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Grendel or valkyrie? (Page 2 of 2)
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Link Posted: 4/10/2018 9:51:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/10/2018 9:53:29 AM EDT by m6z]
I want the bigger impact on steel, so Grendel for me. It's been a solid performer and there are plenty of ammo options.

If I was to go with a Valkyrie I think I would get one of the complete LWRC rifles that use the Six8 Pmags.

https://www.lwrci.com/p-5302-lwrci-valkyrie-224-di.aspx
Link Posted: 4/11/2018 11:58:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Evile:
I just got back from my first time shooting at 500 yards using my 556 Aero precision build and it was a lot of fun. The range also has a 1000 yard section that once I get more comfortable on the 500 Id like to try my hand at but I will be in need of a larger caliber. I plan on staying with the ar15 platform for cost reasons as I have a receiver set waiting for a barrel. So given that which should I save my lunch money for Grendel or the valkyrie for 1000 yards ringing steel?
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Neither is ideally suited for 1000y, despite the hype. Both give a lot of wind up at that distance. Gusty days you will learn to hate or learn to shoot, one of the two.
Link Posted: 4/27/2018 8:41:22 AM EDT
I love my Valkyrie, so much so that I ordered a second in the way of a LMT MLR.

Mine is built with a 22" Rock Creek 1:6.7" twist barrel done by Craddock. I've only been shooting factory ammo and the results have been outstanding. A few weeks ago I ran it out to 1350 yards and everywhere in between, the hits came pretty easy and were easy to spot as were my misses. My misses could be spotted easily through the Leupold MK5 3.6-18 all the way to 1350, but beyond about 1100 yards it was hard to self spot my hits through the scope as the targets were on solid mounts (my 300WM barely rocked them), but they had flashers and the impacts were visible from a spotting scope.

I didn't have a Grendel to shoot side by side but I had a Grendel before that I was less than impressed by. I could never get any of the really high BC stuff to shoot well and it was very neutered with the 140 class bullets due to how far back in the case they were to fit mag length. The 120-130gr bullets never performed to any great degree. I also replaced my JP bolt three times in less than 2000 rounds due to failure, and no it wasn't due to hot loads.

Personally I'll never touch a grendel again. I can somewhat see a value in it for hunting, but I'd just go 6.8spc for that role.

If you buy a GOOD Valkyrie upper/barrel/rifle you won't be disappointed. I'd recommend going with a 6.5-6.7 twist though if you want to shoot the 90's in cold weather. Most Valkyries at 1:7 and seem to do fine with them in warmer temps and even at sea level but in cold weather plenty of people have been having issues with them not being properly stabilized. In warm weather they're still probably marginally stabilized even, but at least they're stable.
Link Posted: 4/27/2018 9:20:52 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By ScottyS:

Neither is ideally suited for 1000y, despite the hype. Both give a lot of wind up at that distance. Gusty days you will learn to hate or learn to shoot, one of the two.
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i shoot a 77gr TMK @2750 to 1050yds. THAT takes effort.

i cannot wait to hit 1k at the other range we have up here. ill freely give dope and wind corrections ASAP when im there
Link Posted: 5/12/2018 1:00:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By UnknownPatriot:

Burns barrels like a creedmore too (according to what I’ve read). That’s why I chose Grendel. Grendel reports I’ve read equal to 308 barrel life or better. I haven’t shot near enough out of mine... yet
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Yep and equal to 308 drop and drift at 1k, and that's not a good thing. Grendel is a waste of good 6.5 bullets, lol
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 8:13:18 PM EDT
Well I decided to hold off on a new caliber and practice more with 556 until I feel comfortable and can repeatedly hit targets at 500 yards and work my way farther. I ordered a green mountain 223 wylde 18in match barrel to get a little more fps and keep the rest of my set up the same for now. So instead of $400 bucks to switch to grendel plus ammo costs I bought a barrel for $198 a gas block and tube and Im ready to rock.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 8:29:59 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Evile:
Well I decided to hold off on a new caliber and practice more with 556 until I feel comfortable and can repeatedly hit targets at 500 yards and work my way farther. I ordered a green mountain 223 wylde 18in match barrel to get a little more fps and keep the rest of my set up the same for now. So instead of $400 bucks to switch to grendel plus ammo costs I bought a barrel for $198 a gas block and tube and Im ready to rock.
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i FULLY support this! learn all u can first. 223 is good to 1000yds with the TMK pill. 600+ is where it gets funnnn.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 9:28:33 PM EDT
Grendel is a Lower velocity round so barrels tend to last longer. My favorite Grendel loading was a 123 grain bullet at 2550-2600 fps. With that loading, the bullet didn't go transonic until around 1400 yards or more depending on conditions. To be sure, other rounds will go further before hitting the transonic problems, but you would need to get into rounds that burn barrels faster, use more powder, or have to be fired from the AR10 sized platforms. It all depends on how far you want to shoot, how much you want to spend on each round and if you want to get into the Ar10 sized rifles.

