What's the best modern DMR in 7.62x51mm & why?  Cost not being a consideration.  Figure max realistic engagement range of 1000 yards, generally more like 800 yards. Firing from semi fixed prepared positions but needing to maintain enough mobility to change between positions. Exclude the legacy battle rifles.  Fal, M1a, Svd, G3, etc. I've been bitched at enough about those.

I currently own a Scar 20s in 7.62x51mm.  I've got issues with it, primarily with the weight.  I don't care for Ar10's in general,  but will suck it up & listen to the pros & cons.  Will not get on the 6.5 creedmoor bandwagon.  Great round that burns up barrels way to fast for my wallet.

LMT MWS is what you seek.  I wish I had bought one after all I've heard

I've read that the SCAR rifles are good shooters, so it sounds like you might already have a DMR, unless I misunderstand the definition of that gun.  Weight helps with recoil management;  my "DMR" weighs about 17 lbs loaded, and that weight helps me spot longer shots past 500.  

I know I spent way too much time and money trying to find the perfect gun for my intended purpose.  I belabored heavy vs light barrel, barrel length, cartridge, and gun type.  They say that perfect is the arch enemy of good enough, and I learned that lesson the hard way.

My current long range gun is a DPMS in 6.5 Creedmoor.  It's not operator tier by any stretch, but it is sufficient to give me adequate long range accuracy so I can practice shooting at distance.  If your SCAR is accurate enough, start using that and hit the range.

How many rounds do you shoot a year?  Barrels are a consumable item.  If you shoot 5000 rounds of .308 a year the cost of a new barrel is relatively insignificant.

Oh, look.  Done with iron sights and slings.  

Eleven years ago.

Imagine what they could have done with scopes.  Maybe bipods, too.



1,000 Yard Service Rifle Record

"USAMU Service Rifle shooters coached by SFC Jeremy Mangione set a new Service Rifle record using 7.62mm AR10 rifles with 185gr Berger bullets at the Interservice Championships at Quantico, Virginia.  Team USAMU Mangione posted an 1154-33X (of a 1200-60X possible) Aggregate, a Service Rifle Team Record -- with military iron sights.

Specialist Augustus Dunfey recorded a 200-10X. Coach Praslick called this a “spectacular individual performance.”  SFC Praslick told us that Dunfey’s 200-10X “is definitely the highest [20-shot] Service Rifle score shot in Interservice 1000-yard competition. And, as far as anyone can remember, it is the highest [20-shot] 1000-yard score ever shot with a Service Rifle anywhere.”

Specialist Dunfey was shooting at a target with a 20″ 10-Ring, and 10″ X-Ring with a stout-recoiling .308 rifle using a sling (no rest or bipod) and relatively crude sights. Dunfey put half his shots inside one MOA and did not drop a single point."

Sounds like you have a problem with most everything available.  You’ve ruled out all of the legacy platforms (not that I disagree there).  Your SCAR is too heavy.  You don’t like “AR-10s” (I take that to mean large frame ARs as a whole, not specifically Armalite large frame guns).  You aren’t left with much.

You’re going to be fighting weight no matter what you do.  I’d take a look at the LMT MWS or an SR25 with a 20” barrel, although they’re both going to be very close in weight to your Mk20.  You can shoot a 16” .308 (what most lighter options will be) out to 1000y (with the right load and ideal circumstances/environmentals), but it’s not ideal and not something I’d want for doing that on a regular basis.

I think you’re going to need to change your requirements (to facilitate a shorter, lighter profile barrel) or just deal with the weight.

9lbs is sort of the magic number as average for large frame semi-autos.  The weight range of piston and DI .308s is 8-10lbs, but the lightest that can perform is the POF Revolution at 7.3lbs.  The problem is that if you are not an AR/SR fan, then it’s all a moot argument.  The SCAR 20 has a dry weight of 11.6lbs, which is 2-3lbs heavier than competing options, so that’s a significant weight reduction in terms of percentage of weight.  The problem is that the weight for that platform helps accuracy, and if most of your shooting is from emplaced/static positions, weight really shouldn’t be a significant selection factor.  If you look at PRS and NRL type competition shooting, guys are adding weight to their rifles to reduce recoil to help keep the gun on target for faster follow up shots.  But yeah, I get it- lugging it around can get inconvenient.  

