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ATI Galil? (Page 3 of 4)
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Link Posted: 8/20/2019 9:35:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/23/2019 6:02:08 PM EDT by DillyCleo]
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Originally Posted By centermass69:
2nd attempt with this rifle. Disassembled rifle cleaned all the grease out of it, then went through 5 surplus mags cleaned/lubed reassembled.

Again attempted test fire. Bolt slides over cartridge about every other round smashing unfired casing. FTF after FTF tried 5 surplus mags and tapco that came with rifle. same results with all.

flash hider was also finger tight as well.

Also missing rear night sight.

Save your money until this company can get it right.
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I've had issues with surplus mags as well. I have some that will work. In all cases in the mags that work the bottom edge of the mag reinforcing plate on the side of the mag will be parallel with the contour of the receiver.  The mags that won't work are at a slight angle (more of the plate is visible below the line of the receiver) - towards the back. So basically the backs of these mags are lower in the receiver and the bolt over rides the rounds.  So I can basically tell visually which mags will work and which won't - by the degree to which the mag reinforcing side plates are parallel to the receiver.

I suspect that the problem lies with the cut of the ATI receiver on the back edge of the mag well - in that it may not be cut deep enough to allow the back edge of the surplus mag to swing up into the receiver far enough for the bolt to pick up a round. It seems that the radius cut in the back two corners of the magwell interferes with the back corners of the mag.

BEFORE I touch the receiver I'm going to try to take a little metal off the back edge of one of the mags that sits too low - in order to see if I can get it to ride higher in the mag well.

OK - so I went into my shop area with one of the mags that wouldn't feed a round - where the bolt would over ride the cartridge - a mag whose bottom of the side plate on the mag was not parallel to the receiver on the ejection port side.  I took a file - and worked the back side of the mag - above the locking lug. I took some material off the back and and rounded the back edge corners.   In addition I filed some material off the TOP flat surface of the magazine's rear locking lug - the TOP.  The more material you take off the TOP of the mag lug the higher the mag will ride (at the rear) into the mag well.  The mag seemed to insert deeper into the mag well - the side plate was more parallel to the receiver than it had been - it was more like the other mags that I found that would cycle properly in the rifle.  I loaded three dummy rounds in the mag and they all cycled and ejected properly.  The proof the pudding of course will be to see if it works properly at the range - but that's for another day.  So I basically took a surplus mag that would not cycle rounds and turned it around with a little filing - particularly on the TOP flat of the mags rear lug (the more you remove the higher the mag will insert). Make sure you are judicious in filing the lug - don't go off the deep end.

I think this confirms my opinion that the back edge of the mag well of the ATI receiver is not cut deep enough to allow surplus mags to swing back and in/up into the mag well.  I will eventually "dress" the back radius cuts on the receivers magwell.

Day two of trying to figure this out.

Still experiencing some intermittent problems.  Again the fundamental problem is that the rear of the mag is sitting too low in the magwell and the bolt is overriding the cartridges.

So I stripped the rifle down and compared it to a factory IMI Galil that I have that runs perfectly. I also compared it to a cut receiver piece that I have in a parts kit (with the trigger guard and mag release assembly still attached).  The one measurement that sticks out like a sore thumb is that on the Galil and the receiver piece from the parts kit the thickness of the receiver at the bottom rear of the magwell is 1/8"  (4/32").  The thickness of the receiver on the Galeo is 5/32". The Galeo receiver in this area is 1/32" thicker (.03125").  So the net effect is that it is keeping mags lower (from the bolt) by this thickness - 1/32" - because the rear lug on the mag keeps the rear of mag lower because of this extra thickness. The height difference is actually a little more than 1/32 because if you look closer there is a little depression in Galil receiver (where the rear lug of the mag lug rests) that enables the mag to ride even higher.  So the difference is actually a little closer to 1/16"

Before I go to the expense of having this extra 1/16" machined from the Galeo, I'm going to double down on the filing that I am doing on one of the surplus mags - and take as much metal off as it takes to get the mag to cycle reliably.  My worst case scenario here is that I still have a Galeo that runs with Tapco mags and I'm only out the cost of a surplus Galil mag if I happen to take too much metal off the lug.

Day three of trying to figure this out.

