User Panel
Posted: 5/7/2020 2:14:17 AM EDT
Yep, no masks for me...
So, in the beginning my view was that if this was going to be really bad you want to get exposed early before the beds and vents are all taken or wait until after the peak.. Things here didn't really get bad and my wife and I did the whole distancing thing, etc... I believe that most people will be exposed eventually no matter what.. You will either develop immunity or die. I think that the odds of a vaccine being available quickly is very low, I'm not in a high risk category, effective treatments have been developed and advanced medical care is available...… I may have already been exposed and don't know it... So, now I'm not doing anything to limit my exposure.. We are taking Zinc, Vitamin C and as always, I drink ridiculous amounts of Vitamin D milk... So, my goal is to get exposed now before any possible kind of fall spike in cases... |
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[#2]
I do agree that we all are getting it, or already have had it, but I think 'trying' to get it in the hopes to be immune to a particular strain is a bold strategy. But maybe it's like Chickenpox. We all wanted to getit early, because getting it later in life was more severe, but we now know that it lies dormant in nerve cells until you are old, then can cause shingles. And a vaccine was developed, so now hopefully my kids won't have to deal with it.
Thoughts on rumors of lasting lung/cardiovascular/renal damage? not talking you out of it, but wanted your perspective, I haven't seen any real studies yet, just anecdotal reports. im still shopping and going to appointments, but I'll throw a courtesy mask on when I'm in close settings, and wash my hands more often than before. Do you worry about passing it to a CNA at a retirement home or cashier with a underlying health condition? Those are the ones that I go back and forth on. Or if I give it to my wife, and she goes to visit her at risk dad and inadvertently passes it to him. |
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[#3]
I thought the exact same thing, I' right there with ya.
Local hospital wouldn't let me make a reservation, butt I been suckin doorknobs and lickin toilet seats down at the airport just trying to get on with things. |
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[#4]
I may have already been exposed and don't know it... View Quote Millions will find that already true. And you don't have to go full retard Muslim licking the Shrine of the Holy Ass in Qom to do it. What we actually know: Children dont' seem to get it at all, and don't transmit it. The Netherlands is reopening schools, and Switzerland has put out guidance it's ok for the kids to see Grandma and Grandpa. Adults up to age 60 are about 80% NO SYMPTOMS AT ALL. If you have some other preexisting medical condition which requires daily medical care, it might not be a good idea. The reality however, is that it WILL get around. Plan accordingly. Point being, if masks work, then why close down businesses, and if masks don't work, why force us to wear them at all? Be advised there is a rule of science that "you will not get out of this alive." What you do get to do is to control to the best of your ability, when. Americans have lost that concept - they act like they are going to look like Sweet Sixteen their entire life and live the same as they did then. One look at Pelosi or Hillary tells you that ain't happening. RGB just dodged another bullet but Death rides full auto when he chooses. We were supposed to flatten the curve, nobody promised you'd never get it. Nobody. |
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[#6]
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[#7]
I’m hoping to avoid it till a vaccine is out. Working for me so far but who knows what the future holds and if a viable vaccine will ever happen.
Humans have eliminated countless diseases through vaccines. I’m guessing antibiotics and vaccines have saved more lives than anything else in the medical field. |
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[#8]
From the title, thought this was a thread about sharing a joint at the bus station.
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[#9]
I would be wary of your proposition...
It seems to affect people drastically differently with no rhyme or reason for who it hits hard and who it seemingly passes through without a sign. Friend of a friend in his late 20's with zero complicating factors or underlying conditions has been in ICU on a vent and oxygen concentration machine (can't recall the technical name right now) for a few weeks. He is in a coma and has been touch and go the whole time... You sure you want to roll that dice while medical professionals are still infighting about what is the most effective treatment? The more time you buy the better treatment you're likely to get. IMHO, no need to worry about a shortage of vents unless you're in an urban area that is already extremely short staffed and undersupplied. One thing I really like about Indiana's COVID-19 tracking page is it also shows ICU bed & ventilator usage. Despite our growing case load we have been maintaining around 50% ICU bed use & 20% vent use. Indiana will run out of ICU beds before vents. |
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[#10]
I think that's a monumentally stupid idea.
