range, already converted in the US, with some decent furniture and a front rail set-up.

I'm looking around today, and seeing a whole lot of things out of stock that were there a couple days ago, panic buying?


*EDIT* Here ya go, Vepr already converted for compliance and has bullet guide installed :
http://www.classicfirearms.com/long-guns/vepr3916hcmc

Comes with a 30 round mag, hammer forged chrome lined barrel, 50% thicker RPK receiver.
Link Posted: 11/3/2012 2:58:23 PM EST
Thanks for the replies...

I also been eyeing the Veprs since Centerfire has them on sale for 499$ for the 7.62 model but was unsure what all is needed to convert them to high cap mags.. the 7.62x54R for 699$ is very tempting but I was planning on getting a Vepr 12 for $999 for myself for Christmas since wifey is going to give me half of the money :)

The M + M 10 I also linked but many of the reviews I read people were mentioning receiving canted sights and that is something I am hesitant about.. best price I could find is $569.

I have to do some more research on the Veprs from Centerfire and see what all is needed for the conversion and how much time it would take, I am sure I could the actual work its just I am limited on much free time lately due to work, but if its something I could knock out in an hour or two then $499 for the VEPR seems like the best deal going, hopefully I can make my mind up before they are all gone at that price.. tick tock...

Ugh! Just looked again at Centerfire and it seems they only have Left handed 7.62s in stock.. grrr..







Link Posted: 11/3/2012 3:08:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/3/2012 3:11:17 PM EST by liquidflesh1349]


Correction! Centerfire has a 7.62 right handed in stock with a 16.5" barrel and integrated sights.. Looks like there is a cap on the end of the barrel, is it threaded underneath? is it pinned? I would like to add a brake to it if its not pinned.
Not sure if I like the looks of the integrated sights tho.. :(

linky:

http://enterfiresystems.com/AKAGUN-VEPR-16IS.aspx

Sorry for the the 2 post in a row, I would have added this to my previous reply but did not notice the *EDIT* button til afterwards.
Link Posted: 11/3/2012 5:03:36 PM EST
Originally Posted By Fr1skyDing0:
Honestly... the best AK on the market right now is the Vepr. They take a little work if you want to set them up for milsurp mags (20 minutes to install a bullet guide and file down the mag catch by a couple thousands) and 40$ of extra parts to keep it 922R compliant, but a Vepr conversion is far easier than a Saiga, and the rifles are nicer in the end. Veprs have heavy barrels, chrome-lined everything, and the workmanship on them is excellent. I just got my third, ordered my fourth, and all of them so far have the smoothest action of any AK I've seen. The only negative I can think of on a Vepr is the slant cut reciever, but even that's no big deal, you just need an adapter which are readily available to accept standard AK stocks or a bonesteel side folding mech.


Concur 100%.
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 4:33:59 AM EST
Thanks guys, I went ahead last night and ordered a Vepr 7.62 w/16.5" barrel from Centerfire for $499. The only right handed model left in stock was the version with integrated sights so that is what I had to order.
The integrated sight model, is it any less desireable than the standard AK style sights? Seems the front sight distance is dramatically decreased, wonder how that would affect accuracy (of course mostly depends on shooter).

Also, from what I understand, the gas tube is 1" longer, does this have any affect on what style aftermarket hand guards I can use? Personally I dig the furniture on the VEPR, if it was mine I would strip the finish and stain it black like the stock on
the VEPR12 (I love that black woodgrain!) but this is for my son and I am a little worried that the wood furniture may be a little too heavy for his liking at the moment and might need to lighten it up with some polymer if needed.

In case you are wondering about my concern with the wood furniture weight, my son is 11. He is very proeffecient with the handling and firing of his rifles as he has been doing since his first rifle at age 8 (.22 rifle) and has recieved at least one or two guns a year since then. I am carrying on the tradition that my parents did with me as they bought me a gun every year as I was growing up since I had shown much interest also and they felt it was something that I could keep practically forever and would have something to show for in the end over the years. He has a Ruger 10-22, a Ruger 77-22, Remington 700 BDL .243 and 22-250, Smith-Wesson MP15-22 AR, Browning Invector 20 gauge shotgun and his first handgun last year a Sig Mosquito (i know.. should have bought a Buckmark, but so far it has had only few feed issues with junk ammo), For Easter I plan on purchasing him a Marlin 30-30 for his first hunting trip. Oh and he still gets toys, dirt bikes and whatever electronic items also, not just "weapons" hehe.

