How many people plan on going to a cabin, lake place, friends/family out in the country, etc when SHTF? How far is it for you? Do you have the gas to get there? Can you bring all your beans, bullets and bandaids?

Last year I bugged out from a deep blue Midwestern state to my own personal paradise in Montana. Besides the overloaded moving truck, I had a trailer with my truck pulling it maxed out as well. I still left about 4000# of LTS food and other gear with my brother. It took me until last month to get back for the rest of it, but its all under my roof now.

Point being, if you can’t defend it, hold it, take it with you or get it to where you’re going…it’s not really a prep item. I live at my BOL now and am working every day to set it up to be defensible and productive while holding onto all that I have. —Not having access to that food for ~11 months really bothered me. I stacked up another 1000# of food and restocked all freezers to basically overflowing (26cu ft total from empty to 95%+ full as a normal status).

Get your plans in order. Hopefully you won’t need to use them within the next year.

I'm in the burbs and to say bugging out is an option is unrealistic.  I've got bridges to deal with and regardless, getting out of my house would be a shit show.  Ask your family to pack up for a two week camping trip with a hour notice and see how it goes.  Now add 100K people doing the same thing.

1) May be joining you soon in Montana, or might go to Utah or Wyoming.  I'm all set now, but could always be better, and with more acres.

2) A bugout location is great, if it is already stocked and you are there.  Otherwise, a million things can go wrong trying to get there.

3) Absolutely, if you don't have it in your hands, it ain't yours.  And if you can't protect it, it ain't yours.  And if you can't take it with you on foot (cause gas and traffic and...) it ain't yours for long.

4) To those in the burbs... don't crowd onto the highways and surface streets if SHTF.  Literally 99% of people will try it, because they heard it is the smart plan.  So just trash the outside of your home one night, lock up tight, and bug in.  Then go shopping at all the abandoned homes in your AO and be the Warlord of your HOA.  

I live in a neighborhood in a town of about 24k. Town next to me has 20k. Outside of that, it is podunk towns. Anyways.. i'm not sure I could bug out with a 9 week old, and a 4 year old. My best bet is to gather with my immediate family including a few cousins and dad. Only 4 of us have ARs, and only 2 of us (my dad and I) can shoot and move. Even that is shotty for him being in his 60s. I can't move far from my formula, food, and water stash sooo I better be John fuckin Wick when the time comes. I keep meaning to go into debt for a thermal.

Bugging out is a last option like you live near a nuke power plant and "there was an incident but there is nothing to worry about"

I have a plan for it but its not a priority move. Have a quick bag and packing list. Try it and go.

Leaving is the last option if/when this area/place is no longer habitable for whatever reason.  

Back up positions are planned...depending on the scenario depends on where we would go and what we would take depending on what's left...

You can have all the plans in the world...but in the end, most of the time, the situation dictates your moves and those 'plans' fall apart quickly.  Best to be as mobile and flexible as possible.

My focus is more shifted towards getting home during a shtf deal. With my luck I would’ve just pulled in to the parking lot at work 30 miles away when something happens.

I really think too many people have unrealistic ideas about bugging out.  A lot of people have read fictional stories where the characters bug out but that is fiction.  Anyone east of the Mississippi River and those on the west coast have a lot of company around them.  For every place someone thinks they are going to bug out to, you are going to cross paths with a bunch of others trying to do the same thing.  I can only imagine the Washington DC/Baltimore or L.A. metro areas trying to bug out.  It wouldn't happen for the overwhelming majority of people.  Way to many people trying to move on way too few roads.  Walking?  Biking?  Sure, join in with the other million people trying to do it.

Nope, I think bugging out is a pipe dream for the majority.  There are some who will make it sure, but most won't without a big heads up before the masses panic.  Better to plan to hunker down and stay local for as long as you can.  Lets all hope it never comes to the point any of us have to really find out.

Looked out the window just to check.

I’m here.

Lots of relatives that were touting suburban life a few years ago have hinted at coming here when things go south. Haven’t encouraged it.

Live full time at my BOL.  My main efforts, other than constantly working on food and power concerns, is getting together with my few full-time neighbors.

