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Posted: 3/26/2009 11:06:34 AM EDT
Flirting w/ the dark side...

I don't know anything about AK really cept that some are milled & some are stamped. A guy at an estate sale has a romanian AK for sale in 7.62. It has pistol grip & fixed wood stock. Apparantly, the receiver will take 30 rd mags. Has the box, manual etc. Says it has only been shot once or twice.

Is that milled or stamped?

Not sure if it has a threaded muzzle. This could be a clinton ban gun? How can you tell besides the muzzle & bayo lug?

What should I look for in terms of problems when buying a used AK? Are there brands to aviod etc. Apparantly this gun can assembled w/ pistol grip so I seems like it may be american assembled on a romanian receiver in accord w/ 922 compliance???

What is a reasonable NON Obama-scare-price-bubble price for a fixed romanian that is almost NIB? Like what would the private party value have been like 9 months ago before everything got scarce? This guy probably doesn't really know that much about guns & is a motivated seller & I don't want it so bad that I am willing to pay bubble prices.

I


Link Posted: 3/26/2009 11:32:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2009 11:34:40 AM EDT by Shane333]
Almost certainly stamped unless it was some kind of home-built or special order project. That really isn't an issue, though. In terms of function it makes no reall difference.

If it has any kind of muzzle attachment then it is either threaded or else had something welded on.

What to watch out for? Check to see if the front sight is canted. Make sure that standard mags fit right. Take the safety off and work the bolt a few times to make sure it isn't jammed up somehow. Pop the dust cover off and peep inside to make sure there isn't a bunch of rust from someone using corrosive ammo and not cleaning it. Otherwise it's hard for it to go wrong.

As far as brands to avoid, the WASR's are the bottom of the heap, but even a WASR will serve just fine if it was assembled correctly. Otherwise, assuming its romanian, it could be a SAR, which have a decent reputation.

Value? In these parts WASR's sell for $600 to $700, with the occasional ad for $750 as the upper limit unless a bunch of mags or ammo is thrown in with the deal. Personally I wouldn't pay more than $650 for a WASR, but that's just me. SAR's are worth a bit more than WASR's.

Edit: Pre-scare price would have been around $400 to $500. A couple years ago they were selling for as little as $300 to $350.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 11:37:23 AM EDT
Thanks.

Is WASR a brand or a more general term for a rifle from a particular country?

If it is a WASR, will it still run good? Is it so poor just b/c it has bad fit & finish?
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 11:54:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By rightwingnut:
Thanks.

Is WASR a brand or a more general term for a rifle from a particular country?

If it is a WASR, will it still run good? Is it so poor just b/c it has bad fit & finish?


WASR's are a brand of re-built Romanian AKs produced by Century Arms (they take imported Romanian parts kits and assemble them on a US receiver with a few other US parts like fire control group and maybe a US pistol grip or US muzzle brake). They are the base "economy" model of AK's on the market. Unfortunately the workers at Century don't have a very good reputation when it comes to quality assurance.

I won't say that WASR's are trash, because that would be untrue. While WASR's aren't going to win any contest for finish on the metal or wood, most function just fine and will outlive our great grandkids. It's just that the WASR's have a few more lemons in the bunch than other AK's on the market.

That's why I mention checking the front sight to see if it's canted. Check the magwell to make sure a magazine fits right (some magwells are too tight while others are too loose). A little bit of mag wobble won't hurt. Check the bolt carrier to make sure nothing hangs up while working it. Etc.

If properly assembled, a WASR is just fine.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:11:59 PM EDT
So, you're dating Catherine Zeta Jones, but you're curiosity demands that you bang Rosanne Barr?

To each his own.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:18:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By dogsplat:
So, you're dating Catherine Zeta Jones, but you're curiosity demands that you bang Rosanne Barr?

To each his own.




If AK's aren't your thing that's fine, but comparing an AK to Rosanne Barr makes you look snobbish and foolish.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:47:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Shane333:

What to watch out for? Check to see if the front sight is canted. Make sure that standard mags fit right. Take the safety off and work the bolt a few times to make sure it isn't jammed up somehow. Pop the dust cover off and peep inside to make sure there isn't a bunch of rust from someone using corrosive ammo and not cleaning it. Otherwise it's hard for it to go wrong.