I run an LMT 308MWS for heavy applications and whatnot.  It gave a baseline for my agency selecting a SASR platform.  With the CHF 16” barrel, it’s a 3/4 MOA gun.  With the SS barrel, it’s been known to be 1/2 minute or better.  Other options abound and there are a lot of accurate platforms that can give you want you want, as most modern pistol and DI rifles have configurations that will print sub-MOA groups.  I’ve personally tested probably a dozen large frame rifles, and most of them are pretty similar in how they feel and shoot.  SCAR 17 is the only that felt significantly different, and I honestly wasn’t a huge fan.  To get a SCAR 17 to a respectable configuration with trigger, stock and handguard, you’re looking at upwards of an extra $1k over the purchase price, which pushes it into SCAR 20 territory.  No thanks.  And you’re not getting the same accuracy capability of the SCAR 20 either.  

I don’t think there is one specific best DMR, but there are a lot of really good options.  LMT 308MWS, Sig Sauer 716 G2 DMR, POF Revolution, Barrett REC10, PWS Mk2, LaRue OBR, KAC SR25, HK MR762A1, Nordic Components NC10, LWRC REPR, JP LRP07, Midwest Industries MI10, and several others.  It’s sort of a matter of what you like to shoot.

Thanks for the information y'all.  Its given me much to ponder on & things to research.

Check out Robinson XCR maybe. Pretty much everyone who owns one loves them and typically owns more than one. Its maybe more of a battle rifle but can be configured for any purpose.

Why do you dislike the AR10/AR308 platform?

You have paint yourself into a corner by not wanting ever option available.  The AR10 series guns will be the best solution, and your Scar20 is a really damn good rifle.  Every option that is accurate, stable, and capable of absorbing as much recoil as possible will be kind of heavy compared to an AR15.   That’s the name of the game when you want to shoot a bigger bullet

I would agree with you that most legacy battle rifles can't be made to shoot accurate enough to be considered a DMR.

I've never been a fan of the SCAR. I just don't care for how it looks and have a hard time dropping as much cash as they want for it for a rifle that they can't get the furniture colors to match.

As far as an AR 10 goes it has a lot of pluses going for it. Options are only limited by your imagination and your wallet. As far as your off the shelf AR10 that can fulfill the DMR role I would say the top three choices would be LMT, Knights, and LaRue OBR. I think that any of these fit the DMR role very easy.

I do like the Robinson XCR but it isn't any lighter than your SCAR.

When I got my AR10 I was a little shocked at the weight but got over that quickly when I realized this wasn't a gun I'm going to be doing a 10 or 15 mile road March with, at least I don't have any plans on it at this time. The political climate may change that but this would be more of a half mile pack in and set up type rifle.

I wish I didn't sell my Canteen Green MWS.  I did make a pile of money off it though!lol

I finally got around to shooting my ADM .308. Absolutely love it.

How about the B&T APC308?

Where’s the KAC?

LMT MWS, Larue, or KAC> everything else

Super Sass would be my suggestion but it’s 11.5 pounds.
https://www.armalite.com/SACItem.aspx?Item=A10SBF2&ReturnURL=/d58ae4a3-306c-42e9-bc7b-0544843e93d4&Category=d58ae4a3-306c-42e9-bc7b-0544843e93d4

If weight is your main concern but you have to have a 308 I’d just build a lighter weight gun. Seems like an AR15 in 6.5 Grendel or the new 6mm ARC would do everything you need.

While not quite what I think of as a DMR, I ended up picking up an older POF P308  for cheaps. With a pinned 14.5" barrel , its ridiculously lightweight & quick to point. Not sure what kind of accuracy I'll be able to get out to 500-600 yards, but I've got quite a few bolt guns that are more than capable at those ranges. If nothing else, I will get a longer barrel for the POF. If they're ever available.  

FPNI. Select a length/caliber barrel. I have a 16” CL 7.62, 20” CL 7.62, and 20” SS 6.5 CM. It’s a versatile, reliable, and accurate rifle.



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Another vote for LMT MWS. My 13.5 rings steel at 500 with boring reliability if I do my part.

This was the correct answer.

If your concern about the SCAR 20 is weight you can toss out the LMT MWS suggestions.

Wrong.

pretty much everything is an AR10 variant.
Kac
lmt
larue
even the gun OP bought is just a piston converted AR10.

So you’re saying the LMT isn’t heavy?

Depends on the configuration. It can be within 1/4 lbs of a SCAR17S configured properly.

You could say the same thing about the SCAR 20 he has(not sure you could quite get it to 8lb4oz but I don't know if you could get an LMT that light either).  A stock LMT and a stock SCAR 20 are pretty close.  If he doesn't care about anything other than 7.62x51 and his issue with the 20s is weight there are probably better options than a MWS(KAC SR-25 CC @8lb5oz or SCAR 17 @8lbs).

Something like this with a re-profiled barrel should be under 9lbs.