My main concern is the part timers that are rarely here or are here regularly for a weekend kind of thing. They have no preps here, and at least half of them AirBnB their homes on the lake, so if TSHTF in summer or around a holiday, it's likely that someone is renting their place and who the hell knows what those people will be like.

Because a six-page thread started less than a week ago isn't enough

If you want an idea what mass bugging out looks like come sit on the side of I55 in Mississippi the next time a hurricane is headed for New Orleans.It ain’t pretty.

it's not the frequency of discussions that bothers me, so much as the lack of effort.

If the OP could be bothered to organize their thoughts and talk about what kind of event was causing people to bug out, these threads would be vastly more useful and less dramatic.    But no, they default to click bait SHTF so everyone will come with a different assumption about the base situation.

That was in GD, and some people don't go to GD. That said, these kinds of threads are dumb. Everyone's situations are different, and what works for one person, won't work for another.

I'm in an urban apartment complex with lots of kids. If the SHTF I'm staying here to protect the kids until they can all leave.

Bugging "out" is a fantasy at best for 99.999% of us. Between the .Gov and local cops controlling the roads and SPECIFICALLY the bridges traffic can and WILL be locked down almost on a moments notice. Imagine you and yours in your immaculate bug out vehicle locked in a traffic jam idling your fuel away surrounded by idiots doing the same thing. Not a pretty picture.

This is why we are bugged IN permanently and are securing our survival at a leisurely pace with lots of thought on the potential outcomes we could face. We are fortunate in being well remote to begin with but that alone is not going to be the end all do all if society breaks down. We have a rural water supply that has served us well but in REALITY has no reliability whatsoever in SHTF. Pump failure? No parts. No freight service. No labor. No power. No nothing. Gravity flow on the system will last for an hour or two at best and then,,,nothing. The same can/will happen in metro areas. You'd better have a TON of water on hand. Just the wife and I go through a couple of gallons a day for coffee and drinking water every day. 60 days in will you be thirsty or shooting your neighbor because he has water and you don't? Will your neighbor be shooting YOU because you have water and he doesn't? These questions can be asked on every "need" we all have.

Meds are a critical issue for us and ALL of you. It's SO critical that I'm researching medical tourism as we speak along with other sources. Post SHTF there will be NO supply available TO you no matter how much inventory sits on the shelf. Keep in mind the Fed Ex will NOT be an option nor will Amazon. This may seem to be an obvious fact BUT can YOU deal with that fact?

If we had to bug out it would be for a no warning event, such as a train derailment and we're downwind of the hazmat cloud.

We don't get the kind of weather events, such as a hurricane, where a bug out is required.

For general mayhem/unrest I'm staying put.  We're all shooters, none have FSA background or mindsets, and we all lend a hand when needed already.

General law and order with supply chain breakdown is the scenario in mind. You know, what's been slow rolling now for a couple years?

The thrust and point of this thread isn't the WHY something caused you to bug out, but the logistics behind securing your "stuff" and/or bringing that "stuff" with you if you leave a place for another place. These are very real concerns and I think most people don't really think them through at all, much less practice loading, routes, convoying, refueling from cans, etc.

I still have concerns at my new location but that mostly centers around feeding my goats, chickens and livestock guardian dogs. Working on solutions now.

Lots of Montana is pretty expensive now. I know we overpaid for our house on 11ac last year. Oh well, it's good peace of mind and we threw a bunch of cash at it to bring down the payments so whatever. Anyplace you'd want to be in Wyoming likewise expensive. No clue about Utah.

I have zero plans to bug out...  It would have to be an immediate life and death scenario where leaving was my only option, and in that scenario I would not be carrying a 50# ruck full of survival gear, and driving a way would probably not be an option.  I enjoy living in the woods.

Short of a nuclear, biological or chemical disaster contaminating the land for 100 miles in all directions, we're staying put here in the burbs.

I have provisions for months, am heavily armed and have a few neighbors I trust. Bugging out would mean leaving far too much behind. Better to wall up and harden the entrances to your neighborhood.