In the end I thank all you guys for offering advice, doing some reading I feel that the VEPR probably is the best deal going, especially at the $499 price. I just hope someone will have the VEPR 12 in stock when I go to order it for myself
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 5:56:46 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/4/2012 5:59:38 AM EST by Fr1skyDing0]
I just got done with my Vepr 7.62x.39 conversion three days ago, I have the model with the integrated sights on mine. They're threaded underneath a blind pinned barrel cap, you can easily drill the pin out with a 3/16ths drillbit and about 10 minutes of your time. It's a standard 1/14LH thread and will fit pretty much any AK muzzle device. To get a standard milsurp mag to fit and feed you need a bullet guide, Carolina Shooter Supply sells a kit that includes the correct sized drillbit and tap, plus the guide and screw for 19$, and you'll need one for a round trunnion. Anyone remotely competent with basic shop tools can do the bullet guide install in about 20 minutes, you just have to drill a hole, tap it, and screw in the bullet guide. The magazine catches on the Veprs are a little too long inside the reciever to accept a standard magazine, so they need to either be filed or (as I did) carefuly dremel'ed out with a carbide cutter by a couple thousanths. Again this took no longer than 10 minutes to do. The PG conversion is MUCH easier than a Saiga because you don't have to drill out any rivets and move the trigger group foward, basically everything's already been done for you.

They are a fairly hefty rifle, but not too bad as far as AK's go. I liken them to a Mak-90 or something of that nature. If you really want a light AK, I'd go with a long barreled AKSU, but those are pricey and can be finicky. My 106UR set me back about 1100, and it's never functioned right. Arsenal has it right now, but they claim they can't find anything wrong with it and they've had it since August. I've been thoroughly unimpressed with them.

I'll have a 7.62x54R Vepr coming in hopefully within the next week or so, and I plan on ordering a 5.45x39 version before they go off sale tomorrow afternoon. The price is right, they're well worth the money. I can't think of a better AK I can buy for 500$ honestly. Ronin grips even sells a Robarms lookalike stock kit for the guns to make them look like Vepr K's if you're into that sort of thing.
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 6:14:08 AM EST
Originally Posted By Fr1skyDing0:
I just got done with my Vepr 7.62x.39 conversion three days ago, I have the model with the integrated sights on mine. They're threaded underneath a blind pinned barrel cap, you can easily drill the pin out with a 3/16ths drillbit and about 10 minutes of your time. It's a standard 1/14LH thread and will fit pretty much any AK muzzle device. To get a standard milsurp mag to fit and feed you need a bullet guide, Carolina Shooter Supply sells a kit that includes the correct sized drillbit and tap, plus the guide and screw for 19$, and you'll need one for a round trunnion. Anyone remotely competent with basic shop tools can do the bullet guide install in about 20 minutes, you just have to drill a hole, tap it, and screw in the bullet guide. The magazine catches on the Veprs are a little too long inside the reciever to accept a standard magazine, so they need to either be filed or (as I did) carefuly dremel'ed out with a carbide cutter by a couple thousanths. Again this took no longer than 10 minutes to do. The PG conversion is MUCH easier than a Saiga because you don't have to drill out any rivets and move the trigger group foward, basically everything's already been done for you.

They are a fairly hefty rifle, but not too bad as far as AK's go. I liken them to a Mak-90 or something of that nature. If you really want a light AK, I'd go with a long barreled AKSU, but those are pricey and can be finicky. My 106UR set me back about 1100, and it's never functioned right. Arsenal has it right now, but they claim they can't find anything wrong with it and they've had it since August. I've been thoroughly unimpressed with them.

I'll have a 7.62x54R Vepr coming in hopefully within the next week or so, and I plan on ordering a 5.45x39 version before they go off sale tomorrow afternoon. The price is right, they're well worth the money. I can't think of a better AK I can buy for 500$ honestly. Ronin grips even sells a Robarms lookalike stock kit for the guns to make them look like Vepr K's if you're into that sort of thing.

All that work and no pics? We'd Love to see the finished product. Congratulations!!

