So as not to clutter up HighpowerRifleBrony's thread, I decided to start my own.

From seeing his success with a carbine in Highpower, I decided to make up something similar to his carbine and try it out. Specs are: Ballistic Advantage Gov. profile barrel,  UTG FF handguard, RRA NM trigger, Nikon 3x32 scope on a YHM riser with Leupold rings.

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Today we had a Highpower match at our local club.  Well, it wasn't a propper match per se, more of a practice than anything else, but still was the full 50 round National Match course.  The course was shot entirely at 200 yards (on reduced targets to simulate the longer ranges).  This was the second time for me shooting the carbine under match conditions.

Was doing fairly well offhand until the eighth shot when I threw a 7.  I knew it was low right when the shot broke but I didn't think it was that far out.

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Sitting felt good - until the point I ran out of time and saved a round!  It's been a long time since I did that.  I just ate up too much time getting into position for my first shot and misjudged how much time I had available.

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Rapid prone I had a good position and this time I used my time more appropriately.

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Slow prone my position was OK.  Looking at the target later it looks like I could have put on more elevation.

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Ended up with a 469/500 with 12x.  That 7 in offhand and the saved round in sitting hurt me a bit, but overall I'm fairly pleased with the results with the carbine.  There is another match next week so hopefully I'll be able to improve my performance then.  Stay tuned.

Hoo boi!

On that 7, did it move out during the lock time, or could you have let go of the trigger?

They all look a little low. NPoA?

As far as the 7 goes, as I recall the shot was going as the crosshairs moved out of the black - there was no time to stop it.

I try to be very conscious of my NPoA.  I account the low trend to be my reluctance to change the sights.  I see too many people (and I have been victim of it myself) chasing their shots all over the target, or over correcting for a bad shot.  Unfortunately this day I think I was just a bit too hesitant to change elevation when I should have.

My eyeball says 0.25-0.5 minutes. May well be within your variation or weather. We'll see next time.

ETA: just remembered you have the P-223, not P-Tactical, so 0.5 minute clicks. Good safe-siding.

I picked up the P-223 for cheap.  I like it for the most part, but it seems to me the adjustments might be a little on the "fat" side, where instead of .5 min. change it is more like .75 min. or so.  Hence my reluctance to make changes.

I see that a couple of places offer the P-Tactical for a smidge under $100.  Maybe I'll swap the P-223 for one of those.  Looks like those have .25 min. adjustments?

Yes. My tall target test showed about 0.28 per click, but I'll attribute the extra hundredths to shooter error.

I recommend blacking out the quarter marks with a marker. I find it easier to see where it's at within the minutes.
It might be my long 0.5 usage on the A2, but I rarely use the quarters, except when resetting my base zero if I've removed and replaced the scope.

Did some load development the other day.

Prone with sling at 100 yards on the MR-31 target

69gr Nosler Custom Competition with AA2460

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Might be on to something good here.

Did you call the left and low ones? It's odd to see the ES being less than 3x the MR.

But a clean is a clean.

ETA: if you click on the upper-left of the text box, the cursor should change to a T, and you can click elsewhere to move the box. With the bigger targets, I find that to be less cluttersome.

The left shots, yes, those were on call.  The low ones, no, but pulse was giving me issues that day.

And thanks for the tip on moving the info box.  I couldn't figure out how to do it.

Looks like great shooting to me. A 7 or 8 here and there just reminds us that we're human, right?

I'm going to shoot my kid's carbine (16" mid length) in the New England Regional on Saturday. Full distance, 100 shot match at Nashua Fish&Game. Got to shoot it last weekend on a 100yard reduced match and it shot as good as my full sized rifle. This will probably be my one and only real match this year.

B

Similar pattern as the first post you made:
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I don't think you've posted a pic of it yet. How much does that one weigh?

No idea how much is weighs.

Here are the specs:

16" 1/7 Mid Length SDM barrel (12 flutes) from WOA.
Mid Length Float Tube from Compass Lake.
Trigger - X-Treme 2 stage NM (I don't think he sells these any more)
HeavyBuffers.com Anti-Tilt carbine buffer.
Aim Surplus nitride bolt carrier.
Did a shim job on the barrel extension.

B

"How do you do, fellow carbines?"

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Shot a couple more matches with the carbine.  First match was a 200 yard reduced course and scored a 476-9x, so I was fairly happy with that.

Last weeks match was a 100 yard reduced, and that one was a dumpster fire, scoring a 466-7x.  Just couldn't seem to hold center that day.

I had shot the carbine after using my 20" service rifle on the previous relay, and had already posted a disappointing score with the 20", so the score with the carbine just capped off an already crappy day.  Oh well.  Some days it is just not meant to be.