Everything is situationally dependant.
I have everything I need to last a good amount of time in my house, and keep it secured. I'd get by pretty well. But without heat (no wood fireplace) we'd be in a rough spot long term. And I'm in town, not a big town, but still a town.

I have family house/land about 2:30 drive (using highways) and there is LAND. Everything we'd need is there; firewood, barns, machines, fuel, well, except for Food. There are apple trees, game, and some berries bushes (short season), but there's no long term food stored up. I'd really like to relocate my hundreds of #'s of dry goods there, but I can't do that.

If we had to BO, I have enough fuel on hand (well I usually do, I'm slipping and gotta refill my cans) in addition to what's in my truck. And I have bins I've started assembling which have a few days food and essentially a mobile kitchen. Also have dry bags with Mt House and other shelf stable food that doesn't require cooking.
I'd probably load that, a some defensive items into the truck and meet up with family. Then I'd want to return with a family truck (box or dump) to load up remaining supplies, and get everything to the property in 1 go, avoiding highways.

If vehicles become disabled I've got bags and the additional dry bags of light weight food to go it on foot. But there'd be little point because the lack of food there.

Catch 22.

Good post and similar to my situation except my family is only a 45min drive away.  Fortunately I have discussed this situation with family and their stored fuel is calculated in the 100s of gallons so one run with my truck and trailer, plus one run with one of their F250s and dump trailer would easily be able to relocate all my supplies and any gear I wanted to take in one trip if I need to go more remote to be with more family.  I would not relocate to a place with less preps than what I currently have.  My truck never gets parked in the yard with less than half a tank, not including my supply I could easily make half a dozen runs myself and still have some left over.

I think as pointed out by others that it is impossible to paint with a broad brush what folks should do. For instance my mother will definitely bug out but it will be to my home. She is older and retired so her leaving at the hint of things getting spicy is easy. As well we have pre-staged many items for her such as clothes and etc. We have discussed what she brings in detail and the priority in which they get loaded in her car. Multiple routes have been discussed. But the plan is not to wait until there are roving bands of Nazi Zombies.

Now some folks are bagging on Bucks thread about bugging out but I think they are being a bit obtuse. We all know the folks he was mainly referring to. Go on Youtube and search for prepper videos. Half of them will be about living in the forest and how to make fire with a beaver pelt and your ass cheeks. Go on some other prepper forums and you will see plenty of people who are thinking they are going to run to the wilderness to survive while making snares from shaved bark and deer penis. Those are the folks he was mainly targeting. And look, if you like woodcraft and enjoy it then have at it. But when the SHTF and I am worried about true survival I am just going to use a bic lighter and a .22. The last thing I will do is head to the woods with a bunch of other idiots.

+1.  Even some folks I know think that if things get bad, they will all just go "kill a deer."  I don't really debate it with them because it's not worth it but a simple look at deer populations overall it's a no brainer.  Even if 1 in 10 get a deer out of season deer will be extinct.  Thats not even taking into consideration I don't want to go be on public land if its full of hungry hunters letting rounds fly every time the bushes rustle.  It's bad enough in some places during opening day, well if folks are starving every day will be worse than opening day.

I envision a slower paced decline for America rather than one catastrophic incident.  This is what I am primarily planning for.  I chose to move to a rural location to better raise my family a number of years ago.  I do not plan on leaving.  

In relation to posts on hunting for game.

With the evolution of night vision and thermal optics as aiming aids, there will be no deer or other game left to hunt.  If times become harder, if food becomes scarce or unaffordible, rural people will take up hunting.  In season, out of season, at every given opportunity.  For themselves, for trade or gifts to others.  They will correctly know that if they pass up a given chance to harvest an animal, the next person will probably not let it circle back to them for them to have another chance.

People who have and use quality night vision or thermal optics can understand this already.  These products remove every natural advantage an animal has other than superior smell.  That will not be enough.  There will be almost no animals that can survive the advantage of not being seen at night nor hiding their body heat.

Who pray tell has quality night vision & practices regularly with it?  Perhaps some military folks.  Perhaps a few individuals or groups.  And two other groups, varmint hunters being the third.  I would suspect that the third group has far more individuals practicing and using their night vision several times a week than the other two combined.  They already know where the game is located at night.  They have the practice and ability to kill that game.  They already have the ability to kill any game they choose.