There is growing evidence that the severity of your symptoms greatly depends on how much of the virus you are exposed to. Get a small enough dose, and you don't even notice any symptoms. Get a large enough dose, and you die - no matter who you are. When you intentionally expose yourself, you have absolutely no way of knowing or adjusting your dosage. It's not much different from trying to become immune to rattlesnake bites by walking into a pit of rattlesnakes. |
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[#11]
Death rides full auto when he chooses View Quote Hell yes he does |
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[#12]
Dumb. - better treatment not vaccines are coming out. They are learning to give people blood thinner when infected. Wait a while longer until you do something stupid. If you do- please will me your ammo
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[#14]
My question for the dissenters….
Assuming that a vaccine is not developed anytime soon, what is your plan..? |
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[#15]
Originally Posted By CoyoteGray: My question for the dissenters…. Assuming that a vaccine is not developed anytime soon, what is your plan..? View Quote Avoid contact with the sick. Maintain fitness. Eat healthy. Take supplements that might help boost the immune system. Wash hands. Same things one does to avoid any illness. If I get it, get treated for it. If it leads to my death, then so be it. Everyone has a designated time to die. |
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[#16]
I agree the get it over with before fall.
BUT I will wait till there is a more clear cut treatment. There is evidence of permanent lung scarring and potential for other problems. And I have HCQ and zpacks in the safe and take all the vitamins. I had pneumonia in Jan and it was not fun. |
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[#17]
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[#18]
I live in a rural area with low population density.
We've got 35,000 pop, had 14 cases, 13 recovered. If you live in NYC or some other metro area where you live on top of one another, I think the risk is greater due to sheer number of virus cells you're exposed to. Rural areas certainly have it, but not as much of it. I think we'll be exposed to lesser viral loads, with fewer symptoms, fewer hospitalizations. |
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[#19]
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[#20]
Originally Posted By rob78: I live in a rural area with low population density. We've got 35,000 pop, had 14 cases, 13 recovered. If you live in NYC or some other metro area where you live on top of one another, I think the risk is greater due to sheer number of virus cells you're exposed to. Rural areas certainly have it, but not as much of it. I think we'll be exposed to lesser viral loads, with fewer symptoms, fewer hospitalizations. View Quote I think you are right about population density. That does seem to make a difference with the spread of it.....which makes complete sense. |
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[#21]
I'm going with avoidance, will wear mask when out, wash hands often, etc. I have at-risk coworkers and family members, and a few elderly neighbors who have been told by their doctors not to go out unless necessary so I'm doing a lot of their grocery shopping.
I've had bronchitis, flu, and pneumonia and while I got over them all, each caused weeks of misery and it took months for me to get back to full lung function. No asthma, never have smoked, but for whatever reason I seem to be sensitive to that kind of thing. So, I'd rather just avoid COVID if possible. |
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[#22]
Quoted: I would be wary of your proposition... It seems to affect people drastically differently with no rhyme or reason for who it hits hard and who it seemingly passes through without a sign. Friend of a friend in his late 20's with zero complicating factors or underlying conditions has been in ICU on a vent and oxygen concentration machine (can't recall the technical name right now) for a few weeks. He is in a coma and has been touch and go the whole time... You sure you want to roll that dice while medical professionals are still infighting about what is the most effective treatment? The more time you buy the better treatment you're likely to get. View Quote That sucks for your friend, but unless there’s a full biopsy or you’re this guy’s personal physician, I wouldn’t say there are no underlying conditions. Last report of the “healthy” guy who died from COVID-19, they found out he had an undiagnosed heart disease. Doctors are now coming out and are saying they’ve been pressured to list the primary cause of death as COVID-19 even if the patients had significant on-going complications. A factor? Yes; primary cause…extremely questionable. I think for the first month of so of uncertainty, avoidance was the best course of action, mostly to avoid over-taxing the hospitals as we didn’t know the severity or scope…which isn’t the case anymore. While I wouldn’t go out and seek infection by “licking door knobs and toilet seats at the local airport”, I no longer am concerned about the over-precautions of gloves, masks, and absurd social distancing (I still personally like my “personal space”). We may or may not get a vaccine, and just like the flu, the vaccine isn’t a cure and may not even be that effective. We do know that HCQ and Zpack is a very effective treatment combination and now we’re hearing that Vitamin-D is a good deterrent. I still question the data on the mortality rate, I’ve had recent medical checkups and all throughout my military career. My wife and I are both active, healthy, and no underlying conditions from our recent checkups, so my concern is dropping significantly. This Chinese viral gift is out and will just be a normal part of life (and death). The best way is to limit the affects through herd-immunity and continuing to isolate those adversely infected/impacted or with those additional health risks and underlying conditions. Common sense still applies but the fear of transmission is simply not dangerous to 99% of the population and you can’t stop society and the economy for 1%...live cautiously in accordance to your own health conditions, but I see little reason to fear infection anymore; just like the seasonal flu. ROCK6 |