I like that - looks pretty sharp.  Does Compass Lake not offer the mid-length tube anymore?  I could not find it on their website.

They do them as a one off, I had to call them on the phone as it's not on the website. They will want to know if it has a circular or triangular hand guard cap. I think mine was $150.

B

Cool - thanks!

Hey, what classification are you? Just wondering since you referred to 466 (a high Expert score) as a "dumpster fire" lol.

Damn, I keep thinking about getting back into High Power.

I have a Colt SOCOM with a TA31 I'd like to try,

Just in case smaller folk who want to make the journey see this: midlength sling swivel placement isn't currently EIC legal.

With Mk262, try a Flat Tire hold at 300yds and 6:00 hold at 600yds. Assuming your TA31 is calibrated for M855 from 14.5".

Master

It is and the barrel is 14.5"

Hmmm, I didn't realize that. I'll have to take a look at the rulebook again.

B

The heat index was over 100* today. Humidity was absolutely gawd awful,  very difficult conditions to shoot. Match was shortened to an 800 RMC to keep people from having heat stroke and avoid a torrential downpour. Managed to shoot a 764-15X, a solid Master score, I think a 788 won the match. Nothing notable, except that 1/7 twist barrels will stabilize Sierra 90gr HPBT. Had a 191-5X @ 600 yards.

B

8" or 13" +/-0.5 from the magwell. I'm pretty sure Midlength is 9 or 9.5". Inspectors might not care, especially with a kid holding it, but it needed mention.

I predict any new general issue long arm to feature midlength, and CMP will probably write them in then. Working with juniors and several adults, I find them to index about midlength, so Bullseye-wise it may be superior. I know I would be less cramped than behind a carbine.

Great job!

Miserable conditions to be shooting in, though.  I'm down the road a ways in Mass., and I wasn't wrapped up in a coat on a 90 some-odd degree firing line, but I was still incredibly uncomfortable just hanging around the house not doing much.  I can't imagine what it was like for you.  Glad you survived it!

Yeah, same here. This was my range conditions yesterday. Dang whole rifle was painfully hot to hold with bare hands. If I had a shooting jacket on I’d probably still be lying out on the firing line getting eaten by vultures.

Haven't shot the carbine in a while, so at last weeks match decided to bring it out and throw some rounds down with it.

Weather was nice - about 70 with a breeze gusting to maybe 10-15 mph. mostly left to right.  Match was a 200 yarder on reduced targets.

I was using a load that I had not tried in this rifle yet but works well in my service rifle - a Sierra 52gr molly coated over a charge of Win. 748

Offhand was a 95 1x

R/S was a 98 1x with the group off to the left but with good elevation

R/P was a 96 1x.  First two shots were low, so I added elevation.  I don't remember how much, I believe a full minute, which was too much, as the rest of the shots were clustered in the 10 and 9 ring at 12:00

Slow Prone didn't go so well, with a 188 5x.  Most shots strung vertically.  I don't know if it was the light, my eyes or what - but I kept losing the crosshairs in the target and couldn't find a defined aiming point.

So ended up with a 477  8x for the day.  I think we have a couple matches next month where I'll be able to try again with the carbine and hopefully work on gaining a few more points.

Ya dun good.

I think a mix of diopter focus and light. Focusing on the target and dialing in til reticle came in focus worked better than the book method for me.

The smoked lens reducer reduces unnecessary glare.

If it is an issue next match I'll try playing with the reticle focus ring and see if that helps.

We had our last league match of the season last week - 100 yard reduced range.  I shot two relays, using my 20" service rifle the first relay and the carbine on the second.

Weather was just about perfect - mostly sunny, low 60's temp., no wind.  I was late getting out of the house that morning and got to the range only about 15 min. before start time.  Luckily they had one spot left.

It took me a while to settle in for the first relay - being late didn't help my mental game much, and I felt like I was really struggling for every point.  It worked out pretty well in the end, though, ending up with a 489 - 20x with the 20" rifle.

Then it was on to the carbine.  By this time I was totally relaxed.  I had done good enough on the first relay, if my calculations were correct, to get my NRA reclassification.  So for the carbine I was just in it to shoot for fun, and not worry too much about the score.