At least with my rifle I THINK I have this figured out. I took two EXEC to LIKE NEW IMI 35rd surplus mags (that I bought from Numrich for $23 each) and modified the top of the mag's rear locking lug by filing (machining) 1/16" of the lug's thickness off. The measurement of the lug's thickness was done at the tip - which is a little difficult because of the lugs underside taper.  But nominally a new mag's lug measures 1/8" (at the tip). So I reduced the lug's thickness in half (by filing from the top down).

So both of these mags now sit 1/16" higher into the mag well (because the top of the lug is not restricting it - the restriction has been reduced by 1/16".  The mags fit looser (much like Tapco mags fit - a little loose at the back).  They reliably dry cycle 5 dummy cartridges in a cycling sequencing. I'm beginning to believe that a little "looseness" at the back of the mag is a good thing - and that a tight fitting IMI mag just compounds the problem - makes it more difficult for the bolt to strip a round out of the mag.  Just think about the little wobble that the Tapco mags have at the back - it doesn't seem to be a problem for them. The rifle still needs to go to the range.

This is clearly an interim (although workable) fix for those of us who want to use IMI 35 rd steel surplus mags.  However, the proper/correct fix would be to remove the mag catch assembly from the bottom of the receiver (removing the four rivets that hold it in place), machining material from the bottom of the receiver (see day two comments) and then reattaching the mag catch assembly to the receiver with rivets or machine screws.  This would have the effect of raising the back of the mag to the correct height - while retaining the proper relationship between the top of the mag catch lever and the underside of the mag lug.  With this fix you would not have to file on the back of the mag lug.

NOTE:  One other little complicating factor.  There is a difference in the spacing between the top of the magazine catch and the underside of the receiver - between the Galil and the ATI.  There is less open space above the ATI's mag catch than there is in the Galil - 1/32" less space.  The ATI is going to hold the mag tighter than the Galil. The fact that there is more "slop" in the Galil than there is in the ATI has a bearing on how tight the rifles mag is held in the magwell.  I think that's in part why my taking 1/16" off the top of the locking lug has resulted in a mag that sits higher in the mag well but is not overly "sloppy".  This same mag in the Galil would be much too "sloppy" to function reliably.


THE FIX:
  I even contacted Mark Graham with the idea of sending it to him. But after thinking about it I realized that I didn't want to go to that expense or trouble for what is basically a plinker/shooter. If I had the problem with a real Galil that would be another story. I just did not want to put another dime in this rifle.

So I mustered up the courage and went full bore this morning. I got out the one tool that BUBBA can't live without - the Dremel. And after summoning up the courage from my Polish ancestors I cut a little notch in the underside of the receiver at the back of the mag well - the area where the rear mag lug engages the underside of the receiver. I went to work - and relieved the area. See the photo. I touched it up with a little cold blue - and voila! I can now insert surplus IMI 35rd steel mags - and get THEM to reliably dry cycle dummy rounds. I do not have to file down the top of the rear mag lugs. The tops of the mags are virtually touching the underside of the rails inside the receiver.

Tapco mags function just as before - but now I have a pretty good expectation that surplus mags will function just fine when I get to the range. The bolt no longer over rides the mag!  The rifle now cycles dummy rounds without a hitch - without an exception - something it RARELY did before I started on this quest.

I have this thread running on another discussion board as well - and the only way I could figure out how to post a pic here was to provide a link to the photo I posted over on there

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=92149&d=1566572867
Link Posted: 8/22/2019 2:25:42 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/22/2019 2:26:09 PM EDT by josefius]
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Originally Posted By 14BoltFF:

I see what you mean now. Interesting observation. An image search of Galils shows that all of them have it except for these ATI ones. Even the ACE stock on one of my AKs has the reinforcement.