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[#23]
Originally Posted By ROCK6: That sucks for your friend, but unless there’s a full biopsy or you’re this guy’s personal physician, I wouldn’t say there are no underlying conditions. Last report of the “healthy” guy who died from COVID-19, they found out he had an undiagnosed heart disease. Doctors are now coming out and are saying they’ve been pressured to list the primary cause of death as COVID-19 even if the patients had significant on-going complications. A factor? Yes; primary cause…extremely questionable. View Quote I'm certain they haven't closely examined every "healthy" person to die from this so I don't think it's a valid argument that only unhealthy people are dying from it. Additionally, your point is largely irrelevant to the point I was making. OP is talking about intentional exposure bc he feels that he would be able to recover as long as the medical system isn't overwhelmed. But OP, and anybody else can appear healthy enough to recover but could have undiagnosed health factors that would complicate recovery. Those factors may remain undiagnosed right up until they complicate a COVID-19 infection at which point it may be too late... Not a risk I recommend taking until the various treatments are better studied & understood. |
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[#24]
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[#25]
Comments on this....?
https://www.amny.com/transit/cuomo-expresses-dismay-at-the-number-of-covid-19-cases-of-those-staying-home/ “Data from up to 100 hospitals across the state showed that 66% of patients – from a pool of 1,000 – had been self-isolating for the most part and still contracted the coronavirus” |
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[#26]
Quoted: Comments on this....? https://www.amny.com/transit/cuomo-expresses-dismay-at-the-number-of-covid-19-cases-of-those-staying-home/ "Data from up to 100 hospitals across the state showed that 66% of patients from a pool of 1,000 had been self-isolating for the most part and still contracted the coronavirus" View Quote Self isolating.... Like still going to the store, using a shared restroom...kitchen etc Style of self isolation that 95% of people practiced......... |
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[#27]
Originally Posted By CoyoteGray: Comments on this....? https://www.amny.com/transit/cuomo-expresses-dismay-at-the-number-of-covid-19-cases-of-those-staying-home/ “Data from up to 100 hospitals across the state showed that 66% of patients – from a pool of 1,000 – had been self-isolating for the most part and still contracted the coronavirus” View Quote What people SAY and THINK they are doing and what they are actually doing is too very different things. We didn't have a "lockdown"- we had a shelter in place SUGGESTION. People still went places, idiots still congregated and "loved on" each other at Walmart. Because grandma missed bridge club a time or two, she figures she "isolated" but other than that she made all the trips out she normally does. Just think of the ridiculous double speak the general population heard- "Don't hoard food" but "don't go out to the stores more than you have to"- that sort of thing. The general population aren't like most of us (should be), wherein we have several weeks or months or years of food at home. I mean there are people out there that actually ran out of TP LOL. |
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[#28]
Quoted: I'm certain they haven't closely examined every "healthy" person to die from this so I don't think it's a valid argument that only unhealthy people are dying from it. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: I'm certain they haven't closely examined every "healthy" person to die from this so I don't think it's a valid argument that only unhealthy people are dying from it. Well, the data does show that over 90% of deaths with COVID-19 have had additionally, and serious underlying health conditions. Pulmonary conditions and the immuno-compromised are not the leading underlying health conditions based on percentages, instead, diabetes, chronic kidney disease, obesity and cardiac problems are the most commonly repeated pre-existing conditions. State by state are showing deaths, by the largest majority are still victims over 60 years old and with one or more of the above conditions. It's very much a valid argument that the vast majority of Americans are not at risk...the data couldn't be more clear. Originally Posted By protus: Self isolating.... Like still going to the store, using a shared restroom...kitchen etc Style of self isolation that 95% of people practiced......... This is really the danger for future (and far more serious) pandemics. "Self-Isolation" is no longer actual isolation; it's staying home unless you need to go out and get or do something. Add in poor PPE practice where people use the same mask and/or gloves every day without replacing or washing...and a virus that can remain contagious on such surfaces for several days is a good indicator on why these "isolated" individuals mysteriously contracted the virus. ROCK6 |
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[#29]
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[#30]
I have yet to change my habits one single bit, but I'm a flu bro.
