Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
Durkin Tactical Franklin Armory
User Panel

Posted: 4/18/2021 9:05:29 PM EDT
Bought 1k of the newer 69 gr. .224 bullets from RMR to do load work ups for my Lothar Walther LW50 rifle and my LaRue stealth barreled Aero Precision rifle. Both are 16” 1:8 Wylde chambered rifles.

Here are my results from today. Promising, but not anything special at this point. I don’t think I had my best stuff today, as I seemed to get eye fatigue and towards the end felt a little rushed. I also was having issues with my bench as it has a very slick top and my bag was sliding all over the place, but I think I got that squared away about midway through the first set of TAC loads  with the LW50 rifle.

I’d appreciate comments on groups/trends or specific charges to look at. The goal is to have the best sub MOA load for both rifles.

I did not chrono this work, but will chrono future development and seating depth tests.

Here are the work ups:
69 grn RMR
XBR (23.1, 23.4, 23.7, 24.0, 24.3, 24.6, 24.9)
Wolf primer + LC brass
COL = 2.25"

69 grn RMR
TAC  (23.2, 23.5, 23.8, 24.1, 24.4, 24.7, 25.0)
Wolf primer + LC brass
COL = 2.25"

First set with TAC & the LW50
Attachment Attached File


Fourth set with TAC & the LaRue
Attachment Attached File


Second set with XBR and the LW50
Attachment Attached File


Third set with XBR and the LaRue
Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 4/18/2021 9:07:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Observations....

24.7 and 25.0 of TAC had very similar patterns in both rifles...
On the XBR set, the 24.0 looks similar with little horizontal spread, but vertical stringing.

Please give me your observations/insight on these groups. I’d like to try some seating depth trials, but need one or two charges to try. Should I look at any particular charges and work around those?

This is the first time I’ve shot for groups in years, so I was feeling a little rusty, I’m sure a lot of you guys could do better.

Thanks

ZA
Link Posted: 4/19/2021 12:55:34 PM EDT
[#2]
Is this at 100 yards?
Link Posted: 4/19/2021 1:53:16 PM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TheDude315:
Is this at 100 yards?
View Quote


That would have been helpful info.... LOL!

Yes, 100 yards.

ZA
Link Posted: 4/19/2021 9:28:39 PM EDT
[#4]
I forgot to mention that my goal here is to find a common, accurate, durable load for both rifles. I have a 3rd LaRue stealth barreled rifle this will work for as well. When I say “durable” I mean that if I’m off a tenth of a grain on my powder charge, it won’t affect the grouping/accuracy. I’m hoping the TAC one wins as I have about 20 lbs of that powder on hand, but I do have about 9 lbs of XBR as backup. The RMR bullet is about 1/2 the price of the 69 SMK, that’s why I’m studying this bullet.

In that frame of mind, I think I’m going to look at the following for follow up developments:

TAC @ 24.8 grains
XBR-8208 @ 24.7 grains

My reasoning is that the 24.7 grains of TAC and the 24.6 grains of XBR were not bad if you eliminate some of the horizontal stringing (some of which may have been wind or poor form on my part) and the next increment up in powder charge was similar in grouping. Conversely, the powder charge of 24.4 of TAC and 24.3 XBR seemed like a scatter node. I think going a tenth of a grain further away from the scatter nodes would be good idea to increase the durability of what I find.

Next up would be seating depth trials. Planning on doing 5X for each rifle in each powder @ 2.22”, 2.23”, 2.24”, 2.25” and 2.26”.

What do you guys think of this action plan?

Thanks in advance...

ZA

Link Posted: 4/21/2021 11:49:28 AM EDT
[#5]
Do you have a control of any sort to show you're capable of being more precise than these loads given a different load? Such as a known good load. For all I can tell that bullet is just not precise, or that's your limit as a shooter with that rifle.
Link Posted: 4/22/2021 6:13:48 PM EDT
[#6]
Same rifle from like 8 years ago...

Attachment Attached File
Attachment Attached File


ZA
Link Posted: 4/23/2021 9:47:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: SuperJlarge] [#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ZA206:
I forgot to mention that my goal here is to find a common, accurate, durable load for both rifles. I have a 3rd LaRue stealth barreled rifle this will work for as well. When I say “durable” I mean that if I’m off a tenth of a grain on my powder charge, it won’t affect the grouping/accuracy. I’m hoping the TAC one wins as I have about 20 lbs of that powder on hand, but I do have about 9 lbs of XBR as backup. The RMR bullet is about 1/2 the price of the 69 SMK, that’s why I’m studying this bullet.