If we’re talking custom work the LMT can go lighter too. The difference is it doesn’t eat bolt carriers or optics, has a proper barrel twist rate, and uses cheaper readily available mags.

I currently have an MWS, and I’ve had two SR-25’s and an AR-10T over the years.

If I was going to do it again, I’d go with the SR-25.

The MWS really only makes sense if you want the ability to swap barrels around, and if that’s case, good luck finding any barrels in anything other than 7.62.

In the current environment sure. I have a 6.5CM and several .308 barrels. I had all the legacy battle rifles, an SR-25 EMC, the SCAR, and a few others to include the MWS. I know some of it is personal preference but I stuck with the MWS for many reasons. My DMR setup is with a 20” 6.5CM or .308 barrel, while the battle rifle setup is a 16” LW .308 barrel.

I respect the achievement, but this one thing has me  You may as well say they were wearing boots that were too tight.

It is stout compared to a lot of the 223 guns and that definitely matters in timed strings of fire.

How does a LMT get to 8lb4oz to begin with?  I suspect you need to change the barrel and buttstock, that's all I'm saying he has to do with his 20s to achieve a similar effect. Here is a post from someone in the FN forum that did exactly what I'm saying. At +$800 it seems like a cost effective option as well.



Also, I think the "eats optics" thing has been put to rest, 1:10" twist seems fine to me, and I don't think an extra $20 per mag is that big of a deal.  

AR10 or SR25 or the like are your best bet. I put together a AR10 recently and love it. Kept it fairly light at 8.5 pounds without optics or suppressor or anything extra. It's been very accurate.

Wait... what are the supposed advantages of converting a 20S to a 17S (going from the 20" to a 16" barrel, and swapping the heavier, fixed 20S stock for the lighter, folding 17S stock?) instead of just going with a 17S?

A couple lbs lighter and OP already has the 20S.

For me a 20” heavy 6.5C and light profile 308 in 14.5-16” would be the best of both worlds for the 20S.

I must be the unluckiest guy around then.  Even pre COVID, I was on more "notify me when back in stock" lists than I could count for a 6.5 and 16" LW barrel for the better part of 18 months.  I don't sit in front of the computer all day.  By the time I'd get a notification, and get over to whatever site, the few barrels they received were long gone.

Most dealers wont take back orders, the LW barrels are special order now, with no ETA.  If It's going to years before I can reliably acquire barrels or parts, the system starts to loose it's luster.

Ah, ok.

I was wondering about thehun06's comment about preferring the 20S turned into a 17S, over just getting a 17S.

Buy one with an MLOK upper and use a LW barrel.

LMT barrels are 1/2 the cost of FN SCAR barrels....the SCAR barrels (even the 20S) are 1:12 not 1:10, and my 17S ate a $2200 Leupold, so there goes the “use quality optics and you’ll be fine.”  

Just calling it how it is from personal experience, not internet lore.

V1 Tactical and Proven Arms had them regularly.

I'm on both their lists currently.  I didn't find out about V1 until recently.  They aren't doing allocations anymore either, just "notify me when back in stock".

At this point, if Marvin Pitts can do a barrel conversion for me in under a year, I'll probably just send him a BA 6.5 CM barrel, and have him cannibalize my 16" CL barrel.

IMHO, the MWS is way too heavy for a 16" .308 in stock trim, but I'll put up with the weight in 6.5 CM.

The MLOK and LW 16" combo is 3/4lbs more than a 17S, not 1/4lb.  Once FN introduced the 6.5C about a year ago they switched the twist to 1:10 in the 308.  I had a brand new Leupold Mk6 take a shit within the first hundred rounds on my EMC, I think it says more about Leupold than the rifle it's on.




I can’t speak for thehun06 but I imagine the reason he likes a cutdown 20S over a 17S is for the extend receiver, it seems like a lot of people really hate how short the 17S is.

At least FN finally progressed past 1995 era twist rates in the SCARbage....

I can only guess the 1:12 was specifically requested in the original SCAR competition. Otherwise I don’t know what excuse FN would have for choosing such a slow twist.

Thanks. Yeah, the stock 17S rail is pretty short, especially if someone wants to tack a bunch of stuff on, or prefers something like the extended C-grip hold. I got the KDG MREX for those purposes.

Yeah...Mine shot 175's terribly. After FN fixed mine it shot 168's fairly well for such a light barrel profile as long as you didn't get the barrel too warm. It really liked 155 Palma's.

Palmetto 308 AR's seem to be a good bang for the buck, but as others have mentioned, if money isn't an object, it seems there are better options.
LMT or maybe Seekins seem to be the cats meow.