You could even get into an AR10 platform in 6 Creedmoor if you wanted...but again, barrel life, component cost and other factors need to be considered.

While the Grendel is a fabulous cartridge, there are benefits and problems with just about every round...including the Grendel.
Link Posted: 5/13/2018 9:29:25 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Evile:
Well I decided to hold off on a new caliber and practice more with 556 until I feel comfortable and can repeatedly hit targets at 500 yards and work my way farther. I ordered a green mountain 223 wylde 18in match barrel to get a little more fps and keep the rest of my set up the same for now. So instead of $400 bucks to switch to grendel plus ammo costs I bought a barrel for $198 a gas block and tube and Im ready to rock.
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Great call!
Link Posted: 5/15/2018 10:30:52 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Evile:
Well I decided to hold off on a new caliber and practice more with 556 until I feel comfortable and can repeatedly hit targets at 500 yards and work my way farther. I ordered a green mountain 223 wylde 18in match barrel to get a little more fps and keep the rest of my set up the same for now. So instead of $400 bucks to switch to grendel plus ammo costs I bought a barrel for $198 a gas block and tube and Im ready to rock.
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Same here. Ordered an 18" WOA spr barrel on sale from brownells for $ 239

Figured I have plenty to learn and was getting ahead of myself with the new calibers
Link Posted: 5/31/2018 4:12:58 PM EDT
We were shooting steel at 300, 350 swinger, 500, 700, and 1000yds yesterday.

My buddy was shooting his .221 Fireball Improved wildcat with higher shoulder angle using 80gr ELD-Ms and only 17.5gr powder through a 22" Krieger barrel he threaded into a Howa Mini action.

We could actually hear the impacts of the 80gr ELD-M most of the time at 1000yds, which was surprising.

Wind wasn't bad at all though.

He shot a 3" 5rd group with it at 700yds on a 2 MOA plate.

There's a new .224 95gr Sierra Match King with a pretty high .600 G1 BC, so that will do really well with a 6.5 twist in the Valkyrie or a .224 AR even better.

Sierra says they're now pointing their 6.5mm 123gr SMK, but don't show an updated BC for that compared to the old unpointed 123gr SMK.

Litz found that the 123gr SMK samples he tested were actually .522 G1/.260 G7, much higher than Sierra's .510 G1 BC many years ago.
Link Posted: 5/31/2018 11:25:05 PM EDT
im doing 1k sunday....80gr eld 20" .224v
Link Posted: 6/1/2018 1:43:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By HaveBlue83:
im doing 1k sunday....80gr eld 20" .224v
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What barrel length and what's your mv?

80gr ELD-M will do great from Valkyrie at 1k in lower and consistent winds.
Link Posted: 6/2/2018 12:23:12 AM EDT
20", 2800fps, hoping for some good results!
Link Posted: 6/2/2018 9:01:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By HaveBlue83:
20", 2800fps, hoping for some good results!
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We were smoking steel out to 1k quite easily at 2650fps mv with 80gr ELD-M, but baro was 25.5" hg, temps 80°-82°F.

A bubble level will help you past 600yds as usual.

Should be fine unless your barrel is crap.
Link Posted: 6/3/2018 5:55:08 PM EDT
smoked a clay at 1035yds. 34moa, .5mil wind hold. 80gr eld m.

approx 31.5 moa to 980yd gong, good audible hits on steel.

ny comparison, .223 was 1.5mils hold on wind and like 43moa. its exactly what i wanted :)
Link Posted: 6/5/2018 12:10:38 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By HaveBlue83:
smoked a clay at 1035yds. 34moa, .5mil wind hold. 80gr eld m.

approx 31.5 moa to 980yd gong, good audible hits on steel.

ny comparison, .223 was 1.5mils hold on wind and like 43moa. its exactly what i wanted :)
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That’s great to hear, thanks for posting your results.