http://i64.tinypic.com/rlg9p1.jpg

http://i66.tinypic.com/2mq7nfm.jpg
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Mine came with a spacer.
Link Posted: 8/22/2019 2:40:37 PM EDT
Thanks for continuing to trouble-shoot guys, I am following these developments with interest.
Link Posted: 8/22/2019 2:47:02 PM EDT
So much potential but these issues are out of a possible
Link Posted: 8/26/2019 7:52:18 PM EDT
Much to Classic Firearms credit they posted my review of the Galeo (un-edited and with the submitted photo)

https://www.classicfirearms.com/ati-atiggaleo556p18-galeo-poly-18-30rd/
Link Posted: 9/7/2019 12:10:01 PM EDT
I finally got mine to the range and I am happy to report that with surplus unissued grade mags it is 100% reliable. Tapco's were also reliable. Used surplus mags were problematic with the reported issue of alternating rounds not being picked up. Accuracy was excellent. Head shots at the 25 yd indoor range offhand were boringly easy. This rifle is a keeper.
Link Posted: 9/14/2019 3:47:38 AM EDT
Anybody else have time to take theirs to the range? So surplus steel mags are hit or miss (and we're sure it's the mags, and not the receiver dimensions)?
Link Posted: 9/14/2019 6:45:57 AM EDT
I think the dimensions are off enough that perfect mags work but those worn and not 100% let you down. I ordered more of the "like new" grade mags after my last range trip. If they start to fail me with time then I'll start making adjustments to the firearm. Right now that isn't necessary or a concern to me.
Link Posted: 9/14/2019 10:11:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2019 10:12:43 PM EDT by flyer]
I took both of mine out and had issues with two new mags.  Bolt overrode and damaged rounds in both rifles and both mags.
Link Posted: 9/16/2019 8:50:29 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By flyer:
I took both of mine out and had issues with two new mags.  Bolt overrode and damaged rounds in both rifles and both mags.
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I was using Malaysian 5.56 M193.  Does anyone think ammo choice could play a part with steel mags?  Also, where are you getting like new surplus mags?
Link Posted: 9/17/2019 8:22:57 AM EDT
Numrich Arms has them in stock. That's who I ordered them from. As to the ammunition that I used, it was Federal XM193 ball.
Link Posted: 9/17/2019 8:26:45 AM EDT
This thread makes me glad I went the parts kit/Jeff Miller build route.
Link Posted: 9/21/2019 8:59:09 PM EDT
Keep shooting it it gets better also clean the inside of steel mags specially the used Israelis.
Link Posted: 9/24/2019 7:35:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/24/2019 7:35:54 PM EDT by HaveBlue83]
just held.one today, got excited! found this thread

PASS! THX guys for posting up.

once again, nobody can make a galil unless its soft or cant use OEM Mags, unless you send it to a builder. HOW DID IMI make these work so well?!
Link Posted: 9/25/2019 10:14:55 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By HaveBlue83:
just held.one today, got excited! found this thread

PASS! THX guys for posting up.

once again, nobody can make a galil unless its soft or cant use OEM Mags, unless you send it to a builder. HOW DID IMI make these work so well?!
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They did design and manufacture the original receiver according their own original blueprints. That probably helped a little.

IMI building guns in the 80s to defend their homeland against every one of their neighbors that wanted to annihilate them probably had slightly more resources at their disposal and motivation to get it right than ORF, Century, and ATI put together.
Link Posted: 12/28/2019 11:17:32 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/8/2020 9:06:48 PM EDT by 14BoltFF]
Aim Surplus has 7 wood handguard Galeos in stock if anyone still has interest in these.

Edit: Sold out again as of 1/8/2020.

FWIW I have had zero problems with mine over the months using Tapco mags. I stocked up on Tapcos and got away from using the surplus mags in it. I still want to get it to play well with the surplus mags eventually.

ETA, I noticed this information in the description for the Galeo on AIM's website:

The American Tactical manufactured Galeo receiver was designed to utilize a US made Tapco brand magazine. The use of a US made magazine with the Galeo rifle meets the requirements of 18 USC 922r for rifles built with imported components. It is the responsibility of the end user to maintain compliance with 18 US 922r regulations in operating and maintaining their Galeo Rifles. For more information on 18 USC 922r compliance, please visit https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/922
Due to variations in manufacturer specifications and wear conditions, American Tactical cannot guarantee these rifles will operate with surplus Galil magazines. If you are attempting to use surplus magazines in your Galeo rifle, American Tactical recommends performing general maintenance and cleaning of the magazine before attempting to operate it. Failure for a Galeo to operate with a surplus magazine is not covered under warranty, as we only recommend using new manufactured US made magazines with your rifle.
Limited Lifetime Warranty and Product Return Policy Please Click Link For Further Details: http://www.americantactical.us/warranty.html
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Link Posted: 1/5/2020 8:23:51 PM EDT
How about accuracy? What size groups at 100 is everyone getting?
Link Posted: 1/6/2020 11:04:24 PM EDT
Assuming all the barrels are the same(Green Mountain), my home builds are about 2.5-3.0 MOA with iron sights.
Link Posted: 1/7/2020 12:06:22 AM EDT
Thats good
Link Posted: 1/29/2020 12:58:36 PM EDT
That estimate sounds right about what I'm seeing for accuracy. It was better than I expected.
Link Posted: 1/29/2020 2:14:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/29/2020 2:17:41 PM EDT by tucoelpistolero]
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Originally Posted By GOH:
Assuming all the barrels are the same(Green Mountain), my home builds are about 2.5-3.0 MOA with iron sights.
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My Rifle did well with my reloads 1.75 to 2.25 at 100 yards but did 3.25 to 4.5 with the Wolf ammo (using sled rifle rest).
Link Posted: 1/29/2020 7:23:52 PM EDT
My first Galeo had issues with zeroing. Had to crank the front sight all the way to the left and was still not on. Come to find that the top cover had some wobble in it, and comparing it to a buddy’s Golani that had zero play, I suspect that was the issue. This past weekend I saw a gun shop in the area had 3 in stock, so I went to take a look. Two of them had the same wobble in the top cover, but the third was solid, so I picked it up and sold off my original. I need to get to the range to live fire it.
Link Posted: 2/4/2020 12:55:55 PM EDT
My LGS currently has 3 in stock, one with the wooden HG and two with the black R4 handguards. All are priced at $999.99, and am sorely tempted. Have always wanted a Galil or a clone but don't like the prospect of them not being more reliable with surplus orig steel mags. I would prefer a 16" to the 18" bbl as well. What to do?
Link Posted: 2/5/2020 8:58:47 PM EDT
If anyone needs Tapco magazines for their Galil/Galeo, I would recommend stocking up on them sooner rather than later. I just learned that along with DPMS and Bushmaster, Remington is also killing off Tapco.
Link Posted: 2/19/2020 9:32:36 PM EDT
It looks like the supply of Tapco Galil magazines is dried up already since Tapco is gone. That didn't take long. The non-availability of the one magazine that works 100% in this rifle without mods will not help future sales of the Galeo. If anyone comes across any in-stock sources for the Tapco Galil mags, please post for those who didn't stock up.
Link Posted: 2/19/2020 10:02:31 PM EDT
Mine, luckily, works well with new condition surplus mags. I also have a supply of Tapcos
Link Posted: 2/22/2020 10:16:31 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By 14BoltFF:
It looks like the supply of Tapco Galil magazines is dried up already since Tapco is gone. That didn't take long. The non-availability of the one magazine that works 100% in this rifle without mods will not help future sales of the Galeo. If anyone comes across any in-stock sources for the Tapco Galil mags, please post for those who didn't stock up.
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Galati international has some tapco galil/golani mags for sale.

Tampa Tactical Supply had some Tapco Galil/golani mags for sale as well.

Most everyone else sold out.

I ordered from Galati Int'l and received the mags a few days later, quick shipping.
Link Posted: 2/23/2020 11:41:57 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By bmwguy:

Galati international has some tapco galil/golani mags for sale.

Tampa Tactical Supply had some Tapco Galil/golani mags for sale as well.

Most everyone else sold out.

I ordered from Galati Int'l and received the mags a few days later, quick shipping.
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Not a horrible price, either. Galati International Tapco Galil mags.
Link Posted: 2/24/2020 10:48:52 PM EDT
I just picked one up, here in Alaska. Wood handguard model, $1049 OTD. I have something like 80 original mags for the damned Galils, and nothing to shoot them with, lol. That changed today, I'm sure I'll be able to get it running with original mags.

I still have to go through it and tear it down for a cleaning, and then range time will tell all. Should be fun. I'll probably start setting it up as an R4.
Link Posted: 2/29/2020 1:24:36 PM EDT
I got one about a month ago. Living in NJ they took out the Tapco mag, so I had to order a blocked surplus mag. It was a little bit tight initially, but always locked in fine, works great never had any stoppages. only about 300 rounds thru it. There is a gunshow next week hoping to pick up some more mags. So far so good. I really like this rifle just got an original bipod and sling for it. Now looking for a carry handle setup next. Only issue I had with this was putting the AK Mastermount on it. I guess the receiver may be out of spec because I had to shorten the mounting pin/screws by about 1/16" to get it tight.
Link Posted: 2/29/2020 6:25:50 PM EDT
Did you all catch the Galil bipods coming on the market now?

