I'm talking about fore-end and toe support bags, pump pillows, barricade bags, sand socks, stuffed animals and whatever else you use that's a fabric container holding some kind of media which you use to set part of your rifle on while shooting. I hadn't really noticed how heavy mine were and I was surprised when I weighed the set. Have you weighed yours?

3lbs of black beans combined front and rear bags..

My bags combined weight 6+ lbs..

I use a Harris bipod for front support.  I have 5 different toe support bags.  1 was a gift - a leather, sand filled rabbit ear bag that weighs more than the capacity of the small scale that I have so it is over 4 pounds.  1 I bought - a Midway large cylinder - it is poly filled and weights 46 ounces.  The other 3 I made myself.  All are filled socks.  1 is filled with fish tank gravel and weighs 32 ounces.  The other 2 are poly filled - 1 is 24 ounces and 1 is 10 ounces.

I most commonly use the Midway bag and the large poly filled bag that I made together, both lying on their sides, one on top of the other - combined weight = 70 ounces (4 lb 6 oz).

I use an Atlas prs up front, out back I use any of 4 different bags, they vary from a pound or so to maybe 2.5-3 pounds...

Attached File

I'm seeing a lot of the same thing. Heavy ass bags for no reason. Filler media that's used in these sacked cannonballs isn't exactly expensive but it does need spec'd right.

For a good while now I've been working with some partners around the world testing out better options. All 3 Midway bags shown below, which I've refilled and which are just about identical to AKSnowRider's bags, are coming in at just under half a pound COMBINED. The filler media I'm using is a synthetic material that I spec'd out just for this purpose. The filler itself has a pretty high durometer value and is impervious in my testing so far to every solvent and lubricant on my cleaning bench. Best of all, it weighs almost nothing. It really is about as close to air as I could get while still getting good lock-in, shape conformance and water absorption resistance.

These are what I use:

Triad Tapered, large and small
Red Tac Gear Tac Pillow, large
Rifles Only Rear Bag

Would anyone be interested in some of this media? I can send you just over a liter of it for $10 shipped or a roughly 8 liters for $45 shipped. Shipping is USPS flat rate box. This is basically my cost + $1 for the trouble. I have an absolute shitload of it on hand and don't need quite so much (you have to buy it in pretty huge amounts) so might as well hook some brutha's up.

So you found a source for crumbled space shuttle heat shield tiles but it only comes in 55 gallon drums?!?!?  I see an opportunity for a new business startup!  

P.S.: for those interested >>>  a spherical container 12.4 cm (4.9 inches) in diameter contains ~1 liter of volume or ~1 US quart...  just an FYI...

Basically, yeah. Shipping is ferociously expensive partly because it's so bulky it has to go freight. The media itself isn't super expensive but they don't sell it in quantities a single human might find useful. I had a particular need for a shiatload of it and still had to buy enough to have a large amount to spare.

PM me details. I am interested.

PM'd.

Whatever a game changer weighs.  It's the only bag I carry to a match, and it would suck with light fill.

Why do you say that? Have you tried such a thing? If it conforms to the shapes you need it to, stays where you put it and holds your rifle up I can't see how it would suck to not lug around extra weight.

Light bags don't settle in the same on props. There is a reason they use a heavy fill

yep.  The heavy fill game changer is still much better at settling in without 'grooming it' than my lighter one.

I can definitely see that. I'm pretty confident that there's no need for the thing to weigh 15lbs to get the effect. A pound or two of heavy fill in a couple strategic areas plus filling only to the level it needs to be in the places it needs to be instead of stuffing it full gives that pull down effect without making the whole thing silly heavy. We'll see how it does under the pressure of a real match in a week and a half anyway. I have a proper PRS match coming up which I'm hoping to not come in last in. I've been playing with a large bag of my own design in the back yard and so far I'm not having issue getting it to lay nicely over boards and bars and cables but I can't touch off a round in the back yard and I can't rightfully judge stability with only 15 feet of vision so it's not a very good analogue of the real thing.

I just know the way i use my bag I wouldn't change a thing about it.  I also use it laying different orientations and don't wan't to think about what is where when I'm dropping my bag on a rock or whatever else is supporting my rifle.

Got the material today. Holy shit this stuff is like air. When compressed it’s hard as a rock. I’ll do some shooting with it when the weather clears and report back.

Here's my cylinder bag filled with the new material holding up a 12lbs weight. It conforms well enough to the shape of the ground and the shape of the weight that I didn't even have to fiddle around to get it to stay there. Really digging on it so far.

I've tried a game changer with light fill, it's not the same.  Nothing wrong with trying new stuff, but positional bags benefit from weight.

I made my first custom bag design. I didn't bother with adding straps and such yet but it'll get some. This was deliberately a very easy design to build since I haven't sewn other than to attach a button or fix a tear in something like 30 years. Needed to refresh those skills on something easy. Material is cotton/poly 50/50 blend in digital woodland. The local fabric shop did not carry codura.

The shape is basically a half-donut in one aspect as you can see in the pic but it's also able to go flat as a 14"x12" rectangle that's 3" thick, or fold up to 6"-7" thick fore end support, flip to the side to get 8-9" tall or flip to the other side for 9-11" tall. The half moon convex side is meant to lay over barricade materials like 4x4 posts and steel pipes without having to fiddle with it giving 3" of pretty firm fore end support. It works as a toe support as well though it's a little big for that. Weight is less than 4 ounces.


Sorry there's no feet in the picture. I know the foot fetishists are going to be offended. Can't be helped.

I found a "fabric" that's supposed to have ultra high sliding friction so I've ordered a sample and will make a bag out of it and see how that does as well.

Here is the one I filled with the material you sent me. Didn't get a chance to shoot it yet, but just playing around with it in the house, it seems like it will be a good fill.

Let me know how that does for you.

Boxtobenchprecision.com (I'm acquainted with the owner from prior projects) has agreed to start carrying the 2nd generation of the new media which is super cool because I'm officially out of stock and super not interested in trying to start up a business.

If you want some, hit up https://www.boxtobenchprecision/store. I'm not involved in any of that. Like I said, I know the owner a bit and asked him if he'd carry it and it looks like he and the media manufacturer were able to make a deal. For me, all my bags are filled with it and all my friends filled their bags so my needs are handled. Everyone else has a place to get it so this is where I bow out and go work on other engineering challenges that have been bothering me.