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[#31]
Originally Posted By ROCK6: Well, the data does show that over 90% of deaths with COVID-19 have had additionally, and serious underlying health conditions. State by state are showing deaths, by the largest majority are still victims over 60 years old and with one or more of the above conditions. It's very much a valid argument that the vast majority of Americans are not at risk...the data couldn't be more clear. View Quote Is that supposed to be some comfort to the young people or people without complicating factors that have died or are going to die? Yes, the data is clear, they are low risk, but certainly not "no risk" as you're suggesting. |
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[#32]
I have found that maybe 5% of people that are "self isolating" are doing it to a level that would keep them completely safe.
Most aren't careful with deliveries and are still getting fast food. I watched a trained medical person walk into the building with gloves and mask on and after opening 2 doors and using a counter pen they then pulled there mask down and scratched there nose. |
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[#33]
Originally Posted By CoyoteGray: Comments on this....? https://www.amny.com/transit/cuomo-expresses-dismay-at-the-number-of-covid-19-cases-of-those-staying-home/ “Data from up to 100 hospitals across the state showed that 66% of patients – from a pool of 1,000 – had been self-isolating for the most part and still contracted the coronavirus” View Quote Self-isolating in a tenement or high-rise in NYC with 500-2000 other people is not the same as self-isolating on my 20 acre farm or running an apple orchard in Up-state NY. Just checking the mail everyday is a risk in the city. |
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[#34]
It just occurs to me that using PPE until a vaccine is out and proven makes the most sense. We can't hole up in our houses full time for months on end. We human beings are social animals, we NEED interaction with other humans to stay sane. That doesn't mean we can't take advantage of we in the "prepared" group using the PPE we have acquired to minimize our exposure.
If other folks want to roll the dice and play the General Tso's Hot and Spicy Virus lottery, by all means go right ahead. I'll pass on that, thanks. |
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[#35]
Judging from the refrigeration trucks parked in all the Funeral parlor parking lots here I'll say the only good time to be exposed to the virus will be after being inoculated with a vaccine!
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[#36]
Originally Posted By Bubbles: You forgot wearing the mask incorrectly, like under your chin or only covering your mouth but not your nose. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Originally Posted By Bubbles: You forgot wearing the mask incorrectly, like under your chin or only covering your mouth but not your nose. Yes, and most disregard the most vulnerable vectors of contracting the virus is through the eyes. While the mask is meant to contain spreading the virus from someone who already has it or thinks they have it, it's not an effective means of protecting yourself if ill-fitted and without eye protection. Personal Protective Equipment is kind of an oxymoron as it's not really meant to protect the wearer for this instance of slowing the spread of the virus. Again, staying home if feeling ill, covering your mouth/nose when coughing or sneezing, and washing your hands with soap are just as effective...the mask (and gloves, to an extent) are not effective means of PPE. Those who fall into that susceptible age category or they have the already identified, riskiest health conditions should take significant precautions and either isolate themselves and limit exposure as much as possible. Quoted: Is that supposed to be some comfort to the young people or people without complicating factors that have died or are going to die? Die from what? Diabetes, obesity, suicide, drug overdose, car accidents??? Healthy young people (under the age of 17) are at zero risk without underlying conditions as of April according to the CDC. Even with all age categories, deaths with no underlying conditions is under 200. Do the math. If you are healthy with no known health risks you are far more likely to win the lottery than die from COVID 19. I'm not trying to downplay the danger, but just saying we need to have some perspective. We average about 7000 deaths a day in the US, that just makes me wonder about the actual causes of death where COVID-19 is getting credit. I won't argue it's deadly to a small section of our population, but it's essentially a non-threat to the vast majority of Americans. As an optimist, I do hope the fear and threat spread from this virus to those who are at risk by their own life-choices and bad habits. Obesity and diabetes are identified risks. Many I'm sure are genetically not-at-fault, but some at-risk factors can be mitigated by just taking one's personal health serious. ROCK6 |
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[#37]
I see lots of people that assume that once you get this virus, that you'll somehow build immunity that will prevent you from ever getting it again. That's a bold assumption.