In that frame of mind, I think I’m going to look at the following for follow up developments:

TAC @ 24.8 grains
XBR-8208 @ 24.7 grains


View Quote


I’d look at XBR-8208 at 24.8grs and TAC at 24.9gr and possibly 25.2gr if safe in your barrel. Smart move to go with finer charge adjustments in recent testing vs 7yrs ago. Imo, going with greater than .2-.3gr changes in charge weight for sub 50gr loads can easily lead to skipping over a node (as seen below). Also, if the brass is beyond 3x fired, it may lead to irregularities if it hasn’t been annealed. Just tossing that out.

I think you’ll have to adjust the seating depth for the Larue and hope it also works well in the LW50 barrel or just deal with needing two loads. None of the LT groups appear to really like that seating depth from my untrained eye.

Using this same method of reading the target is how I developed my 69gr load and what I’ll use to finalize my H4895/75eld load (Hypothesized 23.9gr or 24.5gr).



Good luck on your endeavor.
Link Posted: 1/22/2022 6:22:34 PM EDT
[#8]
OK boys… finally got around to getting my next batch of work ups made for the 69 RMR.
Going to shoot them again in the LW50 and the Larue Stealth rifles.
I got a new, much nicer scope that I’m hoping will be a little easier to shoot with.

24.8 grains of TAC with the Wolf SRP, LC brass, 69RMR at the following COL:
2.205”, 2.220”, 2.235”, 2.250”, 2.265”

AND…

24.7 grains of XBR8208 with the Wolf SRP, LC brass, 69RMR at the following COL:
2.200”, 2.215”, 2.230”, 2.245”, 2.260”

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 2/18/2022 12:19:38 PM EDT
[#9]
Subscribed.  Thanks for info.
Link Posted: 2/25/2022 4:52:12 PM EDT
[#10]
Hello all . I’ve been watching this forum for a while because I’ve been reloading the same 69g rmr bullets . I’ve been working them up and had some good results today

Rifle = Noveske 20’’ heavy varmint barrel . Noveske bolt and receivers and rail with geissele (SD-E) trigger
Gfl brass
REM 7/12 primers
Rmr 69g bthp bullet . A lot like smk but a lot cheaper
Accurate powder 2520 . Had 8lbs on self and getting low on 8208 so I’ve been using the 2520 a lot lately

25.10g of powder got me .45 moa group and 100yrs
25.70 g 0f powder got me a .33 moa group with 4 shots the wind got my first shot so there was a flyer on 1st shot

Attachment Attached File
Attachment Attached File
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 2/25/2022 6:10:09 PM EDT
[#11]
Nice. Thanks for the update
Link Posted: 3/14/2022 10:44:24 PM EDT
[#12]
I think I’ll be able to get out this weekend and shoot these loads.
Got the new scope and put a nice LaRue trigger in the LaRue barreled Aero rifle. The previous trigger was a NiB coated GI style trigger… probably a 6 or 7 lb pull. The LaRue is similar to the SSA-E I have in the LW50.

I also cleaned the heck out of both barrels with Wipeout and some JB/Kroil. Both are virgin now and ready for some foulers!

ZA
Link Posted: 3/24/2022 3:52:35 PM EDT
[#13]
Well...

I shot 1/2 the load work ups (with the LaRue), but I'm not going to acknowledge them (horrendous).
Complete scope fiasco at the range. I should have just left when I knew there was an issue and saved the whole thing for another day.

GRRRRRR.....

I'll post up in this thread when I get it done to some level of satisfaction where I didn't screw up multiple variables at the same time and make a fool of myself.

-ZA
Link Posted: 3/27/2022 11:37:27 PM EDT
[#14]
Do you have access to a chronograph? As a handloader it can become an issue of chasing down the wrong rabbit hole. Do you have access to a longer range? If so go out as long as you can at lease 300 preferably 500. Load a few rounds extra at a mid weight. The. Load 2 rounds of each weight, shoot one round in each rifle, then mark the holes on target for each weight you try. You are looking for the 3 closest numbers on vertical. Do not worry about horizontal, wind will be messing with you and you can tune some horizontal with setting depth. Use the middle weight. This is your optimal charge weight. It will give you the most flexibility. Then work on setting depth if you want but you should be close when you figure you are loading for 2 rifles at book length. A chronograph can pay for itself in saved time and components.
Link Posted: 4/2/2022 9:25:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: ZA206] [#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By GreenA5H2:
Do you have access to a chronograph? As a handloader it can become an issue of chasing down the wrong rabbit hole. Do you have access to a longer range? If so go out as long as you can at lease 300 preferably 500. Load a few rounds extra at a mid weight. The. Load 2 rounds of each weight, shoot one round in each rifle, then mark the holes on target for each weight you try. You are looking for the 3 closest numbers on vertical. Do not worry about horizontal, wind will be messing with you and you can tune some horizontal with setting depth. Use the middle weight. This is your optimal charge weight. It will give you the most flexibility. Then work on setting depth if you want but you should be close when you figure you are loading for 2 rifles at book length. A chronograph can pay for itself in saved time and components.
View Quote


I have two chronograph’s (magneto speed and a Caldwell)… I need to start using them more. I can shoot out to 300-ish at my range. I’m currently focused on getting better at shooting groups with these two rifles while doing these work ups. Honestly, adding more variables that I have to deal with at this point feels counter productive.