Apex had them but sold out.

ATI now has them for sale @ 69.95 in limited quantities.  it's the old style and not the quick detach type.

Get them while you can.
Link Posted: 2/29/2020 7:33:09 PM EDT
The old style bipod works out fine. I don't need QD for this.
Link Posted: 5/4/2020 12:56:25 AM EDT
I picked one up with my trump bucks

So far I like it. About 120 rounds put through it on the Tapco mag

Up to 9 tapco mags now. Ill be taking it out on the 16th to shoot a few hundred through,  then in june I'll be putting 3-400 more rounds through it with both tapco mags and a surplus mag or 2, if I modify them or not.

I really hope I can put a positive review in for it on here and change some opinions of the naysayers  

Had one case split in half in the initial 120 rounds. Checked headspace, Go- Closed, No-Go- did not close, Field Gauge - not even a chance of closing. I chocked it up to the ammunition which was winchester. I've had some past problems with winchester shotgun ammunition so ill put my blame on them.

Want to add a note to mag availability (tapco) .... ATI has them sporadically on their website, gunmagwarehouse had some when I bought 4 (use a credit card and lock it after, heard of card compromises), and gunbroker has them a lot of time. They're out there, you just gotta search around.  

Future predictions would be either ATI making them in house, contracting with remmington to buy them using older tapco machinery, if magpul made them,  it would be cool, ATI redesigning the receiver and using surplus mags, or adding an AR15 magazine adapter into the mix.
Link Posted: 5/6/2020 5:30:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ShotThera­py_JR:
I picked one up with my trump buck­s 

So far I like it. About 120 rounds put through it on the Tapco­ mag

Up to 9 tapco mags now. Ill be taking it out on the 16th to shoot a ­few hundred through,  then in june I'll be pu­tting 3-400 more rounds through it with both tapco ma­gs and a surplus mag or 2, if I modify them o­r not. 

I really hope I can put a positive r­eview in for it on here and change some opini­ons of the naysayers  

Had one case sp­lit in half in the initial 120 rounds. Checked headspace, Go- Closed, No-Go- did not close, Field Gauge - not even a chance of closing. I chocked it up to the ammunition which was ­winchester. I've had some past problems with winchester ­shotgun ammunition so ill put my blame on the­m. 

Want to add a note to mag availabili­ty (tapco) .... ATI has them sporadically on their website, ­gunmagwarehouse had some when I bought 4 (use­ a credit card and lock it after, heard of ca­rd compromises), and gunbroker has them a lot­ of time. They're out there, you just gotta search aro­und.  

Future predictions would be either ­ATI making them in house, contracting with re­mmington to buy them using older tapco machin­ery, if magpul made them,  it would be cool, ­ATI redesigning the receiver and using surplu­s mags, or adding an AR15 magazine adapter in­to the mix.
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I wish you good luck on using the metal mags. I need to bust mine out - I haven't shot it at all yet this year.
Link Posted: 5/8/2020 5:11:23 PM EDT
Update. Around 300 rounds theough the pipe so far

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File



This is with Cheap Red Army Standard 55gr ammunition  at 100 yards

Fucking. Junk.

I blame the failure on the ammo since the bullet went into the casing, probably a loose seated round

The accuracy is probably  1/5th my fault

Here's 50 yards with match grade ammo out of my AR10

Attachment Attached File


Probably 3/5ths the ammos fault

And 1/5th the Bear Creek Arsenal Barrel

But holy shit. For $1200 I'd expect at least somewhat accuracy at 100 yards. This was just plain embarrassing.