Link Posted: 11/4/2012 7:28:14 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/4/2012 7:45:38 AM EST by Dragynn]
Originally Posted By topcote:

All that work and no pics? We'd Love to see the finished product. Congratulations!!



+1. pics please!

*EDIT* OP, here is Dinzags guide with pics to installing the bullet guide: http://www.dinzagarms.com/downloads/bg_install.pdf
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 8:50:43 AM EST
Alright, twist my arm. The stock and PG aren't going to be final, I just had them laying around until I can save a little more money to order the colors I want. I've got a Spikes Dynacomp on the end, that's a keeper. Haven't decided on my optics choice yet, but I have a TRS-25 mini dot on it for the moment. Ordinarily I'd just go combloc on it, but I'm looking seriously at a Mepro M21. The integrated sight models have better handling characteristics IMO than the standard models because of reduced swing weight, but make no mistake, this has a thicker reciever and a heavy barrel, this will be a heavier gun.



With the Bonesteel right side folder I attached a QD mount and a cheapo bungee sling I've had since my airsofting days. The Bonesteel folder is a drop in unit, it screws into the existing holes in the rear trunnion, no gunsmithing required. It's a milspec diameter tube. I don't like galil style hinges, I prefer push button interfaces, but this stock works pretty well.



To be honest, the right folding Bonesteel stock when folded blocks you from pretty much using the rifle if you're right handed, but really the only reason I have the folding stock is for storage, carry and transport in tight spaces, and it does allow me to still use my side optics mount. It does hang nicely because the QD mount is in the perfect spot, right over the firing hand on the left side of the rifle.




Anyway sorry to thread-jack, but if you want to do a Vepr conversion down the road this is pretty much what they look like. I've got a bunch of AK's all over the spectrum, this is tied with my SLR101 as my favorite.
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 8:58:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 11/4/2012 9:06:19 AM EST by AnnaConda]
Can get one of those yugo underfolders. Classic firearms around 650 with shooter package.

Vepr is better IMO but its also very different. And if you plan to customize it in the future ( like everybody else) price goes up very quickly.

Price tag of my 308 after all add-ons went from 720 to 1080. Add 6 mags and we got 1380$.
Link Posted: 11/4/2012 2:24:07 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/4/2012 2:24:27 PM EST by Dragynn]
Originally Posted By Fr1skyDing0:
Alright, twist my arm. The stock and PG aren't going to be final, I just had them laying around until I can save a little more money to order the colors I want. I've got a Spikes Dynacomp on the end, that's a keeper. Haven't decided on my optics choice yet, but I have a TRS-25 mini dot on it for the moment. Ordinarily I'd just go combloc on it, but I'm looking seriously at a Mepro M21. The integrated sight models have better handling characteristics IMO than the standard models because of reduced swing weight, but make no mistake, this has a thicker reciever and a heavy barrel, this will be a heavier gun.

http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s496/wvmoon556/DSC04048.jpg

With the Bonesteel right side folder I attached a QD mount and a cheapo bungee sling I've had since my airsofting days. The Bonesteel folder is a drop in unit, it screws into the existing holes in the rear trunnion, no gunsmithing required. It's a milspec diameter tube. I don't like galil style hinges, I prefer push button interfaces, but this stock works pretty well.

http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s496/wvmoon556/DSC04049.jpg

To be honest, the right folding Bonesteel stock when folded blocks you from pretty much using the rifle if you're right handed, but really the only reason I have the folding stock is for storage, carry and transport in tight spaces, and it does allow me to still use my side optics mount. It does hang nicely because the QD mount is in the perfect spot, right over the firing hand on the left side of the rifle.

http://i1054.photobucket.com/albums/s496/wvmoon556/DSC04053.jpg


Anyway sorry to thread-jack, but if you want to do a Vepr conversion down the road this is pretty much what they look like. I've got a bunch of AK's all over the spectrum, this is tied with my SLR101 as my favorite.


Nice! I kinda want one of those Bonesteel stocks, but don't want a folder, at least not for the .308.

Now i'm wanting an x39, i'm worried that vepr's may be my new addiction.

Link Posted: 11/20/2012 11:57:26 AM EST
Roughly how much weight does the RPK receiver veprs are built on add vs a Saiga?
Link Posted: 11/20/2012 4:10:59 PM EST
Hey Fr1skyDing0, how did you deal with the little gouge in the barrel from the pin that held that front cap on the threads?
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