If it has a Century fire control group, you'll end up replacing it. The Century fcg is easy to tell, the pull is hard and gritty.
If needed the replacement G2 can be had for about $30 and is a drop in replacement.

Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:48:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
Originally Posted By Shane333:

What to watch out for? Check to see if the front sight is canted. Make sure that standard mags fit right. Take the safety off and work the bolt a few times to make sure it isn't jammed up somehow. Pop the dust cover off and peep inside to make sure there isn't a bunch of rust from someone using corrosive ammo and not cleaning it. Otherwise it's hard for it to go wrong.


If it has a Century fire control group, you'll end up replacing it. The Century fcg is easy to tell, the pull is hard and gritty.
If needed the replacement G2 can be had for about $30 and is a drop in replacement.



I put a Tapco G2 FCG in my Saiga conversion and have been happy with it.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:51:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2009 12:52:06 PM EDT by POLYTHENEPAM]
Originally Posted By Shane333:
WASR's are a brand of re-built Romanian AKs produced by Century Arms (they take imported Romanian parts kits and assemble them on a US receiver with a few other US parts like fire control group and maybe a US pistol grip or US muzzle brake). They are the base "economy" model of AK's on the market. Unfortunately the workers at Century don't have a very good reputation when it comes to quality assurance.



WASRs are made in Romania on a receiver made in Romania. That is why the rifle says "Made in Romania" on the side.Century imports the complete rifles and only replaces the US parts and opens the magazine well.

Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:53:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
Originally Posted By Shane333:
WASR's are a brand of re-built Romanian AKs produced by Century Arms (they take imported Romanian parts kits and assemble them on a US receiver with a few other US parts like fire control group and maybe a US pistol grip or US muzzle brake). They are the base "economy" model of AK's on the market. Unfortunately the workers at Century don't have a very good reputation when it comes to quality assurance.



WASRs are made in Romania on a receiver made in Romania. That is why the rifle says "Made in Romania" on the side.Century imports the complete rifles only replaces the US parts and opens the magazine well.



Ah, my bad. I was thinking of most other kit builds done locally like my Yugo's. Thanks for the correction.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 12:59:31 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Shane333:
Originally Posted By dogsplat:
So, you're dating Catherine Zeta Jones, but you're curiosity demands that you bang Rosanne Barr?

To each his own.




If AK's aren't your thing that's fine, but comparing an AK to Rosanne Barr makes you look snobbish and foolish.


Catherine Zete Jones to Megan Fox.... perhaps. i think my AK's sexxy...or was that my tractor. Thanks. now i'm confused.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 1:00:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Shane333:
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
Originally Posted By Shane333:
WASR's are a brand of re-built Romanian AKs produced by Century Arms (they take imported Romanian parts kits and assemble them on a US receiver with a few other US parts like fire control group and maybe a US pistol grip or US muzzle brake). They are the base "economy" model of AK's on the market. Unfortunately the workers at Century don't have a very good reputation when it comes to quality assurance.



WASRs are made in Romania on a receiver made in Romania. That is why the rifle says "Made in Romania" on the side.Century imports the complete rifles only replaces the US parts and opens the magazine well.



Ah, my bad. I was thinking of most other kit builds done locally like my Yugo's. Thanks for the correction.


Century's bad. They sold a rifle called the GP1975 which was just as you described it and they did so after calling WASRs with threaded muzzles and bayonet lugs WASR GPs. I think they were trying to confuse people.

Link Posted: 3/26/2009 1:03:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Shane333:
Originally Posted By dogsplat:
So, you're dating Catherine Zeta Jones, but you're curiosity demands that you bang Rosanne Barr?

To each his own.




If AK's aren't your thing that's fine, but comparing an AK to Rosanne Barr makes you look snobbish and foolish.


+1
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 1:05:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
Originally Posted By Shane333:
Originally Posted By POLYTHENEPAM:
Originally Posted By Shane333:
WASR's are a brand of re-built Romanian AKs produced by Century Arms (they take imported Romanian parts kits and assemble them on a US receiver with a few other US parts like fire control group and maybe a US pistol grip or US muzzle brake). They are the base "economy" model of AK's on the market. Unfortunately the workers at Century don't have a very good reputation when it comes to quality assurance.



WASRs are made in Romania on a receiver made in Romania. That is why the rifle says "Made in Romania" on the side.Century imports the complete rifles only replaces the US parts and opens the magazine well.