Btw dig the username. Lockheed fan?
Link Posted: 6/5/2018 1:58:18 PM EDT
I'm not a fan of facebook (or social media in general) but there's a couple great group pages for info on the Valkyrie. There's still BS you have to sift through from people not knowing what they're doing whether it's at the manufacturing/chambering level causing problems or assembling/shooting or bought a $400 complete upper and expect the same results as a $500 barrel. If you get through that there's a ton of great info on the round and shooters getting performance as good or better than the claims by Federal.

There's also a load data page on Snipershide that's starting to get some good data.

The Valkyrie now has several reliable barrels options at all price ranges of the commercial market as well as customer options, two factory match loads from two manufacturers plus four "factory" match loads from a smaller/custom ammo company. There's also several low and mid range bolts on the market (and has been) as well as top tier options from LMT, LWRC, and JP.

Starline brass has hit the market which is phenomenal quality, and the load data is starting to appear.

Honestly the hardest part is just making the decision on parts to build from based on your budget/expectations.
Link Posted: 6/5/2018 6:44:13 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By hiih8r:
I didn't have a Grendel to shoot side by side but I had a Grendel before that I was less than impressed by. I could never get any of the really high BC stuff to shoot well and it was very neutered with the 140 class bullets due to how far back in the case they were to fit mag length. The 120-130gr bullets never performed to any great degree. I also replaced my JP bolt three times in less than 2000 rounds due to failure, and no it wasn't due to hot loads.
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None of this sounds typical of the Grendel (except for maybe the 140s part with mag length). It seems to be a very inherently accurate round. That is an insane failure rate too. I am thinking you had issues well beyond the bolt, maybe barrel extension lugs if I had to guess. One sitting higher than the others, causing a single bolt lug to take all the force?? I don't think I would have even continued to shoot such a rifle, let alone killed $500 worth of bolts in 2000 rounds.

OP, doesn't sound like you reload, might be something you want to look in to also. I personally enjoy it. Just another thing to be nerdy about, optimize your rifle's performance and can make it cheaper to shoot. Especially with .223.
Link Posted: 6/5/2018 7:32:53 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DarkDrifter:

None of this sounds typical of the Grendel (except for maybe the 140s part with mag length). It seems to be a very inherently accurate round. That is an insane failure rate too. I am thinking you had issues well beyond the bolt, maybe barrel extension lugs if I had to guess. One sitting higher than the others, causing a single bolt lug to take all the force?? I don't think I would have even continued to shoot such a rifle, let alone killed $500 worth of bolts in 2000 rounds.

OP, doesn't sound like you reload, might be something you want to look in to also. I personally enjoy it. Just another thing to be nerdy about, optimize your rifle's performance and can make it cheaper to shoot. Especially with .223.
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I'm not the only person who has had problems with the Grendel.

I actually still have one because I think it's a great round for game in the AR15 platform but I don't shoot it much and what I do I just run factory Federal 130gr.

Valkyrie for my uses is a better performer all around.
Link Posted: 6/6/2018 1:01:29 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Rbass:

That's great to hear, thanks for posting your results.

Btw dig the username. Lockheed fan?
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Have Blue
Tacit Blue
Senior Trend
Archangel
Oxcart

im a lil skunky from my high school days of paging through aircraft books till the bindings broke. good eye ;).

np, the valk was an easy build and loading cartridge and i enjoy shooting a 20" 1000+ yd AR :). Happy to give info.
Link Posted: 6/6/2018 1:29:57 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By HaveBlue83:
Have Blue
Tacit Blue
Senior Trend
Archangel
Oxcart

im a lil skunky from my high school days of paging through aircraft books till the bindings broke. good eye ;).

np, the valk was an easy build and loading cartridge and i enjoy shooting a 20" 1000+ yd AR :). Happy to give info.
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I'm sure you've read Ben Rich's book then. Fascinating stuff! I have a few years of JetStar time, which was one of theirs. Amazing plane. Boss wouldn't let us paint the skunk logo on them though. Would've been way cool!
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Grendel or valkyrie? (Page 2 of 2)
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