Here are the results of the second round of the 69 RMR testing. The LaRue results can be mostly discounted as I shot those a couple weekends ago and had major scope issues and wound up using my 1-10 Vortex Razor which was not great for shooting groups. It was a bad day and I should have just packed it up and saved the rounds for that rifle for another day.

The shooting I did today was with the LW50 and I think I had decent form today, but I had a gusting side wind that may have caused a little more horizontal dispersion than what I’d expect. Oh well…

I don’t think there is any value in trying any additional work on XBR loads, nothing was worthwhile. The TAC load at 2.235” was four clustered together in a 1/2” group and I threw the 4th out of the five.

Attachment Attached File


Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 4/3/2022 12:58:41 PM EDT
[#16]
What’s the best groups you have ever gotten with those rifles ? Do you have a base line with a factory ammo they shoot lights out with ? Have you ever shot 69g gold metal match and see how they do ?I was going to test some more 69g rmr bullets yesterday but shot my 77g smk loads and my 308 loads . 77g did fantastic .3 but my 308 load was horrible guess I have some work to do .those 69g rmr bullets has lot of potential . They say the corncob bits in the hollow point don’t effect accuracy but I’m anal I guess and remove it with a small pin dill .
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 1:58:37 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Sinfulsilence:
What’s the best groups you have ever gotten with those rifles ? Do you have a base line with a factory ammo they shoot lights out with ? Have you ever shot 69g gold metal match and see how they do ?I was going to test some more 69g rmr bullets yesterday but shot my 77g smk loads and my 308 loads . 77g did fantastic .3 but my 308 load was horrible guess I have some work to do .those 69g rmr bullets has lot of potential . They say the corncob bits in the hollow point don’t effect accuracy but I’m anal I guess and remove it with a small pin dill .
View Quote


To be honest, I've never bought factory "match grade" ammo for either of these rifles, and have no "baseline" for how good they are. I've shot close to 1/2" 5-shot groups in the past while doing load workups with the LW50 rifle. These are the first load workups involving the LaRue barreled Aero rifle. I've had that LaRue barrel for about 5 years, but just got around to building it up last year. I'm trying to "get better" at shooting for groups (and just become a better shot in general) with all of my guns. All of my recent workups for all of my 223 rifles are now using Wolf SRP's because I've got like 9000 of them. Most of my old workups were with Rem 7-1/2's which have been unavailable for a long time...

I think both guns are more accurate than I am, and I'm working on trying to refine my shooting technique so I'm repeatable and am less of a variable.

I did new load works (really re-hashes of old ones but using the Wolf SRP) on the LW50 last weekend using the 52 SMK +H322 and a 55 ZMAX + TAC. Both of those looked promising and I think I can find some reliable base line ammo with either, now I just need to do the seating depth test.

-ZA

Link Posted: 4/24/2022 5:56:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Sinfulsilence] [#18]
Got out today and shot some 69g rmr bullets loaded with IMR 8208 powder 22.0 g — 25.60g loading .30 up every 10 rounds . All my groups where under 1.5 moa but did get some good results with the higher charge weights .I did get tighter groups with the 2520 powder . The best group with 25.70g of 2520 got me a .33 moa group . One of the best groups I’ve had with this rifle . Just as a side note I’ve been doing my load development with a Dillion scale and I didn’t think it was weight my charges very accurately . This load was weighted out using my new A&D FX-120i and this scale is more reliable and accurate so hopefully will get my load development info more accurate  Attachment Attached File
Attachment Attached File
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 4/29/2022 10:44:46 AM EDT
[#19]
I bought a receiver extension lapping tool from Brownells and some Loctite and tore both rifles apart the other week and trued up the extension on the LW50 (couldn't do the LaRue b/c of the type of upper) and bedded both barrels with the Loctite. I also cleaned both of the barrels very well and looked at them with my new bore scope and they both look good. The LW50 has polygonal rifling that's almost mirror like... it's trippy looking at it in the bore scope.

Hope to get back on this experiment in the coming weeks with some better results from the guns an myself. Gonna start using the magnetospeed.

-ZA
Link Posted: 4/30/2022 8:56:00 AM EDT
[#20]
I'd say receiver face as receiver extension is the buffer tube.
Link Posted: 5/2/2022 11:27:15 AM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By HighpowerRifleBrony:
I'd say receiver face as receiver extension is the buffer tube.
View Quote


You mean lapping the buffer tube won't help??!!!
Link Posted: 7/18/2022 8:01:28 AM EDT
[#22]
Best I could do with TAC was right around an inch. Gun is a solid 1/2” gun with loads it likes.
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top