Offhand that light little carbine just seemed to settle in.  the reticle barely moved and the shots broke just about where they needed to.  Ended up with a 98 - 4x, with one just barely out of the ten ring at 11:00 and a mid-ring 9 at about 2:00.  This was my best offhand ever (usually average about 95 offhand).
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Sitting again the carbine seemed to settle right in there.  60 seconds later the score score was a 99 - 2x.  The group was slightly high with one 9 at 12:00.
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Rapid prone is usually one of my better positions.  Ended up with a tight little cluster in the x and ten ring - and one nine about 4:00 not even close to the rest of the group.  It was my eighth shot, and it was one of those situations where you brain is saying "clean it up - it's not right", but you pull the trigger anyway.  Oh well.  Ended up with a 99 - 5x on that string.
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Slow prone was pretty uneventful.  Load a round, close the bolt, aim, pull the trigger, get a 10.  Rinse and repeat.  They weren't the prettiest groups and the x count was low, but ended up with a 198 - 6x, dropping two points on the first target.  (For those that haven't shot a 100 yard reduced course, slow prone is divided up on two targets - 10 on one, 10 on another.  Makes it easier to score.)
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So overall score with the carbine in the last match of the season was a 494 - 17x - a personal best.

To say I was happy with the results would be an understatement.  To get that kind of score with a carbine was a real surprise.  I think the biggest reason for the score was my attitude going into it.  At every match my goal of course is to score as many points as possible, which can lead to a bit of anxiety and stress - and mistakes.  Here, I went into it with the attitude to just shoot, and let the chips fall where they may.  No stress, no anxiety - just shoot.

I also think that the carbine itself is settling in.  I don't have that many rounds through it, and from what I have read from others on this forum is that these barrels (Ballistic Advantage) seem to benefit from having a few hundred rounds through them before they start shooting really well.  That seems to be the case here - other matches I have used this carbine in my slow prone groups were a bit larger than I thought they should be, but this match they were on par with my 20" service rifle and more what I think they should be.

So that is it for this season.  We don't have any more matches scheduled for this year, so probably won't shoot either my service rifle or carbine again until next season, which will start in March or April of next year, depending on weather.

All in all it was a good season.  I had a bit of a mid season slump in July where my scores were not what I wanted them to be, but I recovered from that and finished the season strong.  Like I mentioned if my calculations are correct once all the league scores are submitted to the NRA I will be reclassified to HM, which was my goal for this season.

Getting a personal best - with a lightweight, inexpensive carbine, of all things - was really icing on the cake.  It is funny to think about it, but I spent less on building this carbine up - scope and all - than what it would cost for just a NM upper from White Oak.  Not too shabby.

I saved my targets, so I'll try to get some photos of those posted in the next few days (because who doesn't like pictures )

Sounds like my 491/500.

Take it to full distance when y'all thaw out.

That's one of my plans.  We have a 300 yard range close by but to go 600 is a bit of a drive.  I am going to try to get out there a few times next season, though.

Wow! Sounds Awesome!

If that bbl shoots any better we will have to declare it a Secret Weapon!

Congrats on ending your season on a high note!

you are always welcome to come shoot a 600 match in Nashua NH

Haven't had a chance to get up there the past few years, but I plan on getting there next season.

These threads are so cool.  :)

I built a mid-length for my kid to shoot in the as-issued at Perry.  They had no problems with the rail-mounted swivel at 6-o'clock just behind the front sight triangle.  The CMP technical staff, typically not being shooters, wouldn't know if it bit 'em on the backside with dentures.

The 2015 rule book changes make basically anything built on an AR receiver generally OK.

As-Issued? You mean "Modern" Military?

The email response I got about using a Dissipator with swivel at 8" said that's okay for anything under 20" barrels. For most adults, that 2" further midlength sling swivel is ideal, but not leg legal.

That's what I thought so I built a mid length with a 16" and a CLE mid length tube and then HPRB pointed out that it's supposed to be a carbine length gas system. With my luck my kid will get some EIC points and get his score tossed.

I know what they are trying to do, but I absolutely hate what they have done to the sport with all the ham fisted stupid rule changes.

B

Mid length is fine, but the swivel has to be 8" from magwell.

Yeah but the rulebook says carbine length gas system. I'll have to look at it again, maybe it will be as easy as adding a sling swivel down on the handguard.

B

Dang. It stupidly does.

What port size and buffer weight for a 19" carbine?

You mean for a 16" carbine? I'd just put a H3 in it. I have a heavy buffer in my mid length.

B

Issa joke. Since apparently anything under 20" is supposed to be carbine gassed which would have stupid long dwell time.
/Derail.

No worries, I'm just a little out of it tonight.

B

John, have you done any shoulder firing lately, or have you just been having fun with the smokeful handguns?

Yup, been doing quite a bit of highpower this year - pandemic be damned!  

Haven't used the carbine at all, though - been concentrating on the 20"

We need a lot more people shooting carbines, especially when I'm shooting in an EIC.