Ah, my bad. I was thinking of most other kit builds done locally like my Yugo's. Thanks for the correction.


Century's bad. They sold a rifle called the GP1975 which was just as you described it and they did so after calling WASRs with threaded muzzles and bayonet lugs WASR GPs. I think they were trying to confuse people.



Century does take a bad rap on alot of their builds. I've had a couple. I still have their Yugo M70 and it's a very nice gun. Fun to shoot.FCG is tight and I would recommend it.....if you can find one. Been looking at an Arsenal. More bucks but probably worth it.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 1:57:17 PM EDT
If the front sight is canted I guess that will restrict gas flow to the piston?

If the bore looks bright & everything else you said to check looks good I'll offere the guy $400.

Tell me, what is a WASR that is almost NIB going for at gun show. Not the asking price but the actual selling price?


Link Posted: 3/26/2009 2:21:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rightwingnut:
If the front sight is canted I guess that will restrict gas flow to the piston?

If the bore looks bright & everything else you said to check looks good I'll offere the guy $400.

Tell me, what is a WASR that is almost NIB going for at gun show. Not the asking price but the actual selling price?




As I mentioned, $600+ actual selling price in these parts. Depending where a person lives it could go higher.
Link Posted: 3/26/2009 6:54:37 PM EDT
My recommendation is that if you can get it for under 550 then do it as long as it's in good condition. You could flip it for a small profit later.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 5:49:33 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2009 5:52:14 AM EDT by ArmedFerret]
Originally Posted By rightwingnut:
If the front sight is canted I guess that will restrict gas flow to the piston?


How? The front sight has nothing to do with the gas system. The gas block, however, is part of the gas system. They're not the same part like on an AR-15, unless you're talking Krinks. Here's a quick pic of one of mine:



Note the gas block about halfway up the barrel, and the front sight right up at the muzzle.

Although I had an SAR-1 for a good long time that had a canted gas block, and never had an issue with extraction or feeding.

Really pissed I sold that rifle....
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 12:00:00 PM EDT
thanks for the clarification.

Well, I called the guy & told him I wanted to come over & look at it & he called me back & told me that he was in the process of selling it right then. He told me he sold it for $400, which is just a little more than I would have given him. Oh well.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 4:38:36 PM EDT
He was robbed if he sold it for $400. Unless it had MAJOR issues.

'Course I "bought" one for $425 NIB about three months ago... I haven't seen one under $600 for at least two months.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 5:51:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ArmedFerret:
Originally Posted By rightwingnut:
If the front sight is canted I guess that will restrict gas flow to the piston?


How? The front sight has nothing to do with the gas system. The gas block, however, is part of the gas system. They're not the same part like on an AR-15, unless you're talking Krinks. Here's a quick pic of one of mine:

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s278/armed_ferret/ak_pictures/folded.jpg

Note the gas block about halfway up the barrel, and the front sight right up at the muzzle.

Although I had an SAR-1 for a good long time that had a canted gas block, and never had an issue with extraction or feeding.

Really pissed I sold that rifle....


Man, I love the way that underfolder looks!!!

rightwingnut, I was in your exact position, I'm a retro AR15 guy and I was told about a guy needing cash quick and he was unloading an AK in the process. I'd been thinking about maybe getting AK so I had to check out what he was selling. Turns out it was a WASR 10 and he was asking $400.00. I came here and did a little reading and learned what to look for. Well, here is the latest addition to my collection.



Doc


Link Posted: 3/28/2009 3:48:16 PM EDT
http://www.gunsnet.net/linx310/

Check out this site. It has a lot of info on Romanian builds and gives a good idea of what to look for.

I own a WASR10 and have had no problems with it. The gun shop I bought it form worked it over a bit, opened the mag well to accept hi-cap and drums, and other little things. It's been very reliable to date.

The fun thing about AKs in general is that they are FUN. ARs can do some great precision shooting, but an AK is a blaster- you cna go out and shoot low-priced rounds all day long qithout much worries. An AK is just as good stock with wooden parts as it is with the latest and greated packages of additions. At the end of the day, an AK is just that gun to go out and fool around with. Hope that makes sense.

There seems to be this division were AKs are for people that can't afford, or don't know about ARs. I don't see why this is, as it is totally possible to enjoy both types of firearms.
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