I am not that bad of a shot. Im no expert but I would've been happy with 7MOA. This is ridiculous.
Link Posted: 5/8/2020 5:22:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/8/2020 7:51:30 PM EDT
I try not to put weak Russian steel case Ammo through any rifle that I like. It just wastes your time and money. Get some good NATO spec Ammo for that rifle and don’t look back.
Link Posted: 5/8/2020 10:13:55 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By wreckless:
I try not to put weak Russian stee­l case Ammo through any rifle that I like. It just wastes your time and money. Get some good NATO spec Ammo for that rifle ­and don’t look back.
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I will put a variety of ammunition through it next weekend at 50 yards. 6 brands. 20-30 rounds each of the 6 bullseyes on the target. If i can't get at least 6MOA out of it by then,  well, might as rebarrel it at that point

Cheap rusky ammo in my AKs generally garner about 5MOA or less for me, so this is surprising
Link Posted: 5/9/2020 5:37:36 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By DillyCleo:



I've had issues with s­urplus mags as well. I have some that will work. In all cases in the mags that work the botto­m edge of the mag reinforcing plate on the si­de of the mag will be parallel with the conto­ur of the receiver.  The mags that won't work are at a slight an­gle (more of the plate is visible below the l­ine of the receiver) - towards the back. So basically the backs of these mags are low­er in the receiver and the bolt over rides th­e rounds.  So I can basically tell visually which mags­ will work and which won't - by the degree to which the mag reinforcing s­ide plates are parallel to the receiver.

I suspect that the problem lies with ­the cut of the ATI receiver on the back edge ­of the mag well - in that it may not be cut deep enough to all­ow the back edge of the surplus mag to swing ­up into the receiver far enough for the bolt ­to pick up a round. It seems that the radius cut in the back two­ corners of the magwell interferes with the b­ack corners of the mag.

BEFORE I touch the receiver I'm going­ to try to take a little metal off the back e­dge of one of the mags that sits too low - in order to see if I can get it to ride high­er in the mag well. 

OK - so I went into my shop area with one of the ­mags that wouldn't feed a round - where the bolt would over ride the cartridge­ - a mag whose bottom of the side plate on the ­mag was not parallel to the receiver on the e­jection port side.  I took a file - and worked the back side of the mag - above the locking lug. I took some material off the back and and ro­unded the back edge corners.   In addition I filed some material off the ­TOP flat surface of the magazine's rear locki­ng lug - the TOP.  The more material you take off the TOP of t­he mag lug the higher the mag will ride (at t­he rear) into the mag well.  The mag seemed to insert deeper into the ma­g well - the side plate was more parallel to the rece­iver than it had been - it was more like the other mags that I found­ that would cycle properly in the rifle.  I loaded three dummy rounds in the mag and ­they all cycled and ejected properly.  The proof the pudding of course will be to ­see if it works properly at the range - but that's for another day.  So I basically took a surplus mag that woul­d not cycle rounds and turned it around with ­a little filing - particularly on the TOP flat of the mags rea­r lug (the more you remove the higher the mag­ will insert). Make sure you are judicious in filing the lu­g - don't go off the deep end.

I think this confirms my opinion that­ the back edge of the mag well of the ATI rec­eiver is not cut deep enough to allow surplus­ mags to swing back and in/up into the mag well.  I will eventually "dress" the back radius c­uts on the receivers magwell.

Day two of trying to figure t­his out.

Still experiencing some interm­ittent problems.  Again the fundamental problem is that the r­ear of the mag is sitting too low in the magw­ell and the bolt is overriding the cartridges.

So I stripped the rifle down and comp­ared it to a factory IMI Galil that I have th­at runs perfectly. I also compared it to a cut receiver piece t­hat I have in a parts kit (with the trigger g­uard and mag release assembly still attached).  The one measurement that sticks out like a ­sore thumb is that on the Galil and the recei­ver piece from the parts kit the thickness of­ the receiver at the bottom rear of the magwe­ll is 1/8"  (4/32").  The thickness of the receiver on the Galeo ­is 5/32". The Galeo receiver in this area is ­1/32" thicker (.03125").  So the net effect is that it is keeping mag­s lower (from the bolt) by this thickness - 1/32" - because the rear lug on the mag keeps the re­ar of mag lower because of this extra thickne­ss. The height difference is actually a little m­ore than 1/32 because if you look closer there is a litt­le depression in Galil receiver (where the re­ar lug of the mag lug rests) that enables the­ mag to ride even higher.  So the difference is actually a little clos­er to 1/16"

Before I go to the expense of havi­ng this extra 1/16" machined from the Galeo, I'm going to dou­ble down on the filing that I am doing on one­ of the surplus mags - and take as much metal off as it takes to ge­t the mag to cycle reliably.  My worst case scenario here is that I still­ have a Galeo that runs with Tapco mags and I­'m only out the cost of a surplus Galil mag i­f I happen to take too much metal off the lug.