The fourth group is farmers (the third and fourth groups will have a lot of overlap).  The people that depend on their ability to harvest crops for their financial well being.  Every deer, every coon, every bear that visits their fields will eat or destroy how much in value.  Those folks that live rural, and in places where gunshots at night are already ignored.  You may think, farmers, they don't have thousands of dollars for night vision.  No, they only have hundreds of thousands of dollars for equipment to plant and harvest crops, there is no chance they could have a few thousand in night vision equipment to protect those crops.  Getting to write that night vision off of their taxes as farm equipment would probably only add to their enjoyment (if they did have it).

I believe anyone who plans on hunting, trapping, or snaring animals for food long term will quickly be going hungry.

Amen on thermal. Honestly I could decimate everything in my immediate area easily.

After owning one for a few months I am quickly considering them as becoming a necessity in A SHTF scenario.

This^^^

To ignore the fact that life may require a bugout, or call it a fantasy is blatant ignorance or disregard for reality. But the situations that would cause many to bugout are not what most think of when they hear the term.

Chem spill, or other localized issue, I'm loading up and leaving. But general unrest, roving gangs of bandits, I'm not going anywhere.

I won't be bugging.

I do sorta live in a city, it's the biggest city for a hundred miles, and they have a tractor parade every year.  I  do own more remote property, but I see no reason to bug, or anywhere to bug to that would be better than my home.

Attached File

planning on Bugging Out is planning to be a refugee.  Interesting article.  


Hard Pass, UNLESS it's local and unwise/safe to stay such as a fire, 'nado, train wreck with chemical spill, etc.

I’ve got a bit of experience with bugging out from an industrial disaster in SE Asia. My experience clarified the practice for me and gave a good context for when and how to do it effectively.

Reasons to bug out: fleeing the country (legal/criminal troubles), fleeing an NBC disaster area, or an extremely preemptive escape from an urban area to a more sustainable location.

Time to bug out: immediately upon heading of disaster or there being the possibility of trouble. So this means, have cash available to pay for a hotel and a few meals at any time and enough open credit to buy plane tickets out of the country at the drop of a hat.

I live in my BOL with the wife
40 acres with a 1/4 mile driveway.
Neighbors I only see when I want to see them but good ones that help and prep

Can at least bring the camper with us if we have to leave our AO.  We have extra propane tanks, filled, solar, and extra gasoline.  Sure, it ain't gonna get us cross country, but at least it's something.  Lots of food we could bring, too.

Gonna be overweight with all the ammo, tho.  Really need to limit calibers to just necessary stuff.

I have a small stash 400 miles away, but realistically, if everyone's fleeing, I'll never get there.

I'm pretty well set up here, currently can be self sufficient for a year or more.

But if we HAVE to bug out, it will be by water.
Can get to my brothers.
He's also set up.pretty well.
But Chesapeake can't be angry that day, lol.

There was a movie made in the early 2000s called Time of the Wolf/Le temps du loup.  I watched it on a DVD from Netflix. Set in France, some catastrophe happens, family bugs out to their little stone weekend cottage in the county, and then the S really HTF.  It is a dismal movie but I think it is probably very realistic about what will happen to people, whether they had a plan to bug out or not.  Leave early and be armed -- the moral of the story.  It is available on Amazon, YouTube, Hulu as a rent or buy movie.

Which thermal are you using?

@canoeguy

Moving and bugging out are two completely different actions.

I hope to do neither, but if i have to bug out, it will be what can fit in the truck and trailer. The TV, dressers and beds, refrigerators, etc wont be part of a real bug out.

I have a TS-35 640 Rattler. Small enough to use handheld which I do. But also a scope. For me it makes the most versatile set up.

And everyone who has rented there will decide it is a fantastic place to bug out to... so the lake houses will all have 10-20 families and hangers-on vying for each house.  And tons more will die on the road there.

If you don't have the FUEL already on board or in storage to take you to your destination (at least x2) because of the heavy load & excessive wait & idling. you are boned, because the pumps will be dry or locked.