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[#38]
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[#39]
Quoted: Is that supposed to be some comfort to the young people or people without complicating factors that have died or are going to die? Yes, the data is clear, they are low risk, but certainly not "no risk" as you're suggesting. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Originally Posted By ROCK6: Well, the data does show that over 90% of deaths with COVID-19 have had additionally, and serious underlying health conditions. State by state are showing deaths, by the largest majority are still victims over 60 years old and with one or more of the above conditions. It's very much a valid argument that the vast majority of Americans are not at risk...the data couldn't be more clear. Is that supposed to be some comfort to the young people or people without complicating factors that have died or are going to die? Yes, the data is clear, they are low risk, but certainly not "no risk" as you're suggesting. Nothing is no risk. I'll go drive my car and get where I'm going safely most likely, despite thousands who are going to crash and die. Stats say for young people, dying from covid is on par with a lightning strike probability wise. |
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[#40]
Quoted: Avoid contact with the sick. Maintain fitness. Eat healthy. Take supplements that might help boost the immune system. Wash hands. Same things one does to avoid any illness. If I get it, get treated for it. If it leads to my death, then so be it. Everyone has a designated time to die. View Quote Agreed. I'm a believer in herd-immunity, but the reality is that it takes years to really take effect and is greatly assisted by vaccinations. A vaccine isn't a guarantee, but we do have reports on effect treatments. There are still a lot of unknowns about this virus and how severe the mutations may or may not be as it seasonally moves around. The majority will get it in the future, just like the flu. It's still extremely low risk to the vast majority of those under 60 years old and healthy...there are such a small number of presumed "healthy" adults contracting COVID-19 with really bad reactions that it's simply not a concern for me. The big question is how much of the contracted virus is needed for the more severe symptoms (there are reports that higher concentrations likely cause more severe reactions)? I won't wear a mask unless required for work entrance and if I'm around an older crowd or those with underlying health conditions (such as our church). However, I won't be licking door knob and toilet bowl seats. I think there are valid concerns that even contracting COVID-19 and having anti-bodies doesn't necessarily mean a second exposure won't be worse...I would still use some caution. Even if you don't subscribe to the efficacy of masks or social distancing, I will still avoid large, dense crowds indoors, continue to wash my hands thoroughly, and if I'm feeling ill with any flu-like symptoms, I'll self-isolate. Life will go on and death will continue as well. Make smart decisions, look after those close to you who are older and have underlying health conditions; practice good sanitation and hygiene, limit stupid or unnecessary exposure, eat and stay physically healthy. ROCK6 |
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[#41]
Quoted: Nothing is no risk. I'll go drive my car and get where I'm going safely most likely, despite thousands who are going to crash and die. Stats say for young people, dying from covid is on par with a lightning strike probability wise. View Quote The OP is about intentional exposure. Do you you drive your car as fast as it goes through traffic with no seatbelts? Or do you take appropriate precautions to reduce the risks? I'm not saying you should hole-up in your house; I'm just saying it's stupid to intentionally expose yourself to something that we don't really understand yet. We don't even know if exposure will lead to immunity or what possible mutations will look like so it be all for nothing. Why intentionally take risks that could have severe consequences? And just an update on the young man I spoke about earlier. He is now out of the hospital and going through outpatient rehab. He had no prior diagnosed health conditions before COVID and still has none. He says he was one of those that felt that bc he was young it wouldn't be a problem for him so he wasn't taking precautions. He was in a medically induced coma and on a vent for 22 days of his 4+ weeks in ICU. He lost over 40 lbs (more than 20% of his bodyweight) and has trouble with basic body functions due to muscle weakness. Even if you survive it can be life altering. IMHO, it seems especially stupid to intentionally expose yourself to that. Yes, you will likely get it eventually. But hopefully by then more is understood about it and it can more effectively be treated. |
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[#42]
Quoted: I believe that most people will be exposed eventually no matter what.. You will either develop immunity or die. View Quote I've heard this sentiment a lot. Unfortunately, it's not based in any type of science. Something like 3% of our state population has gotten it. There's never been a disease in recorded history of the earth that 100% of everyone living has gotten. |
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