Day three of trying to fi­gure this out.

At least with my rifle I THINK­ I have this figured out. I took two EXEC to LIKE NEW IMI 35rd surplus­ mags (that I bought from Numrich for $23 eac­h) and modified the top of the mag's rear loc­king lug by filing (machining) 1/16" of the lug's thickness off. The measurement of the lug's thickness was d­one at the tip - which is a little difficult because of the l­ugs underside taper.  But nominally a new mag's lug measures 1/8" (at the tip). So I reduced the lug's thickness in half (by­ filing from the top down).

So both of these mags now sit 1/16" higher into the mag well (because the top­ of the lug is not restricting it - the restriction has been reduced by 1/16".  The mags fit looser (much like Tapco mags f­it - a little loose at the back).  They reliably dry cycle 5 dummy cartridges ­in a cycling sequencing. I'm beginning to believe that a little "loos­eness" at the back of the mag is a good thing­ - and that a tight fitting IMI mag just compou­nds the problem - makes it more difficult for the bolt to stri­p a round out of the mag.  Just think about the little wobble that the­ Tapco mags have at the back - it doesn't seem to be a problem for them. The rifle still needs to go to the range.

This is clearly an interim (although ­workable) fix for those of us who want to use­ IMI 35 rd steel surplus mags.  However, the proper/correct fix would be to remove the mag catch ­assembly from the bottom of the receiver (rem­oving the four rivets that hold it in place),­ machining material from the bottom of the re­ceiver (see day two comments) and then reatta­ching the mag catch assembly to the receiver ­with rivets or machine screws.  This would have the effect of raising the b­ack of the mag to the correct height - while retaining the proper relationship betw­een the top of the mag catch lever and the un­derside of the mag lug.  With this fix you would not have to file on­ the back of the mag lug.

NOTE:  One other little complicating factor.  There is a difference in the spacing betwee­n the top of the magazine catch and the under­side of the receiver - between the Galil and the ATI.  There is less open space above the ATI's ma­g catch than there is in the Galil - 1/32" less space.  The ATI is going to hold the mag tighter th­an the Galil. The fact that there is more "slop" in the Ga­lil than there is in the ATI has a bearing on­ how tight the rifles mag is held in the magw­ell.  I think that's in part why my taking 1/16" off the top of the locking lug has result­ed in a mag that sits higher in the mag well ­but is not overly "sloppy".  This same mag in the Galil would be much to­o "sloppy" to function reliably.


THE FIX:
   I even contacted Mark Graham with t­he idea of sending it to him. But after thinking about it I realized that ­I didn't want to go to that expense or troubl­e for what is basically a plinker/shooter. If I had the problem with a real Galil that ­would be another story. I just did not want to put another dime in t­his rifle.

So I mustered up the courage and went­ full bore this morning. I got out the one tool that BUBBA can't live­ without - the Dremel. And after summoning up the courage from my P­olish ancestors I cut a little notch in the u­nderside of the receiver at the back of the m­ag well - the area where the rear mag lug engages the ­underside of the receiver. I went to work - and relieved the area. See the photo. I touched it up with a little cold blue - and voila! I can now insert surplus IMI 35rd­ steel mags - and get THEM to reliably dry cycle dummy rou­nds. I do not have to file down the top of the re­ar mag lugs. The tops of the mags are virtually touching ­the underside of the rails inside the receive­r.

Tapco mags function just as before - but now I have a pretty good expectation tha­t surplus mags will function just fine when I­ get to the range. The bolt no longer over rides the mag!  The ­rifle now cycles dummy rounds without a hitch­ - without an exception - something it RARELY did before I started on ­this quest.