The roads will be packed with others figuring "I'd getting OUT of HERE - don't know exactly WHERE we are going - but GOING none the less".  See traffic picture from Hurricane "Rita" above.

Roads will most likely be restricted at the choke points (bridges, highway intersections, ) by either the Authorities or Gangs.  

Remember back when you could just drive off grass on the shoulder or across the median?   Not anymore with all the steel guardrails, steel "safety cables" or concrete "Jersey Barriers".  You are trapped ON the road and can only move forward.

And how much can most people carry in a typical car?  

I have a 3/4 ton 8' bed 4x4 pick up and a 20' flatbed trailer.  If I'm loaded with all the goodies, Good News is that Ican move most of it, but bad news is I'm moving slow & a juicy target.

And - DO YOU HAVE A PLACE TO GO?    So many people tell me - I'll take off to "the wilderness" ... ... ... thinking they will live off the land like Grizzly Adams or Jeramiah Johnson mountain man style and not have a clue that the "parks" will be packed (often with less prepared & more desperate people), and all that "wide open" (private land belonging to others) will not be welcoming them with open arms if they trespass on someone else's land - especially in a time of lawlessness & crisis ...

Fact is most people these days don't have the skills to live once the few cans of Chef Boy'ardee they brought run out, or the bottled water is gone, or they have a few freezing cold nights in a tent.

BIGGER_HAMMER

I brought this question/concern up a few years ago as well and the same basic conclusion was also reached, bugging out is not going to be realistic.  I live in a small town, less than 6k, whole county is like 20k of people, but an hour from a major metro area.  Fortunately, it's not a main highway, but I would fully expect to see people heading the direction of my town.  I think a lot of people that live in the city think they can just head to the "country" and find food for the picking and when they finally realize that it does not work that way, I think people will get really froggy.

I would love to live more remote, but if you are anywhere within 150 miles of a decent population center, you will eventually get some visitors, I don't think it can be avoided.  I just got thermal also, wish I could have gotten even better ones, but for what I need and where I live, it covers it.  Would still like regular night vision, but that is in the future.

I too think it will be a slow decline and eventually might see people coming further out looking for resources.  I do remember one guy's story from Katrina where he had several acres kind of rurally.  One friend showed up and then someone else and then another with campers.  Pretty soon he had multiple people set up on his property with nothing he could about it.  Trashed a lot of his property and this was from an event people can recover from.  If a major, protracted situation, such as serious economic decline or a very slow to recover disaster, it would be really bad.  I think of that scene from a made for TV movie about a nuclear war in the 80s and people wandering in the country killed a man's cattle to eat and when he confronted them, someone killed him.

Salon did a really good story on the Hurricane Rita evacuation shit show. The evacuation was an absolute dumpster fire. More people died in the evac than they did from Rita. I'll see if I can find it. It's really a good read.

Found it:

How Rita Drove Texas Crazy

Live in a red county on the coast.  Technically we're on an island, road access by one of 2 bridges.  

We would have to travel west past major metro areas to reach the mountains, which are much closer to ATL.  I think we'll stay put.  Hurricane(s) will suck though.

I remember reading a short story, probably on here cause where.else would I read it, about a societal collapse and this guy bugging out with his family.

For some reason a yellow Jeep is in my memory. Anyway while bugging out they encounter very heavy traffic, and the husband/father decides to get off the highway and go through some trails or fields or something. Hits a point that they can't physically cross. Gets ambushed by bubba's.

Story ends very badly for them.

Kind stuck with me because stories always have a happy ending. But that's not reality.

I hear you, but hope is neither a plan nor a strategy.

I don't have anyplace but my own little Alamo (where I am now), but I know that the trick to surviving eotwawki is; it's better to arrive at your BOL a day, a week or even a month early, then to head for it a day late.

Yes, that's why it's important to think it through and possibly do a dry run. Thinking you have the space, the gas, the seats for everyone and most especially the place to go, but never having done it WILL be an eye opening experience if you ever have to bug out. You'll likely very quickly be triaging what's "most important" vs what you can live without.

That might be "The Bugout" by halffast.