I have this thread running on another­ discussion board as well - and the only way I could figure out how to p­ost a pic here was to provide a link to the p­hoto I posted over on there

http://www.falfiles.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=92149&d=1566572867
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Ok got my ATI Galil clone in on Wednesday. It had wood hand guards and they were noticed for the carrying handle. I corrected the mag well as per DillyCleo’s instructions as stated about. Everything turn out just like his.. It did not take to long, you just have to go slow at it. Now all my mags fit great and function as should.
Link Posted: 5/9/2020 9:16:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By marcus581­9:


Ok got my ATI Galil clone ­in on Wednesday. It had wood hand guards and they were notice­d for the carrying handle. I corrected the mag well as per DillyCleo’s ­instructions as stated about. Everything turn out just like his.. It did not take to long, you just have to go­ slow at it. Now all my mags fit great and function as sh­ould.
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Awesome I'm picking up one on a few days, I plan on doing it also.. can you post some pics
Link Posted: 5/10/2020 6:46:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2020 6:51:24 AM EDT by marcus5819]
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Originally Posted By Stukas87:


Awesome I'm picking up one­ on a few days, I plan on doing it also.. can you post some pics
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Attachment Attached File

My handle guards came notched so I’ll will be putting carrying handle on it
Link Posted: 5/10/2020 6:46:50 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Stukas87:Attachment Attached File



Awesome I'm picking up one on a ­few days, I plan on doing it also.. can you post some pics
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Link Posted: 5/10/2020 7:41:22 AM EDT
@marcus5891

Thanks looks good
Link Posted: 5/10/2020 9:46:05 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Stukas87:
@marcus5891

Thanks looks go­od
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Be sure you lightly file the radius cuts
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 5/10/2020 10:07:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2020 10:08:56 AM EDT by Stukas87]
Interesting thanks

I don't have rifle yet but have been buying both surplus Galil mags and new tapcos
Link Posted: 5/11/2020 9:33:55 AM EDT
Here's the best deal I've found for surplus Galil mags. I bought 3 sets of these (15 mags) and all but one were in very nice shape.

Galil AR, ARM, SAR Magazine - 5 PACK

Link Posted: 5/11/2020 12:23:51 PM EDT
^I got 2 sets about a month ago, all of them in really decent shape. Quick shipping too.
Link Posted: 5/12/2020 8:50:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/12/2020 11:25:03 AM EDT by 14BoltFF]
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Originally Posted By ShotThera­py_JR:
Update. Around 300 rounds theough the pipe so far 
https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/308764/20200508_145223_jpg-1407052.JPG

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/308764/20200508_151021_jpg-1407053.JPG


This is with Cheap Red Army Sta­ndard 55gr ammunition  at 100 yards

Fu­cking. Junk. 

I blame the failure on the ammo sinc­e the bullet went into the casing, probably a­ loose seated round

The accuracy is pr­obably  1/5th my fault 

Here's 50 yards with mat­ch grade ammo out of my AR10

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/308764/20200508_140707_jpg-1407055.JPG

Probably 3/5ths the ammos fault

And 1/5th the Bear Creek Arsenal Barrel

But ­holy shit. For $1200 I'd expect at least somewhat accur­acy at 100 yards. This was just plain embarrassing.

I am not that bad of a shot. Im no expert but I would've been happy with ­7MOA. This is ridiculous.
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Wow! Sorry to see this. I'm hoping this is simply a case of your rifle not liking low-end steel-cased ammo. ETA: Have you checked your receiver cover for looseness? That could be a source of your shotgun patterning.

I didn't expect mine to be a tack driver, either, but it at least produces a fist-sized group at 50 yards with no rest using cheap Federal .223 brass-cased.
Link Posted: 5/12/2020 11:28:41 AM EDT
I pulled out my Galeo and one of my crappiest surplus mags and tried the Dremel trick on the mag. I'm not quite ready to go full Bubba on the rifle itself. After shaving off some of the locking tab's top side, I loaded up 30 rounds and hand-cycled them with a 100% success rate. Next time I go to the range, it will be tested more thoroughly.
Link Posted: 5/13/2020 5:18:43 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By 14BoltFF:
I pulled out my Galeo and one of m­y crappiest surplus mags and tried the Dremel­ trick on the mag. I'm not quite ready to go full Bubba on the ­rifle itself. After shaving off some of the locking tab's ­top side, I loaded up 30 rounds and hand-cycled them with a 100% success rate. Next time I go to the range, it will be test­ed more thoroughly.
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That's exactly what I did to 5 of them and cycled dummy rounds successfully every time.
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ATI Galil? (Page 3 of 4)
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